Starise


Take single parent children for example- as a general rule children from a single parent home might struggle more than others do but they usually get through it and function in society. OTOH there is a small PERCENTAGE of children who are affected by it in a serious way that follows them the rest of their lives. Most kids who play video games know they are only games, but a few of them might be seriously influenced by these games and start to role play in a more substantial way.

Star, I'm sorry but I see this as a total non-sequitor, unless of course you have statistics to back it up.
 
I would argue that how a child eventually conducts him or herself as an adult has very little to do with how many parents they had around when they were growing up. What really matters is how loving, caring and supportive their home environment was, and how attentive their parents (or parent) and extended family were in encouraging them.
 
I would also argue that a child who is brought up by two parents who are constantly arguing and fighting with each other, or who don't spend any time with their offspring, is at a disadvantage compared to a child who is well looked after by one loving parent.
 
It is the assumption that 'single-parent family' = 'broken home' that I find hard to agree with.
 
I am in full agreement that there is most likely a link between a broken home and a broken child though.
 
 
 

The educational system now teaches children the theory that we came about over billions of years by nothing more than chance. A PERCENTAGE of these kids indoctrinated with this theory will think that they are merely animals who have no moral directive and therefore  free to invent their own set of rules or lack thereof. Most kids will comply with what is viewed as sane moral and safe but a PERCENTAGE of these kids might look at things differently.

I don't know where to start on this. Would you advocate that we lie to our children?
 
And I fail to see how you can indoctrinate anyone with knowledge.
 
And I am an animal, and 'merely' an animal at that. So are you. If not, what would you call yourself?
 
I may be wrong (and please feel free to correct me if I've got the wrong end of the stick) but I'm guessing that by saying "The educational system now teaches children the theory that we came about over billions of years by nothing more than chance. A PERCENTAGE of these kids indoctrinated with this theory will think that they are merely animals who have no moral directive and therefore  free to invent their own set of rules or lack thereof" you're actually implying that our children's moral well being would be better served by being taught that the word of the bible is to be taken literally?
 
I'm sorry, but I find it hard to think of any current problem around the world that would benefit from throwing a bit more religion at it. Over the years, more soldiers, more civilians and more children have been killed, maimed, tortured and imprisoned in the name of religion than for any other reason. The only thing that's probably killed more people is malaria - and if that rather insidious micro-organism hasn't come about as the result of "billions of years" of evolution, I'm guessing it must have been part of some creator's plan. Almost a clean sweep then.
 
To be honest, I'm saddened and also quite insulted by your implication that I need some divine (i.e. not 'merely' animal) guidance to possess a moral directive. I'm quite capable of thinking for myself. I don't need 10 Commandments to know that 'murder', 'stealing' and 'perjury' are, under most circumstances, morally wrong. I'm not so sure about the other seven so-called 'most important' sentences ever written though. If I'd composed them, I'd have included something along the lines of 'not allowing slavery' and 'not raping choirboys'.
 
 
 
 
 
Apologies to all for any TOS violations.
 
 
 

backwoods


 I don't need 10 Commandments to know that 'murder', 'stealing' and 'perjury' are, under most circumstances, morally wrong.


How do you know that? 

 
Because I wouldn't want them to happen to me.
 
 

backwoods


OK - do unto others etc

 
It's a good enough place to start.
 
 

Don't get me wrong though, I don't mean to imply that a non-religious society is necessarily better.

I just think that state and religion should be kept apart. I believe the US was founded on the principals of secularism, and I honestly wish the UK Government was run along similar lines. For example - in this country, Church of England bishops, as leaders of our 'state religion', are rather anachronistically allowed to sit in the House of Lords and therefore contribute, if only as part of a modifying body, to the law-making process.

As I figured, there's a lot of intellectual to-ing and fro-ing debate happening here.
 
I've still got the impression that it is a horrific tragedy and my heart is still broken.
 
Some bloke just down the road in Brighton lost it and started killing and maiming people with his van the other week, anyone on Earth that's actually come of the edge and lost it to the point of losing complete control during their lifetime has to be grateful that the consequences weren't as bad as this.
 
How cruel it is, I saw a still picture of a Mothers face from this disaster, I'll never forget what it was telling me.  It flies in the face of any natural order for a parent to have to bury a child, and in these circumstances?
 
Sometimes there is no cause to point at, no justice.  Sometimes justice, simply is a case of it just is.
 
I can't find it in me to point fingers to look for comfort from recriminations or revenge, I just sit here feeling the pain, a pain that must be beyond bearable for those currently sitting in the epicenter of it.
 
If I don't have a prayer to offer those people, then what have I got?

