John T
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/25 22:20:52
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Kylotan
It could have just been a link at the bottom of the existing start dialog that said, "New updates available! Click here to launch the Cakewalk Control Center" and that would cover 95% of it. "No need to check email or the web for your monthly updates anymore."... I don't, that's what CCC is for. Stick a link to that in the main app, flag it up when something new is available, done.
Well, there you're making an argument not against the feature, but as to how much time and effort should have been expended on it. And that's fair enough, except that none of us end users have any idea about how much time and effort was expended on it. * * Please nobody bore us with "well, as a developer" arguments.
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Anderton
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/25 23:24:38
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Beepster
so maybe a "Connect to Cake News" button would be nice when I do feel like looking at what's up. I think that's the point of having to click on the notifications button to see the notifications, but we'll find out for sure in a few days. In any event I don't think the notifications are "pushed" to you given that you have to choose to see them.
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Anderton
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/25 23:28:16
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☄ Helpfulby John T 2015/08/25 23:36:45
It just occurred to me...shouldn't we be debating the Start Screen's merits or lack thereof after it's actually been introduced and people have had a chance to use it? I know, I know...that's crazy talk. 
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John
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/26 00:05:35
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Well, where's the fun in that? 
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Adq
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/26 00:51:56
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There is one thing that is related to this theme. If Sonar crashes, it doesn't remember open project. I mean when I start it again, the recent list is not updated, so if there has been new, or "saved as" project, Sonar forget it, and I must find it to open again. I don't know if it will be addressed with this start screen update (probably not), but for me this small improvement could be significant.
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Doktor Avalanche 
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/26 02:35:30
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Anderton
It just occurred to me...shouldn't we be debating the Start Screen's merits or lack thereof after it's actually been introduced and people have had a chance to use it?
I know, I know...that's crazy talk.
I still want a finish button.
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Beepster
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/26 11:36:02
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Anderton
Beepster
so maybe a "Connect to Cake News" button would be nice when I do feel like looking at what's up.
I think that's the point of having to click on the notifications button to see the notifications, but we'll find out for sure in a few days. In any event I don't think the notifications are "pushed" to you given that you have to choose to see them.
Yeah, I just figured maybe this topic had been covered already. I'll save the histrionics until after I see what the official release says (and user reaction). I never install right away anyway so I can wait. I really do hope they allow it to be fully disabled though (no reaching out to home base at all) or as you said only reaches out when told to do so (instead of gathering stuff without being prompted in anticipation of serving it up). The latter would actually be ideal and very respectful to the customers on Cakewalk's part. In fact if it is off by default and requires me to go out of my way to click a button to activate it I'd probably be ten times more likely to use it simply because they showed me the courtesy most other software companies refused to these days. Essentially... convenient but not FORCED. Pique my curiosity but let ME take the action. Put the newspaper rack in my lobby so I can snag one on my way in/out the door instead of trying to cram it through the mailslot. Knowaddimean? Whatevs. I'm sure they dealt with all this because they know how freaky and angsty some of us are about these things. They proved that by allowing offline installs and more recently by making missed monthly downloads available in our accounts. Cheers.
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BobF
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/26 12:57:56
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Anderton
It just occurred to me...shouldn't we be debating the Start Screen's merits or lack thereof after it's actually been introduced and people have had a chance to use it?
I know, I know...that's crazy talk.
OK - GO!!
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ØSkald
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...[Good Answer!]
2015/08/26 19:11:45
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I can't use it because of Scandinaian / Norwegian letters like æÆ øØ åÅ! The shortcut is messed up so it can't go to the right file to open it. OmeDrive screen capture of the startscreen with Norwegian letters. http://1drv.ms/1NVegS8
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Kylotan
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 07:08:49
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John T
Kylotan
It could have just been a link at the bottom of the existing start dialog that said, "New updates available! Click here to launch the Cakewalk Control Center" and that would cover 95% of it. "No need to check email or the web for your monthly updates anymore."... I don't, that's what CCC is for. Stick a link to that in the main app, flag it up when something new is available, done.
