backwoods

p.s. Sidechaining is not my preferred method for ducking or deesing. It's a lot easier to do with manual envelope adjustments. Not sure how you "Professionals" do it.

"Professionals" on a timeline consider many factors and use the most appropriate tool for the task at hand on a case by case basis.
 
Perhaps you should take your childish instigations somewhere people are interested.

Oh ok- with special consideration to their Wvaes Bundle which is the gold Standard I presume...

backwoods


Oh ok- with special consideration to their Wvaes Bundle which is the gold Standard I presume...

Why, no, golly, I see far more Elysia compressors in studios and academic institutions than Waves of course...
And the same goes for Live mixing. Yup. You might consider having that thing up that place surgically removed. It appears to be aggravating you and making you a little inflammatory.

Hi Noel !

" ..... All cakewalk products have had this functionality since the 90's. Our DX sdk had an IDeferZeroFill interface that Ron thought of way back then. If anything I think this capability in VST3 came from there :) Additionally SONAR has always optimized to not stream through plugins that do not have an active audio stream. Only channels that have audio or are input monitored or have a synth feed actually pass through audio to plugins. That has been done from day one so its most certainly not something new you will get ..... "

From this and your other post further elaborating on this, firstly:-

-> thank you for explaining

and

-> if it is possbile to do this with the current VST 2.x spec, it would be great if Cake could put this on the  " to do "  list for the not-too-distant future - so to be very specific about what I mean by this, I  clarify with this example:-

- say you have an audio track of lead vox and inbetween the Verses / Chorus / M8 / Outro  etc...... there are gaps of no-audio-at all  - that is, each verse  / chorus  etc.... is in its own stand-alone un-connected audio clip

- say this track has  6  VST effects on it when playing back

- so when it plays back say a Verse or Chorus, the CPU sits on a steady at %10

- with Sonar X1 and the current VST 2.x spec, when playback hits the  empty parts between each audio clip, the CPU meter will remain at a steady  %10 - it wont drop to zero

- with the VST 3 spec - my understaing is - and please correct me if I am wrong -  that the CPU meter will drop to %0 cpu when it is running between the audio clips and only be at %10 when it is running through a Verse / Chorus clip  etc....

So ...... * if *  my understing above is correct, it would be great if Sonar could get this feature under the VST 2.x spec  some time in the nearer future.

All the best Noel and thanks again.

TomG

SToons
What backward opinion? That Sonar does not fully support Waves. Yeah, real backwards. Completely accurate. 

By hobbling their VST2.4 plugins, Waves is the one choosing to not fully support SONAR... and Ableton... and Cockos... and Samplitude... and whatever host chooses to get the most functionality out of the fewest number of lines of code added/changed from release to release. Ripping things apart to support a new and entirely different plugin architecture needs to be weighted against the alternatives... namely: not ripping things apart.  
 
All Waves has to do is add two freaking i/o pins to their oh-so-freaking-special plugins, boom, done. We're not even having this conversation. But instead they've decided to draw an artificial technology line in the sand between VST2.4 and VST3. So now it's VST2.4 against VST3, instead of asking why Waves chose to hobble their VST2.4 plugins for artificial reasons.
 
Docs Noel was refering to: http://www.cakewalk.com/devXchange/article.aspx?aid=102 . Couldn't be simpler.
 
Do you want sidechaining in Cubase SX3 and C4 using VST2.4 plugins?  We can do that too... http://www.electrypnose.com/data/tutorials/Intellinoise_sidechain_compression_v1.1.pdf

Just not with, er, Waves. For some reason. Nobody quite knows why. But I'm open to theories. Actually, I have my own theories, but they're not nice ones, so I'll keep them to myself.
 
 

One pin actually :) The original pin already exists since every VST has an input and an output. All that's required is for the speaker config to specify a 2 pin input. 
For DSP that already has sidechain capabilities it literally takes a few hours to implement this scheme. 
When we were doing our prochannel compressor the dev's had this going in less than a day. Its baffling that so many still think its necessary for a whole new model to do something this trivial. And this is not proprietary to Cakewalk - there were plugin vendors such as Kjaerhus supporting this even before we implemented sidechaining back in 2007. 

Thanks Keith and Noel for chiming in. As you may well understand it's not obvious to users what's going on behind the scenes in terms of plugin conformity (different story from Waves...) so it's nice to hear another perspective, not like I have the savvy to fully understand the politics of decisions such as this.
 
I do, however, have a much better understanding of the limited benefits (note I said limited, not non-existant) of VST3 at this point and understand Cakewalk's position alot better. I also have a better understanding of the "limitations" of VST 2.4  vs VST 3 which are less significant than I had expected. Despite others' feelings towards this thread, for me it has been informative and I thank you again for the input. This may change my mind about future decisions/purchases and it's nice to feel a little better equipped to make those choices.

You may want to go here and vote for vst3:

http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.aspx?m=2655451

I still haven’t decided yet if I going to upgrade to X2 but if this slow progress continues of not adding new technologies in time, they will eventually lose me as a customer too....

Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk
]

One pin actually :) The original pin already exists since every VST has an input and an output. All that's required is for the speaker config to specify a 2 pin input. 
For DSP that already has sidechain capabilities it literally takes a few hours to implement this scheme. 
When we were doing our prochannel compressor the dev's had this going in less than a day. Its baffling that so many still think its necessary for a whole new model to do something this trivial. And this is not proprietary to Cakewalk - there were plugin vendors such as Kjaerhus supporting this even before we implemented sidechaining back in 2007. 

Dear Noel!
I’m sure you know all about this Noel and we all users are just fools asking about it. Obviously you have already made up your mind decided we don’t need it and you are personal against it like VST just from the beginning. I bet you hate VST so much you think we shouldn’t have added it in the first place. In your SONAR it should only support Direct X only and VST should just DIE!! DIE!!!DIE!!!
Is that why Cakewalk dragging there ass behind now for over 4 years now? Just wondering?
Other manufactures see VST 3.5 as potential and cost effect solutions like ARA. I don’t know what you see?
  
 
So being a represent of a TECH GURU Cakewalk Company; obviously you think I’m a pain in ass; is that why you try to silence me by not reply to any of my post here on this thread or this Forum?
It’s not working!  I just wonder where you stand sir, so we all know.
Not willing to listen on the customers and the users will never victory, even the pain ass ones.
 
 
 
You may hate me but I still like you and like to hear what you have to say in any matters.
 
 
For you sir, all this it’s very simple! In your mind, anything could be done with VST 2.4.
No one needs VST3 to accomplish any task at all. We don’t even need VST it will work even better with direct X instead.
I agree you are correct of that one!
But end of the day no one care what you or me personal think about VST 3.5 or that we don't need it.
The Battle of making VST 3 as a standard is already over, years ago!
 
 
One day the other 3part manufactures like Waves, Native Instruments, UAD 2, Fabfilter, EASTWEST, Spectrasonics, Celemony Melodyne and so on will just add VST 3.5 ONLY anyway; no matter if we like it or not. You can debate all day long how good VST 2.4 are or Direct X is even better then VST. In the end it’s just "game over" like x32 plugins. In the end VST 2.4 will just die out, and that day has come and it's soon.
 
 
Thanks in advance for any reply! 
 
Best Regards
Freddie