So more fun with EastWest and Play

Some here may have seen that I've had a number of issues with Play (EastWest's sampler), and bought Kontakt to solve my problems and so on. I also tried to see if I could get a solution on the forums, with no success. It is amusing because their support forums are locked down, only people who are verified owners can see them and post in them, and the'll move anything remotely tech support related form other forums. Ostensibly the reason is to stop piracy, but of course their Play plugins are not cracked. The real reason is so that people can't see all the bugs their software has.
 
At any rate nothing suggested there was a help, but whatever. I also noticed a few other posts from people having Play issues similar to mine, and particularly mentioning the old NI versions working fine. So I noted that I too was having trouble, and that my observation was that Play did have trouble where Kontakt didn't. I also let them know things that had mitigated some of the problems. I was nice about it, never hated on EastWest or the like, just let them know my experience.
 
The result? They quietly disabled my account from being able to post. No communication or anything, just when I went to post to someone today, the account can't do it.
 
I'm not at all surprised, but I figured I'd share it with people here. Doug Rogers (the guy who owns EW) seems to be exceedingly thin skinned about Play's issues. As far as he's concerned it is the most powerful sampler out there and people shouldn't be talking bad about it. He's sure of this because he has the best programmers (he's said this). It would seem that if you suggest to someone that Play might be problematic, and say you personally are holding off on any new EW purchases until it is fixed, that is enough to get you silenced.
 
I am just struck by the contrast to the Cakewalk forums, where problems are out in public, for all to see, people are sometimes downright mean and they still tolerate it generally, and people freely talk about competing products (like ProTools) and that is all ok.
 
Makes me like Cakewalk all the more and makes me completely resolute to never let EW see another dollar.

I can't post in the support forum (or any forum anymore) and I'm not going to bother to contact them. I really don't care, as I said I'm done with their products. I just want to make people here aware of the issues I've had with the, both technical and otherwise, so they can consider that if they are considering purchasing EW products. Their loss is NI's gain, the $1000ish I've spend on Kontakt and related libraries recently would have gone to them for the Complete Composers Collection otherwise.
 
They are just an extremely bad tech company. It is sad, because they make top notch sounds, but they fail at being a technology company. The real problem is the paranoia of their founder. That is actually the whole reason they made Play. Not because they needed something Kontakt couldn't do, or because it is cheaper to not pay the license fee (making your own software is really expensive) but because they wanted iLok DRM. They are convinced that the end game is preventing piracy, not making more sales.
 
So like I said, I'm letting people know. Also taking time to appreciate Cakewalk, how there is a big thread in the most popular forum about a problem with the 64-bit mix engine. There isn't any threats to ban, no moving it to a "super sekert" hidden forum, nope, people get to discuss it, the devs weigh in, and life goes on. That is software done right.

vintagevibe
It's a shame they're that way.  I have SO Gold with the extra mic positions and it sound absolutely incredible but I also hesitate to get to lock into that company.

Ya I'd been an EW fanboy for a long time. The first "real" samples I ever bought was Drumkit from Hell 2, which EW distributed. It was a major purchase for a poor college student. I later got SO Silver, and then Colossus. All this was for NI Kompakt/Kontakt. When they went Play they had a big sale. I was on the fence, since I hate the concept of dongles, but decided fine, I'd give in. Upgraded Colossus to Goliath, and got SO Platinum and Symphonic Choirs. Play was hugely problematic for me, and well, everyone else in the early days but I stuck with it. For awhile things worked ok, but then problem happened again. I waited, not so patiently, for years while Play 4 was on the way since that was supposed to fix things. Needless to say it didn't, so I said "screw it", asked for advice here, and got Komplete based on that advice.
 
I was still kinda "holding out hope" for them, I mean Play is still under development, and I talked to people on the forums, but then this. So I'm just done, there are other companies to do business with that aren't such jerks and, for me at least, Kontakt just works.
 
Also I've discovered that I really, really appreciate the ability to edit instruments. Play is still a player only. They promised Play Pro about 6 years ago, and even had it on "preorder" sale for a time, but nothing has ever come of it. While I'm not a sample designer by any stretch of the imagination, I've found that I do indeed use and value the ability to get in to Kontakt and modify the instruments, when I feel the need.

I have Komplete and Session Strings Pro but they sound really small next to EWQLSO.  If I had tro move away from EW I'd have to get a "real" VSL string section.  The Kontakt ones don't really do it for me.  The thing about EWQLSO is that they sound so d*mn good!  I've had good luck with play but I really don't like the company culture.

Thanks for your advice about Komplete Session Strings.  I thought you could by a VSL version for Kontakt, but I can't find it advertised anywhere?  
 
If I go for the straight VSL (without Kontakt) I would need another dongle (ilok won't work for them).  I wonder which VSL bundles would be good replacements for SO Gold and Solo Violin?

The have a lot of choices and their site is a bit confusing to me.  I do know you can start off with a "special edition" for around $500 or less and add to it.

Just remember that it requires an eLicenser to work. That may be a problem, given the whole bootcamp thing since those DRM dongles are rather fussy.

If you get it let us know how you like it.

Very interesting and appreciated. 

Anyone tried the Project Sam OE ? Spitefire Albion series is epic also ;)

I got the 24 instance of MIR + VEPro 5 at Audio Deluxe on sale a few years ago for alot less than $900.00.
It comes with a very nice algo that that you can use alone or in combination & as a second placement position mic inside MIR.

You probably missed the holiday sale for it though but here's there page.
http://audiodeluxe.com/search/apachesolr_search/vepro
 
I think there's a demo you can try to for both.
 
* I just noticed they no longer include room packs, I got 3 with mine.
If you check them out here's the one I prefer.
http://audiodeluxe.com/products/vienna-mir-roompack-2-studios-sound-stages
 

Zo
PCM can be purchased at 399 nowdayz and those Verbs are untouchable !!

Where do you see that price?  They had a $300 deal for black Friday but I still see $600 most places.

If anyone has problems with the EW forum or EW in general, go onto the Gearslutz forum and contact a user called "EW Lurker"
 
He's helped me out a couple of times

I like my solution better :D.
 
Seriously though, I went to their forums to try and get help, and basically their answers are useless. It is more or less "Your system is the problem, our software is perfect." Also clearly I'm the jerk for wanting to run more than just a DAW on my computer, and to have it on the network and such (even though I tried disabling that and it didn't help).
 
I'll stick to software that works.

You shouldn't have any problems.
I run all my vi's inside VEPro5 together & mix at the same time.
Kontakt, EWQL/ Play 4, UVI workstation plus all my plugins w/o any issues. It took me a while to get used to it but wouldn't be without it now.
Loading up many vi's & sample mem works so much smoother & efficiently using VEP than with Sonar, Cubase, PT, etc..
Especially working with large orchestra libs or templates, just open one instance & leave it all day while working on different projects or daws..