Helpful ReplyDorchester much more unstable than Cambridge.

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Anderton
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 13:09:24 (permalink)
One comment about load times: it sure seems that Windows itself takes a looooooong time to boot fully. After I enter the password, I go do something for 5 or 10 minutes. A project that can take a minute to load right after turning on the computer can take 10 seconds a few minutes later.
 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#31
Sir Les
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 13:38:14 (permalink)
MANTRASKY
Hello Sir Les, what's funny is that I've thought that my system, or to say the Processor Intel Q6600 Quad Core, is kind of old by today's standards. I can't say enough about SSD, since I've installed mine, Samsung 830 Pro 512gb
my computer is like a high-performance machine! I do have the primary Sonar Platinum program on the main SSD and the plug-ins, loops etc. on the secondary HDD (1tb). I have an external drive (Glyph) 8tb which I keep the music projects, other than that I haven't modified the Register, Bio's etc. I don't over-clock, the only time I noticed a lag in load up time is when I had forgotten that I was running my "Window's Defender & Anti-Virus" which I minimized, wasn't looking at the tray. Opened Sonar and I four minute project, and it took about 35 seconds? (approx.), I have this thing where I need things to respond at an instant, so I'm very aware of my computers condition most of the time, I'm sorry that I can't be more help! I also use 8gb of DDR2 which is old standards by today???


 Thanks...I had one of those Q995 machines once..But never did it open in 2 secs...never...Just making a point....if you got that happening in your estate...Bravo!...lol.

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2.  USING MAC PRO, as win 10 has damaged 2 x99 systems 8.1 is also to blame for the final burnout trying to roll back!
 
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#32
lfm
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 13:40:57 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby mettelus 2015/05/04 17:43:39
SteveStrummerUK
 
Edit to add: If I reopen the same project immediately after closing it, it takes less than 15 seconds to open.
 

 
Can't help but think that read cache helps a lot there.
And even disk issues, like defragmentation and chkdisk should be run.
 
#33
Rob[at]Sound-Rehab
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 13:55:09 (permalink)
Upgraded to Dorchester last night on the main DAW ...
 
I find it really cool that 2 major issues with mix recall I posted got improved: batch export using mix recall of time selection (collapsed folder bug) and optionally excluding FX rack from mix recall for faster load times (feature request) :-) thanks a lot.
 
Yet, I also pulled in a template hosting 5 synths (1x element, 2x zta3, 1x FF, 1x absynth) and it crashed an almost virgin new project ... and when trying again it crashed it again ... 3rd time around it worked (don't ask me why??) ... and I get the occasional crash when exiting/closing projects (which sometimes even require reboots) ... so talking about stability I'd appreciate this to be the focus ...
 
 

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#34
Beepster
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 14:10:39 (permalink)
Welp... that's a shame. I was hoping to hop on this release to get up to date (on Braintree still). Seems everything has been more or less stable for most folks and BT has been pretty good to me (it is snappier than X3 but I have had a couple crashes when pushing it). I was trying to avoid the Control Bar thing and some of the minor annoyances until this release but, even though I usually ignore the persistent naysayers, we seem to have a lot of confirmation from reliable members that something went wonky this month.
 
I'm thinkin' maybe I'll give Cambridge a go and just ignore some of the quirks. I do want to check out some of the new stuff (mostly the virtual keyboard) and I don't think I'll poop myself if my CB doesn't stay static (although I do have a preferred set up).
 
Ya'll log your reports. I'm sure it'll get resolved. Unfortunately I am in no position to do un-official beta testing right now otherwise I would pitch in.
 
Cheers... and thanks for the report.
#35
MANTRASKY
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 14:16:23 (permalink)
Sir Les, I've been lucky with mine, I also don't use Coloring the Tracks and Picture Icons which don't interest me. They would load down (maybe not much) as you know "Every time" with your project. My son's computer is more for gaming but is "Quick" 6 Core around 4.3ghz and that's with a HDD, his rendering speeds are blistering, he's a Game Designer/Programmer by profession, and he wants the newer Intel 8 Core (expensive). Cakewalk has been a very good program for me, but recently with the Bugs I have "Lost" music sections, (always backup!).
 
Good Luck!
 
Mike. 

 
 
#36
stickman393
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 14:23:59 (permalink)
@Beepster - Try it out and roll back to Braintree if you don't like it. It is trivial to roll back to a previous version, even if you don't use CCC.
 
I agree with Craig - the rollback process is - so far - clean and reliable.
 
I have all the upgrade .exe stored in a folder, and I just run the one I want to roll back to a specific version. I actually rolled back to Cambridge because I thought I might have found a nasty bug last night, but after verifying that there was no change, I rolled forward again.
 
