• Techniques
  • Someone help please! [tuning discussion]
2014/12/08 18:43:10
larry hardig jr
I recently came across some things about tuning your A=432hertz, instead of A=440hertz.
Can someone please direct me to a correct link in which I may learn how exactly to do this on my guitar,
as well as how to do this with music in Sonar X1.
Thank you very much in advance and I do appreciate any help from any particular individual. :)
2014/12/08 18:51:30
Karyn
Most tuners can vary their root frequency,  usually 440Hz for A  (standard pitch)
 re-tuning something like a guitar is easy,  you just downtune it a bit.  Retuning a virtual instrument in Sonar would depend on the capability programmed into the VSTi
2014/12/08 18:53:13
jb101
 
I can offer a little advice on this.
 
Whatever you have read on the subject - it makes no difference.
 
You will have probably read a lot about different frequencies sounding better, etc., etc.
 
IT IS NOT TRUE.
 
Music (and the physics of sound) is concerned purely with ratios, and not integers.  The rest is utter bunkum. Balderdash.  Snake oil.
 
Please trust me.  My thesis at music college was on tunings and temperaments.  This has been floating around the internet for years.  It makes no difference.
 
Tune to A=440. It is a standard that has nothing to do with the third reich.
 
For your own benefit - what have you read about it?  I will be happy to discuss it with you.
2014/12/08 18:57:09
jb101
2014/12/08 19:00:58
Anderton
larry hardig jr
I recently came across some things about tuning your A=432hertz, instead of A=440hertz.
Can someone please direct me to a correct link in which I may learn how exactly to do this on my guitar

 
Most tuners allow changing the default pitch for A from the standard of A=440 Hz. For example, TASCAM's PT-7 can change tuning from 349-499 Hz. This is a very full-featured unit, but even inexpensive tuners like the Snark SN-3 let you change the tuning reference. Once you set the new reference, then you can tune normally as if the reference was A=440.
 
If you have a Gibson guitar with Min-ETune or G FORCE, you can create a custom tuning. 
 
...as well as how to do this with music in Sonar X1.



Cakewalk's instruments can adjust tuning in cents. If you set the master tuning to -32 cents, then A will be 432 Hz.
 
FYI here's an article concerning studies regarding 432 compared to 440 Hz tunings...might not be worth the trouble. Report back and let us know. However, the timbre of instruments changes when tuned differently. Some metal guitar players like to tune guitar to E flat. Tuning to a higher pitch can give a brighter sound. Orchestras vary as to what they choose for their reference pitch. With classical Indian music, you tune something like a sitar to match the range of a vocalist rather than an arbitrary standard.
2014/12/08 19:01:53
toby
jb101 has it right.  May I also add that if you ever play with other musicians they'll tell you to ...
 

2014/12/08 19:02:02
John
jb101
 
I can offer a little advice on this.
 
Whatever you have read on the subject - it makes no difference.
 
You will have probably read a lot about different frequencies sounding better, etc., etc.
 
IT IS NOT TRUE.
 
Music (and the physics of sound) is concerned purely with ratios, and not integers.  The rest is utter bunkum. Balderdash.  Snake oil.
 
Please trust me.  My thesis at music college was on tunings and temperaments.  This has been floating around the internet for years.  It makes no difference.
 
Tune to A=440. It is a standard that has nothing to do with the third reich.
 
For your own benefit - what have you read about it?  I will be happy to discuss it with you.


Please listen to this. It is definitive and there is nothing to be gained by screwing with tunings. Besides try telling an old hand piano tuner to tune to a lower frequency! You may wind up in the piano permanently!
2014/12/08 19:14:58
mettelus
An alternate method to detuning is to record as you would normally, and then pull the final mix into a program which does not maintain pitch correction when a wav file is slowed down. Slowing an entire song by 1.82% (or to 98.18% of its original length) will keep everything in tune with each other, but lower the pitch as you are seeking. This is a much simpler method than what you are proposing.
 
FWIW, the real issue lies in getting instruments to be in tune with each other, which is why there is a standard.
2014/12/08 19:20:51
jb101
 However, the timbre of instruments changes when tuned differently. Some metal guitar players like to tune guitar to E flat. Tuning to a higher pitch can give a brighter sound. Orchestras vary as to what they choose for their reference pitch. With classical Indian music, you tune something like a sitar to match the range of a vocalist rather than an arbitrary standard.




I agree wholeheartedly.  Tuning to E Flat, or tuning your guitar to drop C will make a massive difference.
 
Tuning to A=432 instead of A=440 will not.
 
There was a video on youtube that demonstrated how much "better" an acoustic guitar sounded when tuned to A=432.
 
I concede that it may just be possible that a particular instrument or room may have a particularly "pleasant" sweet spot or resonance, but that will vary in each instance.  A=432 will certainly not be the answer.
2014/12/08 19:21:59
Anderton
John
 
Please listen to this. It is definitive and there is nothing to be gained by screwing with tunings.



Well...yes and no. Again, it's not because music becomes any more "special," but because of timbral differences that result from pitch changes. That's why I think the study I quote above is flawed, because it changed frequency by pitch-shifting, not re-recording the music at a different pitch center. No one likes the sound down of a downward pitch-shift, right?
 
A lot of my opinions about tuning changed once I started working on the manual for G FORCE and had to test the various functions. For example I got into subtle tuning tweaks for individual strings, like basically doing the equivalent of a piano's "stretch" tuning on guitar ("sweetening"). But tuning down half steps and such does make a difference. It makes it easier to bend strings, too 
 
Also, orchestras that tune to higher than 440 Hz do so because they believe the sound is sllghtly brighter. It's subtle, but apparently it's enough for conductors to be picky about it. Baroque ensembles often tuned way up, and orchestras had a period of "pitch inflation" during the 19th century where they kept tuning higher and higher to produce brighter timbres--I guess it was that period's equivalent of overcompressing . It got totally out of hand when La Scala decided A was 451 Hz. 
 
Higher tunings change the amplitude of the harmonics with strings. Maybe one reason why people think 432 makes a difference is because the tone is duller, so they find it more new agey. Or something.
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