cityrat
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 09:05:04
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☄ Helpfulby Guitarmech111 2013/09/26 13:24:25
The way I look at it is:
a) I don't want/need Melodyne
b) I have Addictive Drums
c) Don't need want any more plugins - I have enough. I want better WORKFLOW and things that make my work easier. Not a bunch of plugins to play with (I GET that a lot of people will use these etc)
I DO want: better stability, notation/staff updates, and bug fixes that I have submitted fixed.
To me I'm subsidizing more software plugins etc and it's not sure what's in it for me. Now I could just not upgrade - and I'm actually ok with paying for some stuff like take lanes if they improve workflow etc. Maybe they could/should have a 'base program update' only and a 'bundle' package?
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 09:07:16
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Beepster
Bristol_Jonesey
Beepster
Bristol_Jonesey
Off Topic - have you seen the GUI of the soon-to-be-released BFD3?
http://www.gearslutz.com/...-soon.html#post9454820
Oh, crap. I didn't realize that was happening. Looks cool but I want to snag 2 on discount before it disappears (don't want to pay full price and once 3 is released you know it'll be full price for a looong time). Better start keeping an eye on their site. Cheers.
Huh. I don't suppose it's gonna go any lower than the $129 it's currently at. I wonder if I'll still be able to snag the upgrade after they release 3. No flow right now and I wanted to get my VRM box first.
Rumour has it that there will be NO discounted price for upgrades to BFD3.
Full price or nothing.
Think I'm going too pass on this one
Whoa. That's messed up. Do you happen to know if they sell boxed BFD2 upgrades for Eco? If I can't scrounge up the cash before the new release (which will most DEFINITELY not be possible if the Oct 7 rumor is true) then maybe I can snag an old stock box. Otherwise I guess I'll have to buy the full boxed version of BFD2. I should look into whether they do allow license transfers as well. Maybe ebay will have some deals.
Gawd I hate being broke. It makes things ever so complicated.
Don't know Beep. Steve would be the one to ask, but he's not been around for a while (he's a Beta tester for BFD)
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 09:11:49
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Bristol_Jonesey
Don't know Beep. Steve would be the one to ask, but he's not been around for a while (he's a Beta tester for BFD)
Good idea. I did however take a peek on ebay and it does seem like there are some boxed upgrades for sale (whether they are legit or not IDK). Maybe I'll call my retailer and see what they can do for me. Maybe I'll put a box on layaway if they don't intend to keep the old stock around. Cheers.
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cclarry
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 09:26:08
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Silicon Audio
So I am seeing some posts about X2a users upset about having to spend, say, $150 to upgrade. I also purchased X2 and yes, I've had some issues with some features, but I feel I have gotten my money's worth out of the software anyway. Maybe a mammoth company like Microsoft, with billions of copies of their S/W sold and millions of annually renewing corporate license agreements rolling over every year can afford lots of free patches. But Cakewalk have just a tiny fraction of that market and they need income to keep making the software we love.
Let's put this into perspective... What piece of audio gear in your studio could you upgrade for $150 and get similar bang for your buck? You could maybe buy a very average microphone. You could buy a super low-end junky mic pre. Maybe a really nice mic stand and pop filter? Does any of that compare with a bunch of enhanced features, fixes and plug-ins? Most of you guys would drop $150 on a single plug-in and not bat an eyelid.
I work full time in IT and you should see the cost of the software assurance contracts we pay. Believe me when I tell you that $150 per year to keep your software up to date is CHEAP! You guys have no idea how good we've got it.