You might be surprised at how stable Dorchester is for you.
 
 
#37
Beepster
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 14:42:43 (permalink)
Hi, stickman. I may but am pretty busy/pre-occupied right now. I am mostly doing tracking and some very specific tasks that don't really require much more than Bt is doing for me. I also kind of want to clear off my project schedule and do a massive clean up (or perhaps full restore/rebuild) of my system. It's been a long time coming and I think I'm more susceptible to certain quirks due to my "negligence". Gotta get that sorted.
 
It is possible Dorch will be solid on my rig and many times I do not experience a lot of the issues reported on the forum BUT based on past experience and my obsession of scouring this forum daily when the folks in this thread report issues I generally have issues.
 
Strange way to operate, I know, but I do have a good idea who's system's and workflow's are similar to mine so I can make pretty good assumptions as to what's gonna nail me and what isn't. Considering how insanely stressed out I am about other stuff right now having to deal with installs/rollbacks/weirdness I may completely melt down if something goes wonked on me.
 
Either way... I'm currently on the "If it ain't broke don't fix it" philosophy. I'm getting a gut feeling Cambridge will be solid (but will have some of the minor reported quirks which aren't a big deal) but the Dorch may amplify some issues I'm already having intermittently based on the reports here.
 
Meh. I'm a scaredycat. lol
#38
Beepster
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 14:58:26 (permalink)
I guess I should follow that up with... no one follow my lead on that if you have even the slightest bit more patience/time than I do (both of which I have zero of at the moment). We are able to rollback relatively easily these days and I'm sure this release isn't disastrous (we've only heard it is somewhat glitchy from SOME users on SOME systems).
 
I just ain't in a calm enough mental space to wrangle with it all right now. Long story but I don't want to discourage anyone from giving Dorch a test run. SPlat has been pretty cool for me so far.
 
Just needed to clarify that. Sorry.
#39
BobF
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 15:05:36 (permalink)
lfm
SteveStrummerUK
 
Edit to add: If I reopen the same project immediately after closing it, it takes less than 15 seconds to open.
 

 
Can't help but think that read cache helps a lot there.
And even disk issues, like defragmentation and chkdisk should be run.
 




The difference with cache is the reason I cleared my cache between times loading the same project.
https://technet.microsoft.../library/ff700229.aspx

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#40
joden
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 15:08:32 (permalink)
LJB
......... as an 8+ hour per day, 7 days a week professional user of Sonar Platinum ..............


OT, but how do you do that? I struggle to get through two hours without severe brain fade. 
 
PS: It is a serious question LJB, I am not trying to be a smartarse.....
#41
bapu
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 15:13:49 (permalink)
FWIW, I worked in Dorcherster for about 8 hours on Saturday and 5 hours on Sunday and the only crash I had was when I tried to open an old project whilst I had my current project open. I just wanted to copy one measure of audio to drop it in my new project.
 
After a restart of SONAR (not computer) the old project opened just fine as did the new one.
 
+1 FWIW - I've had this same thing happen to me in X3, X2 and X1. Yet at other times I can sucessfully load two or more projects. Maybe be track/vst related.
#42
Beepster
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 15:20:08 (permalink)
bapu
FWIW, I worked in Dorcherster for about 8 hours on Saturday and 5 hours on Sunday and the only crash I had was when I tried to open an old project whilst I had my current project open. I just wanted to copy one measure of audio to drop it in my new project.
 
After a restart of SONAR (not computer) the old project opened just fine as did the new one.
 
+1 FWIW - I've had this same thing happen to me in X3, X2 and X1. Yet at other times I can sucessfully load two or more projects. Maybe be track/vst related.





Okay... that's a little more encouraging.
 
Hope all is well in Bapsland.
 
Cheers, bud.
#43
Mark Huot
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 15:39:14 (permalink)
FWIW, I was having all kinds of issues with Plt not loading certain projects....it would hang no matter what I tried. Contacted support (great job Joey, thx again) and everything is good. I removed all instances of visual c++, reinstalled Dorchester and bingo all is well. I also didn't realize that my CPU is 2 generations below mininum spec for Plt (AMD A8 instead of A10) and I'm still running projects with 30+tracks and lots of plugins. The VSTi that I use usually get bounced to audio as soon as I get them where they have to be and the synth tracks are then archived....old habits from days gone by ;-) 
 
Morale of the story, Cakewalk tech support is top class! 
 
Now, back to making music............
#44
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 16:01:09 (permalink)
FreeFlyBertl
Upgraded to Dorchester last night on the main DAW ...
 
