Helpful ReplyDoes anyone else here NEVER use console view?

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Sylvan
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 01:17:42 (permalink)
I use both Track View and Console View. I would be lost without the console View so I am glad it is still there. Tracking and editing happen in the Track View for me, then most of the mixing happens in the Console View.

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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 03:21:08 (permalink)
I never use it. I can do all I need with Track view and Inspector when needed.

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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 04:14:41 (permalink)
I really like having the CV on my second monitor. It gives me an easier overview of the total project (in my mind). Recording editing is done in the trackview and PRV for MIDI.

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#33
Kalle Rantaaho
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 04:37:09 (permalink)
I change to Console  View regularly when mixing. I use the sliders on my keyboard to control the Console sliders

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#34
bapu
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 05:04:48 (permalink)
As long as my Tascam FW-1884 works I'll not use CV. TV gives me everything I need.
 
When it goes, touchscreen will be next then I'll use CV.
#35
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 05:38:42 (permalink)
I use both - Track view when tracking, Console view when mixing, though the 2 disciplines are extremely fluid these days and I constantly switch between them.

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#36
olemon
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 09:11:20 (permalink)
I have a second display connected to my laptop.  I added that second screen right after I got Sonar X1 so that I could keep the Console View and the Track View open all of the time.
 
I keep the Console open on the 17" laptop and that's where I mix and control all of the channel/bus strip functions including PC, FX Bin, Sends, I/O....  I record and edit using the larger 22" screen to the left, where Track View is always open.
 
I use the Console View so much that I wish it had a few more functions, like deleting and rearranging tracks and buses.
post edited by olemon - 2015/05/18 09:19:00

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#37
Deon_C
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 10:03:15 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Resonant Serpent 2015/05/18 10:49:37
You can rearrange tracks and buses from the console view. Just hold alt then click/drag a track/bus where you want it.
#38
matt fresha
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 10:34:47 (permalink)
I'm 50/50 with Console View and Track View. I'd also be totally at a loss without either one of those views, especially track view for obvious reasons. lol
#39
Resonant Serpent
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 10:49:39 (permalink)
Two 23" monitors stacked vertically so I'm not looking side to side and I can keep my focus on the stereo field while mixing. Track view on the bottom where I do the obvious arranging. I keep the console open on the top monitor where I do the actual mixing like it was analog. I keep my pro channels open, set up sends, etc. Keeping the the two workflows on separate screens helps me keep it all organized in my head.

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#40
Jimbo 88
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 11:02:37 (permalink)
I NEVER used console view for years...then my work situation changed and i realized I have to be as good of mixer as i am composer to survive...
 
Now that I am using it, I realize i was missing out on a lot of Sonar features and when you get to the mixing stage, a lot more efficient.

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#41
olemon
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 11:16:06 (permalink)
Deon_C
You can rearrange tracks and buses from the console view. Just hold alt then click/drag a track/bus where you want it.



Thank you!

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#42
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/18 13:49:47 (permalink)
I use 2 monitors with the console on one by itself with track view on the other.

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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 18:06:29 (permalink)
Leadfoot
I use one monitor for track view, and one for console/multidock view.

+1

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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 18:15:03 (permalink)
Deon_C
You can rearrange tracks and buses from the console view. Just hold alt then click/drag a track/bus where you want it.

You can do the same from the TV view without holding the Alt key, but I suppose you knew that.

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#45
subtlearts
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 19:34:21 (permalink)
I use it and like it. I never used to, or would only occasionally crack it open to get an overview, but rarely. That changed a bit with the X series and the multidock, where it was so handy and instant I could flick it open with a keypress and so often did... and changed even more when I finally got around to putting up a second monitor. Now the console is pretty much open all the time on the second screen, undocked and maximized. The multidock gets edit windows and such. If I'm doing video that might be on the second screen and the console back in the dock. Depends. But I do use it, yes.

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#46
...wicked
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 19:51:47 (permalink)
Never use it. If you remember, way back when Cake even touted an early SONAR version with "you'll need the console view again!" but a few versions later touted it's return with some beefed up graphics.
 
I don't see the point in it. Why emulate an old console whose controls (knobs mostly) do not translate well to a computer/mouse operation? Everything is visible in the track view, INCLUDING the actual audio and MIDI data, so why bother? Sure, it's a good exercise in "use your ears" but in the Track view you can actually SEE problems like spikes and missing notes and whatnot. If you can get your navigation down to a quick science you really fly in the track view.
 