Just sayin'
In comparison to Reaper...which has FREE upgrades for 2 FULL versions...at less then HALF the price of this upgrade for the FULL version, and FL Studio, which costs, on the street the same as this UPGRADE, and has FREE UPGRADES FOR LIFE.... And Mixcraft Pro Studio, which is highly underated, also costs the same as this UPGRADE for the full version... It's HUGE....IT software is quite different then this...so, there is NO COMPARISON. This analogy FAILS in the fact these are TWO entirely different animals. It's a nice try...but not the same... by any stretch of the imagination. These companies have to realize that the COMPETITION out there is FIERCE... Now take into account that Cubase 7 has had 6 updates since release to address customer concerns. Studio One has been FREE for all updates since 2.0., and currently stands at 2.6. Consider that, not only did we not get our bugs fixed with X2a, but were told WE CAN'T TELL YOU ANYTHING, so carry on. So, the way I see it, they are CHARGING me for plugins that I don't need, to get PAID for bug fixes that SHOULD have been released in X2b. MOST Producer users here already have most of the 3rd Party Plugins bundled in this deal, so we NOW have to pay again for plugins that we don't need to get fixes that we should have received for free, had the program been PROPERLY maintained. I have no Problem with an X3 release, what I have a problem with is being CHARGED for things that I already own, to get fixes for things that should have already been fixed... AND, they NOW want to RAISE the upgrade price by 50% to boot...to cover the royalties for plugins that I don't even need... NOPE...not doing it...I'm waiting for a sale.... The junkies will STAND IN LINE TO BE THE FIRST TO GET IT....always have and always will. Not me...not this time... Had things been handled differently, maybe, but not like this....these companies KNOW that the vast majority of you will CAVE because you have OCD, and JUST HAVE TO HAVE IT! They thrive on it on that mentality. For once in your life, think about...what's in this that you can't live without for $150 bucks? I really want to know....
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djwayne
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 09:31:24
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My biggest concern is that we pay for X3 then 2 months down the road we have to upgrade again to Tascam Pro. If there was a free upgrade to Tascam Pro included in the X3 upgrade deal, that would be much better.
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:06:53
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Moving this from the other thread so I'm sh*tting all over the queue.
Since we still don't have any official word yet I think I'm just going to stop torturing myself and resign to my contingency plan. My main issues with X2 are mostly premix phase related. The tracking and editing is just too weird and unpredictable. Mixing seems to be fine and the processing effects and stuff is really where I dropped my money anyway when I bought the Suite.
I'll be digging deeper into the competitors base/entry level versions to see who provides the best/most stable editing tools (I have a pretty good idea which one I want but I'll do some window shopping first). I'll drop no more than $100 and then use that program for tracking and bulk editing. Once things are sliced and diced to the point where I'm ready to mix I'll dump it in Sonar and use the tools there to getting it sounding slick. Doing a few minor edits or overdubs in X2 should be alright. It's just trying to do loooong sessions where the bugs become a major hindrance.
The only thing I'm concerned about is how well X2 automation is going to work. I want to do some pretty wacky stuff and the little bits I've done so far have been a little problematic.
If by the next release cycle I see that X3 is the godsend we all hope it to be and I have some extra cash I'll go for it. If not then I'll probably start upgrading whatever DAW I've been using for editing and let X2 fade into the background of my studio.
There. Plan is in place. Now I can stop chewing at my wounds. Sorry bakers. I gave it a shot.
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cclarry
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:10:31
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Beepster
Moving this from the other thread so I'm sh*tting all over the queue.
Since we still don't have any official word yet I think I'm just going to stop torturing myself and resign to my contingency plan. My main issues with X2 are mostly premix phase related. The tracking and editing is just too weird and unpredictable. Mixing seems to be fine and the processing effects and stuff is really where I dropped my money anyway when I bought the Suite.
I'll be digging deeper into the competitors base/entry level versions to see who provides the best/most stable editing tools (I have a pretty good idea which one I want but I'll do some window shopping first). I'll drop no more than $100 and then use that program for tracking and bulk editing. Once things are sliced and diced to the point where I'm ready to mix I'll dump it in Sonar and use the tools there to getting it sounding slick. Doing a few minor edits or overdubs in X2 should be alright. It's just trying to do loooong sessions where the bugs become a major hindrance.
The only thing I'm concerned about is how well X2 automation is going to work. I want to do some pretty wacky stuff and the little bits I've done so far have been a little problematic.
If by the next release cycle I see that X3 is the godsend we all hope it to be and I have some extra cash I'll go for it. If not then I'll probably start upgrading whatever DAW I've been using for editing and let X2 fade into the background of my studio.