I find it really cool that 2 major issues with mix recall I posted got improved: batch export using mix recall of time selection (collapsed folder bug) and optionally excluding FX rack from mix recall for faster load times (feature request) :-) thanks a lot.
 
Yet, I also pulled in a template hosting 5 synths (1x element, 2x zta3, 1x FF, 1x absynth) and it crashed an almost virgin new project ... and when trying again it crashed it again ... 3rd time around it worked (don't ask me why??) ... and I get the occasional crash when exiting/closing projects (which sometimes even require reboots) ... so talking about stability I'd appreciate this to be the focus ...

 
I'd be very surprised if the crashes you are having are specific to Dorchester or just coincidental. Can you or anybody who have had crashes please post the CWBRN numbers so I can investigate?
Stability has definitely been the focus - look at the bug fix list in Dorchester! Of course there is a chance of something new to break but in this case I'm not convinced yet that its a new issue or coincidental.

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#45
stevec
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 16:08:02 (permalink)
Just another "everything working well here" post to add to the chorus.   I'm running a Q9300 w/ 8GB RAM, 1GB ATI Radeon card, all 7200 RPM HDDs and Win7 x64.  And with this, uh, "mature" setup, SPlat feels very similar to X3 overall.  I also haven't noticed any real performance difference between one SPlat release and the next, and even that's subjective.   Maybe a few seconds here and there during initial project load, or it could be my level of patience at the time.   Really hard to gauge.  
 
Oh, and all of my projects include VSTi and audio, some leaning more towards one direction than other, but always a mix and always at least 3-4 VSTi; e.g., Kontakt, AD2, AK, DP/Rapture, etc., and lots of PC modules and FX Chains.  
 

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#46
bitman
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 16:54:57 (permalink)
Can we call it Dorkchester now then?
I've been wanting to so badly because I guess I must be so immature. :-)
#47
mettelus
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 17:46:23 (permalink)
lfm
SteveStrummerUK
 
Edit to add: If I reopen the same project immediately after closing it, it takes less than 15 seconds to open.
 

 
Can't help but think that read cache helps a lot there.
And even disk issues, like defragmentation and chkdisk should be run.
 


This point is a good one, since I am often remiss in defragging my HDD (do not defrag an SSD!). I had a program (not SONAR) which regularly updates and installs its piece parts anywhere it chooses. Just last weekend I defragged/consolidated data on these drives and load times for all programs dropped substantially.
 
As things are written to disk, it is often in an easily accessible position for the heads at that time. When reading ALL of these piece parts for a load, the heads may be going all over to retrieve/assemble this data. Defrag/consolidation can have a dramatic effect for this, especially if the HDDs are higher capacity.

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#48
Jeff Evans
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 19:49:59 (permalink)
Anderton
One comment about load times: it sure seems that Windows itself takes a looooooong time to boot fully. After I enter the password, I go do something for 5 or 10 minutes. A project that can take a minute to load right after turning on the computer can take 10 seconds a few minutes later.
 


Hmmm not sure Craig about this.  I have just built a new Win 7 64 bit machine with a Samsung SSD as the C drive.  I get to the desktop in Win 7 in 23 seconds.  (Note I have done many tweaks though and not allowed any unnecsaary programs or background operations to boot up, ie have disabled lots of things that you don't need)  And Windows seems to be ready for action from that second on.  For me there is no difference 5 or 10 minutes later.
 
Studio One can open a huge session with many many tracks loaded with VST's and plugins in under 5 seconds flat and I mean it.  (2 seconds in most cases!)  It is so fast it is rude.  I still have a normal audio drive and the audio is being loaded up from that.  I guess the SSD might have something to do with the VST's and plugins though.  That is probably where the speed jump comes in.
 
They are fast and I mean fast. Samsung make the best I believe. After working with this I dont think I will ever go back. My other machines feel slow no in comparison. It shuts down in 2 seconds too.!
post edited by Jeff Evans - 2015/05/04 20:07:37

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#49
joden
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 20:28:24 (permalink)
perhaps the issue is a combination of dorchester AND rapture pro? I'd be interested to know how many of those who upgraded to dorchester and are having problems, also upgraded to rapture pro which IS giving me issues!
#50
BobF
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 20:40:11 (permalink)
I upgraded to S-PlatD and also have Rapture Pro.  RapPro has its issues, but none manifest themselves as stability problems.  The problems I'm having with RapPro are of the outright 'don't work ever' variety, which have been fully acknowledged and are being addressed by the Instrument Bakers.
 
None of them are keeping me from using S-PlatD or RapPro.

Bob  --
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#51
Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 20:41:47 (permalink)
Stable for me, most of these look like environmental issues. If there are specific issues you have the problem reports forum.
 
