Helpful ReplyGuitar amp simulator software

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hockeyjx
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/22 14:59:13 (permalink)
I'd love an AMP SIM CHALLNGE; where you could A/B a miked rig versus sims at the same volume in a silent control room. We secretly replaced his Marshall stack with...
 
It could be great marketing for someone.

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Sanderxpander
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/22 15:30:44 (permalink)
Unless it's an amp that's entirely unfamiliar to the player, I doubt you're gonna fool him. In my experience guitarists are pretty finicky about "their sound", at least the ones that bother dragging around expensive tube amps are, and no emulation is going to be 1:1 for that specific amp.
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tlw
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/22 17:55:21 (permalink)
hockeyjx
Out of curiosity, I wonder if a lot of people who use the traditional setup have their opinion altered from hearing the amp in all it's glory in a live room or JUST the mic'd signal.
 
Because a Marshall in a room of course has more power than a sim.


Once tracked you're always hearing/mixing just the mic'd signal so it is a matter of comparing like with like. Nothing to do with the impact of volume either. A sub 1 watt valve amp isn't very loud, especially if kept on the clean side. As for playing live, once the venue is to big for something like a Deluxe Reverb, AC15 or Tiny Terror you'd normally be going into the PA anyway, at which point unless you're playing a stadium the sound person will often tend to get unhappy if you turn a 50W Lead or a Twin up above about 3. The days of 100 watt amps that go to 11 are gone, and that's really not a bad thing.

I'd add that I've never really understood why the software sims bother with emulated microphones in the first place. Useful if you specifically want the sound of e.g. a Jensen C12 after filtering by the emulated response of a virtual SM57/whatever I suppose, but otherwise the microphone is a compromise made necessary by mic (or DI of course) being the only way to record a "conventional" setup.

The older Sansamps had mic emulation of a sort, though it was really more of a basic tone control than anything. The Character series Sansamps don't and to me they are better without it.

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#63
Anderton
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/22 18:06:22 (permalink)
Sanderxpander
Unless it's an amp that's entirely unfamiliar to the player, I doubt you're gonna fool him. In my experience guitarists are pretty finicky about "their sound", at least the ones that bother dragging around expensive tube amps are, and no emulation is going to be 1:1 for that specific amp.



Funny related story. When I was doing sound design for Gibson's FBX one of the goals was to create some sounds that emulated other existing guitars (e.g., Strat). We set up an environment for A-Bing guitars where I would have either the FBX or the guitar being emulated, and Frank Johns from Gibson would have the other one. The musicians couldn't see us or tell who was playing what. 
 
When we started the process, they identified the real one almost 100% of the time. I'd go back and tweak the sounds some more, and eventually we got it to the point where no one could tell reliably which was which.
 
Then I'd say "let me do one more tweak." After hearing it, almost invariably they'd say "Well, now you've lost it again...I can tell that guitar A is the real Strat." Except guitar A was actually the FBX. The final tweak I did was to add just a little bit of emphasis to the characteristics people associated with a particular guitar. In other words, I was closer to the sound they heard in their head as representing the guitar compared to the guitar itself.

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kennywtelejazz
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 06:39:23 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby hockeyjx 2014/08/23 11:23:24
A common mistake that guitar players often make ( myself included at times ) is they often think that an amp sim is gonna magicaly inspire them to play and sound better than they actually do
think about what I am saying here because that is actually putting the cart before the horse …
the horse will still have all the power of his legs but what happens here is when the horse is behind the cart
his nose is going to be way to sensitive to be able to push the cart ..even w all his above average Equine strength ...
 
I'm sure I'm not alone on this board when I mention that I have done many sessions as a guitarist for hire in NYC and LA ….
I  have brought multiple amps,  multiple guitars and pedal boards to a session …...probably lugged a half a vans worth of gear into the studio and wound up not having gotten to play out of most of it …or any of it ….
 