I saw some people post about the pro-channel and not using it, I'm not one of those people. Having all my effects tucked away and able to be recalled using the "I" key is wonderful. I even try and stick with mostly SONAR based effects (including the most excellent BlueTubes effects now). I was worried my go-to choices would stagnate my sonic palette but that has not turned out to be the case, which means I can quickly dump fx chains onto tracks and build mixes up quickly. Which is good because I spend that recovered time doing automation, which in my mind is what separated the kids from the grown ups, especially with electronic music. And sure, you CAN record automation in the console view, and even edit it I suppose, blindly. Me? I much prefer the Track View where I can dig in there with the mouse and envelopes. 
 
There was all this hoopla last time around about the console view's new expanded fx bin and whatnot, being able to see more sends and fx. Meh, you can wheel scroll the Pro Channel yo! And with auto-track zoom you can make a track height enough to see all the sends you want. That second monitor? I don't put the console view on it, I just extend my Track view over it so I can see as much of the song as possible. It's great.
 
Now I just want Cake to at long last implement a centered Now time so I don't have to keep doing it manually. :-)

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#47
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 20:52:36 (permalink)
I track and edit mainly in the track view (and PRV of course), and I do most of my mixing in console view, but I'll switch to the track view for certain things, such as duplicating a track, automation envelopes, etc. 

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#48
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 22:59:03 (permalink)
I always use the console view - for mixing and in combination with the track view for tracking.  It just feels easier / more natural to me.  I'm sure I could adjust and use only the track view if I had do, but I am comfortable with my dual monitor setup of having the tack view on one screen & the multidock on the other, which 99.99% of the time displays the console view. 

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#49
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/19 23:29:19 (permalink)
Use the CV for mixing.

In the past I did use a second monitor for a long time. CV full screen on second monitor.

But since SkyLight UI came along ( and I got familiar with it) I just use one big screen. Hitting D is almost as second nature now as CTRL + S!

Grem

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#50
Jesse G
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 09:22:58 (permalink)
What is this? How can you guys call yourselves engineers without the use of Console view?  OK If you have a set up in which there is a physical console in your studio or at least a controller with faders, pan pots and  such others, then I can see omitting the use of the console view, but if you just use a laptop and a keyboard, or a desktop and nothing else to really control your mixes then you have to use console view.
 
I have a dual monitor setup with track view on the left and Multi-dock on the right.  The Multi-dock shows the Console view, the Media view, Synths, Plugins, the Browser, and a bunch of other views.  So when I want to view something, I look to the right screen and click the appropriate tab on the Multi-dock and it's available for instant view.  Console is my favorite.  I have two Mackie Controllers which give me use of the faders in Sonar and the pan pots, as well as plugins and and other various functionality.  I have to see it as if I were in a actual studio, and the console view gives me that view.
 
I use my studio as an engineer, not a musician, so I need to see it from an engineers perspective.  The console view helps me use Sonar as if I were an engineer with an SSL Console. (But I have Mackie Controllers instead)
 
Keep in mind before I get stoned from this rough crowd, this is just my opinion so be gentle with me. LOL 
 
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#51
kevmsmith81
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 09:47:35 (permalink)
I flit between console view and track view, depending on what I'm doing at the time.
#52
RexRed
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 10:41:15 (permalink)
Thanks for all the REALLY great posts!!! 
 
I open console view and my mind swims. I have to perceive my song in a totally different orientation. The argument to many is that this orientation is easier to mix in. It is not easier if I am constantly switching back to track view to edit envelopes and track effects, then I have to reorient myself again. It is not how quickly I can switch to the other view but how it disrupts my concentration. I will try and keep console view open on my second monitor (a tv) I have vertical above my main monitor (a 22" monitor). I will experiment with this idea.
 
Each time I switch I need to rethink the entire song in a less or more detailed manner.
 
Then I have to think of my song in a horizontal and not a vertical spread.
 
It seems like nothing to me could be more torturous and time consuming. :)
 
If in TV I need to see several tracks and their relative volume meters I simply re-size the track so that only the volume faders show. I align them vertically in order and proximity and put them in a track folder and solo them if necessary.
 
If you use mackie mixers I can understand using a console view. 
 
