John
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 30467
- Joined: 2003/11/06 11:53:17
- Status: offline
The Official Staff View enhancement thread now with summary!
Please per Willy Jones requests post the improvements and features you want to see in the Staff View of Sonar here. I will then try to summarize it and present it to CW.  We understand your frustrations and requests. Product managers have already chimed in on other threads in regard to this matter. I would suggest organizing all of your thoughts and requests into one unified thread if your goal is to get our attention through the forum. Which you already have, so this whole thread is a tad bit redundant but nonetheless one thread with a ton of hits is going to draw a lot more attention then 45 little ones. Quoted from Wily Jones. See post 54 for the complete summery. It is on page 2.
post edited by John - 2009/06/13 19:58:17
|
g_randybrown
Max Output Level: -40 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3522
- Joined: 2003/12/24 11:30:04
- Location: Las Cruces, NM, USA
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 14:51:52
(permalink)
One of the complaints was the triplets/tied triplets display (or lack thereof) BTW...yay CW and Willie!!!! ORIGINAL: John
Please per Willy Jones requests post the improvements and features you want to see in the Staff View of Sonar here.
I will then try to summarize it and present it to CW.
We understand your frustrations and requests. Product managers have already chimed in on other threads in regard to this matter. I would suggest organizing all of your thoughts and requests into one unified thread if your goal is to get our attention through the forum. Which you already have, so this whole thread is a tad bit redundant but nonetheless one thread with a ton of hits is going to draw a lot more attention then 45 little ones.
Quoted from Wily Jones.
post edited by g_randybrown - 2009/06/09 15:04:39
G. Randy Brown Windows 10, 64 bit, PlatinumIntel Core i7-3770S Asus P8Z77-V LK mobo 4X8GB Corsair XMS3 memory 500 GB Crucial BX100 SSD (OS)two WD Black 1 TB HDDSAPPHIRE DUAL-X 100314-4L Radeon HD 6970 2GB 256-Bit GDDR5 Presonus AudioBox 22VSLyoutube.com/crystalclearnm
|
pbognar
Max Output Level: -76 dBFS
- Total Posts : 720
- Joined: 2005/10/03 16:22:03
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 14:54:08
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: John
Please per Willy Jones requests post the improvements and features you want to see in the Staff View of Sonar here.
I will then try to summarize it and present it to CW.
Thanks for taking the initiative in creating this thread. IMHO, given what Alex has communicated, my initial reaction would be categorize improvements into short-term improvements and long-term ones. Short-Term: Resolve the handling of triplets, including rests and ties. The ability to print with the triplet handling issues resolved. The replaying of chords each time a note in said chord is moved to a new pitch (ala Logic). Long-Term: A MIDI edit view where one has the option to view data simultaneously in notation, piano roll, and controllers (or any combination there of) (ala Samplitude). The translation of articulation symbols into MIDI data (ala Cubase).
|
Guitarpima
Max Output Level: -34 dBFS
- Total Posts : 4125
- Joined: 2005/11/19 23:53:59
- Location: Terra 3
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 15:07:01
(permalink)
I guess for the short term.
Triplets and the like.
more subdivisions up to 64th notes.
For the long term.
More than triplets. 5's, 7's, ETC.
If were going to print these, proper markings would be nice. For that though, there would have to be a page view with the ability to put in repeats and codas and things like that.
Notation, the original DAW. Everything else is just rote. We are who we are and no more than another. Humans, you people are crazy. Win 7 x64 X2 Intel DX58SO, Intel i7 920 2.66ghz 12gb DDR3 ASUS ATI EAH5750 650w PSU 4x WD HDs 320gb DVD, DVD RW Eleven Rack, KRK Rokit 8s and 10s sub
|
marce
Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
- Total Posts : 237
- Joined: 2006/10/03 13:53:23
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 15:15:21
(permalink)
|
Elffin
Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1196
- Joined: 2007/02/11 16:49:19
- Location: Wales
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 15:16:04
(permalink)
What I'd like to see is the triplet feature corrected / Ties / rests.
