When I rule The World featuring Kristan Mikala

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notnat
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2011/02/06 22:40:18 (permalink)

When I rule The World featuring Kristan Mikala

A new tune featuring Kristan Mikala on vocals...
This is a rough basic mix so far... 
 
Complete REMIX: 2-8-11
 
Latest Mix 2-17-11
featuring David Adkins on harmony
 guitars...
Final Mix (maybe) 2-19-11
http://www.soundclick.com/TanTon
post edited by notnat - 2011/02/19 18:11:39
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    Scottytunes
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    Re: featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/06 22:50:58 (permalink)
    The vocals sound great! I am getting a phasey playback from your SC site.

    String Jammer
    #2
    rockinrobby
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    Re: featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/06 23:04:36 (permalink)
    The band sounds really good, and she's an awesome singer. That is the band right? Or is that all you?

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    rockinrobby
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    Re: featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/06 23:08:32 (permalink)
    yours is one of the sites that when you listen to a song, you can just leave it on autoplay and listen :-) I let it play right on in to the road's my middle name. Great slide and harp...
    post edited by rockinrobby - 2011/02/06 23:09:34

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    notnat
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    Re: featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 01:13:04 (permalink)
    Scottytunes


    The vocals sound great! I am getting a phasey playback from your SC site.

    Thanks Scotty...
    My ears are fried... I'll listen again tomorrow and...
     
    Thanks Robby... just me and Mikala so far, but I'm going to bring in my buddy Dave Adkins on this to sweetin' things up a bit... check back a little later for some hot licks, and a better mix... 
    #5
    rockinrobby
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    Re: featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 01:39:41 (permalink)
    So you're the harp player? And you did the drums? All the guitar and bass work, and mixed it? That is "amazing..." The skirt is nice too, but the song is all you.

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    #6
    acoustigod
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 08:24:32 (permalink)
    I listened to a bit of the first song. It has some good sounds. It sounds WAY overly compressed though, especially the snare and toms. Maybe it was just squashed way too much in the limiter, or possibly the individual drum tracks were squashed too much. The snare bottom is very much affected.

    I can also hear all sorts of background noise. I would advise to get a program like izotope rx and clean up every single track in your Audio sub-directory in your project. That way when the files are compressed, the noise volume is not brought up.

    Shoot for -10db RMS. There isn't much point to go much louder. Everything else is out of line if it's beyond this, not yours.

    Anyway, because of the overly compressed sound, I stopped listening. It was actually hurting my ears :(
    post edited by acoustigod - 2011/02/07 08:37:03

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    patm300e
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 09:38:09 (permalink)
    I am just listening on ear buds right now, but it does seem the drums are being "squashed" (Like acousitgod mentioned).

    Love the guitar & bass sound! 

    Actually the next song with Harp & slide the drums sound Much more natural...Wow the harp player is good!  So is the slide player.

    Bump the reverb (on the next song) just a tad on the vocals...

    I like the sound of this song much better. 


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    #8
    Slow Marching Band
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 11:29:32 (permalink)
    Good song Frank, quite memorable and she sings it well. Always quality playing in your tracks and this is no exception, everything played just enough to support the song. Good stuff.

    James
    #9
    paulo
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 17:49:39 (permalink)
    Sounding pretty good so far. The vocs don't sit quite right to me at the moment though - could maybe be a bit warmer sounding. Look forward to hearing the finished version.
    #10
    jimmyman
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 19:17:28 (permalink)

      Over all this sounds very good but there are a few things that, for lack of better
    words gives it an "unnatural sound". That term I'm using isn't the proper one just
    the only term that I can think of. It may be caused by the combination of those few
    things. Scotty had mentioned the phasy sound. I hear that too but it seems to be
    in the mix. Some similar effect that I remember was in the old Doobie Brothers song
    Was it Listen to the music? (That part) "like a lazy falling river rounding castles in the sky"

      That was more like a flanging effect in that place in the Doobies song as opposed
    to what seems a bit more chorusy on your song and it was (only in places) for effect
    on their song whereas yours is all the way through.

      The kick and snare side stick sound great.
      Going from the (Side stick) to the (snare) is a huge contrast as the "snare has a
    low mid thump to it like a metal snare tuned low with maybe a gated sound but
    with a reverse reverb. The toms sound similar too as well with what seems a
    bit more comping and maybe some kind of saturation. Its a real "loose" sound
    compared to the great sounding, and tight kick.

      The snare and toms have a "swoosh" sound.

      Your piano and vocs have a wide sound. Good on the piano but the vocs coming
    from the "sides" in aural perception does just that. It puts the vocs to the side.
    The acoustic or electric guitar which ever that is coming from the middle and the
    lead guitar fills (as well) sort of (take up that middle space) where the vocs should
    be instead.

      The kick and bass down the middle (it sounds that way) sound good. the toms
    going side to side sounds neat as far as looking at it from a "lets try this aspect"
    but in looking at things from a real world aspect it sounds like the toms are
    stage left and stage right.

      I was over 2 minutes into the song before I realized that she was singing
    "when I rule the world". Of course more listens (not just the first) would have
    a person understanding the "words" in the vocs more, but on the first listen
    there isn't much clarity in the vocs.

