pianodano
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Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
Hi to All, I Installed 8.5 a few days back and have been running into crashes (3 so far). Prior to 8.5, I had been at Sonar 6 running extremely high track counts, with well over 100 tracks on the most recent song in 6, and numerous softsynth counts. But I don't ever remember having 6 crash. This problem seems to arise after long sessions or when the system has been in use for many hours. The most recent crash ocurred when opening Sonar HELP. It just threw up a "out of memory" dialog and zap. Zilch. Does anyone know if 8.5 is not releasing or leaking memory ? Computer is a ADK core i7, 3gig ram with 1 system drive, 1 audio drive and 1 samples drive. OS is Windows XP pro. Lynx Aurora convertors. Reported latency is 4 ms. Current project has 18 midi and 3 audio tracks. 2 instances of Realguitar are inserted. Audio effects are 1 UAD on each audio track and 1 instance of Lexicon reverb on a buss. As an aside, it doesn't seem to be handling midi data as well as a 6 either. When looping, it has a approx 10 ms delay spitting out midi events at the loop return to the beginning. It also currently has 1 midi track which has gone dead and stopped playing it's data. Thanks, Danny
post edited by pianodano - 2010/04/15 07:25:33
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krizrox
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 09:38:04
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This sounds exactly like the same problem I was having. It got so bad I eventually made the painful decision to just stop using Sonar for new projects and ported over to Samplitude - which has been running rock solid for months now. I keep Sonar active because I have projects in the works that I need to finish and I have like 5 or 6 years of projects in the can that I'll periodically need to retrieve. One thing that seemed to make a big difference for me was to increase the playback and record I/O buffer sizes to 1024. Which had the unfortunate side-effect of making the overall response of Sonar a little sluggish. But it seemed to solve the crashing problem enough to where I could get work done without worrying about constant random crashing. If nothing else works for you, try playing around with those buffer size and see if the problem goes away. Good luck!
Larry Kriz www.LnLRecording.com www.myspace.com/lnlrecording Sonar PE 8.5, Samplitude Pro 11, Sonic Core Scope Professional/XTC, A16 Ultra AD/DA, Intel DG965RY MOBO, Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 2.4GHz processor, XFX GeForce 7300 GT PCIe video card, Barracuda 750 & 320GB SATA drives, 4GB DDR Ram, Plextor DVD/CD-R burner.
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 11:47:24
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Thanks for weighing in. Let's hope that someone else will have more to say about this. I am now about ready to start recording the current project midi tracks as audio. I wonder if it can even do it.
Danny
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krizrox
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 12:11:13
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Frankly, I'd be surprised if anyone chimed in with a definitive answer. These types of posts have been floating around here for years. You rarely ever see positive closure. If there was a one-size fits all solution, I'm sure it would be a sticky at the top of the page.
If nothing else, call Cakewalk TS and run the problem by them and see what they have to say about it. That's what they are there for. You might get lucky and they'll have a valid cure for the problem. I wasn't so lucky. But you know what, I don't care any more. I found happiness elsewhere and that's all that mattered. I have a business to run and that means more to me than loyalty to a specific software program.
Larry Kriz www.LnLRecording.com www.myspace.com/lnlrecording Sonar PE 8.5, Samplitude Pro 11, Sonic Core Scope Professional/XTC, A16 Ultra AD/DA, Intel DG965RY MOBO, Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 2.4GHz processor, XFX GeForce 7300 GT PCIe video card, Barracuda 750 & 320GB SATA drives, 4GB DDR Ram, Plextor DVD/CD-R burner.
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 12:27:57
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It could be that no one else will chime in. Honestly, this is exactly why I had stopped at 6 for so long. My experience has always been that they are constantly bleating over fixing some things in a new release all the while they're inadvertantly breaking something else. Sheesh. 
post edited by pianodano - 2010/04/15 12:30:17
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strikinglyhandsome1
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 12:36:19
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I reported that it has a different memory to 8.3.1 in about October. I still stand by that. I've tested it. All I can say is that what happens with mine and I seriously do not care if it's better or worse on other peoples. The only one I use is mine and that's the one I want to see good performance on. BTW they've never chipped in when anyone has mentioned this so you won't get any 'Official/unofficial Cake' guidance.
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 13:09:50
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I am going to look up your post from Oct. I'd bet most of us shall I say, more seasoned users, have blazing fast machines, tweaked to the max and there is absolutely no excuse for this bull. I mean, 3 audio tracks for crying out loud and some midi tracks and run out of 3 gig of memory ??
post edited by pianodano - 2010/04/15 13:11:18
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 13:17:19
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Quote Strikinglyhandsome1 BTW they've never chipped in when anyone has mentioned this so you won't get any 'Official/unofficial Cake' guidance. Lovely. But hey, that is now normal around here for complex problems. I feel like I'm back at 3 all over again. Just a different "feature" set. Been there, done that. Ain't going down that road again either.
post edited by pianodano - 2010/04/15 13:22:27
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JonD
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 13:24:02
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Dan,
You should also consider contacting ADK. They might be able to help.
SonarPlat/CWbBL, Win 10 Pro, i7 2600K, Asus P8Z68 Deluxe, 16GB DDR3, Radeon HD5450, TC Electronic Impact Twin, Kawai MP11 Piano, Event ALP Monitors, Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro, Too Many Plugins, My lucky hat.
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F@ker
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 13:24:36
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pianodano
... This problem seems to arise after long sessions or when the system has been in use for many hours...
This raises a red flag; have you tried clearing your undo history every so often as you work?
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JonD
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 13:47:12
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F@ker
pianodano
... This problem seems to arise after long sessions or when the system has been in use for many hours...