A velocity lane so I can adjust dynamics within SV.
Something similar to cubase's expression in order to choose keyswitching with sample libraries.
What might be useful is to have a print score page where we could drop dynamics / slurs which would be independant of the midi information but couild be saved and edited as well?
|
Susan G
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12016
- Joined: 2003/11/05 22:49:26
- Location: Putnam County, NY
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 15:43:58
(permalink)
Hi John- Not a SV improvement, per se, but " The Official SV enhacnement thread!" could definitely be improved!  Quoting from Willy: Which you already have, so this whole thread is a tad bit redundant but nonetheless one thread with a ton of hits is going to draw a lot more attention then 45 little ones. I would've thought that would be this one, with 3,573 hits already! There's plenty to summarize from there. Do you plan to grab from that and similar threads, or would it be easier for you if we re-post here what we've already said there and elsewhere? I guess I read Willy's post more as a "Try to keep these in one place, guys", rather than as a request for yet another new thread on SV, but whatever helps. Thanks- -Susan
2.30 gigahertz Intel Core i7-3610QM; 16 GB RAMWindows 10 x64; NI Komplete Audio 6.SONAR Platinum (Lexington) x64
|
John
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 30467
- Joined: 2003/11/06 11:53:17
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 15:57:38
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Susan G
Hi John-
Not a SV improvement, per se, but "The Official SV enhacnement thread!" could definitely be improved!
Quoting from Willy:
Which you already have, so this whole thread is a tad bit redundant but nonetheless one thread with a ton of hits is going to draw a lot more attention then 45 little ones.
I would've thought that would be this one, with 3,573 hits already!
There's plenty to summarize from there. Do you plan to grab from that and similar threads, or would it be easier for you if we re-post here what we've already said there and elsewhere?
I guess I read Willy's post more as a "Try to keep these in one place, guys", rather than as a request for yet another new thread on SV, but whatever helps.
Thanks-
-Susan
Good point Susan I was thinking what more really needs to be said too. Yet I got the notion that we could put together a more concise thread that I could at some point simply summarize. Much as Space Cowboy did a little while back for Sonar in general. I am very reluctant to copy from other's posts in other threads to do this though. Not because its too much work because it isn't but because its a little too much like stealing. It makes me a little uncomfortable to do that. You all can do that with your own previous posts if you like.
|
Richard Fey
Max Output Level: -78 dBFS
- Total Posts : 650
- Joined: 2003/11/07 11:52:40
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:01:33
(permalink)
suggest organizing all of your thoughts and requests into one unified thread if your goal is to get our attention through the forum. Which you already have, Am I the only one who can read? lol Hey John, take it from a friend, you should take a computer vacation, no really, lol. 
|
John
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 30467
- Joined: 2003/11/06 11:53:17
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:06:25
(permalink)
So which is it do we do this thread or do we believe CW will do something about the SV? I got mixed messages from that quote.
|
Susan G
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12016
- Joined: 2003/11/05 22:49:26
- Location: Putnam County, NY
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 16:06:41
(permalink)
Not a SV improvement, per se, but "The Official SV enhacnement thread!" could definitely be improved! I was trying to say: First, edit the Subject Title! I don't want to see that 3k+ times!
post edited by Susan G - 2009/06/09 16:17:26
2.30 gigahertz Intel Core i7-3610QM; 16 GB RAMWindows 10 x64; NI Komplete Audio 6.SONAR Platinum (Lexington) x64
|
Richard Fey
Max Output Level: -78 dBFS
- Total Posts : 650
- Joined: 2003/11/07 11:52:40
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:13:38
(permalink)
So which is it do we do this thread or do we believe CW will do something about the SV? I got mixed messages from that quote. Yeah I think he meant when our goal is to get their attention for a problem or need for an overdue feature/request that the best way is to present all of that in a single, easy to reference thread. But really, I think they likely have a solid idea what we want out of Staff View and to me it's all rather pointless to beat a horse that's not even going to be born for a while (according to Alex).
