drewfx1


but there are more important things in the world to get really upset about.

See John's fred.

No wonder John's getting his panties up in a bunch.

Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

drewfx1


I suppose someone should point out that grammar is not there for it's (  ) own sake, but to foster communication.

So it doesn't make to ( ) much sense to me to get more than a little upset over situations where the meaning is clear even if the grammar is incorrect. 

Minor frustration is one thing, but there are more important things in the world to get really upset about.

In all seriousness, the meaning is often not clear. It requires deciphering and that tends to not foster communication, but inhibit it IMO. The English language already has enough oddities without adding to it. Really bad grammar or spelling tends to make me not bother to read, or... worse yet, begin to write the person off as a dolt. If they cannot write at a grade 2 level, how good is their reading comprehension, or, how much education/experience does this person even have (and believe me, I have questioned the reading comprehension abilities of more than one person here)? If it is just laziness... well I cannot respect that either (I mean, seriously, how hard is it to check these days?).

That being said, I am trying to reduce my own feelings about such things. Getting upset over anything only harms me, so its much easier to just try not to.

foxwolfen

In all seriousness, the meaning is often not clear. It requires deciphering and that tends to not foster communication, but inhibit it IMO. The English language already has enough oddities without adding to it. Really bad grammar or spelling tends to make me not bother to read, or... worse yet, begin to write the person off as a dolt. If they cannot write at a grade 2 level, how good is their reading comprehension, or, how much education/experience does this person even have (and believe me, I have questioned the reading comprehension abilities of more than one person here)? If it is just laziness... well I cannot respect that either (I mean, seriously, how hard is it to check these days?).

What is it you're trying to say?

spacey

Funny how little quirks can bother one...

I cringe when someone answers, " do you mind if I...?" with, "sure, go ahead".
Is it they do mind but go ahead or that they don't mind?

I have to suppress rolling my eyes in an obvious manner whenever someone says:
 
"Can I ask you a question?". 

dmbaer

spacey

Funny how little quirks can bother one...

I cringe when someone answers, " do you mind if I...?" with, "sure, go ahead".
Is it they do mind but go ahead or that they don't mind?

I have to suppress rolling my eyes in an obvious manner whenever someone says:
 
"Can I ask you a question?". 

Good replies are:
 
- You just did
- Yes, at a dollar apiece and that counts as one
- Do I have to answer?
- Can I ask you to get lost?
- No.
 
 

OK, I think I get it now:

Someone who has something to say and says it with incorrect grammar is "disrespectful".

Someone who says, "I don't give a  %$^& *^$%^ about your ideas because you said it incorrectly!" is being "respectful".

bapu

drewfx1


OK, I think I get it now:

Someone who has something to say and says it with incorrect grammar is "disrespectful".

Someone who says, "I don't give a  %$^& *^$%^ about your ideas because you said it incorrectly!" is being "respectful".

Ideas are plural and it is singular.


That's disrespectful, no?

Perhaps. But if I say "I don't give a  %$^& *^$%^!", then that makes it respectful, roight?

I do Alex and you are a fantastic example of how a warm heart can permeate the limitations of language.

Actually this thread has brought up something in me that has been an increasing concern and has in fact been causing some alarm.  My ability to write to the standard I have enjoyed for many years is in steady and alarming decline.

I'm constantly getting fundamental things like 'i' and 'e' the wrong way round I often find that I'm repeating words in very redundant ways and all sorts of things like that I used to take for granted are taking longer and longer to figure out.

I don't think my intelligence or respect for my readers is diminishing but my ability to write without increasingly more read throughs is failing pretty quickly and I ain't joking.

I've known many great writers over the years whose technical grasp of language has been average and even very poor but what made them great was the ability to convey meaning through the written word and tell great tales, I've also known plenty of able writers who have had impressive vocabularies a strong grasp of grammar and spelling that have had nothing to say but have been long-winded about saying it.

Things like 'should of' yes ought to be 'should have' and like most here I get mildly irritated by some of them but there are circumstances in education, dialects, personal styles that lead to many as many quirks in expressing the written word as there are people writing.

The important over-riding thing to me is if  I can actually understand what is being said.

I'm also thinking it isn't going to be long before I can't make any sense of what I've just written at this rate and I'm wondering how I'll end up being judged as a result.

Had to log in again to post this

Jonbouy

alexoosthoek


Jon, thanks for getting my point :)

I'm not sure what you are saying here?




Btw: mail is sort of on it's way, writing in English about things I even don't really get in Dutch does take some time.

I think I'm saying I'm getting old and going bats...

Don't do that pls, we need you here.

bapu

Jonbouy


I do Alex and you are a fantastic example of how a warm heart can permeate the limitations of language.

Actually this thread has brought up something in me that has been an increasing concern and has in fact been causing some alarm.  My ability to write to the standard I have enjoyed for many years is in steady and alarming decline.