Now if that has happened to you …good …..then you have some idea where I'm going with this 
 
Every producer and engineer I've ever worked for has wanted me to lay down a useable workable guitar sound that they could sculpt and manipulate after it was tracked using the whole power of the studio …
my personal preferences about what tone  I thought was best always took a back seat ...
the truth is , I was thinking little picture , they were always thinking about the big picture 
 
let me tell you what I am getting at …
I stopped using guitar sims in the traditional way that people try to use them
I decided to go  with an old school approach ..
I put the full power of my DAW upfront in the signal chain first by using the studio emulated plugins just like an real engineer would  
 
now what do I actually mean by that ? 
I do my best to nail my guitar part with a workable sound that I can sculpt using the more powerful and versatile plugs that come w SONAR or Logic …first …just like in the old days when I was in the studio 
 
example I will use the VC 64 as my guitar compressor or the Sonitus delay as if I'm using these plugs in a virtual pedal board . the same goes for EQ , then as my last step I will hit them with a touch of an amp sim just as I would use my amp in real life / real world 
now when I use the amp sim last I treat it as if I'm using it just like a reverb ..
I want just enough to imply not over power ...
it has been my personal experience that by using the more powerful and versatile plugs before hitting the amp sim  
I can get a more idealized / unique guitar tone …
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...
you will be able to hear I hit everything hard in SONAR first . my amp sim was the last object of my signal chain 
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson 
 
disclaimer,  what I might consider a good guitar tone using an amp sim  might be somebody else's idea of nails scraping away on  chalk board 
 
Kenny
 
post edited by kennywtelejazz - 2014/08/23 07:37:35

                   
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#65
Kylotan
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 06:55:00 (permalink)
Anderton
If you put your ear three inches from a Marshall's speaker cone, it's not going to sound all that great.


And yet that's exactly what ends up on the album usually, and gets called 'classic tone' or whatever.
 
I am 95% convinced that most of the arguments over guitar sound are entirely psychological and largely the result of confirmation bias with a dose of 'louder = better' thrown in. Many albums are being done with amp sims these days and no listener can tell the difference. But then I've also seen guitarists perform live through sims that have 1/10th the fidelity of modern sims (eg. the venerable Behringer V-Amp2) and everyone at the gig seemed to think it sounded great.
 
For me, the key is to not use your judgement of how it sounds in the room to decide what tone to put in the mix (nor to assume that a tone that works well on a recording will sound good in a live setting).

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lawajava
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 09:51:45 (permalink)
kennywtelejazz
 
I do my best to nail my guitar part with a workable sound that I can sculpt using the more powerful and versatile plugs that come w SONAR or Logic …first …just like in the old days when I was in the studio 
 
example I will use the VC 64 as my guitar compressor or the Sonitus delay as if I'm using these plugs in a virtual pedal board . the same goes for EQ , then as my last step I will hit them with a touch of an amp sim just as I would use my amp in real life / real world 
now when I use the amp sim last I treat it as if I'm using it just like a reverb ..
I want just enough to imply not over power ...
it has been my personal experience that by using the more powerful and versatile plugs before hitting the amp sim  
I can get a more idealized / unique guitar tone …
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...
you will be able to hear I hit everything hard in SONAR first . my amp sim was the last object of my signal chain 
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson 
Kenny



Kenny, I'm not accustomed to your idea of putting the amp sim last in the chain, and it seems illogical.  That said, I listened to your sample songs.  First off, I have to say you've done a great job on those pieces.  Really well done!  Your guitar tone is excellent.  I certainly may try your idea for an experiment.  However, I'm finding tweaking with an amp sim (like Amplitube) and applying effects within it, I can also easily produce some great sounds to my liking that fit within a song.  That said, it's clear you've nailed your guitar sounds, and really your performance on them, the notes you're hitting and your pieces are really nice.  I'm glad I had a chance to hear them.