Single parent individuals don't develop or inherit a set of problems secular to losing a parent. Personality disorders are always made of indidvidual circumstance and misunderstanding of the whole picture. While that may sound general, and it is, it has nothing to do with a dead or missing parent. It has to do with subjective influence and knowledge. That means in broader terms, what code of right and wrong-(conduct), you adopt in relation to the missing influence in your heredity.
All our hearts are broken by this tragedy. We are all trying to find and identify what the common thread in these attacks on schools and innocent people is. All the killers have been people that dropped off the norm suddenly and took up the same persona. A killer clad in black with no motive. This is a common and as yet unidentified influence, causing people to go nuts and become automated killers.

  People who grow up in horrible situations, are disadvantaged and in many cases, "do suffer with all kinds of scars," for the rest of their lives.  However, "whether you want to become a meth freak, or a teacher, or a murderer, or a doctor," is up to you. 

There is no proof this guys household was filled with abuse.  Perhaps it was, but at 20 years old, "regardless of your upbringing," you will know right from wrong.

Child abuse suffered does not mean you will be a psychopath.  Great parenting does not ensure, "your nobel peace prize."

This guy was insane.  We do not have the medical science to determine with any accuracy, what was wrong with his body, mind and soul.

This was apparently posted by Morgan Freeman in response to the killings, not often I agree with him but he makes sense here:

"You want to know why. This may sound cynical, but here's why. It's because of the way the media reports it. Flip on the news and watch how we treat the Batman theater shooter and the Oregon mall shooter like celebrities. Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris are household names, but do you know the name of a single victim of Columbine? Disturbed people who would otherwise just off themselves in their basements see the news and want to top it by doing something worse, and going out in a memorable way. Why a grade school? Why children? Because he'll be remembered as a horrible monster, instead of a sad nobody. CNN's article says that if the body count "holds up", this will rank as the second deadliest shooting behind Virginia Tech, as if statistics somehow make one shooting worse than another. Then they post a video interview of third-graders for all the details of what they saw and heard while the shootings were happening. Fox News has plastered the killer's face on all their reports for hours. Any articles or news stories yet that focus on the victims and ignore the killer's identity? None that I've seen yet. Because they don't sell. So congratulations, sensationalist media, you've just lit the fire for someone to top this and knock off a day care center or a maternity ward next. You can help by forgetting you ever read this man's name, and remembering the name of at least one victim. You can help by donating to mental health research instead of pointing to gun control as the problem."

craigb


I can't help but think that most of those parents are probably sitting at home with presents wrapped for a child that no longer is alive to enjoy them...  The timing of this (i.e., during a season where families generally think more about each other) makes it that much worse.

I wrote a poem last night that illustrates that horrible truth:
 
Unopened presents under the tree,
Stockings full of toys and candy.
A shiny new bike sits outside,
A pretty doll with a bow tie.
 
Favorite box of cereal remains half full,
Favorite ice cream once made them drool.
A matchbox car sits on the rug,
A coloring book not quite done.
 
Little laughter in a memory,
Pitter patter of little feet.
Little cries for spilled juice,
Sometimes having to call a truce.
 
Pain will slowly fade away,
Hearts will mend day by day.
Forever will their memory remain,
Until we meet again.
 
12/14/2012 - We won't forget... RIP little ones.
 

NYC had its first crime free day, ever.  No stabbings, no slashings no shootings.  I remember hearing that about a week before and feeling a little uplifted......and then this.

I think that statistically, the over all level of violent crime is getting lower in the US, even through a particularly harsh recession.  However when one of these horrific tragedies occurs it makes one feel that things are getting worse. 

As many have stated, there is no single reason, no one thing to fix.  We all need to stay involved in our childrens lives (not just your own chilren) and teach them non-violent ways to solve things.  Especially teach them how to handle dissapointments and the "slings and arrows of outrageous fortune" and not let them fester into rage and pointless violence. 

JR

Why are we arguing religion in this thread? 

Friendships can be severly damaged by the words in this thread alone. 

I thought this thread was lamenting the loss of children in a horrible act of violence?

If people are going to throw out inflammatory statements like 'indoctrination' Reece, they're bound to get challenged.

I shake my head when people come out with contentious statements and then don't expect another point of view to be aired, retreating into the 'I'm not going to argue' corner.

This thread will no doubt be locked tomorrow.

http://www.gk-music.com/ultraphones.htm













These block out most of the noise and let me play to the beat of my own drummer.


People that have allowance for other people to have pluralistic experience don't see any need to argue or substantiate their viewpoint.


I can be right for me, and you can be right for you. One person's right doesn't make the other person's right wrong.


Having issues understanding that is a sign of weakness. That is my "right"... if someone else does not agree, there's nothing to argue about. They can be right too.


Grow up. Get a pair. These headphones are the best.




ya'll the best,
mike

mike_mccue




These headphones are the best.

They might be 'your' best, but they ain't 'my' best.


Don't argue about it either, that'd be weak.