       The vocs also have a bit more of an effected sound which kinda falls in with
    the electric piano sound so the vocs are (not very intament sounding) or
    should I say more in front sounding. That might be caused by the "wide sound"
    of the vocs.

      It might be only places in the song where the toms sound so panned such as
    the intro. And take into account that we sometimes hear differently be it the
    "listener" or the "person mixing". So what I'm speaking of here is first impression
    types of comments and I don't know if I'd call them crits as I generally think
    of crits as something that many people might notice that same thing.

      Anyway I guess I can call them thoughts. This is great as usual from you Frank.

     



    #11
    spacealf
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 21:54:22 (permalink)
    Nice smooth song. To me it lacks some low end and the vocals seem to be coming out of the left speaker more than the right.


    #12
    Bub
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/07 23:22:12 (permalink)
    He said it's a rough mix, don't be too critical. :) It sounded great for a rough mix. I had 8.5 up with Guitar Rig running and I was doing some riffs to it. The only thing I noticed is, there's no place for a lead, and it's hard to do riff's with the way she's singing it without overlapping her vocals and taking away from them. She's such a great singer I don't know if I would want to take any attention off of her voice. Not sure if you could add any more too this other than what's in it. That said, it sounds great the way it is.

    I'm almost hearing some Chris Isaak Wicked Game style guitar going good with this.

    Great song.


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    #13
    acoustigod
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 06:31:11 (permalink)

      Going from the (Side stick) to the (snare) is a huge contrast as the "snare has a
    low mid thump to it like a metal snare tuned low with maybe a gated sound but
    with a reverse reverb. The toms sound similar too as well with what seems a
    bit more comping and maybe some kind of saturation. Its a real "loose" sound
    compared to the great sounding, and tight kick.

      The snare and toms have a "swoosh" sound.


    It's because of over-compression and way too harsh of limiting.

    The volume of the track is too loud. The evidence is simple - clipped snares and toms that sound overly compressed as well as massive noise from all the tracks combined. Extensive noise brought up like this is often due to compression when the files were not cleaned up before mixing.

    The correct average volume for most tracks like these is around -10db RMS. While I don't have the file to analyze this track, I'm going take a wild guess and say it's -5db or -7db RMS - about 3-5db's too loud for it's own good.


    He said it's a rough mix, don't be too critical. :) It sounded great for a rough mix.


    Rough mix or not, these issues are really serious. A rough mix should actually not sound this compressed at all, as there are more temptations to compress after and not before.

    There are all sorts of issues with compression. A lot of people just use presets, not knowing how to use a compressor properly. Sometimes solo-ing tracks and compressing while not playing the whole tune causes all sorts of bad decisions to be made.

    The type of limiter used is also really important. If you are using Boost11, then you stand to really damage your track and undo whatever good mix you have underneath. Boost11 is very dangerous plugin to use and I would advise to not use it at all. It will clip and highly distort the sound. A good limiter would let you push it and would not create nearly as many distortions, clips and artifacts.

    Of course, the limiter should not be pushed. A good general rule of thumb is to take the loudest section of the song and make sure that is -10db RMS. This ensures you have great volume but also a lot of dynamics left in the song. There is also low chance of distortions, artifacts, clips, etc. in the final master. Overall, it will sound much better.

    To get -5db or 7db RMS, you really need to optimize the tracking and have really expensive gear and use fantastic techniques at every stage of production. Green Day has a budget to do that... I'm guessing he doesn't.
    post edited by acoustigod - 2011/02/08 06:34:03

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    #14
    listen
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 09:32:55 (permalink)
    spacealf


    Nice smooth song. To me it lacks some low end and the vocals seem to be coming out of the left speaker more than the right.

    spacealf
     
    I thought it was just me or if I needed to start considering hearing aids - the lead vox seems to becoming from the left more than centered...

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    patm300e
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 09:37:17 (permalink)
     thought it was just me or if I needed to start considering hearing aids - the lead vox seems to becoming from the left more than centered...

    +1/ Thought it was my Ear buds!

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    thepogue
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 10:07:43 (permalink)
    Great job Frank! Sound like you guys (gals) have some great chemistry going on...all in all I think your heading in the right direction.

    I'm like Robbie I can just let your tracks roll on...love 'em...a fav of mine is gone tomorrow.

    Great job mate!
    #17
    vechung
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 10:14:19 (permalink)
    Really like the song!  She has great voice.  Nice instrumental arrangement.  However the voice is coming from the right, I would put in dead center. 

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    #18
    notnat
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 10:55:49 (permalink)
    Thank you all so much for listening and commenting, and especially "acoustigod" and "jimmyman" for their critical insight... This is one reason why I love this forum... very helpful...
     
    you guys are right on..  I did squash the drums way too much, and I used too much delay on the vox...
    I should not have posted this yet because I was burned out after tracking all day... I spent maybe 5 minutes on this mix...
    I'm sure the next mix will be better, when I can get to it...
    I'm sorry I haven't commented much lately on all the fine music here... I am listening though...
    #19
    darylcrowley
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 15:59:21 (permalink)
    Scotty - I think your system is going phasey or flangey on you!