There. Plan is in place. Now I can stop chewing at my wounds. Sorry bakers. I gave it a shot.
It's a good plan Beeps... And will probably save you some cash in the long run...BOTH ways...
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michaelhanson
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:16:59
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I don't know, before I spent money on anything else, I would wait a few months to see what the general reaction is for other X3 users...see what's been fixed or added to the program. Then I would down load a trial version of X3 when it comes out and see how that reacts to your system. I don't like to waste money either, but that is the way I would handle this if I was unsure of moving forward with X3.
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:21:33
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cclarry
It's a good plan Beeps...
And will probably save you some cash in the long run...BOTH ways...
Yeah, I've been mulling it over for quite some time but was waiting to see how this all plays out. I really don't think the included tools in any of the other DAWs would get me near the sound quality the original base package of Sonar I've bought (Production Suite + X2) will. Also the Pro Channel is pretty darned slick and fun to use. It's just the darned editing that really gets me. I think this way I can have to best of both worlds and now that I have BFD Eco, TH2 full, GR5 full and the synths that came with Sonar (which I'm assuming will work in other programs... I'm referring to DimPro, Zeta, Rapture) I should have everything I need to get the songs together on another platform. Also I've been getting ready to get into the Melda free stuff which is obviously independent and eventually the Izotope mastering stuff I should have a pretty well rounded/powerful studio. The one thing about being broke is you learn to make VERY calculated decisions when it comes to purchases. I still really don't think I screwed up by buying Sonar. I've gotten a lot of tools and acquired a TON of knowledge I don't think I would have had access to otherwise but now my rig and mind have matured to the point I can start making more adventurous decisions. You guys have been a major factor in all that. Really the most valuable part of my Cakewalk purchase/experience has been this forum. So if I haven't said it enough lately... thanks.
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mmorgan
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:24:23
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MakeShift
I don't know, before I spent money on anything else, I would wait a few months to see what the general reaction is for other X3 users...see what's been fixed or added to the program. Then I would down load a trial version of X3 when it comes out and see how that reacts to your system. I don't like to waste money either, but that is the way I would handle this if I was unsure of moving forward with X3.
This makes a lot of sense. I know I tend to get caught up in the storm of upgradeitis. This time though I'm taking a wait and see aproach. That said I am really interested in the ARA implementation and the color customization. Regarding the colors I sure hope there is actually something that makes sense because at present I've never been able to get much of the current custom colors to work. Regards,
Mike Win8(64), Sonar X3e(64) w/ RME Fireface UFX.
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:27:00
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MakeShift
I don't know, before I spent money on anything else, I would wait a few months to see what the general reaction is for other X3 users...see what's been fixed or added to the program. Then I would down load a trial version of X3 when it comes out and see how that reacts to your system. I don't like to waste money either, but that is the way I would handle this if I was unsure of moving forward with X3.
It'll be at least a few months before I can make a move of any kind anyway (unless I decide to go for the free/cheap opensource guys which... IDK if that's right for me in the long run) but just from the leaked list they haven't fixed one of the major problems I have with X2. Audiosnap. Also a major part of my plans for the future revolve around teaching music so getting something with a more powerful/workable notation feature would be a wise investment. I don't want to shell out big bucks for a program that ONLY does notation and considering my lesson ideas will be very interactive and include tons of live audio and MIDI examples having it right the DAW is very attractive. I wasn't even aware of Sonar Staff/Tablature View when I started and got very excited that it was there. Then I tried to use it. lol
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michaelhanson
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:30:35
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That said I am really interested in the ARA implementation and the color customization. Regarding the colors I sure hope there is actually something that makes sense because at present I've never been able to get much of the current custom colors to work. I guess I was reacting to Beep and Larry's post above. If unsure, wait a bit. Myself, I have put some cash away for this upgrade in anticipation of a fall release. X1 and X2 worked great for me, so I have no reservations on grabbing up X3 when released. I cross my fingers that I won't be someone that ends up having issues with X3, but I know this community is there to help and I can always call Cakewalk direct. The absolute worst that could happen is to have to go back to X2a which has worked fine for me.