Well, there you're making an argument not against the feature, but as to how much time and effort should have been expended on it. No, I was making an argument against justifying the whole new start dialog on the basis of 'users need notifications'. I'm in favour of a new Start Dialog, if only it were to do anything useful for me. I made my suggestions in the past, so maybe they'll make it in at some point, who knows.
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jih64
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 08:02:29
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I think they done a pretty good job with the new start screen, and the notification thingy, very unobtrusive, and I think it's a good thing.
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mettelus
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 08:54:47
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After demoing S1, the start screen comes across as a game of catch up to me.
Work flow enhancements to halve throughput time would be wonderful, and burying issues asap with workarounds is rather foolhardy.
Ever consider how many workarounds exist that the average customer has no clue about because they rarely (if ever) visit the forum? People with only a couple blocks of time each week for music are not planning to scour the forums (but some have to).
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 09:12:39
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Kylotan
John T
Kylotan
It could have just been a link at the bottom of the existing start dialog that said, "New updates available! Click here to launch the Cakewalk Control Center" and that would cover 95% of it. "No need to check email or the web for your monthly updates anymore."... I don't, that's what CCC is for. Stick a link to that in the main app, flag it up when something new is available, done.
Well, there you're making an argument not against the feature, but as to how much time and effort should have been expended on it.
No, I was making an argument against justifying the whole new start dialog on the basis of 'users need notifications'.
I'm in favour of a new Start Dialog, if only it were to do anything useful for me. I made my suggestions in the past, so maybe they'll make it in at some point, who knows.
To be clear since you're sort of misconstruing what I was trying to express... I wasn't justifying the entire thing based on wanting to just deliver updates; I was providing examples of how many of the improvements to the Start Screen are actually heavily requested. The reason I provided those examples is because people were claiming we aren't listening to feedback by using the Features & Ideas forum as an example. I'm personally not a huge fan of your idea since it sort of only solves one issue whereas what we're building solves many and can be expanded upon greatly in the future if desired. Also, now you have to deal with the thing getting in the way if you're not ready to update versus a notification in the Start Screen. If you don't want it to keep bugging you, now you have to persist what the user did, etc. I mean, it's not the worst idea, but fact of the matter is we'd have to do it with caution and there's almost just as much work involved just to deliver one bit of information, versus something we can continue to grow to make SONAR more accessible to both new and returning customers. Ultimately, that was what I was trying to express, that the entire experience from beginning to end is always worth considering, for users of all levels. I just listed a particular example. Another example is Templates in general, which new customers often do not find the benefit of how useful they can be until much later in the experience of getting acclimated with SONAR. When I used to answer calls in tech support here, I could not tell you how many times I explained to people what project templates were and how they could be useful to their workflow. Again, we try to consider workflow improvements for all of our customers, not only the power users. whose features requests of course usually take a bit more time to implement.
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Anderton
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 09:49:23
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Those who have been paying attention will have noticed that several of the new features are fairly open-ended and more like platforms for additional changes. Mix Recall, Vocal Sync, and the Drum Replacer have all had enhancements after their introductions (without having to wait for a yearly update) and I suspect the Start Screen is no different.
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ØSkald
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 10:00:44
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Skyline_UK
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 10:01:25
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I love the way the new start screen shows a thumbnail screen capture of my recent projects!
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Anderton
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 10:04:56
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Jarsve
How can i turn it of?
Read the eZine. It describes two ways to bypass the Start Screen, one permanent and one as needed.
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Beepster
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 14:01:40
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Jarsve
How can i turn it of?
There's an Edit > Preferences option apparently. As Craig said check out the Ezine. I haven't installed it yet but if you can't find it I'll dig it up for you. I think there is a post detailing it in the main Hopkinton release thread at the top of the forum too.
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Michael.b
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 14:54:13
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Kylotan
To be honest the new start screen looks completely worthless to me, sorry. Absolutely nothing on there delivers value to me as a user, .....
I completely agree with you and with others here who question this. When I first saw this thing I couldn't find out fast enough if it could be disabled and how. How long will it be before this 'feature' starts marketing the company's products and other ads? Ryan Munnis, in his long post, managed a shortish sentence mentioning it could be bypassed but conveniently omitted just a few more words on how! Anderton does give a link to the ezine which gives the information. For the benefit of all those who wish to disable it here is the information. Edit > Preferences > File > Advanced Uncheck "Show start Screen on Launch"
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 15:34:46
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Michael.b
I completely agree with you and with others here who question this.