I'm constantly getting fundamental things like 'i' and 'e' the wrong way round I often find that I'm repeating words in very redundant ways and all sorts of things like that I used to take for granted are taking longer and longer to figure out.

I don't think my intelligence or respect for my readers is diminishing but my ability to write without increasingly more read throughs is failing pretty quickly and I ain't joking.

I've known many great writers over the years whose technical grasp of language has been average and even very poor but what made them great was the ability to convey meaning through the written word and tell great tales, I've also known plenty of able writers who have had impressive vocabularies a strong grasp of grammar and spelling that have had nothing to say but have been long-winded about saying it.

Things like 'should of' yes ought to be 'should have' and like most here I get mildly irritated by some of them but there are circumstances in education, dialects, personal styles that lead to many as many quirks in expressing the written word as there are people writing.

The important over-riding thing to me is if  I can actually understand what is being said.

I'm also thinking it isn't going to be long before I can't make any sense of what I've just written at this rate and I'm wondering how I'll end up being judged as a result.

Jon,


My spelling is pretty bad. My typing skills are of the hunt-and-peck variety. Yes, I'm a programmer and I type pretty fast when doing that. Thanks be to compilers and syntax checkers.


Yes, I have spell checker here in Chrome.


Problem is, I am getting old(er) and I too sense the execution slipping away. So much so that I went to the doctor over a year ago about it. She put me on a steroid/hormone treatment and it's 20%-40% better (no pun in 10 did, really).


What I will admit here is that ideas flow faster than the fingers can handle. Brain is in 4th gear and the hands are in 2nd (maybe). Then with the desire to move on I do not always take the time to re-read what I've read with the intensity of submitting an important report or software release. IOW, this is the fun stuff and I may be, at times, as Strummy says, a bit lazy. But it is, in my opinion, never meant as being disrespectful.

Jon, I have noticed a similar decline in my own writing. I have actually put some thought to it. My belief is it is due to over-saturation in written media. As it becomes more and more prevalent in my life, I also become more and more distracted. It has become so routine that I am putting less and less direct focus on it, while still participating at the same level. And that leads to errors. So, one might think it odd to force oneself to slow down at my age, but that is what I am trying to do: pay more attention to fewer things. Kinda like my sig I guess

bapu

Jonbouy


I do Alex and you are a fantastic example of how a warm heart can permeate the limitations of language.

Actually this thread has brought up something in me that has been an increasing concern and has in fact been causing some alarm.  My ability to write to the standard I have enjoyed for many years is in steady and alarming decline.

I'm constantly getting fundamental things like 'i' and 'e' the wrong way round I often find that I'm repeating words in very redundant ways and all sorts of things like that I used to take for granted are taking longer and longer to figure out.

I don't think my intelligence or respect for my readers is diminishing but my ability to write without increasingly more read throughs is failing pretty quickly and I ain't joking.

I've known many great writers over the years whose technical grasp of language has been average and even very poor but what made them great was the ability to convey meaning through the written word and tell great tales, I've also known plenty of able writers who have had impressive vocabularies a strong grasp of grammar and spelling that have had nothing to say but have been long-winded about saying it.

Things like 'should of' yes ought to be 'should have' and like most here I get mildly irritated by some of them but there are circumstances in education, dialects, personal styles that lead to many as many quirks in expressing the written word as there are people writing.

The important over-riding thing to me is if  I can actually understand what is being said.

I'm also thinking it isn't going to be long before I can't make any sense of what I've just written at this rate and I'm wondering how I'll end up being judged as a result.

Jon,


My spelling is pretty bad. My typing skills are of the hunt-and-peck variety. Yes, I'm a programmer and I type pretty fast when doing that. Thanks be to compilers and syntax checkers.


Yes, I have spell checker here in Chrome.


Problem is, I am getting old(er) and I too sense the execution slipping away. So much so that I went to the doctor over a year ago about it. She put me on a steroid/hormone treatment and it's 20%-40% better (no pun in 10 did, really).


What I will admit here is that ideas flow faster than the fingers can handle. Brain is in 4th gear and the hands are in 2nd (maybe). Then with the desire to move on I do not always take the time to re-read what I've read with the intensity of submitting an important report or software release. IOW, this is the fun stuff and I may be, at times, as Strummy says, a bit lazy. But it is, in my opinion, never meant as being disrespectful.

Got it.

 
My apologies for using 'disrespectful' in that context - it wasn't the right word to use to convey what I meant to say.
 
I guess what I was trying to say (in one word) was sort of like "if I can't be bothered to type something legible, then why should anyone else be bothered to read it".
 
And I fully appreciate that English isn't everyone's first language around here, and I think I'm always the first to take that into account.
 
But having said that, I still like to think there is a case for correct grammar, even on an internet forum. And definitely on a website advertising and promoting one's business - in these cases I still think it's unforgivable not to go through some sort of proof-reading exercise.