Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:40:18
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John
I think maybe its that Mike is thinking about the strain on the GPU from Aero. Its not like a heavy duty game. Its really quite modest. All it does is take refreshing the screen off the CPU's back In the past the CPU did this for 2 D display. Now its all 3 D display. Its technology that was going back under windows 95 for games. Very modest indeed. You just need a good GPU and enough vid memory. That can be gotten with very little expense.
Also if noise is an issue a good sound insulated case can be very good for that. I have the Cooler Master 1000 Cosmos case and it holds 5 fans none of which are noisy.
Ha, I have the same case for my HTPC!!! Huge and AWESOME case, IMHO.  Love the easily removeable doors, cable management, tool-less disk bays, bottom intake fan, and removable/ cleanable dust protectors. Would make an excellent DAW case, too. SP
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:41:46
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"Frankly, it is simply not true that you need a powerful, noisy GPU to take advantage of Aero."
Let me help put a positive spin on this:
"The advantages of Aero can be appreciated with a modest video card."
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trimph1
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:42:14
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I've got the same case on my DAW here.
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:43:01
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BEATZM1D10T
mike_mccue
Did I mention AERO in that post?
I didn't bring up AERO in this thread... I just offered comments about it in a reply to something that was mentioned.
With regards to my most recent post... I am thinking about the enthusiasm I have read about CUDA more so than anything so particular as AERO.
On my i7 laptop I run Win7 64x and I have had AERO turned off since day 1.
I just like it that way.
all the best,
mike
CUDA really has nothing to do with Win7 or SONAR x1.
This is very true. CUDA is simply the engine nVidia uses in their GPUs, and they make it accessible to software developers to develop software to run on said GPUs. This has been debated to death, but it hasn't taken off for UAD-style plugin hosting as some have hoped. There is plenty on this in this forum already, so please use Google before turning this into another CUDA for audio plugins debate. SP
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John
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:43:04
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Cool Seth. When I built this system I wanted the bast parts I could get. It paid off in stability and this case is the core of it. Its heavy though. LOL.
But I love it. I think Sonar likes it too.
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trimph1
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:45:11
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John
Cool Seth. When I built this system I wanted the bast parts I could get. It paid off in stability and this case is the core of it. Its heavy though. LOL.
But I love it. I think Sonar likes it too.
It's heavy all right..but it allows Spring a useful launch pad to get onto my 8 foot bookcase here... 
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:46:06
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mike_mccue
"Frankly, it is simply not true that you need a powerful, noisy GPU to take advantage of Aero."
Let me help put a positive spin on this:
"The advantages of Aero can be appreciated with a modest video card."
Well, sorta. As I said before, all you need to run Aero smoothly is a modern video card. It doesn't even need to be modest, like a mid-range AMD 6700 or 6800 series card. You can go with a low-end AMD 6400 or 6500 series card and you will be absolutely fine with Aero on. And it doesn't need a fan. SP
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jm24
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:47:16
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So, does Sonar-X work best with all aero functions on deck?
j
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:47:19
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trimph1
John
Cool Seth. When I built this system I wanted the bast parts I could get. It paid off in stability and this case is the core of it. Its heavy though. LOL.
But I love it. I think Sonar likes it too.
It's heavy all right..but it allows Spring a useful launch pad to get onto my 8 foot bookcase here...
Haha, yep, you shoulda seen the UPS guy when he delivered this thing to me. LOL!!! SP
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:48:11
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Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
]
mike_mccue
"Frankly, it is simply not true that you need a powerful, noisy GPU to take advantage of Aero."
Let me help put a positive spin on this:
"The advantages of Aero can be appreciated with a modest video card."
Well, sorta. As I said before, all you need to run Aero smoothly is a modern video card. It doesn't even need to be modest, like a mid-range AMD 6700 or 6800 series card. You can go with a low-end AMD 6400 or 6500 series card and you will be absolutely fine with Aero on. And it doesn't need a fan.
SP
fixed: Thanks for the help! "The advantages of Aero can be appreciated with a modern video card."