|
Susan G
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12016
- Joined: 2003/11/05 22:49:26
- Location: Putnam County, NY
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:13:54
(permalink)
So which is it do we do this thread or do we believe CW will do something about the SV? I don't think it's either/or. I vote that we keep our SV comments in the thread that's had the most comments and hits about it recently (http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.asp?m=1731510), and not keep starting new ones. -Susan
2.30 gigahertz Intel Core i7-3610QM; 16 GB RAMWindows 10 x64; NI Komplete Audio 6.SONAR Platinum (Lexington) x64
|
Susan G
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12016
- Joined: 2003/11/05 22:49:26
- Location: Putnam County, NY
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:32:43
(permalink)
I agree with Richard, and I don't see how starting yet another thread with people stating what they'd like to see in SV is going to go in a different direction or yield more info than the previous ones. I, for one, don't feel like saying again what I've said umpteen times, and unless they decide to bar people who don't care about SV from posting in this thread (which ain't never gonna happen! ), we'll all just be saying the same thing we've said before. I don't see the point. -Susan
2.30 gigahertz Intel Core i7-3610QM; 16 GB RAMWindows 10 x64; NI Komplete Audio 6.SONAR Platinum (Lexington) x64
|
John
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 30467
- Joined: 2003/11/06 11:53:17
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:47:20
(permalink)
No one is required to post here at all. Though it can't hurt to do so. It really is up to you all to decide what you want to do. This is only me trying to follow what I thought Willy was asking us to do. If I have it wrong it wont be the first time.
|
pianodano
Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1160
- Joined: 2004/01/11 18:54:38
- Location: Va Beach Virginia
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 16:55:33
(permalink)
Whew. So many sv threads going on now, I've forgot what my main problem with it is. Regards, Danny
Best, Danny Core I7, win XP pro, 3 gig ram, 3 drives- Lynx Aurora firewire- Roll around 27 inch monitor, 42 inch console monitor- Motif xs controller - Networked P4's and FX Teleport for samples- Muse Receptor VIA Uniwire for samples and plugs- UAD QUAD Neve - UAD 1- Sonar X1 but favor 8.5 GUI - Toft ATB 32 - Vintage hardware - Tascam MS-16 synched via Timeline Microlynx -Toft ATB32 console
|
Susan G
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12016
- Joined: 2003/11/05 22:49:26
- Location: Putnam County, NY
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 17:00:51
(permalink)
Whew. So many sv threads going on now, I've forgot what my main problem with it is. Triplets? See? I'm getting dragged in again -- I'm outta here! -Susan
2.30 gigahertz Intel Core i7-3610QM; 16 GB RAMWindows 10 x64; NI Komplete Audio 6.SONAR Platinum (Lexington) x64
|
pianodano
Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1160
- Joined: 2004/01/11 18:54:38
- Location: Va Beach Virginia
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 17:03:04
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Susan G
Whew. So many sv threads going on now, I've forgot what my main problem with it is.
Triplets?
See? I'm getting dragged in again -- I'm outta here!
