grandwizz
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Renewal Fee
To whom it may concern
I,m not happy about the increase in the annual fee
Last year it cost me $175
This year $229 thats a $54 increase Iv been a loyal customer for years
But its starting to get a bit much in my opinion
I.ll give it another year as i,v just paid for it
But a may have to look for other options
Grandwizz
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John
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 07:40:25
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Too bad you didn't get Life Time updates.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 07:42:08
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We have another loyal customer!!
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 07:49:10
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Way to kick someone who is down. Regardless of lifetime deals, if these numbers work out that's a price hike of over 30 percent. Something the marketing department should definitely be worried about.
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Brian Walton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 08:10:04
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☄ Helpfulby SquireBum 2017/04/08 16:47:32
They have said very clearly they expect to offer periodic discounts. Sounds like you have about a year to see what they offer.
Considering you don't even know if they will offer an update you can't live without over a year from now, seems absurd to get bent out of shape about it now.
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azslow3
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 08:28:27
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Sanderxpander
Way to kick someone who is down. Regardless of lifetime deals, if these numbers work out that's a price hike of over 30 percent. Something the marketing department should definitely be worried about.
The marketing team in any company has obvious goals, collect some money at specific time and/or optimize total money flow. They did, they do and they will do. They apply what works and change it when it does not. For all people except USSR fans that should be obvious and not a reason for complains or suggestions, that is how the world works. There was an idea, theory and a practical attempt to organize it different way. And it has failed as a model for country (but was successfully adopted by big corporations for internal operations...). Cakewalk has managed to take on-board many users which are almost impossible to "harvest" (like myself). Doing this while keeping reasonable budget is not an easy task. But they was successful. So I am convinced that they know what they should "worry about"...
Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc. www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
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John
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 11:03:43
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Sanderxpander
Way to kick someone who is down. Regardless of lifetime deals, if these numbers work out that's a price hike of over 30 percent. Something the marketing department should definitely be worried about.
I don't know but I don't recall CW every saying they would never increase prices. They offered the Life Time deal for a long time giving people a chance to sign up. Lots took the deal some didn't. I can't see why one would complain about raising prices for updates when it could have been avoided with a little foresight.
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 11:37:19
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It's pretty normal to increase prices, I agree. I just don't think it's strange to complain about a 30 percent price hike. That's like 15 times inflation. The OP could have gotten a better deal by going for lifetime updates last year but it's absolutely useless and pretty tasteless to throw that in his face now.
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scook
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 11:52:43
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Must not be US$. For existing Platinum owners the current price is $199 and about $30 less at resellers.
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azslow3
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 12:25:40
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Sanderxpander
It's pretty normal to increase prices, I agree. I just don't think it's strange to complain about a 30 percent price hike. That's like 15 times inflation. The OP could have gotten a better deal by going for lifetime updates last year but it's absolutely useless and pretty tasteless to throw that in his face now.
My old VW Passat had glue lamps... when broken, I could replace them myself for 2 euro. My newer VM Passat has LEDs at that place. They have decided (for no technical reason, I have it now and can make a photo...) that LEDs there are NOT replaceable, and once some part of them is broken I have to may 300 euro to replace complete thing (payed yesterday). Does it make sense to complain?  Cakewalk sad that everyone can pay one time and do not think about that after. May be they just needed extra $$$ last year, may be that was a "gift", may be an attempt to get more users on board, we can only guess... But the fact is that EVERY "loyal" customer (and even not so "loyal") could join the action for NO EXTRA COST. The action was extended, so everyone could one time pay SOME DAYS before this year for this year and forget about price politic. Also every "loyal" customer really had to pay much less then "regular" year price to join. So, my claim is simple: there is NO loyal customers which have no LifeTime update. Either someone is "loyal" and have it or he/she is NOT loyal since has made the decision to pass. There is a separate thread who is "loyal", but from a commercial company perspective "loyalty" means you pay when asked... Ask but not payed? Not loyal. That simple So now the rest of people are informed there is a chance you have to pay $250 per year. Could be $500... could be $1000. No one is forced to pay, marketing team can introduce actions, discounts, etc. They can even re-open LifeTime if they want. From all perspectives, Cakewalk gave a chance for a fair deal. Not it is time for "unfair" deal. Where is the problem?
Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc. www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
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tenfoot
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 12:43:20
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The price does seem to have escalated rapidly. Prior to taking up lifetime updates I think my last renewal was something like $89, which was also credited to the cost of lifetime updates. Cakewalk have in the past always offered very fair paths to upgrade. Perhaps someone new is calling the shots. I hope it all works out for them. Let's face it - no one relies on customers continuing to renew more than those that have lifetime updates!
Bruce. Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 14:42:36
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☄ Helpfulby stickman393 2017/04/12 04:59:41
I think it might be a good idea to see what customers get for the extra dollars (assuming you don't wait for a special or discounted deal) before deciding whether it's worth it or not. There's a bit of a problem with this conversation:
Customer: "I'm not seeing spectacular enough updates. I want things that are rebuilt from the ground up like a revamp of MIDI, ripple editing, great notation...oh, and support for a bunch of controllers, bring back the eZine, 24/7 phone support that I can call up any time and get an answer, and a lot more of the Features and Ideas implemented. I mean, c'mon, there are hundreds of ideas in there...can't Cakewalk at least do the top 50? And an arrangement track! Yeah, and also, redo the audio engine for instant tempo changes. And I want great-sounding stretching and better video support, too. And how about doing more with touch, or that spiffy new dial in the Surface Studio? And take care of those loose ends in the Theme Editor and give us more themes! And the devs should spend less time developing and more time in the forum. There are other things, but that's a good start."
Cakewalk: "Whew! It's pretty expensive to do all that stuff, but we can raise the price and be able to do more."
Customer: "Yeah...well...actually I don't want to have to pay for it..."
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tenfoot
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 15:05:40
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Indeed. It would certainly make sense if the update path was to split between bug fixes only and new features. I certainly wouldn't have a problem with lifetime updates being only bug fixes and OS compatability, and Cakewalk did say from the start that at some point features would be added as paid options. It does of course open its own can if worms:)
Bruce. Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 15:13:55
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I don't mind business decisions. I mind a very large price hike (imagine if this were your rent?!) and people answering with "well you should've paid for lifetime updates, neener". That's a really weird and useless reply, unlike what Anderton said to at least try and explain to the OP where the increase might come from.
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 15:50:58
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Sanderxpander
unlike what Anderton said to at least try and explain to the OP where the increase might come from.
Well, that's only the tip of the iceberg. Salaries in the tech fields have exploded. Fortunately some people would rather do a gig they like for a lot less money than make smart bombs for a defense contractor. And of course, the price of a full price upgrade for Platinum is about the same as one reel of 2" tape. Now, it's easy enough to say "apples and oranges," but that's not really the case. All companies have to hit the sweet spot of keeping prices low enough to be competitive while still making enough to stay in business. The factors that dictate that sweet spot are pretty much beyond a company's control. There are exceptions, like Logic or Reaper, that have major money behind them...but those exceptions are rare.
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Dickie Fredericks
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 17:48:32
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John
I don't know but I don't recall CW every saying they would never increase prices. They offered the Life Time deal for a long time giving people a chance to sign up. Lots took the deal some didn't. I can't see why one would complain about raising prices for updates when it could have been avoided with a little foresight.
I took that deal and am very happy I did. It was stupid cheap too.
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scook
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 17:48:49
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must be planning to delete this one Caa2
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bvideo
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 18:19:08
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Anderton
I think it might be a good idea to see what customers get for the extra dollars (assuming you don't wait for a special or discounted deal) before deciding whether it's worth it or not. There's a bit of a problem with this conversation:
Customer: "I'm not seeing spectacular enough updates. I want things that are rebuilt from the ground up like a revamp of MIDI, ripple editing, great notation...oh, and support for a bunch of controllers, bring back the eZine, 24/7 phone support that I can call up any time and get an answer, and a lot more of the Features and Ideas implemented. I mean, c'mon, there are hundreds of ideas in there...can't Cakewalk at least do the top 50? And an arrangement track! Yeah, and also, redo the audio engine for instant tempo changes. And I want great-sounding stretching and better video support, too. And how about doing more with touch, or that spiffy new dial in the Surface Studio? And take care of those loose ends in the Theme Editor and give us more themes! And the devs should spend less time developing and more time in the forum. There are other things, but that's a good start."
