Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 00:20:36
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bapu This:
is anarchy
That ginger headed bastard! Next time I see him I'm RIPPING HIS LUNGS OUT!!!
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bapu
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 00:21:38
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Can't we all just get a lawn?
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Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 00:22:55
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bapu
Beepster everybodygetcrazywiththecheezwhiz!!!
Ben dare dun dat.
Did ya microwave it a little beforehand? It just ain't the same otherwise.
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bapu
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 00:23:55
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Beepster
bapu
Beepster everybodygetcrazywiththecheezwhiz!!!
Ben dare dun dat.
Did ya microwave it a little beforehand? It just ain't the same otherwise.
Pffffffft Beeps you could use a break and look at my new CH fred.
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bdickens
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 00:56:56
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Is English really that difficult?
Just read what I said instead of reading into it and i think about it. Passing a law against something that heretofore was not illegal turns it into a crime. It wasn't before, but now it is.
Some things NEED to be a crime. Dumping toxic waste. Breaking into someone's house and stealing stuff. Murder. Rape. Some things don't.
There are too many laws already. You can't go through your day without breaking laws. You would be shocked and appalled at just what ridiculous things people go to jail for. We should think long and hard about rh potential benefits AND the potential costs of any new laws. And about what, if any good it will actually accomplish.
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Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 01:08:00
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What R English? Oh, why we so dum, guiz?!
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Linear Phase
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 01:18:36
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Beepster So... you are okay with a device that completely circumvents a ban on full auto weapons (that, IIRC, at least 70%+ of Americans support)? Yes/no? I guess the follow up would be... do you think fully automatic weapons should be available to the general public? edited because I obviously did not mean... oh about 70 people agree... cuz that would be dumb.
What I think is that 20,000 people, walked through concert security guards and fences, were frisked to make sure they were unarmed, essentially gave up their 2nd Amendment rights and gathered peacefully for a music concert; those people expected to be protected by the police and the security at the concert, those people who willfully disarmed were brutally attacked. I also think you haven't bothered to read any of the articles I linked. I think every time I go to a rock concert I willfully disarm. I think I will rethink going to rock concerts.
too many lasers... Sonar = audio editing ninja of a music software!
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Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 01:34:26
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And what exactly do you think would have happened if the people at the festival were armed? He was shooting from 32 stories up and it took the trained pros a while to figure it out. There was absolutely NOTHING that could have been done from the area being shot at. At best everyone would have kept their pieces holstered and got the heck out of there. At worse you'd have multiple "good guys with guns" firing at other "good guys with guns" plugging each other off (and possibly hitting innocents AND sowing extra confusion giving the main shooter more time to do his thing). tl;dr If the audience was armed there was NO way for them to effectively deter this act. Sometimes life sucks. Get a helmet.
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Linear Phase
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 01:43:35
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Beepster And what exactly do you think would have happened if the people at the festival were armed?
The maniac. This murderous disgusting thing, was specifically targeting, "Gun free zones," or places where the gatherers were unarmed. He knew these people were unarmed. So your question has no logic. If the people were armed, they would not have been targeted to begin with.
too many lasers... Sonar = audio editing ninja of a music software!
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Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 01:46:07
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Linear Phase
Beepster And what exactly do you think would have happened if the people at the festival were armed?
The maniac. This murderous disgusting thing, was specifically targeting, "Gun free zones," or places where the gatherers were unarmed. He knew these people were unarmed.
So your question has no logic. If the people were armed, they would not have been targeted to begin with.
Excuse me but I think I'm gonna need a citation for that. edit: I don't see how having the people on the ground armed would have made a lick of difference anyway. Not from a tactical perspective nor a social/legal/motive perspective. That was just silly, brah. Sorry... but it was.
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Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 02:02:22
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Up to 8 pages now. This must be a record.
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eph221
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 02:14:16
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The chronic mis-reading that happens on this forum is legion and very discouraging. Peace.