When I first saw this thing I couldn't find out fast enough if it could be disabled and how.
How long will it be before this 'feature' starts marketing the company's products and other ads?
Ryan Munnis, in his long post, managed a shortish sentence mentioning it could be bypassed but conveniently omitted just a few more words on how! Anderton does give a link to the ezine which gives the information. For the benefit of all those who wish to disable it here is the information.
Edit > Preferences > File > Advanced Uncheck "Show start Screen on Launch"
Everybody needs to read the eZine, pref before they install it I suggest. I appear to know this and I haven't even installed the latest patch.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/27 15:43:32
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 15:47:51
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Michael.b
Kylotan
To be honest the new start screen looks completely worthless to me, sorry. Absolutely nothing on there delivers value to me as a user, .....
I completely agree with you and with others here who question this.
When I first saw this thing I couldn't find out fast enough if it could be disabled and how.
How long will it be before this 'feature' starts marketing the company's products and other ads?
Ryan Munnis, in his long post, managed a shortish sentence mentioning it could be bypassed but conveniently omitted just a few more words on how! Anderton does give a link to the ezine which gives the information. For the benefit of all those who wish to disable it here is the information.
Edit > Preferences > File > Advanced Uncheck "Show start Screen on Launch"
I was replying from my phone in my free time, away from SONAR and the exact specifics of how to do it. You're inferring I omitted it intentionally. But yes, you're right, that's how you can do it. If it is at all helpful, the link in Command Center that says "Latest version: Hopkinton (21.7.0.18)" is clickable and takes you to this article which discusses everything in the release as well as the added menu preferences: http://www.cakewalk.com/S...Hopkinton-Update-Notes I promise the goal isn't to turn this into ad-central. Even the current special offer currently listed in it is very small, out of the way, and easily ignored or dismissed.
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Anderton
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 15:52:07
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Thank you Doktor. Michael.b
When I first saw this thing I couldn't find out fast enough if it could be disabled and how. So is it safe to assume you didn't live with it for a day or two to see if it offered any benefits? There are some who won't see value. There are others who will. There are probably some who have followed (or will follow) my trajectory - didn't see any value in it initially, then after using it found that it was quite useful. - Being able to pin all the songs in an album project so they float to the top no matter what other projects I do
- Simplifying the template selection process
- Choosing whether I want to create a project folder or not based on whether I'm just testing something and don't need to create a project
- Specifying bit depth and sample rate at the beginning of the project instead of going into preferences after the fact
- Learning something new about SONAR if I want every time the start screen appears
- The thumbnails were much more useful than I expected in terms of differentiating projects
What completely misses the point is that Cakewalk has, once again, provided choice because the company understands that different people have different priorities and desires. How long will it be before this 'feature' starts marketing the company's products and other ads? Well if they do, maybe it will put an end to the "When does the special end?" forum posts. Whether you want to click on the notifications button is your decision, not Cakewalk's. Ryan Munnis, in his long post, managed a shortish sentence mentioning it could be bypassed but conveniently omitted just a few more words on how! I don't think anyone asked him how to bypass the Start Screen. Anderton does give a link to the ezine which gives the information. For the benefit of all those who wish to disable it here is the information. For the benefit of those who want to know about a release, the eZine is a more concentrated and helpful source of information than random forum posts. For example if someone only reads Michael.b's attempt to be helpful, he fails to mention that you can bypass the Start Screen on a per-project opening basis, or permanently. The eZine reveals all...
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 15:57:31
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I will be very controversial here and no doubt will get a rebound heading towards me. You gotta be kind of dumb not to read the ezine. Don't expect to be spoon fed. The ezine is about a 5 minute read for me. (EDITED - Would you believe this is a "nicer" post )
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/27 16:10:22
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scook
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 16:00:39
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In addition to the eZine, the help file has a New features section which covers each release and the Support Page was updated too.
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Anderton
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 16:08:56
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Doktor Avalanche
I will be very controversial here and no doubt will get a rebound heading towards me.