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hockeyjx
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 11:31:24 (permalink)
Great post Kenny. Spot on. You given me homework that will take me HOURS to complete ...I don't know how I feel about that 
 

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Anderton
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 11:50:23 (permalink)
Kylotan
Anderton
If you put your ear three inches from a Marshall's speaker cone, it's not going to sound all that great.


And yet that's exactly what ends up on the album usually, and gets called 'classic tone' or whatever.

 
I was referring to the post that talked about how playing an amp in a room has a very different feel compared to listening to a miked sound.
 
But I don't know how many people just stick a mic 3 inches from a cone. I put a lot of effort into capturing some room sound, sometimes using a ribbon's Figure 8 to accentuate pickup on reflections. I also check out the sound of a mic angled, closer to the edge of the speaker, etc. Sometimes I place an open back amp flat on the floor so the floor acts as a baffle and gives more lows. The point is an amp is a multi-dimensional sound source and I think incorporating that into a track, even if it's just backing the mic away a bit from the speaker, contributes to a more interesting sound.
 
For me, the key is to not use your judgement of how it sounds in the room to decide what tone to put in the mix (nor to assume that a tone that works well on a recording will sound good in a live setting).



I think the issue here is more about what's going to inspire you as a player. I'd venture to say that more guitar players would prefer to play in a room with an amp than listen to a sim on headphones. Presumably this is why people like to re-amp - they can capture a performance that was inspired, and deal with the tone that works best for the mix later. Then again, for some guitar sounds like the multiband distortion stuff, I'd much rather listen on headphones with a sim - because if I had to create that sound with a physical setup, it would take hours (and hours), and I'd probably want to go get a stiff drink afterward  

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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Anderton
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 11:51:50 (permalink)
hockeyjx
Great post Kenny. Spot on. You given me homework that will take me HOURS to complete ...I don't know how I feel about that 



This is exactly what I mean by you really have to work with amp sims to get the sound you want. I did one setup that involved 24 (!!) stages of EQ external to the sim; if you bypass any one of them, you can hear the difference (and it's not a good one).
 
Now, you might think "why not just mic an amp?" but a sim with this degree of EQ was the only way I could get the sound I wanted. And as has been pointed out in this thread, guitar players can be very picky about tone - guilty as charged, your honor 

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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mettelus
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 15:52:16 (permalink)
Ibanezer
Hey Mettelus is your Carvin the TS100? I really like mine. I have the guitar rig 5 with their pedal. It's cool to mic all that and then run another line straight into the daw. Gets both worlds and options for later

 
Carvin makes top quality gear, for sure. I have a Carvin XV-212 I bought way back when (1989). It is a bit beefy for a home environment; but after I cleaned the pots in it, it has been better than I remember. Carvin is a company with a high reputation, and I was a bit leery to mail-order something I never played, but no regrets whatsoever. 
 
This same "issue" is why I never bought a guitar from Carvin actually, since I cannot be sure of the tone I am getting. I did a second rebuild of my first guitar in 2012, and used a modified "Super Seven Switching" configuration (only using 6 switches (wired slightly differently), 4 of which are in two "Seymour Duncan TS-1 Triple Shot pickup mounting rings"). Since the guitar was rare to begin with and is now truly one-of-a-kind, I put the effort into making it play the way I have always wanted (it has had bass frets in it since 1989).
 

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hockeyjx
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 16:02:09 (permalink)
SO Kenny and Craig....
 
It sounds like a job for the FX CHAIN! Do either of you have existing FX CHAINS presets to play with Guitar Rig or AmpliTube? Something more than the stock ones would be helpful.

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mettelus
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 16:17:14 (permalink)
kennywtelejazz
A common mistake that guitar players often make ( myself included at times ) is they often think that an amp sim is gonna magicaly inspire them to play and sound better than they actually do  [...]


Another "great post" endorsement for this! I think both effects and "expensive (guitars)" are common pitfalls for new players.