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:31:12
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mmorgan
MakeShift
I don't know, before I spent money on anything else, I would wait a few months to see what the general reaction is for other X3 users...see what's been fixed or added to the program. Then I would down load a trial version of X3 when it comes out and see how that reacts to your system. I don't like to waste money either, but that is the way I would handle this if I was unsure of moving forward with X3.
This makes a lot of sense. I know I tend to get caught up in the storm of upgradeitis. This time though I'm taking a wait and see aproach.
That said I am really interested in the ARA implementation and the color customization. Regarding the colors I sure hope there is actually something that makes sense because at present I've never been able to get much of the current custom colors to work.
Regards,
The Melodyne implementation is the one thing that is really tempting but as I said I'm looking into Izotope stuff and they seem to have pretty decent pitch correction in their bundles. Also V-Vocal may work fine for my limited needs. If I start taking on clients that may change though but I don't anticipate that for quite some time. Gotta get some albums and lessons together to get my chops up to speed and prove myself to the industry. It'll be a good package for many but it's just not the right stuff for me. The X2 release was.
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ston
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:44:39
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As this thread is about putting things into perspective, back in the late 80's, maybe very early 90's, I bought a second hand copy of Cubase 2 for £799.
In today's money that is just about enough to buy Switzerland.
It was buggy as feck and Steinberg never bothered addressing any of the bugs and in fact went on to produce Cubase 16 (also damn expensive) which was also full of bugs and then dropped the Atari platform altogether and moved on to PC development.
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michaelhanson
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:51:35
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Melodyne Essential was one of the best purchases that I have made...ever. They are the industry leader and standard; a very user friendly bit of software.
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joakes
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:54:08
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Linear Phase
joakes
Lets hope the Euro prices are decent this time. 1 Euro does not = 1 USD, it never has.
Cake's explanations are a little shakey.........
Cheers,
Jerry
Fact check.. October 26 200 euro was US$0.8252 Today its about $1.35 and that is still well off its 10 yr high of $1.60 Edit = As an avid market junkie, I'd just like to say that, "there is no guarantee the Euro will not crash like a drunk driver." What is going on right now is, "really short burst of growth, because central banks flood the markets with easy money, but when these mini-bubbles burst, we roll back into months and months of contraction." The global economy has like a, "chronic bronchitis." It gets a little better, because of meds, but then it comes back sick again, and needs more meds...
Sorry, but you missed the point. For X1 and X2 the Euro price was the same as the USD price. The reasons given by Cake were flakey and leaked like a seive. However i still upgraded. I just hope the pricing has been reviewed since. Cheers, Jerry
Built by yours truely : I7-2600@3.4GHz, Asus P67Z68, W10x64 Creator Edition, 32GB RAM, 3 HD's, nVidia 760 GT, Focusrite 18i20 2,d Gen + Ti FW, Oxygen 61 iv Gen, and Edirol SD-20 (yes it works), CbB, Teles, Strats, LP's, Epi Riviera, etc
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dubdisciple
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:55:46
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cclarry
The junkies will STAND IN LINE TO BE THE FIRST TO GET IT....always have and always will.
Not me...not this time...
Had things been handled differently, maybe, but not like this....these companies KNOW
that the vast majority of you will CAVE because you have OCD, and JUST HAVE TO HAVE
IT! They thrive on it on that mentality. For once in your life, think about...what's in this that you can't
live without for $150 bucks? I really want to know....
