noiseboy
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Working with video in X1
Ok, watched the youtube vids and... absolutely nothing about working with video. Anyone from Cakewalk care to comment? Is functionality just the same as 8.5?
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yummay
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 15:45:37
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BUMP! I would also really like to know about video-related functions / formats / workflow improvements.
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garrigus
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 15:49:38
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Yes, working with video is pretty much the same. Scott -- Scott R. Garrigus - Author of the Cakewalk Sonar and Sony Sound Forge Power book series. Get Sonar 8 Power - Today! Go to: http://www.garrigus.com/ Publisher of DigiFreq - free music technology newsletter. Win a free SoundTech Vocal Trainer Package, go to: http://www.digifreq.com/digifreq/ Publisher of NewTechReview - free consumer technology newsletter. Win a free i2i Stream Wireless Music Pack, go to: http://www.newtechreview.com/newtechreview/
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noiseboy
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 15:56:46
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Sigh. I mean... did Cakewalk not get enough feedback?
I'm really gonna have to think again about following Sonar. I see Reaper coming on in leaps and bounds. They're not there yet for AV work, but it looks like they'll get there quicker than Cakewalk. Guys, it really wouldn't have taken much to address the issues that really need addressing, but clearly we're not on your radar.
It's obvious you're not serious about making inroads into the AV industry. Great, great shame.
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stickman393
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 16:13:06
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It's better to have a large, divided, and opinionated customer base, than no customers at all.
"Workflow!"
"No, Notation!"
"MIDI Editing!"
"No, Audio Engine"
"What about working with video?!?"
"Cakewalk just doesn't listen/care about their customers/etc etc"
It seems to me that Cakewalk cycle through the various areas of the product. So Workflow got the attention this time. Recently the audio engine got the revamp. Then the looping MIDI folks. Perhaps next time it will be Notation or Video.
I say, Good Job Cakewalk.
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 16:42:22
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Stay on topic, please. Asking questions about X1, requesting features, and talking about X1 is fine. Devolving a conversation into a complaint thread, and/ or dragging in a competitors product is not.
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yorolpal
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 16:49:31
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Huh? are you reading these threads, Seth?? Sorry, but I'm not seeing any of the "devolving" you're refering to. In fact the last ol feller actually was rootin for you guys. And you can't blame those others for feelin a bit left out update after update. We love ya, ol pal. Just wish the broadcast community was taken into a bit more consideration sometimes. X1 looks mighty good...can't wait, myself!
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ba_midi
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 16:55:18
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Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
]
Stay on topic, please. Asking questions about X1, requesting features, and talking about X1 is fine. Devolving a conversation into a complaint thread, and/ or dragging in a competitors product is not.
+10 I like the initial presentation -- albeit that it's a bit light on details. I think you or someone else said more details will be coming soon. So personally, I'll be patient. I like a lot of the new workflow look, though.
post edited by ba_midi - 2010/11/01 16:56:31
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noiseboy
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 17:06:37
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Seth - sorry if you don't like what you hear. But I am responding to the X1's feature set on the subject of this thread. Feel free to add any more info that we don't currently know, but if it is the case that there has been no attention to the whole AV side of Sonar in this new incarnation - despite many, many people feeding back requests - that strikes me as a pretty poor show and I should be allowed to say so without being ticked off. To their great credit, Cakewalk has always been open in their forums, it would be the final straw if this were to be revoked now.
I've been using Sonar now for many years, loyally upgrading along the way, and frankly I feel that the area I work in has been increasingly ignored. X1, for us, I think will be a colossal missed opportunity.
Unless, of course, you know different...
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 17:17:00
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Discussing your desires for video features in SONAR is totally fine. However, there was a side discussion starting to brew and it looked to me like this thread was going to go down that ugly road, so I nipped it in the bud. That, and only that, was my reason for steering this post back on topic. Again, feel free to voice your concerns and desires about video in SONAR, or whatever else you want to see in SONAR. Let's just be sure to keep the diuscussion on topic and away from the sarcastic, angry discussions that we've seen here so often in the past. Carry on. 
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mudgel
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 18:33:03
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Seth:
Thanks for steering the thread back on track but the OP had a question, the answer to which has not been given.
Having twice interjected in the thread and not answered the question speaks loudly to there being no changes to the Video side of SONAR X1.
I've already seen enough of X1 to take the $99 upgrade offer but I'd be interested to know if there've been any enhancements in the Video area too.
Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 18:40:11
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Indeed, to answer the OPs question ... scoring to video hasn't seen any improvements in X1. I know we've discussed it in the past and it will be on the table for the future, though.
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noiseboy
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 18:58:00
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Seth Perlstein [Cakewalk
]
Indeed, to answer the OPs question ... scoring to video hasn't seen any improvements in X1. I know we've discussed it in the past and it will be on the table for the future, though.