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#73
PH68
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 17:08:31 (permalink)
To be honest the man-on-the-street couldn't care less what guitar/amp/FX/room/software/mixer/studio/engineer you use, or how many hours/weeks/months you spent getting your sound "just right".
 
Similar questions can be along the lines of...
Do you use real drums or a machine?
Do you use a synth or a real orchestra?
Do you actually play the notes or programme them in?
Do you sing in tune or use auto-tune?
Does the band play as a band or track by track?
etc..
 
Bottom line, it's the final product that matters.

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Anderton
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 19:03:13 (permalink)
PH68
Bottom line, it's the final product that matters.



To the person listening, yes. But the point of this discussion is how to get a satisfying sound, and have an enjoyable playing experience, for the person who's doing the recording. I think that's related to creating something that the person doing the listening will like.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
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orangesporanges
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 22:36:23 (permalink)
I feel compelled to chime in on this one, as I recently resurrected three of my amps. An old musicman that I have had forever that I use as a power amp with a rack fueled by a Hafler T2 preamp and a no name 4 x 12 w emminence legends, a crate vintage club 15w class A(they got the lunchbox idea down years before they came in vogue) And a Rivera 5512. A good diverse selection of tube tone. I did a lot of A/B comparisons between my real and virtual worlds.
While I don't think I would take a laptop to a gig, I have to say that the convenience of sims is too much to resist when tracking. I have been using Guitar Rig 5 Pro with great results, and occasionally still go to my old johnson jstation. Keep in mind, that while only tubes truly sound like tubes, your tone sits in a mix, where subtleties tend not to be as noticed. One piece of advice I would give is track your guitar clean and dry, when you can get away with it.(try enabling two tracks in record if you need the sustain and effects feel, feeding one a dry signal) Get a good,hot full bandwidth signal. Then you can "re amp" to your heart's content. Make sure whatever you choose has a good library of amps and effects available, and allows you to run both as a standalone and a VST plugin. 
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mixmkr
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/23 23:44:01 (permalink)
Anderton
 



To the person listening, yes. But the point of this discussion is how to get a satisfying sound, and have an enjoyable playing experience, for the person who's doing the recording. I think that's related to creating something that the person doing the listening will like.


I believe that IS the answer for the bands/musicians that create the most recognizably enjoyable music for their listeners.  We all know the term "sell out" and I can't seem to think of any bands that went that route and had better success in that area, than bands that didn't.  Then there's people who twerk...  good grief.

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kennywtelejazz
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 04:45:20 (permalink)
lawajava
kennywtelejazz
 
I do my best to nail my guitar part with a workable sound that I can sculpt using the more powerful and versatile plugs that come w SONAR or Logic …first …just like in the old days when I was in the studio 
 
example I will use the VC 64 as my guitar compressor or the Sonitus delay as if I'm using these plugs in a virtual pedal board . the same goes for EQ , then as my last step I will hit them with a touch of an amp sim just as I would use my amp in real life / real world 
now when I use the amp sim last I treat it as if I'm using it just like a reverb ..
I want just enough to imply not over power ...
it has been my personal experience that by using the more powerful and versatile plugs before hitting the amp sim 
I can get a more idealized / unique guitar tone …
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...
you will be able to hear I hit everything hard in SONAR first . my amp sim was the last object of my signal chain 
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson 
Kenny

Kenny, I'm not accustomed to your idea of putting the amp sim last in the chain, and it seems illogical.  That said, I listened to your sample songs.  First off, I have to say you've done a great job on those pieces.  Really well done!  Your guitar tone is excellent.  I certainly may try your idea for an experiment.  However, I'm finding tweaking with an amp sim (like Amplitube) and applying effects within it, I can also easily produce some great sounds to my liking that fit within a song.  That said, it's clear you've nailed your guitar sounds, and really your performance on them, the notes you're hitting and your pieces are really nice.  I'm glad I had a chance to hear them.


