Helpful ReplyMackie Control protocol source now available [scroll to p3]

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bitSync
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/15 13:25:32 (permalink)
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
HI guys,
 
We realize that users want periodic updates to the Mackie control dll. To facilitate this we are planning on open sourcing SONAR's mackie control surface. There are several developers in the SONAR community and a few have expressed interest in maintaining and updating this. We're still working through some details but I'll post an update when I have some more details.
Well also be releasing the current version of the control surface API that has access to more SONAR specific parameters, Prochannel etc.
 
thanks,
Noel




Holy smokin' coolness!  I am currently using a Mackie Control Protocol (MCP) emulator (BluAudio D8Bridge) along with the Mackie d8b as a control surface, and I'm reasonably happy with the integration.  Important stuff works as it should - Solo, Mute, Pan, Record Enable, faders, audio level meters, time code display and transport/shuttle/scrub functions.  The channel Selects don't work and I've got the same issues with EQ control that the MCU users have.
 
One of the biggest challenges to the MCP emulator builders is no access to the MCP spec.  The Logic Control spec is close but certainly not identical.  So consequently, some things are just unknown and not everything works as it should.  This idea of publishing Sonar's control surface and API is huge!  Thank you!
post edited by bitSync - 2013/12/15 13:37:19

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#31
BlixYZ
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 09:00:59 (permalink)
I am going on record saying that I will contribute $$ to development for the MCU.  It has always been great, but never lived up to it's full potential due to neglect.  I would like it if the buttons did what they say they do (with the Sonar overlay) and if it and/or the C4 could control the PC.   How incredible that would be!!!!
If it was fully customizable, that would be sweet, but I would probably borrow a well made template and modify as needed.  I don't usually have time for long tedious mappings and whatnot.
 
I don't have any coding skills, so I will make a donation.  I don't follow the forums closely all the time, so please message me if it's time to cough up some dough.
 
James

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#32
smallstonefan
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 10:03:55 (permalink)
I would be happy to donate to such a product as well.
#33
lawp
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 11:23:51 (permalink)
after a couple of months, any progress on making it open source?
#34
Freex
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 14:46:28 (permalink)
oh to have a fully functioning MCU, now that would make a great xmas, or new year, or just my day.
I hope the guys on here that can make it happen, CAN make it happen.


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#35
Splat
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 17:13:36 (permalink)
Freex
oh to have a fully functioning MCU, now that would make a great xmas, or new year, or just my day.
I hope the guys on here that can make it happen, CAN make it happen.



Doing something like that isn't going to be an overnight thing unfortunately...

Sell by date at 9000 posts. Do not feed.
@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#36
gcolbert
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 19:37:45 (permalink)
lawp
after a couple of months, any progress on making it open source?


Kind' wondering the same thing.  Has someone picked this up?
 
Glen

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#37
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 20:04:49 (permalink)
Hi folks,
 
Haven't forgotten about this. As you might imagine between all the stuff that we did for X3D and the changes here we have been swamped beyond belief so this was on hold due to lack of time. Definitely still intend to set it up as an open source repository probably on GitHub.
 
Also some good news - we got clearance from Roland to also open source the VS-700 surface so that should be a great resource for someone who wants to build a full blown ACT surface.
I'll do my best to set this up next month when people are back from the holidays, assuming I don't get hijacked into some other fires.
 
Sorry for the delays and thanks for your patience.

Noel Borthwick
Senior Manager Audio Core, BandLab
My Blog, Twitter, BandLab Profile
#38
Splat
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/22 20:07:56 (permalink)
Not codeplex? :) Anyways I'm getting fussy... Good news... thanks...

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@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#39
Freex
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/23 05:35:19 (permalink)
CakeAlexS
Freex
oh to have a fully functioning MCU, now that would make a great xmas, or new year, or just my day.
I hope the guys on here that can make it happen, CAN make it happen.



Doing something like that isn't going to be an overnight thing unfortunately...




Oh I know, don't get me wrong, I'm not expecting miracles...
 
But just have the acknowledgement that it's a problem and the bakers are going to let it lose opensource, has made my day, when and it's a big when, some kind and gifted programmer solves our Mackie Control headaches, it will be as if Xmas has come.


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#40
Freex
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/23 05:35:30 (permalink)
double post
post edited by Freex - 2013/12/23 18:40:43


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How To Setup A Drum Map...The Easy Way.PDF

#41
FCCfirstclass
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/23 10:03:37 (permalink)
Great news Noel.   Please keep us posted.  Thanks

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And away we go!
#42
Jesse G
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2013/12/23 13:13:08 (permalink)
Using MCU with Sonar X2 and it is able to connect without any problems.  I connect using MIDI only not USB. I can operate a lot of my Sonar functions using the MCU, however,  not as much as I used to when I had Sonar 8.5.  I do believe there was a change in the Mackie.ini file at some point.
 
