Hi Krazylain

Thanks for clearing that up :)

I'm not a PT user, I don't have it and clearly I don't know enough about it, but I've most definitely seen it in action on more than several occasions in professional studios downunder.

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This is big indeed. But I don't think Cakewalk will be dealt the hardest blow. I expect a lot Mac users formerly running PTLE but who've since moved to Logic to go back to ProTools.

I feel that the whole "wow, is that really Pro Tools?" thing has worn off for the most part as new entries into the home studio world are learning that there are other players on the market (particularly Logic these days). So Digi, um, AVID won't be able to lean on that anymore!

That being said I do believe that PT9 will shake up the market (and hopefully send other developers scrambling to come up with greatness).

Sven

Nah you're just fooling yourself!

You guys can switch if you want...I mean there would be substantially less complaining on the forum. But, I don't want to pay 600 dollars for a DAW which can't perform the simple task of input monitoring. Read it for yourself: http://www.avid.com/us/pr...mily/Pro-Tools/compare

Home Studio 7 can do that and it's 100 bucks...

This thread has hit full on ****.

I think this is not true. This seems to be referring to a "higher", real-time switchable, input monitoring feature found in PT HD. I can input monitor my tracks in PT M-Powered version 8 easily. Your post got me scared, though... I checked it out on AVID's forum at it looks like standard input monitoring is the same in PT 9.

rainmaker1011


I do not see anywhere on their web, that they have included any new plugins or soft synths in PT9. Only workflow and under-hood improvements. Well, this is what I call "a DAW update" - they have updated the DAW, the core product, basic functionalities, workflow, tools and not just everything around it... Oh well.

+ 1 on this.

As a SONAR and PRO TOOLS 8 user, I have a couple of comments to make from my experience on using both DAWs during the last 10 years.

I am also very exited about SONAR X1, but I am really more of the "under-the-hood" type of customer... and Cake did a lot of improvement like those as well: audio engine, multi-core support, external inserts, side-chaining in version 7 (FINALLY ... HURRAY), grouping got improved even if it is not quite "there" yet, and so on.

In the last years, I've mainly kept a good distance between me and most of Sonar's plugin components (Cyclone, Beatscape, the LP-64 plugin line and so on...) The real good news for me about plugins was the SONITUS line being included in SONAR. The funny thing is that I ALWAYS bought the PRODUCER edition when I upgraded...

 For instance, my experience with the plugins are the following: BOOST ELEVEN always sounds fine for me in a SONAR session, but when I listen to that boosted and exported mix in SOUND FORGE, it always sounds distorted for some reason... And I have better things to do than work on figuring out WHY! On the other hand, mixes exported from PT never sounded distorted when played in other SOFTWARES (in my case, at least).

The LP EQ produces clicks and pops when manipulating parameters... URK!! When I'm sweeping a parameter, I want to hear the subtle changes it produces until I can find a "sweet spot" that I like... I DON'T want to hear anything else... sorry... just to tough to continue on mixing... for those of you who still can use it, I salute you! Your ability to focus is beyond mine, it seems.

The VC-64 channel, on a master bus, produces stange and fairly loud noises when I'm saving sessions I used it in... again, I have no time to figure out WHY is that the case on my systems. (my former DAW was a desktop designed precisely for audio, by the way...)

On the other hand, the VOCAL and PERCUSSION strips are working GREAT for me, despite their little GUI bugs! Really was surprised by those! I'm also starting to like the LP multiband compressor as well. Keep those up, Bakers!

Do not get me wrong: I LIKE Sonar... but I also love the time I can have without being force to troubleshoot different things. My experience as a user since 1997 is simply this: on any of the 3 PC systems that I had, i almost ALWAYS had more problems with SONAR than PT. Still true even with my present-day DELL STUDIO 17 laptop that gave me so much trouble since last January... and is almost getting me to buy a MAC next time (but i'll use BOOTCAMP to keep SONAR, of course...)

What kept me with Sonar is simply those: OMF, Multi-band compression (sonitus), unlimited tracks, Notation (and I am really not a big "music theory guy", but I like to use notation also...), Per-clip effects (even if I feel that most of the sessions I ever had trouble with in SONAR were sessions with a lot of Per-clip effects... compared to other sessions using only per-TRACK effects...)

Still, I LOVE the updated GUI in SONAR X1 !! But those are not the features I am looking for and in need of right now ... Brandon, Robin, Noel and everyone at CAKE please keep your good work up! I really can appreciate all the energy you're putting into SONAR, and one team has to make choices about features they develop for a particular release, but at first sight Pro-Tools 9 is really shaking my world right now...

I'm writing this to provide "customer input" to Cake, and I'm sure that the bakers will "balance" the PROS and CONS from many-many customers like me! Present times are indeed very tough on DAW manufacturers.

Cakewalk and other competitors are offering high-quality products that is having the Goliath AVID rethink its product-line to the core. They did this with very limited resources as well... and will continue to do so! I cannot wait to see future developments from Cakewalk/Roland in the next years.

Yea, no matter what the fallout (and I predict a boatload of sales for AVID) they have finally, after all these years of idiocy, made a smart move.  Kudos.

mikespitzer



With this new PRO TOOLS 9 able to work on any hardware configuration ... this opens the door for many, many, more home and project studio people to use what is still viewed as the "industry standard" DAW system.

