ampfixer
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/02 16:39:23
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It's great that Craig is going to write things up for sound on sound, but what about those of us that don't read it? Can we get it posted here as well?
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/02 16:50:57
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☄ Helpfulby Bob Currie [Cakewalk] 2017/05/03 00:29:04
Really at this point Craig shouldn't need to write an explanation in a journal. Why we don't get release videos in 2017 is beyond me?
it's a PR fail.
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/02 16:54:21
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☄ Helpfulby Shambler 2017/05/02 16:55:44
Kamikaze
Really at this point Craig shouldn't need to write an explanation. Why we don't get release videos in 2017, it's a PR fail.
Are you volunteering to create them?  We have a very small marketing team, and we're currently trailing our product releases. So, rather than delay product releases to wait for marketing, we're just getting these product updates and features out to you guys as soon as they're ready, with videos and tutorials to follow.
Alex Westner VP Product Strategy & Innovation
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/02 23:48:10
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No why would I do your job of promoting your company and educating your users (and I haven't figured it out yet). And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. And with early release, we have the choice of not having that delay if we want. These videos should have been in place from ages ago. they are always on the horizon, you even had some going for a bit, but they dried up.
If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works.
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 04:03:54
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What sets this colour in theme editor? 
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paulo
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 13:51:56
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Hi Kamikaze,
That color issue is a known one. The controller label field picks up the same color as other controls in the theme, but in this case, it doesn't refresh with a theme-change until you restart SONAR. We're addressing it. Sorry about that.
~Bob
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 15:06:52
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Thanks Bob, but I thinking your missing my question and responding to the issue that makes me experimenting to find out the answer difficult. Yes, the colour hangs over from the previous theme, and although I've seen it a few time setting up my own theme, this is the first time I can replicate it so easy. I'm glad you are looking into it, and that it will get tidies up. But this isn't what I am asking here, this is my question. How can I set the colour of the in focus from dark grey to my own colour? I cannot find it within Theme editor.  I'd like to make it the yellow orange for my theme, but I cannot find it in theme editor. (its a stretchable field, so I'm guessing it's not a PNG but a colour select. What is it called?
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Lance Riley [Cakewalk]
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 19:47:53
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Kamikaze
No why would I do your job of promoting your company and educating your users (and I haven't figured it out yet). And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. And with early release, we have the choice of not having that delay if we want. These videos should have been in place from ages ago. they are always on the horizon, you even had some going for a bit, but they dried up.
If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works.
If you have suggestions of videos you want to see I'd definitely be interested in hearing more about it. If you are interested in sharing ideas with me, you can drop me a PM of any suggestions you have. As for new features coming out, we are interested in doing more videos but with a small team it can be difficult to have them done on release day but I understand and agree that getting these out as soon as features are available is desirable.
Lance Riley Product Manager
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 20:58:44
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Kamikaze
No why would I do your job of promoting your company and educating your users (and I haven't figured it out yet). And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. And with early release, we have the choice of not having that delay if we want. These videos should have been in place from ages ago. they are always on the horizon, you even had some going for a bit, but they dried up.
If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works.
Because it's extremely common for every successful company in the world to have customers become ambassadors for the product and the company. I'll take your response as a pass. Like I said, we're understaffed. We're a smaller company than we were last year. We don't have a video production team. We barely have a marketing and sales team. We're running lean. If you guys prefer we just sit on feature development instead until we have tutorial videos together, we could consider that. I'm happy to talk with you offline about this - PM me anytime, or we can setup a Skype call or something.
Alex Westner VP Product Strategy & Innovation
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ampfixer
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 21:31:08
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Alex Westner [Cakewalk]
Kamikaze
No why would I do your job of promoting your company and educating your users (and I haven't figured it out yet). And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. And with early release, we have the choice of not having that delay if we want. These videos should have been in place from ages ago. they are always on the horizon, you even had some going for a bit, but they dried up.
If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works.
Because it's extremely common for every successful company in the world to have customers become ambassadors for the product and the company. I'll take your response as a pass.
Like I said, we're understaffed. We're a smaller company than we were last year. We don't have a video production team. We barely have a marketing and sales team. We're running lean.
If you guys prefer we just sit on feature development instead until we have tutorial videos together, we could consider that.
I'm happy to talk with you offline about this - PM me anytime, or we can setup a Skype call or something.