Hello lawajava , 
 
thank you for taking the time to give my clips a listen . I appreciate that you did that and had nice things to say about my guitar playing 
 
let me substitute the idea of putting the amp sim last in the chain with an idea that is probably a lot more Logical ...
How's this ? I am using my amp sim last in my signal chain so I can Re Amp my guitar while staying totally in the box .
this always happens after I have done all my editing of my guitar track .
 
why do it that way ? …….I do it that way for manny reasons….
a few examples are , an amp sim can easily mask many imperfections I don't want on my guitar tracks .
I'm talking about things such as hot spots on the guitar neck where a section / range of the neck may be more resonant and boomy..
or it could be something as simple as my guitar pick hitting the metal case of the neck pick up on my Telecaster . 
I do use single coil guitars a lot and there are so manny little things that can add up 
 
OK real fast , while I'm editing my guitar track I'm multitasking …now what do I mean by that ?
Having handled the creative end of things by playing something I'm happy about I now have to change my mind set . In this mind set I will be going through every critical aspect of my track  ...
this is the place where I don't want anything from an amp sim at all …
I want to be able to use the full power of my studio and avail myself of the absolute best my DAW has to offer ...
the things I keep a constant look out for are every nuance and every element of my guitar performance ...
What am I hearing and seeing ?….do I have any problem frequencies ? are any of my phrases to loud or too soft ?
How much do I have to carve out using an EQ so my guitar will sit where I want it to in my ever evolving mix?
 
pardon my capacity for repetition  but this is the place where I don't want to BS around with some retro stomp box in an amp sim ….unless that happens to be the sound I'm looking for .
 
now heres where it gets interesting man  
I take care of business and use my studio quality plugs and advanced editing capacities from my DAW...
Now guess what happens next once I reengage my amp sim …..my signal is now too hot so I start backing off...
before I edited and applied my plugs , my amp sim was sizzling like a Death Valley Rattlesnake perched on the side of the road on Route 66 in a 110 degree weather in the shade ….
now I can turn that bad boy down because I'm hitting the plug w a much more processed and appropriate signal and gain stage ….
now we are talking the type of territory and sound where an amp sim can really shine ….
SONAR and all the studio quality plugs did all the heavy lifting ..once I hit the amp sim that way 
all I got left to do is a little  tweaking that bad boy looking for the sweet spot , then , I'm good to go  
 
OT, an interesting historical side note  , I certainly do remember well the era in Popular Music when all the guitar players were shlepping multiple racks of studio gear to every gig ….big or small ….
We got it pretty good now a days …. 
 
it has been nice talking with you 
 
Kenny
 
post edited by kennywtelejazz - 2014/08/24 05:42:37

                   
Oh Yeah , Life is Good .
The internet is nothing more than a glorified real time cartoon we all star in.
I play a "Gibson " R 8 Les Paul Cherry Sunburst .
The Love of my Life is an American Bulldog Named Duke . I'm currently running Cakewalk By BandLab as my DAW .
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson
 
https://www.youtube.com/user/Kennywtelejazz/videos?view=0&sort=dd&shelf_id=1
 
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=427899



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Kylotan
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 05:23:02 (permalink)
Anderton
But I don't know how many people just stick a mic 3 inches from a cone. I put a lot of effort into capturing some room sound, sometimes using a ribbon's Figure 8 to accentuate pickup on reflections.

 
Lots of people when recording hard rock or metal will put the mic even closer to the cone, to make sure there is no room sound at all. This might include taking the grille off to get closer. And some even put the cab in an isolation box for this, so zero room sound there.
 
Obviously it's a very hyper-processed genre but it's interesting how nobody minds or even notices the difference between the recorded tone and the performed tone. I strongly suspect that these fine details are lost on pretty much everybody except the people who do the actual recording.

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#79
joakes
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 06:29:41 (permalink)
FWIW this is what i do.

Often when i want to add a certain sound, and being basically a little lazy, I DI my rp500 or ME 80 effects pedals into Sonar via the line in of a LS56.