This is the kind of stuff that starts flame wars on forums. The need to lob insults at those who don't share the same point of view. Early adopters have various reasons for doing so other than being "junkies" or having OCD. I usually wait for the sale, but I certainly don't feel the need to judge and label those who get it the first day. There are users that have had nothing but wonderful experiences with Cakewalk and those who have had nightmares. My experience has had a glitch or two but had been mostly positive, especially in contrast to my experiences with other companies. The last time I dealt with Steinberg, they basically told me it was my problem if their stupid dongle was crashing my system. Avid has about the worst customer support possible IMO. Adobe almost had me wipe my computer to fix what turned out to be a minor glitch on their part. We will ignore for the moment that harping on the $150 is pointless since we have know way of knowing the pricing. Yes, sweetwater listed that, but that same post had other errors in it too. It would not be the first time I saw pricing on a yet to be released product end up being different. Every time I have upgraded my Sony products, the listed upgrade price has been much higher than the offer that came shortly after directly from Sony. Let's just say it is $150. For some people (Like those who collect plugins like candy), it's a drop in the bucket. I'm not one of those people and $150 is not something I spend casually, but I do recognize that my finances are not the finances of every Cakewalk customer, so it's not my place to label someone who can afford that amount casually. We get it. for YOU, the upgrade is not for you. Fair enough, but you are starting to be like that guy who not believing in Santa Claus is not enough, hellbent on snatching every kid in the Macys line to inform them there is no Santa and that he/she is an idiot if they believe. I have skipped upgrades on Cakewalk a few times, or waited a long time to jump in, but it has never dawned on me to play the role of poison pen when I did.
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cclarry
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 10:59:35
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ston
As this thread is about putting things into perspective, back in the late 80's, maybe very early 90's, I bought a second hand copy of Cubase 2 for £799.
In today's money that is just about enough to buy Switzerland.
It was buggy as feck and Steinberg never bothered addressing any of the bugs and in fact went on to produce Cubase 16 (also damn expensive) which was also full of bugs and then dropped the Atari platform altogether and moved on to PC development.
Yeah, that's about what I paid for Cubase SX3 way back when...times they are a-changin'.... But, that was quite a good program for it's time...and mine...LOL
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paulo
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:04:32
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Has anyone from CW actually said what the prices are yet ? I haven't seen anything official.
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:05:31
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ston
As this thread is about putting things into perspective, back in the late 80's, maybe very early 90's, I bought a second hand copy of Cubase 2 for £799.
In today's money that is just about enough to buy Switzerland.
It was buggy as feck and Steinberg never bothered addressing any of the bugs and in fact went on to produce Cubase 16 (also damn expensive) which was also full of bugs and then dropped the Atari platform altogether and moved on to PC development.
Except it is 2013. That Atari probably cost 5 times as much as nice build from ADK as well and did 1/10 000th of the work. A better perspective would be a bag of dry, seed filled oranges. They come with a one of those whistle rings, a box of paperclips and a coupon for some mail order seamonkeys. The bag with all the accoutrements is selling for $10. Meanwhile across the street I can get a bag of nice sweet seedless tangerines for $5. It doesn't come with any doodads or seamonkeys and the bag is significantly smaller BUT I like tangerines and I hate seeds. I mean seamonkeys and whistlerings are wicked cool but do I really NEED them? Even if I did I could probably head over to the novelty shop and pick some up for a decent price. In the meantime I can have sweet delicious tangerine juice dribbling down my face and stickying up my beard. mmm... tangerines. ;-)
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:08:21
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dubdisciple
The last time I dealt with Steinberg, they basically told me it was my problem if their stupid dongle was crashing my system.
Yeah... they were not getting very good reviews when I was DAW shopping so they got passed over. Looks like they are trying to get their shiz together these days though. And Avid will never be allowed to violate my system.
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WallyG
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:19:20
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Charles
FYI,
For giggles I clicked on your URL and came up with a server error. You might want to check it out.
Walt
Roland Jupiter 80, Roland D50, Roland Integra 7, Roland BK-7m, Yamaha Montage 6, ARP Odyssey, Excelsior Continental Artist, Roland FR-8X, 1967 Fender Jaguar, Fender Strat, Fender 1965 Twin Reverb reissue, Selmer Trumpet, Akai EWI, Studio One 4 Professional, Melodyne Studio 4, Behringer X-Touch, RME Fireface UCX, MOTU MIDI Express XT - ADK Pro Audio Hex Xtreme 6 Core i7 4.5GHz, 64GB, 480GB SS, 3 X 3TB Hard Drives, Win 10, 2 X 27" & 1X 46" Monitors, My WEB site - www.gontowski.com/music
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WallyG
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:43:39
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Beepster
... We were getting regular interaction about general mundane stuff (like helping users with questions and the like) the whole summer but they just disappeared this year. Even not talking about new releases but just being around can put folks at ease. Now I could see why they might not want to hang around so much or were instructed not to pop in as frequently because some people were outright abusive towards them...