This raises a red flag; have you tried clearing your undo history every so often as you work?
Good catch. Noel even mentions it here: http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=1850998 If it is the problem (IIRC) there's a setting you can change that basically solves the issue.
SonarPlat/CWbBL, Win 10 Pro, i7 2600K, Asus P8Z68 Deluxe, 16GB DDR3, Radeon HD5450, TC Electronic Impact Twin, Kawai MP11 Piano, Event ALP Monitors, Beyerdynamic DT770 Pro, Too Many Plugins, My lucky hat.
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strikinglyhandsome1
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 13:51:28
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Yes it's a good tip. I have a small undo history.
I never really have to go back because I'm generally perfect in all I do.
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Wickens
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 14:14:55
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Has anyone tried running a memtest just in case?
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brundlefly
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 14:19:33
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As an aside, it doesn't seem to be handling midi data as well as a 6 either. When looping, it has a approx 10 ms delay spitting out midi events at the loop return to the beginning. It also currently has 1 midi track which has gone dead and stopped playing it's data. Hi Dano. Not sure what to tell you about the memory error; I haven't seen that. But have noticed an unusually high number of posts about silent MIDI events/tracks lately, many of which have been resolved by users increasing the MIDI Prepare Using buffer. I think the default is 500ms, but you may have lowered it at some point. I seem to be fine with 250ms, but CJay has been recommended trying a setting of 600-700ms, and that has worked for some.
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 14:21:26
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strikinglyhandsome1
Yes it's a good tip. I have a small undo history.
I never really have to go back because I'm generally perfect in all I do.
Thanks to everyone for chipping in and thanks for the link. I wonder what's suddenly different betwixed 6 and 8.5 re undo levels or why we even need to be aware of it? For sure I make my share of flubbydubs during overdubs but I don't think it's suddenly a whole lot more. 
Dan
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 14:31:28
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brundlefly
As an aside, it doesn't seem to be handling midi data as well as a 6 either. When looping, it has a approx 10 ms delay spitting out midi events at the loop return to the beginning. It also currently has 1 midi track which has gone dead and stopped playing it's data.
Hi Dano. Not sure what to tell you about the memory error; I haven't seen that. But have noticed an unusually high number of posts about silent MIDI events/tracks lately, many of which have been resolved by users increasing the MIDI Prepare Using buffer. I think the default is 500ms, but you may have lowered it at some point. I seem to be fine with 250ms, but CJay has been recommended trying a setting of 600-700ms, and that has worked for some.
Hey man, hope all is good.
I currently have the midi buffer set at 600. I think that is one of the things I tweeked when I noticed the choke on a couple of midi tracks when looping.
I thought I'd copy the data to another midi track and see it that will work. I vaguely remember periodiccally having a dead midi track in version 3 and that's how we'd fix them.
Wonder what's up with midi tracks going caput ?
post edited by pianodano - 2010/04/15 14:32:31
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brundlefly
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 14:51:42
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I vaguely remember periodiccally having a dead midi track in version 3 I remember a couple of other people running into this in the S6/7 era as well. Copying events to another track resolved it IIRC, but I don't think we every figured out how to recover the original track. Some kind of project corruption. 
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skeewiff
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 16:50:02
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Hi guys looks like I've run into the same problem: http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=1993302 I'm running W764 and Sonar 8.5.3 32bit and am definitely experiencing a leak - right up unitl it maxxes out and takes out my system. What do we all have in common? Is it a particular plug - or is it reverbs on buses or sidechain compression? What are we all doing that leads to Sonar swallowing up all available RAM? 
MOTU PCI 424 24IO Biostar Tpower i45 MOBO Intel Q9550,8gb Corsair RAM 1x Crucial M225 SSD - System 1x Samsung F2 1Tb - Audio 2x Samsung F2 1.5Tb - Storage 2x ATI 4550 (not crossfire - 3 monitors) W7 64 bit Sonar PE 8.5.3
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/15 18:06:47
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Skeewiff, Good detective work. On the 1st post I listed what plugs I was using. Nothing new, same ones I've used in Sonar for years. Oh boy, looks like it's really broke this time.
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pianodano
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/16 09:56:34
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Something is very strange . Still using 8.5 since I can't open the current project in 6, I am seeing cpu usage as high as 31% on core 1, sometimes even displaying yellow (cautionary maybe ?). 5 audio tracks are running and 18 midi tracks. 16 of the midi tracks are going to hardware synths and the other 2 are going to Real guitar softsynth. This is after increasing latency to 10ms. 6 on the other hand always displayed the heaviest usage on core 2 and displayed unbelievably low cpu load. I specifically remember everyones amazement recently at seeing and hearing this machine flawlessly run 117 tracks with dozens of plugs while showing a cpu load of less than 15% with latency at 10ms. Hope I can finish this tune and get this version off of my machine. 
post edited by pianodano - 2010/04/16 09:59:45
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brundlefly
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/16 10:23:54
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I am seeing cpu usage as high as 31% on core 1, sometimes even displaying yellow (cautionary maybe ?). Since your machine is from ADK, I have to assume the O/S is fully optimized in terms of disabling core parking and whatnot, but I'm wondering if one of the AUD.IN tweaks for SONAR8.x is needed, like maybe setting threadschedulingmodel=2. It's very suspicious that you are having both memory and CPU issues. Although you're clearly not the only one, these are far from common problems. I wouldn't give up on 8.5 just yet. It has optimizations fo I7 processors that 6 doesn't, and should be working at least as well.
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skeewiff
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Re:Does 8.5 have a memory bloat or leakage problem ?
2010/04/19 14:40:21
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