The resulting sound is OK, but I NEVER inject any reverb nor delay - for that i use Sonitus, both of which are more than adequate.

Sometimes I use GR 5 (full version) but less and less now. On rare occasions (when the wife is out) i use an SM57 to mike my stage amp, a Marshall VT100, through which i use one of the above mentionned pedals.

The sound, i find, using the Marshall, is (of course ?) much better (iMHO), but i have to admit, going against the grain, that GR 5, which therefore gets my vote, is not that bad.......

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#80
codamedia
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 08:04:55 (permalink)
Anderton
... the point of this discussion is how to get a satisfying sound, and have an enjoyable playing experience, for the person who's doing the recording. I think that's related to creating something that the person doing the listening will like.

 
During tracking I don't care if I have a cranked amp with one or more mics or an amp sim. Either way I am wearing a set of cans or sitting in the control room with the artist/producer/engineer so it makes no difference to me.
 
What inspires me is when I get a general tone (guitar choice, amp choice, dirt level) that fits the song and hear it mixed with the song decently during the tracking. If that tone is coming from a Vox AC30 on 8 in another room, or from a POD dialed to a Fender Deluxe setting, or Guitar Rig set to a Matchless - I couldn't care less. If it fits the song - I'll be inspired.
 
25 - 30 years ago, living 40+ weeks a year in hotel rooms across North America I used to get inspired with a portastudio, "drum drop" recording volumes, and a "Rockman X100". Well - that combined with copious amounts of coffee in the morning while reading "Home Recording for Musicians" to start my day :)
post edited by codamedia - 2014/08/24 08:58:05

Don't fix it in the mix ... Fix it in the take! 
 

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#81
MarioD
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 09:23:21 (permalink)
Kenny, I just listened to your songs and I must say your guitar tone and playing technique are second to none. Great job on both!

I never thought about putting the amp sim last until now.  Back before effect loops we used to put our effect pedals before our amps.  This was a kind of back to the future revelation for me.  I am definitely going to try this technique on my next song.



The reason people say the vinyl sounds better is because the music was better.
 
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#82
caminitic
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 13:41:18 (permalink)
kennywtelejazz
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...
you will be able to hear I hit everything hard in SONAR first . my amp sim was the last object of my signal chain 
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson 
 
disclaimer,  what I might consider a good guitar tone using an amp sim  might be somebody else's idea of nails scraping away on  chalk board 

I'm not sure what dope would ever say that what I just heard on your soundcloud could ever be classified as anything CLOSE to nails on a chalkboard.  I would trade half of what I own in my cheesy Nashville home studio to get tones as sweet as those.  Oh...and can I borrow some of your licks?  ;)
 
You got me interested, as others have noted, to fool around with compression, EFX, etc. BEFORE hitting the amp sim.  Thanks for sharing your thoughts...and your tunes.  Very inspiring.  Both...
#83
kitekrazy1
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 14:25:35 (permalink)
Kylotan
Anderton
If you put your ear three inches from a Marshall's speaker cone, it's not going to sound all that great.


And yet that's exactly what ends up on the album usually, and gets called 'classic tone' or whatever.
 
I am 95% convinced that most of the arguments over guitar sound are entirely psychological and largely the result of confirmation bias with a dose of 'louder = better' thrown in. Many albums are being done with amp sims these days and no listener can tell the difference. But then I've also seen guitarists perform live through sims that have 1/10th the fidelity of modern sims (eg. the venerable Behringer V-Amp2) and everyone at the gig seemed to think it sounded great.
 
For me, the key is to not use your judgement of how it sounds in the room to decide what tone to put in the mix (nor to assume that a tone that works well on a recording will sound good in a live setting).