That at least is good to hear, thanks Seth. For me. dunno how long I can wait though.
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passenger57
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 19:17:40
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I was holding out hope for video improvements
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Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 20:17:24
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We all wanted to provide enhancements to video and it was discussed at length. But realistically we have limited resources (as most companies do) and, in a way, have to kind of work on things in chunks or at least from a logical development standpoint. Video support will see improvement, but it won't be in the initial release of SONAR X1.
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passenger57
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/01 22:04:08
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Video support will see improvement Thanks for addressing this Brandon. Good to know this may be coming down the road.
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wynnsong
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 00:23:21
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Thanks Brandon! Keep fighting the good fight!
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mattplaysguitar
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 00:51:49
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Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk
]
We all wanted to provide enhancements to video and it was discussed at length. But realistically we have limited resources (as most companies do) and, in a way, have to kind of work on things in chunks or at least from a logical development standpoint. Video support will see improvement, but it won't be in the initial release of SONAR X1.
+1 That's certainly fair enough. It's a big change and workflow enhancements really looks (so far at least) to be the big strong focus here and I think that's the most important. We have to remember that SONAR is primarily a DAW and the majority of users won't use the video feature. Once other major issues have been addressed, it's fair enough that video could see some improvement, but clearly there was much more to deal with first. Even with serious video enhancements, it's never going to take over a proper video editor. Any professional (if they choose to use SONAR) is going to use a more powerful program DESIGNED specifically for video for their video parts and then import into SONAR for the audio or audio tweaks. Out of curiosity, what video enhancements were you asking for? I have only used it for video a few times but couldn't think of anything that might be needed as I would be doing all the video side in another program anyway.
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noiseboy
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 03:30:43
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mattplaysguitar
Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk
]
We all wanted to provide enhancements to video and it was discussed at length. But realistically we have limited resources (as most companies do) and, in a way, have to kind of work on things in chunks or at least from a logical development standpoint. Video support will see improvement, but it won't be in the initial release of SONAR X1.
+1
That's certainly fair enough. It's a big change and workflow enhancements really looks (so far at least) to be the big strong focus here and I think that's the most important. We have to remember that SONAR is primarily a DAW and the majority of users won't use the video feature. Once other major issues have been addressed, it's fair enough that video could see some improvement, but clearly there was much more to deal with first.
Even with serious video enhancements, it's never going to take over a proper video editor. Any professional (if they choose to use SONAR) is going to use a more powerful program DESIGNED specifically for video for their video parts and then import into SONAR for the audio or audio tweaks.
Out of curiosity, what video enhancements were you asking for? I have only used it for video a few times but couldn't think of anything that might be needed as I would be doing all the video side in another program anyway.
I think we're at cross purposes - the changes requested were all about audio when working TO picture, not editing video - that's the last thing I want or need Sonar to do! I'm just out the door so can't elaborate right now, but lots of fundamental changes are needed - video following edits, a rethink of cue points and tempos etc.
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nathan.madsen
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 08:34:16
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I'd like to put another recommendation in for better video support and performance in Sonar - especially when it comes to video post production. I know that Cakewalk would prefer we not discuss other DAWs here and I'll respect that but the simple matter is other programs have more advanced toolsets for video post production that Sonar does. And some have for years. When you look through Sonar's promo materials many times they include some footage of mention of post production for video. (For example how many times have we seen that jet fighter footage?!)
Key point: if Sonar wants to promote post production for film as one of it's features AND if Sonar wants to be the leading DAW for PC - it's video functionality needs MASSIVE improvements. I've brought this up to Cakewalk many times in the past and frankly to hear "it's on the table" years later... well it's discouraging.
Those are my thoughts on the matter.
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yummay
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 08:41:25
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I think we're at cross purposes - the changes requested were all about audio when working TO picture, not editing video - that's the last thing I want or need Sonar to do!
I'm just out the door so can't elaborate right now, but lots of fundamental changes are needed - video following edits, a rethink of cue points and tempos etc.
I totally agree! I am not wishing for SONAR to become a full video editing suite... I just want it to keep improving its audio-for-picture toolkit / feature set. Just for a start, to be able to import ANY Quicktime file would be one big PITA less for me... FX chain, for instance, is a major + for me in this case. To be able to recall a 2-3 plugin FX chain on a clip-per-clip basis is a major step forward... (Hey, I'm thinking about it now... please do not tell me that FX chains works only with FX bins on tracks and buses...) 
Yummay, Amuses-gueules sonores Bite-sized sounds and harmonic entrées Dell Studio 1747 (I7), Tascam US20x20, Yamaha 01v96V2 / Behringer ADA 8000, Godin LGXT+ Roland GR-09, Behringer Motor 49. Windows 10 (64), Sonar Platinum, Komplete 10, Sound Forge 10, Vegas pro 9, Waves Gold.