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:49:07
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jm24
So, does Sonar-X work best with all aero functions on deck?
j
It does, as long as you have a modern system and GPU that is designed to work with Vista/ 7. With Aero on, the GPU does more of the graphics related work, including refreshing SONAR, etc. This means the graphics stuff takes no cycles form the CPU, which is good when doing intensive A/V stuff like using SONAR, editing video, etc. SP
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:49:47
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mike_mccue
Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
]
mike_mccue
"Frankly, it is simply not true that you need a powerful, noisy GPU to take advantage of Aero."
Let me help put a positive spin on this:
"The advantages of Aero can be appreciated with a modest video card."
Well, sorta. As I said before, all you need to run Aero smoothly is a modern video card. It doesn't even need to be modest, like a mid-range AMD 6700 or 6800 series card. You can go with a low-end AMD 6400 or 6500 series card and you will be absolutely fine with Aero on. And it doesn't need a fan.
SP
fixed: Thanks for the help!
"The advantages of Aero can be appreciated with a modern video card."
LOL, there ya go! Glad to be of service, Mike. SP
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trimph1
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:49:47
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jm24
So, does Sonar-X work best with all aero functions on deck?
j
X1c seems to work fine here...with Aero turned on.
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:51:04
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So, to be helpful further...
My point is that the whole "oh you need a better video card"
and the "you need Aero turned on" thing is a bit over blown.
Do you see how that all came back around?
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John
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:51:17
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Haha, yep, you shoulda seen the UPS guy when he delivered this thing to me. LOL!!!
Funny, same here. LOL
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:53:22
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mike_mccue
So, to be helpful further...
My point is that the whole "oh you need a better video card"
and the "you need Aero turned on" thing is a bit over blown.
Do you see how that all came back around?
Well, I would leave Aero on and would recommend it to SONAR users unless there is some problem with the system. SP
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trimph1
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:58:31
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John
Haha, yep, you shoulda seen the UPS guy when he delivered this thing to me. LOL!!!
Funny, same here. LOL
We picked ours up from the local computer store here...hernia inducer is what we nickname it now
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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mudgel
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 10:59:43
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I run an nVidia Quadra FX3800 card with 1 GIG of DDR5 RAM and a fan.
When the system boots, before the Windows GUI first displays, the fan really cranks up in speed and becomes pretty loud. Once Windows is loading the fan speed is already slowed down and inaudible.
I haven't been able to trigger that fan to spin up and become audible by any amount of heavy audio processing. AERO always on. Hardware runs nice and cool thanks in part to big slow spinning case and PSU fans. Don't need any of this for SONAR but other graphics, video and 3d work make use of all the extra grunt in this card. Fanless not a choice for this amount of power.
Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:01:20
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John
Cool Seth. When I built this system I wanted the bast parts I could get. It paid off in stability and this case is the core of it. Its heavy though. LOL.
But I love it. I think Sonar likes it too.
Ya I'm with you on building a system with quality parts, and a case is an oft-overlooked aspect of that, IMHO. I don't think I'll be retiring my Cosmos for a long, long time, although I might upgrade what's inside it over the next few years. SP
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:05:18
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mudgel
I run an nVidia Quadra FX3800 card with 1 GIG of DDR5 RAM and a fan.
When the system boots, before the Windows GUI first displays, the fan really cranks up in speed and becomes pretty loud. Once Windows is loading the fan speed is already slowed down and inaudible.
I haven't been able to trigger that fan to spin up and become audible by any amount of heavy audio processing. AERO always on. Hardware runs nice and cool thanks in part to big slow spinning case and PSU fans. Don't need any of this for SONAR but other graphics, video and 3d work make use of all the extra grunt in this card. Fanless not a choice for this amount of power.
Ya, nVidia's Quadro and AMD's FireGL series of cards are a completely different product line and use different GPUs than their desktop graphics cards. They are designed for 3d animation, AutoCAD, and things like that, and as such generally do not offer fanless systems because those particular GPUs are designed to do a lot more intensive work and put out a lot of heat. They do work well with DAWs, though, as I have used various FireGL cards on several systems over the years. However, that kind of card isn't required to run SONAR, really only if you're doing the other stuff. SP
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John
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:08:36
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mike_mccue
So, to be helpful further...
My point is that the whole "oh you need a better video card"
and the "you need Aero turned on" thing is a bit over blown.
Do you see how that all came back around?