 Great post. Thick should be a sticky in my brain.  
#84
konradh
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/24 16:49:21 (permalink)
I like Guitar Rig.  Most of the presets are too much—lots of components resulting in over-processed sounds—but if you keep it simple, you can get great results.  The Fenders, Oranges, and the Plexi are pretty good, and I like a number of the components, like the Tube Screamer and some of the choruses.  I use the delays and reverbs on non-guitar sounds sometimes.
 
Obviously, you have to know when you want a Strat v a Les Paul, etc.
 
UPDATE:  I just went to the Overloud website and listened to the demos.  Now I want to buy TH2 just for this sound: Randall® LynchBox

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#85
Anderton
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/25 00:28:47 (permalink)
caminitic
kennywtelejazz
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...

I'm not sure what dope would ever say that what I just heard on your soundcloud could ever be classified as anything CLOSE to nails on a chalkboard.  I would trade half of what I own in my cheesy Nashville home studio to get tones as sweet as those.  Oh...and can I borrow some of your licks?  ;)
 
You got me interested, as others have noted, to fool around with compression, EFX, etc. BEFORE hitting the amp sim.  Thanks for sharing your thoughts...and your tunes.  Very inspiring.  Both...



One of my favorite tricks is de-esser before amp sim. You know how rolling back the tone control gives you a sweeter sound? A properly set de-esser is like having an intelligent tone control in front of the sim.
 
FWIW every guitar part on every song on my YouTube channel is going through an amp sim, and any "acoustic guitars" are actually the piezo output from a Firebird X.

The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!
#86
kennywtelejazz
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/25 00:31:23 (permalink)
hockeyjx
SO Kenny and Craig....
 
It sounds like a job for the FX CHAIN! Do either of you have existing FX CHAINS presets to play with Guitar Rig or AmpliTube? Something more than the stock ones would be helpful.




Hello hockeyjx , 
 
in my case I roll every sound from scratch . I do save my own presets with the intention of being able to start there if I think I might want to repeat that sound . Every time I went to use a sound again ( my pre set ) there was always something that just wasn't right about it gelling in a totally different musical project ….some times that would happen because I would be using a different guitar than what I used when I created the preset.
 
wish I can be of more help 
 
Kenny

                   
Oh Yeah , Life is Good .
The internet is nothing more than a glorified real time cartoon we all star in.
I play a "Gibson " R 8 Les Paul Cherry Sunburst .
The Love of my Life is an American Bulldog Named Duke . I'm currently running Cakewalk By BandLab as my DAW .
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson
 
https://www.youtube.com/user/Kennywtelejazz/videos?view=0&sort=dd&shelf_id=1
 
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=427899



#87
kennywtelejazz
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/25 07:44:37 (permalink)
MarioD
Kenny, I just listened to your songs and I must say your guitar tone and playing technique are second to none. Great job on both!

I never thought about putting the amp sim last until now.  Back before effect loops we used to put our effect pedals before our amps.  This was a kind of back to the future revelation for me.  I am definitely going to try this technique on my next song.


Hello Mario, 
 
thank you for the listens and kind words   
 
Yes , in a lot of respects an amp sim will respond pretty much like a regular amp would when having the efx running into the front end …
in all honesty , I would have to say the best results I have gotten so far were with the clean sounds ..
 
good luck , I hope you have good results ...
 
 
caminitic
kennywtelejazz
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...
you will be able to hear I hit everything hard in SONAR first . my amp sim was the last object of my signal chain 
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson 
 
disclaimer,  what I might consider a good guitar tone using an amp sim  might be somebody else's idea of nails scraping away on  chalk board   

I'm not sure what dope would ever say that what I just heard on your soundcloud could ever be classified as anything CLOSE to nails on a chalkboard.  I would trade half of what I own in my cheesy Nashville home studio to get tones as sweet as those.  Oh...and can I borrow some of your licks?  ;)
 
You got me interested, as others have noted, to fool around with compression, EFX, etc. BEFORE hitting the amp sim.  Thanks for sharing your thoughts...and your tunes.  Very inspiring.  Both...


