However, the argument is that analog summing injects the sound of a familiar mixer/console into the music. Sonar's 64 bit summing bus doesn't do that. On the contrary, it makes our recordings sound cleaner, which is not bad. It just doesn't add character, which is what the mix needs in order to sound more 'organic' and less 'digital'. This is what a summing mixer or plugin does, and I find that the current generation of plugins are beginning to compare favorably against their analog counterparts.

brundlefly

However, the argument is that analog summing injects the sound of a familiar mixer/console into the music. Sonar's 64 bit summing bus doesn't do that. On the contrary, it makes our recordings sound cleaner, which is not bad. It just doesn't add character, which is what the mix needs in order to sound more 'organic' and less 'digital'. This is what a summing mixer or plugin does, and I find that the current generation of plugins are beginning to compare favorably against their analog counterparts.

 
I understand, but I would argue that it's not the summing per se that alters the sound, it's the general behavior of the analog circuits, the non-linear frequency/phase response, addition of noise, etc., and you should be able to get essentially the same result by summing to Master in SONAR, and sending that full mix through a single channel of the magical summing mixer.
 
Plus it's hard to imagine that the sound of any one mixer would make all mixes of all types of music sound "better" than the digital mix.
 
To me, this is a classic cure-all, snake-oil kind of claim. Any positive result you get is largely based on expectations, and reconciling the cognitive dissnance that would result from dropping a large wad of cash on Dr. Goldenear's Magic Music Elixer, and not hearing an improvement.

analog summing boxes a thing of the past

John

analog summing boxes a thing of the past

Are they? Are they a thing of the past or are they a result of the digital age? A thing of the present? I would be surprised if they existed in a pure analog world. What would have been the point of them? Make analog more analog? 

John


From a PDF for the VVC from Steven Slate

WHY ANALOG MIXING?
 Many of today’s top mixers still mix on analog consoles....
 
What we found, was that there was absolutely NOTHING wrong with digital summing. It is actually a fairly straightforward and simple digital process, and nothing about it would reduce bandwidth or create any negative artifacts on the mix.
Then, we began to run some tests on several vintage analog consoles. Again, the results were surprising. Some of the analog desks were FAR from perfect. We found that the analog circuits created many nonlinear and dynamic artifacts such as harmonic distortion, phase distortion, component saturation, and crosstalk.
This was rather odd, since so many engineers claim that analog desks sound better than digital mixers. Therefore, the only conclusion is that these nonlinear artifacts sound “musical” to the human ear.

Excerpted from  Virtual Console Collection Beta 2 quick user guide

The surprising thing about this to me is that they would find any of this surprising.

John

Then I wonder if many of us want fidelity at all?

 
Think about the ipod generation. Everone listening to mp3 or some other data comression format. How will future engineers train their ears to true fidelity? Will we be mixing to compensate for poor fidelity???When you think about it, most of us were brought up on records, with wonderful recordings made on wonderful analog gear...with all of it's flaws and all of it's character. That's how we "trained" our ears to like what we like. Right on John!!!!

Think about the ipod generation.

Don't all amplifiers, speaker crossovers/coils/cones/enclosures and listening environments do the same things in different ways? Why bother with an analog console when you and your listeners are already getting that and more from the output stage of your/their audio systems? Snake oil.

Yea, thanks John, ol pal, for relaying the Steven Slate "explanation" for AS.  I loved that.  How refreshingly honest.  No...there's nothing wrong with digital summing...some folks just want to color up their sound and we're happy to oblige them.  That's it.  I have met the enemy and he is us!