I'm wondering also if it is maybe a change in behaviour with the MIDI that may be causing issues. Some soft synths may be compensating for Sonar's old behaviour.
 
I suggest people having issues check page 7 and try reverting to the old behaviour. If you find a plugin starts to behave itself I would log an issue with the third party.

Rap Pro is NOT causing stability issues for me either. There are other problems but that isn't one of them
#52
Anderton
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 20:45:12 (permalink)
Jeff Evans
Anderton
One comment about load times: it sure seems that Windows itself takes a looooooong time to boot fully. After I enter the password, I go do something for 5 or 10 minutes. A project that can take a minute to load right after turning on the computer can take 10 seconds a few minutes later.
 


Hmmm not sure Craig about this.  I have just built a new Win 7 64 bit machine with a Samsung SSD as the C drive.  I get to the desktop in Win 7 in 23 seconds.



On my laptop with an SSD, yes. On the desktop it's not just a SONAR issue, same thing if I want to open Open Office and write something. I think a lot of time is spent scanning external USB drives and other USB devices. Or it could be that the squirrels running on the treadmill inside the computer need to awake fully.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#53
joden
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 21:10:02 (permalink)
BobF
I upgraded to S-PlatD and also have Rapture Pro.  RapPro has its issues, but none manifest themselves as stability problems.  The problems I'm having with RapPro are of the outright 'don't work ever' variety, which have been fully acknowledged and are being addressed by the Instrument Bakers.
 
None of them are keeping me from using S-PlatD or RapPro.




 
hmm for me Rapture Pro on occasion just hangs the PC. After about 5-6 minutes I am forced to re-boot. And other times just closing/re-opening Plat sorts it.
#54
Resonant Serpent
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 21:23:28 (permalink)
Anyone here with stability problems using Slate VMR? I was having trouble, then read on the literature that they recommend people stick with the VST 2 instead of the VST3 because of stability issues. After loading only the VST 2, a lot of my problems disappeared. The problem for me was Slate, not Sonar.

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#55
Tom Riggs
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 21:48:09 (permalink)
Have those of you that are experiencing crashes etc tried to reset and rescan the vst's?
 
Just a thought.

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#56
Larry Jones
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 22:26:34 (permalink)
I don't think initial load time is very important, as long as things work properly once it's all loaded. That said, I timed my Platinum Dorchester just now. It took 3:59 until ready to work. This was a "cold start": Turned on the machine, waited five minutes, started Sonar by clicking on a project. The computer has 7200RPM SATA drives (other specs below). There are 114 plugins. The project consists of Addictive Drums, two guitar tracks, six soft synths (not frozen) and 11 vocal tracks. A couple of reverbs and compressors, but nothing extreme. I admit I run antivirus in the background, but no other programs.
 
I never paid attention to this metric before. I usually have other things to do while Sonar is starting, and when I come back it's ready for me. But now that I look at it, and now that I see others are loading in under a minute, I wonder WTH. I should mention that once the program is running I have very little trouble with it. I'm not a commercial studio, but I think I would feel comfortable dealing with clients at the level of stability I get from Sonar.
 
So now I'm disgruntled about startup time, but I never was before. Thanks a lot, everybody.
 
[EDIT: Closed Sonar and restarted the same project. Time to work was :21. Closed Sonar and restarted by clicking on a template containing no recording. Time to work was :09. So I'm feeling much better, now]
post edited by Larry Jones - 2015/05/04 22:45:40

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#57
joden
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 23:20:36 (permalink)
That is because of windows pre-fetch, not sonar ;)
 
#58
mettelus
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 23:21:30 (permalink)
One thing I have notice with SPlat is the "not responding" in the title bar. I have seen this in screen captures of people's issues as well. Once SONAR has been run once, I do not see a notable difference between X3 and SPlat, but that "not responding" part of SPlat's initial startup bothers me. I am not sure why this occurs though.

ASUS ROG Maximus X Hero (Wi-Fi AC), i7-8700k, 16GB RAM, GTX-1070Ti, Win 10 Pro, Saffire PRO 24 DSP, A-300 PRO, plus numerous gadgets and gizmos that make or manipulate sound in some way.
#59
Doktor Avalanche
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Re: Dorchester much more unstable than Cambridge. 2015/05/04 23:31:12 (permalink)
They should tidy the whole starting up thing - with a progress bar style animation (it won't be able to report the progress of opening of course, it will be more like a 'buffering' thing), but it would be cool to get notified as to what it is actually doing... and we don't need to see the screen setup in realtime, everything can be hidden until it's all ready... Make it a nice experience..
#60
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