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Majic
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 10:26:21
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Maybe we'll see video improvements in SONAR X2. Or maybe SONAR V1.
Enjoy the time you've got, because it's all the time you get.
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passenger57
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 12:05:35
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I'm just out the door so can't elaborate right now, but lots of fundamental changes are needed - video following edits, a rethink of cue points and tempos etc. I would LOVE to have the ability to lock tempo to picture as well as quicktime support. I think cake would get alot more film/tv scoring customers and would keep more too (like me). But I'm sticking with it for now.
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Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 13:18:47
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yummay
FX chain, for instance, is a major + for me in this case. To be able to recall a 2-3 plugin FX chain on a clip-per-clip basis is a major step forward... (Hey, I'm thinking about it now... please do not tell me that FX chains works only with FX bins on tracks and buses...)
You'll be happy to know that FX Chains work on a per-clip basis as well.
post edited by Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk] - 2010/11/02 13:20:11
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...wicked
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 13:59:57
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Do they provide any "macro" controls like Live does with chained effects?
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noiseboy
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 15:37:13
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I know I'm probably asking for the impossible here, but here goes...
It looks like I'm far from alone in feeling that a video upgrade is long, long overdue. I'm also heartened that it has been taken seriously by Cakewalk, but put on a temporary shelf to get X1 out the door. Without making any demands, I think it would make all the difference if Cakewalk could commit a little further, and tell us that video would be addressed in the lifetime of X1.x. If that was a commitment, I'd buy X1 in a heartbeat and I suspect I wouldn't be alone.
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eratu
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 16:46:22
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noiseboy
I know I'm probably asking for the impossible here, but here goes...
It looks like I'm far from alone in feeling that a video upgrade is long, long overdue. I'm also heartened that it has been taken seriously by Cakewalk, but put on a temporary shelf to get X1 out the door. Without making any demands, I think it would make all the difference if Cakewalk could commit a little further, and tell us that video would be addressed in the lifetime of X1.x. If that was a commitment, I'd buy X1 in a heartbeat and I suspect I wouldn't be alone.
Well said, I wouldn't mind if Cakewalk could more definitively comment on this issue. However, my guess is that there's only so much they can say. :) They have a business model, which does not usually include divulging of specific future plans. I do believe they listen, though, so if you submit a feature request, and continue to ask them, they will hear you. Now, if they can do something about it soon is entirely another matter. It may be quite an investment of resources to do the things we're asking for re: video/film features.
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sdog
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 17:19:44
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noiseboy
I know I'm probably asking for the impossible here, but here goes...
It looks like I'm far from alone in feeling that a video upgrade is long, long overdue. I'm also heartened that it has been taken seriously by Cakewalk, but put on a temporary shelf to get X1 out the door. Without making any demands, I think it would make all the difference if Cakewalk could commit a little further, and tell us that video would be addressed in the lifetime of X1.x. If that was a commitment, I'd buy X1 in a heartbeat and I suspect I wouldn't be alone.
You would not be alone!!!
Doug Gallob - Composer/Audio Engineer Aural Hygiene
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yummay
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 17:31:50
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Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk
]
yummay
FX chain, for instance, is a major + for me in this case. To be able to recall a 2-3 plugin FX chain on a clip-per-clip basis is a major step forward... (Hey, I'm thinking about it now... please do not tell me that FX chains works only with FX bins on tracks and buses...)
You'll be happy to know that FX Chains work on a per-clip basis as well.
Great stuff!! Thanks to Cake!
Yummay, Amuses-gueules sonores Bite-sized sounds and harmonic entrées Dell Studio 1747 (I7), Tascam US20x20, Yamaha 01v96V2 / Behringer ADA 8000, Godin LGXT+ Roland GR-09, Behringer Motor 49. Windows 10 (64), Sonar Platinum, Komplete 10, Sound Forge 10, Vegas pro 9, Waves Gold.
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Jose7822
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Re:Working with video in X1
2010/11/02 17:33:46
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sdog
noiseboy
I know I'm probably asking for the impossible here, but here goes...
It looks like I'm far from alone in feeling that a video upgrade is long, long overdue. I'm also heartened that it has been taken seriously by Cakewalk, but put on a temporary shelf to get X1 out the door. Without making any demands, I think it would make all the difference if Cakewalk could commit a little further, and tell us that video would be addressed in the lifetime of X1.x. If that was a commitment, I'd buy X1 in a heartbeat and I suspect I wouldn't be alone.
You would not be alone!!!
+1 Better video scoring features would be nice to have in Sonar.
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