Hello caminitic , 
 
Oh i said the nails on the chalk board thing to poke fun at myself …
I'm happy you like what you heard 
sure by all means , if you can grab what I'm playing …you have my blessing ...
 
Anderton
caminitic
kennywtelejazz
if you happen to have the time to give the first 4 tunes in the link 15 or 20 seconds worth of a listen ...

I'm not sure what dope would ever say that what I just heard on your soundcloud could ever be classified as anything CLOSE to nails on a chalkboard.  I would trade half of what I own in my cheesy Nashville home studio to get tones as sweet as those.  Oh...and can I borrow some of your licks?  ;)
 
You got me interested, as others have noted, to fool around with compression, EFX, etc. BEFORE hitting the amp sim.  Thanks for sharing your thoughts...and your tunes.  Very inspiring.  Both...

One of my favorite tricks is de-esser before amp sim. You know how rolling back the tone control gives you a sweeter sound? A properly set de-esser is like having an intelligent tone control in front of the sim.
 
FWIW every guitar part on every song on my YouTube channel is going through an amp sim, and any "acoustic guitars" are actually the piezo output from a Firebird X.


Hello Craig, 
 
thank you for sharing the trick about the de-esser . it sounds like something i will have to try out ..
the version you did of We Got To Get Out of This Place is excellent…great sounding guitars   
 
Kenny

                   
Oh Yeah , Life is Good .
The internet is nothing more than a glorified real time cartoon we all star in.
I play a "Gibson " R 8 Les Paul Cherry Sunburst .
The Love of my Life is an American Bulldog Named Duke . I'm currently running Cakewalk By BandLab as my DAW .
 
https://soundcloud.com/guitarist-kenny-wilson
 
https://www.youtube.com/user/Kennywtelejazz/videos?view=0&sort=dd&shelf_id=1
 
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=427899



#88
Awes
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/26 12:26:23 (permalink)
Controversially, I prefer POD Farm 2 (2.5 I think now). I prefer the GUI of this above all the rest and it has some pretty decent sounds too. As has been mentioned a ton of times already no doubt, each to their own. One mans meat is another mans poison.

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#89
lawajava
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Re: Guitar amp simulator software 2014/08/26 19:59:54 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby kennywtelejazz 2014/08/28 07:48:36
CPFC1985
Controversially, I prefer POD Farm 2 (2.5 I think now). I prefer the GUI of this above all the rest and it has some pretty decent sounds too. As has been mentioned a ton of times already no doubt, each to their own. One mans meat is another mans poison.


I have been very satisfied by PodFarm 2.x as well. It has really realistic sounds. I received PodFarm included when I obtained a KB-37, which I trot out like a show dog every time I have a chance to talk about amp sims and a real zero latency experience when recording. The KB-37 sounds like a live amp real time, even when fully loaded with amp sim sounds and effects.

Info, as per my usual, on the KB-37 is here:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRpCXWSC8TE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwBR1OfHRtM

Even though I have been deep into using PodFarm 2.x and also have TH2 and Guitar Rig 5, I am far more taken now by Amplitube. It sounds amazing and is layed out in an easy to understand interface that looks and feels like how a guitar player would like to work with gear and settings. It's very intuitive. Did I mention it's 50% off until then end of Aug? I'm just a user, but I recommend it.

Also I want to point out that the KB-37 comes with PodFarm included, but works with any of the AmpSims equally well. It's not a proprietary thing why it works so well as an audio interface for recording vocals and guitar. But there is something extra in the wiring that enables that real-time, amp effected, recording experience.

I switch to another audio interface easily in Sonar as needed. Easy to flip between two audio interfaces in Sonar.

Two internal 2TB SSDs laptop stuffed with Larry's deals and awesome tools. Studio One is the cat's meow as a DAW now that I've migrated off of Sonar. Using BandLab Cakewalk just to grab old files when migrating songs.
#90
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