With all due respect, that was a pretty flippant remark, worthy of a high school student, more so than the VP of Strategy and innovation. Grow up son.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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The Grim 
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 21:58:04
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☄ Helpfulby Alex Westner [Cakewalk] 2017/05/03 22:19:56
i disagree, i like his style , might even be on my positive list should i ever contemplate returning to using soanr as my main daw  and i think he may well have been being serious in the part you highlighted
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/03 22:19:44
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☄ Helpfulby Skyline_UK 2017/05/04 08:08:26
ampfixer
Alex Westner [Cakewalk]
Kamikaze
No why would I do your job of promoting your company and educating your users (and I haven't figured it out yet). And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. And with early release, we have the choice of not having that delay if we want. These videos should have been in place from ages ago. they are always on the horizon, you even had some going for a bit, but they dried up.
If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works.
Because it's extremely common for every successful company in the world to have customers become ambassadors for the product and the company. I'll take your response as a pass.
Like I said, we're understaffed. We're a smaller company than we were last year. We don't have a video production team. We barely have a marketing and sales team. We're running lean.
If you guys prefer we just sit on feature development instead until we have tutorial videos together, we could consider that.
I'm happy to talk with you offline about this - PM me anytime, or we can setup a Skype call or something.
With all due respect, that was a pretty flippant remark, worthy of a high school student, more so than the VP of Strategy and innovation. Grow up son.
Sorry, I wasn't being flippant. I was serious. The Grim was correct. We ship reach release with documentation about the new features, but if you guys would rather us spend more time on tutorial videos to have ready simultaneously with the product release itself, we'd have to delay the product release. Like I said, we just don't have the manpower to do both. I'm open to whatever works best.
Alex Westner VP Product Strategy & Innovation
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tenfoot
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 01:19:34
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☄ Helpfulby RSMCGUITAR 2017/05/04 05:49:47
Can people no longer read? All of the new features are well documented, and to be perfectly honest, are not rocket science:)
FWIW Alex's response seemed pretty up front and reasonable to me.
Bruce. Sonar Platinum 2017-09, Studio One 3.5.3, Win 10 x64, Quad core i7, RME Fireface, Behringer X32 Producer, Behringer X32 Rack, Presonus Faderport, Lemure Software Controller (Android), Enttec DMXIS VST lighting controller, Xtempo POK.
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Brando
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 01:31:42
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☄ Helpfulby FCCfirstclass 2017/05/04 13:33:31
tenfoot
Can people no longer read? All of the new features are well documented, and to be perfectly honest, are not rocket science:)
FWIW Alex's response seemed pretty up front and reasonable to me.
+1 I like the progress on SONAR to date. Almost never use instructional videos. Sorry just don't. Just my opinion. Keep the good stuff flowin'.
Brando
Cakewalk, Studio One Pro, Reaper Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL ASUS Prime Z370-A LGA1151, 32GB DDR4, Intel 8700K i7, 500 GB SSD, 3 x 1TB HDD, Windows 10 Pro 64
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promidi
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 02:09:03
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tenfoot
Can people no longer read? All of the new features are well documented, and to be perfectly honest, are not rocket science:)
Too true. And this new Transform tool is so intuitive it really does not need an explanatory video. All you have to do is chuck some controller events on a track. Bung a transform tool on 'em and move a few nodes and see what happens. It's definitely not rocket science. I learnt how to do that in about 30 seconds....
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taccess
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 04:28:08
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☄ Helpfulby rtucker55 2017/05/04 18:16:17
Firstly Thank you cakewalk the PRV track pane / Enhancements are amazing for streamline workflow .
However it has a major issue that needs to addressed urgently > Please.
1) when i collapse a Percussion folder inside track view > the PRV window track pane ( with my filtered percussion tracks also collapse )
The whole point of the new PRV Window track pane Filter is to be a quick independent filter > not globally controlled by the folders inside track view which create a mess and render the PRV filter useless .
Am i missing something here because :
This essentially means that all my track folders must stay opened always or i will have to re -filter everything in the PRV track pane everytime i open and close track folders .
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 05:46:24
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Alex Westner [Cakewalk]
Kamikaze
No why would I do your job of promoting your company and educating your users (and I haven't figured it out yet). And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. And with early release, we have the choice of not having that delay if we want. These videos should have been in place from ages ago. they are always on the horizon, you even had some going for a bit, but they dried up.
If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works.
Because it's extremely common for every successful company in the world to have customers become ambassadors for the product and the company. I'll take your response as a pass.
Like I said, we're understaffed. We're a smaller company than we were last year. We don't have a video production team. We barely have a marketing and sales team. We're running lean.
If you guys prefer we just sit on feature development instead until we have tutorial videos together, we could consider that.
I'm happy to talk with you offline about this - PM me anytime, or we can setup a Skype call or something.