I do nearly all of my mixing by editing nodes by hand in volume envelopes on tracks and busses so the volume knobs when in write mode usually "put in way too many nodes" (not sure how to explain that).
 
If you prefer editing envelopes by hand, once volume envelopes are inserted in tracks, console view really becomes obsolete. Editing the mix by hand is also much more precise. It is more time consuming but more accurate.
 
If you have each drum on a separate track and lots of drums I might consider using CV. Or if you have lots of live mics. Sometimes I am using stereo samples for drums and sometimes I have them separated but rarely do I have more than 7 or 8 drum tracks.
 
Vocals on the other hand I can have Oos and Ahhhs (in three part harmony), adlibs in harmony, main vocal and 2 over dubs and harmonies (three to ten parts).
 
That is a lot of vocals, perhaps if I splayed them out horizontally I could see them all at once in CV.
 
That I would possibly do. In this case though console view would simply act as a metering view because I would still feel required to edit my volume envelopes in track view.
 
Another thing, by the time I get to the mixing phase I have inserted volume envelopes into nearly all of my tracks. and I have made decisions as to where each track fades in and out. So mixing in the console is even less likely. Write mode is less likely. At that stage all volume adjustment are done by hand. I am more likely to use CV to get a rough mix and balance before I start a final mix, yet even this process I do in TV.     
post edited by RexRed - 2015/05/20 11:02:54
#53
williamcopper
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 10:57:50 (permalink)
Fwiw .. I use console view for the things some use prochannel ... effects and routing.   But that's a special work-time, so for me it is the only use I have for screensets: one screenset for that; otherwise console view is closed all the time. 
#54
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 13:18:26 (permalink)
RexRed
I open console view and my mind swims. I have to perceive my song in a totally different orientation. The argument to many is that this orientation is easier to mix in. It is not easier if I am constantly switching back to track view to edit envelopes and track effects, then I have to reorient myself again.



This. I understand the old adage of a mixing desk, and users of control surfaces have no choice since it still uses the L-R of tracks spread across paradigm. But DAWs don't use that paradigm and the Console View is just there to appease them. Tracks are now stacked, and left to right is reserved for TIME. Why have to go through the conversion in your head to look at an emulation of a console when all that information is already there in the Track View? 
 
I do get the separation of writing and mixing, so it helps to change the interface I suppose since it reinforces in your head what you're doing, but like you mention later in your post, almost every mix really doesn't enter it's final phase until you start doing your rides and automation. For me, doing it just by ears in the console view is cray-cray. I use envelopes and lots of them and being able to work directly on the waveform is unbeatable. I prefer to take advantage of my ears AND my eyes in that regard. Sheesh I'd lick my monitor too if audio data could be represented in scent format. (no extra charge for this killer joke setup too!)

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#55
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 15:27:46 (permalink)
Although I don't use console view, I understand the value.  In the track view, it is less convenient to make volume and pan adjustments to several tracks quickly.  I use the control surface faders to get a rough mix or to play with levels on an existing mix.  For the final pass, I make fine-tuning adjustments in the track view envelopes.  (If I were not OCD, though, I would do it all with faders instead of trying to clean up all those automation nodes.)

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#56
bapu
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 15:30:53 (permalink)
I used to have a 24 channel Alesis X2 console. I know what it means to work on a consolde. But..... back then we also recorded on it too. So it was a natural flow from recording to mixing.
 
As I've said I have a control surface. I really only use the faders when I want to write automation to track. But I do that in TV.
 
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#57
Blackiejames7
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 15:43:05 (permalink)
I'm old school when it comes to the console view, I like the visual of the view as I am not using an outboard console. I guess what ever works for the individual is the best.
 
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#58
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 15:51:59 (permalink)
I use the track view (and Pro Channel).  Even for mixdown and running Ozone 5, its track view. 
 
However, I usually only have 6 to 8 "analog" tracks, very rare any MIDI tracks.

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#59
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Re: Does anyone else here NEVER use console view? 2015/05/20 22:24:09 (permalink)
I use both console and track view.  With screen sets it's so easy to toggle between the two.  I have two monitors and like seeing a good deal of the console by spreading it across both of them.

i7-4770 CPU @3.40 GHZ
16.0 GB RAM
Widows 10   64-bit
SONAR Platinum
Focusrite Scarlett 18i20
#60
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