Cakewalk: "Whew! It's pretty expensive to do all that stuff, but we can raise the price and be able to do more."
Customer: "Yeah...well...actually I don't want to have to pay for it..."
Customer: "Ha ha... go for it. I've got lifetime updates! 
W10 pro, Sonar Platinum, Alesis Multimix 16 FW, MOTU Express 128, Gigabyte Z370 HD3P, i7 8700K, 16 Gigs, ssd + 2 X 2T disks, D50-MEX, JV80, A90EX, M1REX
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 18:34:32
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Caa2
Proof that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
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scook
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 18:42:11
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scook
must be planning to delete this one
Caa2
predictable FWIW, the original post was Caa2
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Blades
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/08 21:34:18
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As a "lifetime subscriber", who is glad to be one - let me play Devil's Advocate:
Anderton: So if I take the flip side to that, what I read was "so Cakewalk HAD to raise prices so that they COULD bring back the eZine, give more themes, add in 24/7 support (or any phone support, right?) and all of that other stuff you said". Is that correct?
Of course, I'm kidding.
But I think the issue that people are raising, right or wrong, is that for the past few years, Cakewalk has offered certain pricing, with the assumption that the features would continue to be released monthly - that was part of the "Deal" for signing up for a year. Now, they have removed some things like phone support, the eZine, and others, AND raised the prices a pretty good bit. If I were to raise my hourly rate in IT Consulting - just to bring it to industry average, I'd have to go up 30% and I'm quite sure that there would be customer loss in the process unless I was bringing something MORE to the table, not less.
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Darangen
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/09 15:21:01
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Blades has a point.
I'm a lifetime subscriber as well, so I don't have to worry about the increased cost myself. However, if I was not and saw that even though several membership perks were being discontinued my bill was still going up, I'd be rather offended and heavily consider saying goodbye and finding a different home.
That said, as long as what Anderton is saying is true and the increased cost is going to support SONAR updates and not simply line the pockets of Gibson executives, I'd ultimately be fine with an increased cost - because I'd actually benefit from that increase.
So I guess we'll see. It's just very bad timing I think, right after announcing the discontinuation of the eZine and other perks that they announce the price increase.
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/09 18:14:00
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Darangen
That said, as long as what Anderton is saying is true and the increased cost is going to support SONAR updates and not simply line the pockets of Gibson executives, I'd ultimately be fine with an increased cost - because I'd actually benefit from that increase. Cakewalk has some pretty ambitious plans for SONAR that cost money. Cakewalk money does not line the pockets of Gibson executives, it goes back into paying for the growth of the business. Remember, Cakewalk is a really tiny part of Gibson's overall business. It's just very bad timing I think, right after announcing the discontinuation of the eZine and other perks that they announce the price increase. As has been mentioned, the eZine will be re-launched in May as more of a Cakewalk magazine than a SONAR update eZine. This was a trend that was already established in the previous eZine issues. There are already 30 pages laid out for May, along with some other goodies you'll find out about in due time. There was a genuine belief that people wouldn't care that much if the eZine went away - why not put the resources into something else. Well, the community made it clear they cared very much, and Cakewalk did a course correction. However it doesn't produce itself, so it requires resources. What I'm hoping if that the new direction will give the community much more value, without requiring too much of an increase in resources. Finally, I do wish people would realize that the prices quoted are like MSRP. If a professional is making money from SONAR and needs some update feature RIGHT HERE RIGHT NOW, they'll be willing to pay the cost at that time. Those who are willing to wait will pay less. Think about magazines for a moment. A magazine might cost $7.95 at the newsstand, but if you're a subscriber, a couple months before your subscription is due for renewal you get a "Renew now and get the next 12 issues for $29.95" notice. Cakewalk is not going to do anything they think will damage the business. Whether they're right or wrong about any given decision will reveal itself over time, but given that Cakewalk has been around for 30 years, they must be doing something right.