Personally I like the fact that the staff at Cakewalk interacts with members of the forum. I'm also surprised this is allowed for the reason you stated in you last sentence above. I belong to a forum concerning the airplane in my Avatar. The company (Cirrus Aircraft) does not allow staff members to chime in on any posts. Instead they have liaisons who are members of the forum that act as a go between the company and members to make announcements, report issues with the product that are being addressed, etc. Once again I prefer that the staff interact with members and hope that they be treated with respect; otherwise I would assume that interaction would go away… Walt
Roland Jupiter 80, Roland D50, Roland Integra 7, Roland BK-7m, Yamaha Montage 6, ARP Odyssey, Excelsior Continental Artist, Roland FR-8X, 1967 Fender Jaguar, Fender Strat, Fender 1965 Twin Reverb reissue, Selmer Trumpet, Akai EWI, Studio One 4 Professional, Melodyne Studio 4, Behringer X-Touch, RME Fireface UCX, MOTU MIDI Express XT - ADK Pro Audio Hex Xtreme 6 Core i7 4.5GHz, 64GB, 480GB SS, 3 X 3TB Hard Drives, Win 10, 2 X 27" & 1X 46" Monitors, My WEB site - www.gontowski.com/music
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WallyG
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:45:38
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Bristol_Jonesey
gswitz
It has proven to be a sustainable maintenance fee for me for a while now. It's like a magazine subscription.
Exactly this.
I've spent more on SOS magazines over the last year than the price of the upgrade.
It's all about perspective.
I paid $65 for an annual subscription... Walt
Roland Jupiter 80, Roland D50, Roland Integra 7, Roland BK-7m, Yamaha Montage 6, ARP Odyssey, Excelsior Continental Artist, Roland FR-8X, 1967 Fender Jaguar, Fender Strat, Fender 1965 Twin Reverb reissue, Selmer Trumpet, Akai EWI, Studio One 4 Professional, Melodyne Studio 4, Behringer X-Touch, RME Fireface UCX, MOTU MIDI Express XT - ADK Pro Audio Hex Xtreme 6 Core i7 4.5GHz, 64GB, 480GB SS, 3 X 3TB Hard Drives, Win 10, 2 X 27" & 1X 46" Monitors, My WEB site - www.gontowski.com/music
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:50:21
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For ME, the alleged cost of X3 is rather a moot point at present.
I have to spend at least a grand over the next month or so just getting my studio back online, due to a complete re-fit & re-decoration.
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 11:51:50
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WallyG
Beepster
... We were getting regular interaction about general mundane stuff (like helping users with questions and the like) the whole summer but they just disappeared this year. Even not talking about new releases but just being around can put folks at ease. Now I could see why they might not want to hang around so much or were instructed not to pop in as frequently because some people were outright abusive towards them...
Personally I like the fact that the staff at Cakewalk interacts with members of the forum. I'm also surprised this is allowed for the reason you stated in you last sentence above.
I belong to a forum concerning the airplane in my Avatar. The company (Cirrus Aircraft) does not allow staff members to chime in on any posts. Instead they have liaisons who are members of the forum that act as a go between the company and members to make announcements, report issues with the product that are being addressed, etc.
Once again I prefer that the staff interact with members and hope that they be treated with respect; otherwise I would assume that interaction would go away…
Walt
I'm reminded of the episode of The West Wing where Josh (or whatever his name was) stumbles across a fan forum dedicated to him. He's all excited and decides to chime in on some minor WH policy discussion going on. All of a sudden the intertubers start getting a little weird/nasty so he tries to clarify his statement which starts a full on flame war and his assistant has to chastise him for wading into the murky depths of the internet and clean up the mess he left behind. lol... that was a hilarious ep. Ah the internet.