-Susan
Oh yeah, that's it. PS: it would be nice if John would fix the speeling in the title. Later
post edited by pianodano - 2009/06/09 17:13:38
Best, Danny Core I7, win XP pro, 3 gig ram, 3 drives- Lynx Aurora firewire- Roll around 27 inch monitor, 42 inch console monitor- Motif xs controller - Networked P4's and FX Teleport for samples- Muse Receptor VIA Uniwire for samples and plugs- UAD QUAD Neve - UAD 1- Sonar X1 but favor 8.5 GUI - Toft ATB 32 - Vintage hardware - Tascam MS-16 synched via Timeline Microlynx -Toft ATB32 console
|
rhythmeus1
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
- Total Posts : 9
- Joined: 2008/05/20 22:50:47
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 17:09:00
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: marce
Synced SV with Piano-Roll and Controllers lanes:
Screenshot: http://stashbox.org/527385/Idea02.jpg
This is a great idea/visualisation marce. This will be a slamdunk winner for me. if CW does this, I will upgrade to S9 on day 1 (even though I just bought s8 and I am usually on a 2 version cycle) RMX
|
Susan G
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12016
- Joined: 2003/11/05 22:49:26
- Location: Putnam County, NY
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 17:11:21
(permalink)
PS: it would be nice if John would fix the speeling in the title. Yes, I mentioned this in post #11. I'm a hypocrite, since I haven't unsubscribed to this thread yet, but maybe I will once it reads right! -Susan
2.30 gigahertz Intel Core i7-3610QM; 16 GB RAMWindows 10 x64; NI Komplete Audio 6.SONAR Platinum (Lexington) x64
|
Johannes H
Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
- Total Posts : 333
- Joined: 2009/03/11 17:25:51
- Location: Norway
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 17:12:56
(permalink)
I would also like to see improvement in the staff view! First of all this: Resolve the handling of triplets, including rests and ties.
The ability to print with the triplet handling issues resolved. Best, JH
|
pianodano
Max Output Level: -67 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1160
- Joined: 2004/01/11 18:54:38
- Location: Va Beach Virginia
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 17:22:21
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: rhythmeus1
ORIGINAL: marce
Synced SV with Piano-Roll and Controllers lanes:
Screenshot: http://stashbox.org/527385/Idea02.jpg
This is a great idea/visualisation marce.
This will be a slamdunk winner for me. if CW does this, I will upgrade to S9 on day 1 (even though I just bought s8 and I am usually on a 2 version cycle)
RMX
That is for sure a fantastic idea. I would love it.
Best, Danny Core I7, win XP pro, 3 gig ram, 3 drives- Lynx Aurora firewire- Roll around 27 inch monitor, 42 inch console monitor- Motif xs controller - Networked P4's and FX Teleport for samples- Muse Receptor VIA Uniwire for samples and plugs- UAD QUAD Neve - UAD 1- Sonar X1 but favor 8.5 GUI - Toft ATB 32 - Vintage hardware - Tascam MS-16 synched via Timeline Microlynx -Toft ATB32 console
|
tfale
Max Output Level: -88 dBFS
- Total Posts : 122
- Joined: 2005/02/13 00:41:22
- Location: Fox Cities, WI
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 17:31:32
(permalink)
I vote for tuplets (triplets, quintuplets, sextuplets, septuplets....). It's a good place to start. tf
Sonar PE 6.02 Studiocat Q-6600 quad core (@3Ghz, 1333 FSB), XP Pro, Edirol FA-66 Interface, 4 HDs. GPO, Kontakt 2, Battery 3, B4 II, Absynth 3, Korg Legacy, MiniTera, EWQL Syphonic Voices. Taylor 550, Gibson/Les Paul, Kawai EX-100 Concert Grand.
|
bmdaustin
Max Output Level: -68 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1114
- Joined: 2004/01/11 21:56:51
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 17:31:34
(permalink)
In case anybody's still listening:
1)Activate vertical scrolling - surely that can't be too programmer intensive?
2) Fix what you broke in the transition from 7 to 8. In 7 there are track status boxes (Mute, Solo, etc.) on the right side of the screen. Clicking on a status box made that track the "active" track. That functionality was lost in 8. Now I have to switch back and forth (again) from Staff View to Track to View to select a new active track and then back to Staff View to see where I was and what I was doing.
|
John
Forum Host
- Total Posts : 30467
- Joined: 2003/11/06 11:53:17
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/09 17:38:03
(permalink)
I would like to have stave wrap. As in word wrap.
|
marce
Max Output Level: -86 dBFS
- Total Posts : 237
- Joined: 2006/10/03 13:53:23
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 18:00:03
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: rhythmeus1
ORIGINAL: marce
Synced SV with Piano-Roll and Controllers lanes:
Screenshot: http://stashbox.org/527385/Idea02.jpg
This is a great idea/visualisation marce.