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mikeinFL
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 01:04:50
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I didn't get lifetime because I noticed I update to latest version about every 5 years! At that time, I'll wait for a discount deal and get latest version. I also find myself using other software that does something better or easier, like scoring, or non-midi audio, etc. I was also turned off by how colors can't be fully customized. And I think CW has less incentive to create new features that lifetime users want (if they track who is requesting features).
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 16:32:20
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mikeinFL
And I think CW has less incentive to create new features that lifetime users want (if they track who is requesting features).
Those with Lifetime Updates represent a fraction of the universe of SONAR users. In any event, updates are updates. There aren't "special" updates for Lifetime Update people.
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coolbass
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 18:52:29
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This is not being discussed in a fair way, so I am out.
post edited by coolbass - 2017/04/11 01:51:20
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 20:24:04
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coolbass
Anyway.
New Sonar purchase: 100% price.
To stay current ,after the first year, for 12 months: 50% of original price.
Pretty hefty.
Please stop making statements that are not correct: "To stay current ,after the first year, for 12 months: 50% of original price." Obviously it's not a lie because you are not intending to deceive, you simply haven't read the posts in this thread. It has already been made clear, more than once, that there will continue to be specials and discounts. For corroboration, see posts #5, #10, #12, and #25 in this thread alone. Also look at the sticky announcing the new pricing structure. To be clear - the ONLY discount that is going away is from older versions of SONAR to the latest version. But to be fair, you still have until the end of the month to upgrade from an older version at a discount. Furthermore, you do not have to update every year. You can if you're a professional who would really benefit from the latest features, in which case it's likely deductible or amortizable anyway. But if someone is a hobbyist, they can wait out as many updates they want, wait for a discount, and update at their convenience.
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Cactus Music
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 20:33:53
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 Ya it's another mad Canuck! We get that way when Wall Street messes with the exchange rates.... I just don't shop in the States until it comes back in line again. It's actually better for our economy because we shop at home and travel in our own country.
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ampfixer
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 20:39:02
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☄ Helpfulby coolbass 2017/04/11 02:04:16
The price increase is documented and has a set value. You get 1 year, and after that it's half of retail to get another year of fixes and upgrades. That is documented and can't be argued. Whether or not Cake does specials is still an unknown.
Coolbass is absolutely correct and not making any false statements. There's nothing to dispute, facts are facts. Once the discounts happen then we can talk about how great they are, not until.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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Anderton
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Re: Renewal Fee
2017/04/10 20:56:20
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ampfixer
The price increase is documented and has a set value. You get 1 year, and after that it's half of retail to get another year of fixes and upgrades. That is documented and can't be argued. Whether or not Cake does specials is still an unknown. No, it's not. It has been stated by representatives of Cakewalk in the sticky announcing the changes that there will be occasional discounts and specials. Coolbass is absolutely correct and not making any false statements. Yes he is, because he states that the price will be 50% of the retail price. It has been stated unequivocally by Cakewalk in the first post in the sticky announcing the change that "After your first 12 months of free updates on your new purchase of SONAR, you can buy another 12 months of updates for at least 50% off the regular price of SONAR." Subsequent posts mention the 50%+ discount rate. In case that wasn't clear enough, Alex Westner also stated in response to a query that "We still expect to run price promotions from time-to-time." Others like scook have stated it, and Alex Westner has confirmed. The only way Coolbass's (and your) statement would be true is if Cakewalk is lying and has no intention to offer specials and discounts, and the use of "at least 50%" and "50%+" are intended to be deceptive. Throughout a 30-year history there have been specials and discounts. Cakewalk says that will continue. Anyone who claims that is not true better have something factual to back up that contention. I submit Coolbass has nothing factual to back up that contention. If he does, I want to know the source because it directly contradicts what Cakewalk has said in public and in private.
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