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mmorgan
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 12:05:40
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MakeShift
Myself, I have put some cash away for this upgrade in anticipation of a fall release. X1 and X2 worked great for me, so I have no reservations on grabbing up X3 when released. I cross my fingers that I won't be someone that ends up having issues with X3, but I know this community is there to help and I can always call Cakewalk direct. The absolute worst that could happen is to have to go back to X2a which has worked fine for me.
Mike, just to be clear, it isn't the money for me. When X1 came out I was all over it from minute one. X2 was the same story. In general my experiences there were fine, no show stoppers. I'm only standing on the sidelines this time because I want to see what the general consensus is and how long the first update will take. I believe it was Noel who has already stated that a patch was in the works for improved video support. So I'm assuming one is coming... On the other hand, check back with me on the day X3 is available...I can always change my mind.  Regards,
Mike Win8(64), Sonar X3e(64) w/ RME Fireface UFX.
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Brando
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 12:35:45
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dubdisciple
This is the kind of stuff that starts flame wars on forums. The need to lob insults at those who don't share the same point of view. Early adopters have various reasons for doing so other than being "junkies" or having OCD. ....
We get it. for YOU, the upgrade is not for you. Fair enough, but you are starting to be like that guy who not believing in Santa Claus is not enough, hellbent on snatching every kid in the Macys line to inform them there is no Santa and that he/she is an idiot if they believe. I have skipped upgrades on Cakewalk a few times, or waited a long time to jump in, but it has never dawned on me to play the role of poison pen when I did.
Excellent post Dub. Echoes my sentiments exactly. I own both Melodyne Editor and AAS Lounge Lizard (which is really great by the way). I would like to get a detail on all of the plugs/etc, more info on the Tape Sim - but I am also confident that I already own most or suitable equivalents that I don't need. But I am still leaning towards buying the upgrade when it appears. Guess I have OCD. 1) Love the concept of ARA and real integration of Melodyne into SONAR. So many users have had issues with V-Vocal, and/or have moved to Melodyne that I would have thought that ARA (whether or not melodyne essential was included - that it is for those who don't have it is huge) would be a very exciting feature. 2) I have no VST3 plugins that I know of, but I am willing to invest in this (must be my OCD) as a feature for my main DAW - I never asked for it, but when I need it I will have it, and it sounds from some comments made by some Cake staff that the incorporation of VST3 into SONAR has led to some other performance related benefits in general. (It's so funny that when the VST3 discussion came up a few months ago, users who demanded it were so adamant that SONAR must have it - all the big DAWS did - now that it's released, the response seems to be "meh - I don't need it", or maybe "should have been included in X2b". 3) Love Prochannel, and the extension of ProChannel to include a Tape Sim is a great add. More flexibility in display attributes for PC modules is welcome. 4) Comping improvements leads me to think that Cake has responded to all of the user complaints about layers/lanes and got this right - we'll see of course. 5) I am absolutely sure that Cake will have a list of secondary features/fixes that will mean better stability, less dropouts, a more nearly "gapless" engine - color customization (which was not a big deal to me either, but again, was a huge demand of fellow users), and while I can't say they have a new staff view - I hope they will have fixed many of the dominant/prevailing issues that users have had. Again - we'll see of course. For the record, I am willing to pay for bug fixes - provided it's a reasonable chunk of the upgrade price of course. I think there is a lot of value in the upgrade - obviously more for some than for others - for anyone who doesn't have any version of Melodyne, or the AAS Lounge Lizard (I am assuming equivalent to the Session, not the full version), or the included plugins, it has to be seen as a bargain just on that basis alone, assuming you were entertaining purchasing any of those. I understand the economy is tough but it seems there is a prevailing attitude everywhere (I don;t just mean on these forums) that more and more services should be free, or cheaper than dirt. Fair price for fair value. $150 = 30 lattes, (or beers), 7-8 books or DVD's, 1 - 3 typical VST/VSTi plugins, 15 movies, 0.5 of Melodyne Editor, or any of the big softsynths, samplers, etc, 1 MIDI keyboard, 1 really cheap guitar. And that's it in a nutshell - I like SONAR, I have OCD. I'm in.