As it happens I have written guides and shared information for how to do things in Sonar from time to time. I am happy to do this and happy to this for areas I feel competent in in or have something to offer. For example with AD2 http://forum.cakewalk.com/Routing-a-clean-AD2-Drumset-through-Sonars-Console-m3584952.aspx#3585300 and for Theme editer   I was prepared to more on Theme editer, but after you weren't willing to create a sepearte forum area for Them editor and just dumped in third part 'Software' where efforts would easily get lost, I went off the idea. Also once it became clear it was unlikely you were going to make any tweaks, or even respond to interest in tweaking Theme Editor, I though 'why should I even bother?'. I got pretty creative with Theme editor too  Hoping that users would make videos, is fair enough, I don't have video capture software, so I can't, but I've thought about it. But to do it for your monthly releases, isn't. Someone needs to be part of your process, so they know what the new functionality is. (I also live on the other side of the planet to Boston, 12 hours time difference, so not ideal). Be fully proficient with Sonar, (I am not) . Have video capture software. Be American (I joke note, I saw the feed back to the SWA guy from Scotland before Karl did it). Transform is wonderfully intuitive, Track pane, taks a knack, to 'get it'. Having a tech guy sit down a run though how something new works, should not take you guys days of work. Your releases are regular bite size eelases, focusing on typically one area. I do not think it's that much to expect in 2017 that a multimedia developia, use multimedia to educate and advertise their work. I think this should have been in place from the moment you went to regular releases. I also think you are missing an opptunity to show non Sonar users the value of your work process and for them to see regular updates occurring, as Youtube will start shoving it I there face once they have watched one once.
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 05:47:12
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Oh and every time I embed a video, the forum swallows my post.
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 05:50:23
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 13:39:50
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Hi Kamikaze, That color follows the highlighted active track color in the Track View. In the Theme Editor's Theme Browser, go to "Track View"->"Focused Track Background" and "Focused Track Text". Hope this helps. ~Bob Edit: I just found your problem. The text foreground color is always black (instead of following the theme). I just fixed it for 17.05. Sorry for the inconvenience, and thanks for reporting it!
post edited by Bob Currie [Cakewalk] - 2017/05/04 14:35:47
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SquireBum
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 15:44:44
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☄ Helpfulby rtucker55 2017/05/04 18:12:50
In SONAR [2017.04] the the visibility of tracks in the Track View affects the visibility of tracks in the Piano Roll View (PRV) Track Pane.
For example, if I have MIDI tracks containing key switches in a folder and I collapse the folder in the Track View, I can no longer view or edit the key switch tracks in the PRV. Also, if a track is hidden using the Track View Track Manager, then it is not available for viewing and editing in the PRV.
In all past versions of SONAR the ability to view and edit a track in the PRV was independent of the Track View visibility.
Is this new behavior by design or was it an unintended change that occurred during PRV re-design?
If this new behavior is by design, then the filter functionality in the PRV Track Pane seems redundant, since the filtering capability is already occurring in the Track View. IMHO, PRV track visibility should be controlled by the PRV options and the Track Pane filter, not the Track View track visibility.
Thanks,
-- Ron
Cakewalk by Bandlab, Sonar Platinum x64 2017.10, X3E, X2a, X1d, 8.5 Windows 10 x64 AMD Phenom II X4 955 3.20 GHz 8 GB Ram Nvidia GeForce 9500 GT Echo Gina 3G
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WallyG
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 16:03:40
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☄ Helpfulby synkrotron 2017/05/04 16:11:01
Alex Westner [Cakewalk]
.....Like I said, we just don't have the manpower to do both. I'm open to whatever works best.
You and the rest of the bakers have great attitudes! I enjoy working with Splat almost every day (except when there are Honey Do lists!). Keep up the great work! The documentation you provide is sufficient for me. Thanks, Walt
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stxx
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/04 17:23:31
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☄ Helpfulby Alex Westner [Cakewalk] 2017/05/04 21:26:44
Realizing you (cakewalk) are all shorthanded and still managing the updates with still relatively few bugs is no small feat. Also, and I hate to say this, but even though this forum is very important and the information shared here by all the OPs and by CW is invaluable, the most active users I have ever seen at any one time logged in is under 20 people... Certainly there are MANY MANY more users (even though I know they aren't the same 20 users but a good percentage of them ARE on here consistently) and I ,personally, in my own little corner of the world know 10 local sonar users so clearly in the world there are a great deal more Sonar users. So to have someone (one of 20 out of thousands more) continually complain about the lack of videos etc coming out when your company is is having some growing pains and still managing to be productive AND STILL PROVIDE AT LEAST WRITTEN DOCUMENTATION on the new features/fixes to me is unfair and likely not that critical to the huge number of silent users. I've rarely had a question that couldn't get answered here just by searching let alone posting and frankly, I've have more ignores from OPs than from Cakewalk on some issues that I couldn't get answered. If a good number of users are having that much trouble, they should show a larger presence here. Otherwise, just ask your question and likely someone, either and OP or CW baker will answer. I just hate negative posts and complaints... Just sayin'.