This will be a slamdunk winner for me. if CW does this, I will upgrade to S9 on day 1 (even though I just bought s8 and I am usually on a 2 version cycle)
RMX
PianoRoll&StaffView synced: This is not an original idea. You can do that with Samplitude and Logic, afaik.
The Maping of expressions is already in Finale, Sibelius, and Overture. Cubase extend from the Staff View to the Piano Roll. (and is a brilliant idea!) Quantize per staff/track: separated settings in a same Staff view (already in samplitude) StaffView&TrackView: The only original idea/thing i hasnt seen in other host, is to sync the Staff View with the Track View. I dont know if is a good idea, but i would like to see something like that. I made a pic of the idea: http://stashbox.org/527385/Idea02.jpg
|
Marah
Max Output Level: -71 dBFS
- Total Posts : 975
- Joined: 2009/02/04 21:56:41
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/09 23:14:16
(permalink)
God this thread only has 26 posts! What's wrong with you people!?!?!?!?! ORIGINAL: John
I would like to have stave wrap. As in word wrap.
Totally. That's my single biggest issue with SV... though admittedly my needs for it are very modest. Wrapping would at least let you see a conventional lead sheet kinda thing. I guess the SV must inherit its linearity from PRV. Kinda interesting, actually.
|
pbognar
Max Output Level: -76 dBFS
- Total Posts : 720
- Joined: 2005/10/03 16:22:03
- Status: offline
RE: The Oficial SV enhacment thread!
2009/06/10 00:12:50
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Marah
God this thread only has 26 posts! What's wrong with you people!?!?!?!?!
ORIGINAL: John
I would like to have stave wrap. As in word wrap.
Totally. That's my single biggest issue with SV... though admittedly my needs for it are very modest. Wrapping would at least let you see a conventional lead sheet kinda thing. I guess the SV must inherit its linearity from PRV. Kinda interesting, actually.
I think the problem is there is confusion as to which SV thread to post. The way I read Willy's post was that we were successful in getting their attention, but that we needed a unified thread (I kind of got the feeling - right or wrong - that a NEW unified and concise thread was called for - so I can see where John was going with this). Anyway - I think that even though there are only 26 posts, we have the SV improvement ideas pretty much licked. I would hope we don't dilute the ideas by having a thousand suggestions.
|
jsg
Max Output Level: -69 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1079
- Joined: 2003/11/20 04:54:18
- Location: San Francisco, California
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/10 01:39:14
(permalink)
Here are all of my suggestions to make staff view conform to professional sequencing standards: 1. Fix the display of tied triplets. 2. Allow groups of 5, 7, and 11 notes to be displayed correctly. 3. Program a MIDI command that allows the musician to lasso (select) a group of notes in staff view and then apply contrary motion (with a checkbox for diatonic or chromatic). 4. Fix the bug in which the right-hand pane of instrument tracks doesn't conform to the order of the staves in the notation area. 5. Investigate if retrograde works correctly when selecting groups of notes, particularly groups of notes across bar lines. 6. Make it simple to change a given pitch's (or group of pitches) enharmonic equivalent. For example, in Sibelius, to change an F# to a G-flat just click on note and press enter. Something like that. None of these suggestions are meant to make Sonar into a notation program, that's not it's vision and never was. But a great MIDI sequencer needs a fully functional, versatile staff view that exploits the power and possibilities of notated music. For those that don't need, want or use notation, no problem. Sonar still has powerful audio tools. It won't take anything away from those users at all. Jerry Gerber www.jerrygerber.com
|
Qwerty69
Max Output Level: -62 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1435
- Joined: 2004/02/19 17:44:10
- Status: offline
RE: The Official Staff View enhacnement thread!
2009/06/10 03:41:07
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: jsg
For those that don't need, want or use notation, no problem. Sonar still has powerful audio tools. It won't take anything away from those users at all.
Except for the development time taking away from further enhancements, expansions and fixes for those audio tools... I want a pony too. Q.
|