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#43
GaryMedia
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/01/08 22:08:45 (permalink)
Is is possible (and legal) for someone to send the MackieControl.dll from X3c to me?  I'd like to try it in my Sonar X1d to see if it'll enable proper function of my X32 (running 1.15). Right now, it's a disappointing situation.
 
I'm excited to hear that the DLL will eventually be Open Sourced, but until then, I'd like to do this test. At some point I expect to upgrade to X3.
 
This is unrelated, but can someone confirm that, in X3, transport position is driven out to VST's (to enable manual pitch correction within Izotope Nectar).  The Mackie Control and Transport VST issues are two must-haves that would keep me in the Sonar camp. 

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#44
John
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/01/08 23:30:36 (permalink)
Transport VST what is that?

Best
John
#45
lawp
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/01/09 03:15:38 (permalink)
John
Transport VST what is that?


does the host send the position of the playhead/now time/transport to the VST plugin?

sstteerreeoo ffllllaanngge
#46
Sanderxpander
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/01/09 04:11:16 (permalink)
I believe so. At least, even in previous version, when using Melodyne, it would follow the playhead.
#47
GaryMedia
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/01/09 08:43:35 (permalink)
Pardon me for making up the term Transport VST. The function that I need is as Sanderxpander described. The playhead position is given to the VST plugin so it can create a replica of the audio that matches the position of the original. Obviously v-Vocal does this, and I just realized that the Melodyne Essential in X3 has that manual editing function. 
 
I think this puts me over the goal line. The Melodyne Essential provides the manual vocal editing function that I need, and the apparently fixed MackieControl.DLL in X3c (hopefully unchanged in X3d) gives me what I need.  
 
As I have played with Studio One (Windows and OSX), Logic and Pro Tools, I am ever more impressed with the usability and layout of Sonar…and that's why I am upgrading from X1 to X3 this week. 
 
That's enough thread-jacking for one day.  
post edited by GaryMedia - 2014/01/09 09:30:03

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#48
GaryMedia
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/01/10 17:35:39 (permalink)
To share the benefit of my rainy day progress on this issue, I am pleased to announce that in Sonar X1, I've gotten past the 'Connecting' hang, with my Behringer X32, and have made some baby steps toward useful function. I am running on the Firewire interface of the X_UF through a PCI Texas Instruments adapter. 
 
In the Behringer X32, the 'Setup>>Remote' screen has...
Protocol = Mackie Ctrl
Interface = Card MIDI
MIDI In/Out = Card MIDI
Remote Button = Enable {toggled orange}
 
In Sonar X1d, the 'Edit>>Preferences>>MIDI>>Control Surfaces>>Connected Control Surfaces/Controllers'...
The 'Mackie Control-1' selected and X_UF MIDI for both 'In Port' and 'Out Port'.  
WAI is checked, and I picked yellow for my color.  
Under  'WAI Display', 'Track View' and 'Console View' are both checked.
 
I opened a 30-track project, and under 'Utilities>>'Mackie Control-1', there is an utility edit dialog box. This utility seems to be a holdover from a Sonar 8.5 installation. It says Chris Boucher [chris at sorted dot org] copyright 2002-2006 along the footer of the dialog box.  In the bottom right-hand corner of the box, I picked 'Fader touch selects channel' and 'Select highlights track'. 
The biggest leap forward was choosing 'Meters // Signal LEDs + Meters. That made the meters work in the X32 bus faders.  
 
Back in the X32, I tapped the 'View' button in the 'Assignable Controls' area.  
Within Set-B, I chose...
Select Control Button 5 /// Remote /// < Bank
Select Control Button 6 /// Remote /// > Bank
Select Control Button 7 /// Remote /// UP
Select Control Button 8 /// Remote /// DOWN
Select Control Button 9 /// Remote /// REW
Select Control Button 10 /// Remote /// STOP
Select Control Button 11 /// Remote /// PLAY
Select Control Button 12 /// Remote /// FF
 
I put some other stuff in Set-A and Set-C as an experiment, (for example, RIGHT and LEFT moves between markers), but you get the idea.  The faders work, but their current position value in dB isn't displayed in the little display window for each bus on the X32 as Studio One does; I only get a sequential number 1-thru-8 in that field. Fader responsiveness also seems a bit sluggish compared to Studio One, but for now, I'm overjoyed to have gotten this far past 'Connecting...'.
 