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Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/05 08:06:27
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Brando
tenfoot
Can people no longer read? All of the new features are well documented, and to be perfectly honest, are not rocket science:)
FWIW Alex's response seemed pretty up front and reasonable to me.
+1
I like the progress on SONAR to date. Almost never use instructional videos. Sorry just don't. Just my opinion. Keep the good stuff flowin'.
+1 no need to waste time on videos ... there is nothing quicker than searching the online manual for feature functionality; people just need to learn to read again (!!!) FWIW, companies like WAVES do excellent videos on their new products; yet there is nothing more boring than watching a 25 min video telling you which knob is which and what difference it makes on an ever repeating loop in the background. for the time it takes to watch something like this I have it installed, running on material I know well, have browsed the manual for those few knobs which may not be fully intuitive (although there are usually not many in a properly designed GUI is definitely case with WAVES, Cakewalk, FabFilter and many other pro companies) and got a feeling for whether this adds to my toolbox or not ... time is the most valuable good we have - and videos are the #1 way to waste it ... my 50ct
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taccess
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/05 10:02:29
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☄ Helpfulby Alex Westner [Cakewalk] 2017/05/05 14:27:16
No need fo Videos +1
Read the manual +1
Focus on the updates and bug fixes+1
Dont be scared to post for help ! +1
( no matter what you can't know it all and even if you do recalling it all at the right time is sometimes an achievement alone )
With you all the way Cakewalk and Users
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Kamikaze
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/05 15:11:54
(permalink)
Bob Currie [Cakewalk]
Hi Kamikaze,
That color follows the highlighted active track color in the Track View. In the Theme Editor's Theme Browser, go to "Track View"->"Focused Track Background" and "Focused Track Text". Hope this helps.
~Bob
Edit: I just found your problem. The text foreground color is always black (instead of following the theme). I just fixed it for 17.05. Sorry for the inconvenience, and thanks for reporting it!
Thanks. I tried some edits to Focus Track Background, but I wasn't keen on the effacts elsewhere on my theme. I'll live with it until next months release. Cheers for following up
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rogeriodec
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/05 15:12:27
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☄ Helpfulby Kamikaze 2017/05/05 15:18:09
Guys, if we had to choose between producing videos and focus on the updates and bug fixes, it is obvious that the second option is the definitive one.
But I doubt that 100% of Cakewalk's team are programmers, so some people certainly will not be focused on fixes.
The market and experience show us that through videos, the learning curve of a tool is much bigger and the learning time is much shorter, because through images, sounds, examples, interactions, it becomes much easier and faster to learn.
This of course does not excuse the production of good documentation, as it is done today.
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Anderton
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/05 16:24:31
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ampfixer
It's great that Craig is going to write things up for sound on sound, but what about those of us that don't read it? Can we get it posted here as well?
Crucial information usually gets posted in the tip of the week. The SOS articles are longer but also, I try to offer tips that users of other DAWs can translate to what they use so it's a different kind of emphasis. FWIW after four months, the SOS articles are available online for free. You need a subscription to read the more current articles.
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Anderton
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Re: SONAR 2017.04 Update Now Available!
2017/05/05 16:36:37
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Kamikaze
And really any delay in having someone create a video is going to be what, a day. I wish...sure, you can crank out an unedited video with someone talking while you see the whole screen. But to zoom, pan, highlight, etc. takes time. It took months to do each Advanced Workshop video. If Craig is finding the process cryptic, then you are doing something wrong IMO. And we shouldn't be paying for sound on sound to understand how it works. Finding something cryptic is the exception rather than the rule; the PRV changes are significant. However the way I figured out how it worked was by reading the documentation. Then I just used it for about 30 minutes and it all became clear. The main value of the Sound on Sound articles is they are written after having used a feature for a while, so I've had time to reflect on which elements are most important or need to be described. The SOS article on the PRV still isn't done, and probably won't be until the May release comes out...at which point most people will have already figured out the basics. However when the SOS article comes out, it benefits those who haven't really gotten into a new feature, but also, hopefully adds some new twists, born of experience, that can benefit those already using a feature. I understand that it's helpful to have documentation but frankly, I think there's more of a problem with users not taking advantage of it. There have been countless times where I've answered questions in the forum where the person asking it could have found out the answer in a minute or two by either reading the documentation, calling up "What's New" within SONAR, or searching the net.
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