    Frank - My only crit is the drums, everyone here has gotten me into the more powerful drums mode.  They sound like what I would do (and that can't be good right?).

    OK- Seriously.  She has great pop voice.  I like the rhythm.  There are not many of us left that use a strong rhythm track, except some of the young new bands that ONLY do rhythm.  (Have you ever noticed that a lot of young "alternative" bands never have guitar solos.  Passé I guess.  I'm a dinasoar.

    Nice catchy tune, great voice.  I'm sure you will pump up the dynamics on the next pass, but this is good tune!  Sounds very contemporary.

    Daryl


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    #20
    amateur
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 16:26:42 (permalink)
    Beautiful song, and she has a great voice ("Rule the World")
    #21
    notnat
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 17:43:39 (permalink)
    Thanks Daryl and Amateur...

    Here is the new Mix...
    http://www.soundclick.com/TanTon
    #22
    johnnyV
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 19:01:42 (permalink)
    Overall nice powerfull mix, Great voice. Only thing bugging me almost right out of the gate is the kick and bass are doing two different patterns. I'd redo the kick to match closer to the bass.
    Otherwise I like what you are doing with your songs, good stuff.

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    #23
    mgh
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 19:14:54 (permalink)
    not heard the original but this mix sounds excellent dude, mix is spot on, great voice and i like the message and tune. nicely wide and everything blends in well.

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    Kroneborge
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/08 21:00:07 (permalink)
    I didn't hear the original, but I sure LOVE the remix.

    Seriously, even though this isn't the type of music I normally listen too, I could almost see me putting down money for it.   And at the minimum it's the type of song when it comes on, I stop listening to the people I'm talking to and just enjoy the music.

    I REALLY loved her singing, it just caught me up.   Playing was great as well.

    Sorry, I don't have much to criticize.




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    #25
    jimmyman
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala (new mix) 2011/02/08 22:25:12 (permalink)


      The new mix is "outstanding". I really don't know what to think of the whole concept
    or subject of panning in general terms, not (your song) just the "subject in general".
    Such as the "amount of difference" that it makes when listening on a system that allows
    "that" subject to be heard and noticed. I would speculate that even a person hearing
    a song where tasteful panning has been done (from a distance) would still hear
    a difference that "that" makes in the quality of sound.

      lately I've really been into the thought of thinking Left, Center, Right. Although
    that is what "panning" is all about anyway to me it's been I guess "how" I think
    about it, or "what is panned where". I think I'm looking at this from a "dimension"
    aspect so "centered" isn't just necessarily down the middle but is yet an important
    "part" of the song, as well as left and right are also.

       It's like instead of thinking stereo I'm thinking three dimensional. That's what
    I'm hearing in the way that you've mixed this. The vocs now have that three
    dimensional perception as the middle sounds great "and" the "outsides"
    of the vocals enhance what's in the middle.

      And the "placement" or the perception of the placement of the instruments is
    such that the "basic or vital parts"  are in the middle such as the

      Voc
      Bass
      Drums
      guitar

      The electric piano with it "wider" sound seems more to the outside in terms
    of width as well as other things, be it the effects sound or whatever.
    So this to me has me perceiving the ambiance as "all around" such as more
    "detailed". So I'm not as prone to think like "ok this is panned there and that
    is panned at such and such place. It makes everything so distinct, lush, colorful
    and rich sounding.

       You do kind of "just stop" at the end with no indication of the ending is coming
    which almost seems like a "Frank" thing, but I've come to get used to that.

       Awesome Frank you go man!
     
     
    post edited by jimmyman - 2011/02/08 22:27:32
    #26
    Kroneborge
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala (new mix) 2011/02/08 23:08:39 (permalink)
    Oh and I did take the time to rate it 5 stars, hope you make it to #1, really


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    #27
    acoustigod
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/09 03:20:09 (permalink)
    notnat


    Thanks Daryl and Amateur...

    Here is the new Mix...
    http://www.soundclick.com/TanTon


    Yeah, that's a big improvement. I can listen now ;)

    Maybe high pass filter on bass guitar at 35-40hz.

    Maybe lower the background vox by a tiny bit. Just a little.

    Increase the volume of the rim shots a bit.

    Otherwise it's very good now.
    post edited by acoustigod - 2011/02/09 03:21:51

    Need a song, demo or album mixed to sound great? Why waste weeks or months learning how to mix when I'm sure you'd rather spend your time writing songs and performing gigs? I can mix your tracks so that they sound fantastic. My rates are very affordable. Send me a PM to find out more.
    #28
    BretB
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/09 12:41:34 (permalink)
    Your stuff always sounds so amazing.  Clean and professional in every respect from instrumentation to production.  Something to aspire too.

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    #29
    patm300e
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    Re:featuring Kristan Mikala 2011/02/09 14:22:39 (permalink)
    NOW we are talking...She sounds great!  I like the way the bass sits in there with her voice. 

    The little guitar passages are sweet and ot overriding the song...Backup vocals sit well too.

    The drums sound less squished than the last one (and more natural).
    Very nice!

    Still like the second song too!




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    #30
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