The Studio One 2.6 support of the Mackie Control emulation in the X32 is my benchmark for function; although I haven't figured out the equivalent of WAI marking in that DAW. Conversely, Logic in OSX does the WAI very well on the X32, but defaults the fader position value to zero after you stop moving the fader. 
 
That's the extent of my baby steps.  I'd still like to see what differences there would be with the MackieControl.dll from X3c, but at least there's marginal function at this point.  
 
I hope these "instructions" are helpful to someone. 
 
 
 

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#49
Dyonight
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/04 13:19:06 (permalink)
any updates? Any estimation possible?  I have a Nucleus here that seriously need to be healed....

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#50
bitSync
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/04 13:33:25 (permalink)
I vote for a complete revamp/update/scrub of the mackiecontrol.dll in X3e, accompanied by Cakewalk's publication and open sourcing of the MCP / control surface implementation.  Not that my vote counts much, but pretty please...
 
All control surface controls (e.g., mute buttons) written to automation.
 
I'm not whining, really.  I'm fairly happy with X3.  But supertight MCP integration would be the bomb! 

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#51
Splat
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/04 13:35:00 (permalink)
bitSync
I vote for a complete revamp/update/scrub of the mackiecontrol.dll in X3e, accompanied by Cakewalk's publication and open sourcing of the MCP / control surface implementation.  Not that my vote counts much, but pretty please...
 
All control surface controls (e.g., mute buttons) written to automation.
 
I'm not whining, really.  I'm fairly happy with X3.  But supertight MCP integration would be the bomb! 




+1, although I'm happy to wait till X3F, or even X4.

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@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#52
southpaw3473
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/04 13:43:12 (permalink)
Awesome news, Noel! I miss being able to control EQ parameters with my BCF. Karl (Fast Biker Boy) helped me when X1 came out to get back some of the controls back but by X1c or d it stopped working. 

We'll not risk another frontal assault-that rabbit's dynamite!!!

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#53
neirbod
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/20 16:51:46 (permalink)
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
Hi folks,
 
Haven't forgotten about this. As you might imagine between all the stuff that we did for X3D and the changes here we have been swamped beyond belief so this was on hold due to lack of time. Definitely still intend to set it up as an open source repository probably on GitHub.
 
Also some good news - we got clearance from Roland to also open source the VS-700 surface so that should be a great resource for someone who wants to build a full blown ACT surface.
I'll do my best to set this up next month when people are back from the holidays, assuming I don't get hijacked into some other fires.
 
Sorry for the delays and thanks for your patience.




 
Bump.  Any update Noel? 

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#54
Splat
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/20 17:02:18 (permalink)
I doubt you will get it before X3E, and that's late March.

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@48/24 & 128 buffers latency is 367 with offset of 38.

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#55
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/22 17:09:07 (permalink)
The Cakewalk-Control-Surface-SDK open source project is now live on GitHub. Thank you for your patience. 
 
We have published the source code for several production control surfaces that ship with SONAR to the open source Cakewalk community. The code can be found in the Surfaces folder. This software is distributed in the spirit of open source sharing under the MIT license. To this purpose we request that any stable/useful modifications to the control surfaces be published back for the community to build upon. Initially access to the Control Surface SDK repository is read only. You may clone this repository for your own use. If you would like to commit your changes to the GitHub master branch, please contact us with a request for push access to the repository and a moderator will review your request.
 
Please review the basic documentation in the Docs folder and the file "Cakewalk Control Surface SDK.htm" for more information about the SDK.
 
The source code for the following surfaces is now available:

ACTMidiController

Generic ACT control surface from SONAR

MackieControl

Mackie control surface 

VS100

The VS100 control surface from SONAR

VS700

The VS700 control surface from SONAR

SampleSurface

A simple sample control surface that can be used as a starting point or for testing
 
ControlSurfaceProbe
A useful diagnostic control surface that may be used for debugging
 
 

Noel Borthwick
Senior Manager Audio Core, BandLab
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#56
Dyonight
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/22 18:05:16 (permalink)
This is epic
 
Thank you Mr Brothwick!

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#57
bitSync
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/23 08:25:04 (permalink)
Awesome.  Thank you.

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#58
joakes
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/23 08:37:08 (permalink)
CakeAlexS
I doubt you will get it before X3E, and that's late March.


Oops ;-)

Cheers,
Jerry

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#59
siordanescu
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Re: Mackie Control protocol broken in Sonar X1/X2/X3 2014/02/23 10:47:45 (permalink)
I think if someone could develop Sonar integration in M-AUDIO PROJECTMIX. I think we are enough users ....

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#60
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