Brando
Cakewalk, Studio One Pro, Reaper Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL ASUS Prime Z370-A LGA1151, 32GB DDR4, Intel 8700K i7, 500 GB SSD, 3 x 1TB HDD, Windows 10 Pro 64
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Beepster
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 13:09:20
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Brando
I understand the economy is tough but it seems there is a prevailing attitude everywhere (I don;t just mean on these forums) that more and more services should be free, or cheaper than dirt. Fair price for fair value.
$150 = 30 lattes, (or beers), 7-8 books or DVD's, 1 - 3 typical VST/VSTi plugins, 15 movies, 0.5 of Melodyne Editor, or any of the big softsynths, samplers, etc, 1 MIDI keyboard, 1 really cheap guitar.
And that's it in a nutshell - I like SONAR, I have OCD. I'm in.
Again, and not to criticize you personally or to harp on about this, the thing is it's not just $150. For me it will be $750 (if the leaked upgrade price is accurate) for something that is almost, but not quite, doing what I need. I also do not indulge in lattes, dvd's or other such frivolities (although I do like me some barley pops but $150 gets me 75 of those because I enjoy them at home to ease my back problems and that many would last me a couple months at least). Every spare cent goes to the system. I could claw back on my minimal creature comforts and/or go back to starving myself for a while to get the latest upgrade and I would BUT from the leaked details it doesn't look like it's going to address my particular issues or offer frilly frallies and/or dealymadoodles that would make the upgrade price worthwhile (as was the case with X2... which also had core features that were attractive to me like the timeline zoom and take lanes). After a calculated cost/benefit analysis based on the info provided thus far I do not think X3 will do much for me. Perhaps Cake will blow my mind once the official announcements are made but in the other thread Seth (IIRC) basically said the leaked list of features only had a few errors. However... that is just me. I think what people SHOULD be excited about is... VST3- I don't know much about it but from what I've read it sounds pretty damned cool. However I personally do not need it because I'm squatting on the plugs/effects that I already have and the ones I intend to acquire should work fine without it (and the other platforms I'm looking at to supplement my Cake experience have supported VST3 for a while anyway). Improved Video support- If true that is definitely a boon for many but I am not really a video guy at this point and when I actually do venture into the realm of creating videos I will need something a little more powerful than anything ANY of the current DAWS can offer except perhaps Nuendo which there is NO way I'm investing in. I will probably go with the lighter version of Adobe Premiere or simply subscirbe to the full version online when I need it (I think it's currently like $30 per month which is pretty good considering you can get a LOT done in a month). Integrated Melodyne- Well this is self explanatory but I'm not really part of the AutoTune crowd anyway. It will be a massive improvement for many but again... just not something I'm overly concerned about. Tape Sim- Nice add on. Wish I had access to it but not worth an upgrade. Improved Take Lanes- This needed improvements but if you look back I've always been pretty happy with Take Lanes over layers. There are quirks but they work for me. Not worth $150. Addictive Drums- This is a really cool piece of kit and I was gonna buy it at one point but BFD is much better for an old dinosaur rocker like me who would rather have pure, raw samples to work with. I already have the drum sampler I want. Don't need another. However THIS is a HUGE improvement over SD3 and anyone coming into Sonar fresh or anyone who has been relying on SD3 for their drums... well this is going to be a game changer. Great stuff and XLM's forum/support is REALLY excellent. They also have some great expansion packs that cover most any style you want to do. It's also far easier to use than BFD as far as I can tell. So yes... big points for Cake on this one. I'm not sure about some of the new plugs alluded to but I'm sure they are quite nice as well but I'm happy enough with what I have and I've already made decisions on what I personally need for my purposes. I doubt they'll cater to my particular niche. So it does sound like X3 will indeed something really awesome for many people. Just not me. Not right now anyway.
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backwoods
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Re: Putting the price of the X3 upgrade into perspective
2013/09/26 13:31:28
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I just wish they would release so I can buy it.
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