What this is gonna open up is the door to Pandora's box. Rife full of nightmares with configuration problems the likes of which they've never had to deal with. Just go to the forum of any other DAW and it's obvious that the vast majority of the problems have to do with hardware compatibility issues stemming from the myriad of audio interfaces, midi controllers, and, last but not least, the millions of computer configurations. That's why they're trying to cover their asses before the onslaught by saying that these devices are not officially supported. And don't forget that us home and project studio types are a barbaric lot. Not the refined elitist bunch that's been their customer base up until now. Let the debauchery commence!

I just think it is hilarious that they are acting like they are changing the game because it can use any interface and has 96 tracks and has delay compensation.

Seriously, big woop! They arent changing the game. They are finally getting their head out of their arse and lowering the heigth of their high horse and acknowledging that their limits and non innovative brainwashing "industry standard" motto is fading big time.

That being said, I do appreciate them doing what they have done! 

Run protools on my echo gina3g for file transfers to sonar!

That is nice!

I mean even play with pro tools a little since it will work with my interface of choice now. I have an m-box collecting dust here, literally.

This is an opportunity for me to throw ProTools on my existing SONAR system. I'll get to use ProTools without having to change a single patch cord and I'll finally have some thing in common with all my colleagues with facilities in town.

I almost bought a Pro Tools license for my place last year but I was exactly the customer they just made this package for. I didn't want to downgrade to LE hardware and I didn't want to budget for HD. I have lots of existing gear that I wanted to use.

I'll no longer feel a need to wait on SONAR to seem better that ProTools in the public's eye.

I'll be nicer in the forums here... because I just will not care what Cakewalk does with SONAR anymore. I'll keep my yearly subscription up to date and use all my SONAR skills for making pop songs and fun stuff... but I'll be relieved of the desire to see SONAR developed into a full featured DAW.

I'll love SONAR for what it is... and I really enjoy the IBM PC universal access model that CAKEWALK was founded on. I admire that and will not change my preference for that type of approach to making tools available.

I'll never have to explain to my guests that I use SONAR instead of ProTools because I think it is a great program. That will be like sawing a chain off my ankle.

The only thing I'm trying to figure out is if I want to get the upgrade special at Sweetwater or simply keep it simple and get the free standing full install.

I've been so loyal to Cakewalk that I don't know much about ProTools culture. I can run the systems up in town but I don't know much about config or updates etc etc. I'm wondering if there is any downside to using the upgrade path that Sweetwater suggests.

I have to think up a good user name for the Avid forums.

best regards,
mike

On a positive note:

PT9 should make competitors such as; SONAR, Cubase and others develop greater improvements along with greater value for features.  I think within the next year or so we may see amazing improvements in workflow and greater features.

At this point in time I've decided to hold off on upgrading, I'll wait and see how this all plays out.  I might get PT9 or I might get X1 or both, I don't know at this point in time. I'll be honest though, PT9 has caught my interest.

That said; to be fair we're yet to see the finer details on X1.  I hope Cakewalk 'continues' to clean up; bugs, workarounds, half-baked features (for example; Matrix), more easier/faster workflows and improvements on overall performance.

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Can you imagine there would be a crossgrade option for Cubase/Logic/Live/Sonar/Reaper/... users?? I can see the Avid's e-shop servers overloaded to death . 

rotaholic


Looks like ebay is going to be flooded with alot of junk interfaces "you know the ones lol" there will be a whole lot of sales for your focusrites, presonus, rmes etc etc

Wow. What do you consider a non-junk interface. Either your grammar is very bad or you are calling professional level units from Focusrite, Presonus, and RME, junk. Care to re-phrase?

As for the PT vs. SONAR debate; My studio is buying both. Unfortunately in today's market having "eye candy" is a good way to gain clients.

$599 ?? ahem.. I'll stick with Sonar Home Studio 7XL and upgrade that to X1 Essentials.

does it have groove clips?

Thanks Jim,

I use SONAR's groove clips primarily for the drag out function on home made loops. I do most of my massaging with Audio Snap, Melodyne and Wav editors.

I really don't know what's in PT these days. It has been a while for me, I can use the HD rigs in town, but I am not up to speed on the latest features, expectations, or culture.

I am buying PT9 and I am going to try to install it on that win XP 32 machine you built me so long ago. Goodness, that thing still does all I want with the exception of huge memory capability.

I will also try it on my Win7 64 general purpose laptop.

When it settles out I'll ask you for a super duper Win 64 system. :-)

I'm pretty excited because I have always been the ibmPC/SONAR black sheep down here. Two of my mentors came out of the University of Miami Pro Tools revolution and have been proponents of it from those early days. I feel lucky to have access to their insights... and so I know PT is not a panacea :-).

I love the SONAR and think Cakewalk has redefined what I consider a contemporary instrument.

The idea that my shack in forest can become a bona fide Pro Tools tracking studio for guests that want to finish on a HD rig or outboard is a huge step forward for me and my guests.

I look forward to working with PT9 and anticipate that I will be left feeling more comfortable when I visit my friends at their HD studios.

I'm sure I'll retain a preference for many things in SONAR and so plan to stay updated each and every cycle.

all the best,
mike

Jim Roseberry

Please give me a good reason why I should NOT purchase PT9?

• No off-line bounce-down (only realtime)
• No input monitoring
• No VST support
• x64 support still in its infancy (8.04 was a mess under x64)

You're wrong on only one element in your list here: INPUT MONITORING. I have it in PT MP8 and it is still around in PT 9. It is the advance input-switching mode in HD that is not included (whatever that is...) LOL.

All other thing you mentionned is correct.