Thats the problem I have with what you are saying. It is not over blown. Mike we are talking about using software that demands as much performance from the system as it can get In the case of Aero with a proven ability to help with the over quickness of X1's interface it is wrong for you to make such comments. Further open plugins benefit from this technology too. All the ones that have there own display of ongoing processing. I have tested this on XP, Vista 32 and Vista 64 on the same system. The difference is dramatic. Where XP will show a bogging down and slowing of the display with just a very few plugins open Vista with Aero will just keep on going with a great many open. It is night and day. I don't promote stuff if I don't believe in it. What you do with your gear is your own business but to advise others to follow your example is not the right thing to do here.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:11:43
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I'm currently acquiring the parts to replace my ageing P4 Internet/Office/general desktop.
This thing is going to be a beast and the parts list is totally awesome - but if it is quiet enough, I might even make it my DAW, and make my existing the DAW the general pc.
CbB, Platinum, 64 bit throughoutCustom built i7 3930, 32Gb RAM, 2 x 1Tb Internal HDD, 1 x 1TB system SSD (Win 7), 1 x 500Gb system SSD (Win 10), 2 x 1Tb External HDD's, Dual boot Win 7 & Win 10 64 Bit, Saffire Pro 26, ISA One, Adam P11A,
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John
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:17:02
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John
mike_mccue
So, to be helpful further...
My point is that the whole "oh you need a better video card"
and the "you need Aero turned on" thing is a bit over blown.
Do you see how that all came back around?
Thats the problem I have with what you are saying. It is not over blown.
Mike we are talking about using software that demands as much performance from the system as it can get In the case of Aero with a proven ability to help with the over quickness of X1's interface it is wrong for you to make such comments.
Further open plugins benefit from this technology too. All the ones that have there own display of ongoing processing.
I have tested this on XP, Vista 32 and Vista 64 on the same system. The difference is dramatic. Where XP will show a bogging down and slowing of the display with just a very few plugins open Vista with Aero will just keep on going with a great many open. It is night and day.
I don't promote stuff if I don't believe in it.
What you do with your gear is your own business but to advise others to follow your example is not the right thing to do here.
John, let's cut to the chase. 1) I am advising people to think carefully before taking advice. 2) You are advising people to follow your example. That is all there is too it. good day, mike
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djtrailmixxx
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:19:34
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☄ Helpful
Back to the OP's original question "What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?" X1 has AVX cpu extension support. That would be a SIMD instruction set. Only Win 7 SP1 and Server 2008 R2 have ( I think ) The key advantages of Intel AVX are: Performance: Intel AVX can improve performance on existing and new applications that lend themselves well to largely vectorizable data sets: Wider vector data sets can be processed up to twice the throughput of 128-bit data sets. Application performance can scale up with number of hardware threads and number of cores. Unfortunately I cannot attest to that advantage in practice, but it SHOULD give you better CPU throughput and therefore lower latency at higher track/plugin counts. Of note, CPU throughput/efficiency is way more advantageous than raw GHz in many cases.
post edited by djtrailmixxx - 2011/08/17 11:22:08
Sonar Platinum X64 - Win 10 x64 - Intel SB-E 3930 - Gigabyte GA-X79-UP4 - 16GB DDR3 - AMD R290X - 4x 1TB SSD RAID 0 (Sys and Data partitions) - 2x UAD2 Quad - 1x UAD2 Octo - UAD Apollo Dual
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John
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:22:08
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No you are not advising people to think. On the contrary, you are advising people that new technology is unimportant to a healthy DAW.
Its put in a little different context but that is how it comes across.
I am advocating that X1 users get as much horse power as they can.
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The Maillard Reaction
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:26:24
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John, for your information... you have just been patently rude.
Good day sir,
mike
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keith
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:38:04
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John
I am advocating that X1 users get as much horse power as they can.
This is not a practical approach to software development. At least for software that costs ~$300.
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John
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 11:49:10
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keith
John
I am advocating that X1 users get as much horse power as they can.
This is not a practical approach to software development. At least for software that costs ~$300.
I have no idea what you are talking about. CW did so they much think its practical.
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SteveStrummerUK
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Re:What does X1c do that 8.5 didn't do... that makes WinXP old and outdated?
2011/08/17 12:01:25
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MMMMmmmm mmmm............ Aero   As you were, carry on.....
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