You gotta be kind of dumb not to read the ezine. Don't expect to be spoon fed.
The ezine is about a 5 minute read for me.
Whenever someone says to me "I read your manual on [product name]" my stock response is "Oh, so YOU'RE the one! I've always wanted to meet you!!!" But I don't know if I'm kidding or not. I'm sure you also love the people on Gearslutz who write reviews of gear, and later on in the thread, you find out they never tried it - but based their review on seeing some guy in his mom's basement who did a YouTube video.
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ØSkald
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 16:25:34
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I blocked it from startup now. But I would like to use it if it was working with Scandinavian letters. Now my project Kjærlighet gets a kj¤rlighet and file manager can’t find it because it don’t exist. I guess nobody cares about Scandinavia.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 16:29:40
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Jarsve
I blocked it from startup now. But I would like to use it if it was working with Scandinavian letters. Now my project Kjærlighet gets a kj¤rlighet and file manager can’t find it because it don’t exist. I guess nobody cares about Scandinavia.
Yup a UTF bug. Serious in my view but has a workaround.
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Keni
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 17:41:18
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Updated and disabled the start scree...
Thanks but no thanks... I appreciate the work it took to create and I'm happy for those that will use it... It's not for me...
For me I wish you fixed the hold-z zoom issue (not returning to smarttool on release)... This is in my face all day.
<sigh>
I know... Can't please everybody, but I hope one day soon all the assorted zoom issues will get their' share of attention...
Keni
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 17:46:27
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Keni
For me I wish you fixed the hold-z zoom issue (not returning to smarttool on release)... This is in my face all day.
Well there are audio/trackview enhancements coming up so you would think they would have it all resolved when it comes out, along with all the other bugs related to trackview. Ta.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/08/27 17:55:21
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Michael.b
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
- Total Posts : 50
- Joined: 2015/01/27 05:30:33
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Re: Upcoming New Start Screen - thinking...
2015/08/27 18:18:31
(permalink)
Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]
..... But yes, you're right, that's how you can do it. If it is at all helpful, the link in Command Center that says "Latest version: Hopkinton (21.7.0.18)" is clickable and takes you to this article which discusses everything in the release as well as the added menu preferences:
Thank you for the information. Ryan Munnis [Cakewalk]
..... I promise the goal isn't to turn this into ad-central. Even the current special offer currently listed in it is very small, out of the way, and easily ignored or dismissed.
Ah, so this isn't going to be ad-central .. but it is going to pipe special offers .. however small and dissmissable. OK. Anderton
..... So is it safe to assume you didn't live with it for a day or two to see if it offered any benefits?
A program start screen is nothing novel to Sonar. I've been around long enough and seen enough start screens in programs and find the concept irritating. Sorry, and speaking personally, there's nothing in your list of interest or which couldn't be managed without the Start Screen. Anderton
..... What completely misses the point is that Cakewalk has, once again, provided choice because the company understands that different people have different priorities and desires.
Not missing the point at all. This started off as being the whole point of this thread. People have been asking if there was any choice! Now that everyone here knows there is choice, then this does indeed suggest that Cakewalk understands that people have different priorities and desires. Long may this continue. Anderton
..... I don't think anyone asked him how to bypass the Start Screen.
How about in the very first post? (Quote) "I'm just wondering and hoping the Bakers were wise enough to allow it to be bypassed...?"(Unquote) Also in posts 2 and 6 and that's just the fist page with discussion on this several times in other pages before his reply. We have been reminded a few times about reading the ezine fully. Equally, I think it would be good for people to read the threads fully before replying so they have full facts. Anderton
..... For the benefit of those who want to know about a release, the eZine is a more concentrated and helpful source of information than random forum posts. For example if someone only reads Michael.b's attempt to be helpful, he fails to mention that you can bypass the Start Screen on a per-project opening basis, or permanently.
I'm sure the eZine is more concentrated and helpful than random forum posts. After all, my random forum post provided more of the direct information pertaining to the point raised in this thread originally missing in Ryan's random forum post. So, let the random posts continue!
post edited by Michael.b - 2015/08/27 18:45:58
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