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slartabartfast
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 02:24:26
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☄ Helpfulby Beepster 2017/10/06 02:30:19
OK So maybe the point has not yet been made. Let us define "bad faith." Bad faith can basically be understood as bargaining dishonestly or making a promise or statement that you do not intend to keep or that you know to be untrue. So if I promise to be true to my wife forsaking all others, knowing that I am going to have sex with her bridesmaid, that is bad faith. If I say that I am selling you a gold mine knowing that there is no gold that is bad faith. If I make an argument that I myself do not believe is valid, that is bad faith. So how does that relate to a persistent argument that has been made frequently in this thread? Do you believe that if your wife/daughter/girlfriend/mother/favorite nun is for some inexplicable reason unable to defend herself against a rapist then the rape should be permitted? More to the point, do you believe that if the law against rape does not guarantee that evil people will not commit rape, then that law should never have been passed? If not then I call shenanigans, and call anyone who claims that because legislation cannot prevent evil, or prevent evil actions, then there should be no legislation, a liar and a hypocrite. Laws restricting certain kinds of firearms and ammunition will not prevent some evil people from obtaining and using them. No one doubts that, dummy. You could have argued as many serious people do, that laws are not passed to prevent actions, but rather to give the victim, their families or their ghosts a sense of justice or revenge. You could even have recognized, as most of us do, that the police can only rarely prevent a crime, but that the fear of subsequently being arrested and punished for those crimes might deter some people and prevent some crimes. You did not do that. You focused on the absurd proposition that to be enacted into law or regulation, any abridgement of total freedom by restricting a specific action must prevent all such actions. Under that criterion the only legitimate use of regulation would be something like: it is hereby forbidden to all citizens to defecate on the surface of the Sun. Stop being so stupid. All you need to do to make your case is to say that you believe that you or someone like you could in certain circumstances prevent an injury to yourself or some other innocent person if you are permitted to possess and in appropriate circumstances use a firearm. From that point we could disagree about the circumstances, or the risk to benefit ratio of your actions, but we would at least be able to know that we are dealing with someone who is not stooping to dishonesty to avoid the discussion. LSD is illegal. Only criminals will possess LSD. If I could walk into Walmart and buy LSD I would be tripping this weekend. As it is, I have no idea where I can get LSD, and even if I could, it would be waaay more expensive than if it were available legally as a generic. Somewhere out there I hope there is someone looking for a cheap machine gun who is also not going to be using this weekend. Would anyone who believes that simply passing a law banning all firearms would result in the end to all criminal acts using firearms please let us know. If so then you laws-do-not-stop-crimes idiots will have someone to convince, if not then shut the **** up with this nonsense.
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Beepster
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 02:24:42
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☄ Helpfulby eph221 2017/10/06 17:53:56
eph221 The chronic mis-reading that happens on this forum is legion and very discouraging. Peace.
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sharke
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 05:07:08
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I get the heebie jeebies when I'm in large crowds nowadays. It's all too painfully obvious that crowds are basically terrorist targets. I don't even know how people linger when walking through Times Square - if I absolutely have to walk through there, I flit from one end to the other, barely touching the ground. Some years ago I walked between Times Square and 8th Avenue on an errand in Hell's Kitchen, and 10 minutes later tried to walk up the same street to get back to Times Square. It was all blocked off by cops, and looking over people's heads I noticed the bomb squad with one of those robot bomb defusing robots approaching an old van. Turns out it was a bona fide Islamic bombing attempt, and the guy had packed enough explosives to take out the whole block. I'd just walked down there 10 minutes ago and it really brought close to home just how vulnerable everyone is in high traffic areas of a city like New York. The subway at rush hour gives me the creeps as well, that's gotta be hit sooner or later. I have a friend on Nantucket who once made a comment on social media about how pathetic it was to be frightened of terrorists. I reminded him where he lived and how terrorists would not bother their arses to attack sleepy little places on the Cape. When you have to take the subway at rush hour every morning, you get a vivid insight into what it feels like to be a sitting duck.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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Linear Phase
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 07:05:06
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sharke When you have to take the subway at rush hour every morning, you get a vivid insight into what it feels like to be a sitting duck.
An unarmed sitting duck. I grew up in NYC. It is hard to own guns in NYC. The only people I knew who had guns were criminals. The criminals in NYC have guns. The honest people have no way to defend themselves. Even martial arts, "a sport." I do some of the most serious, hardest martial arts around. I currently train (2 - 4 times a week) Brazilian jiu jitsu, and I've trained Boxing, Wrestling, Muay Thai, Krav Maga. Real self defense is carrying a firearm - which as a law abiding citizen you can not get so easily in NYC, but the criminals have them. Believe me the criminals have them, and the law abiding citizens are sitting ducks.
post edited by Linear Phase - 2017/10/06 17:28:47
too many lasers... Sonar = audio editing ninja of a music software!
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Linear Phase
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 07:05:06
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Double post or becan!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
too many lasers... Sonar = audio editing ninja of a music software!
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Linear Phase
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 07:08:28
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And I was in and out of those towers my whole life. Both my parents worked downtown. I walked through those towers every day. Especially since I had a buddy who went to a high school around the corner - I will not name the school
post edited by Linear Phase - 2017/10/06 17:29:16
too many lasers... Sonar = audio editing ninja of a music software!
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scook
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 07:10:12
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Linear Phase
sharke When you have to take the subway at rush hour every morning, you get a vivid insight into what it feels like to be a sitting duck.
An unarmed sitting duck.
Did someone say duck
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jamesg1213
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 07:29:55
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☄ Helpfulby Mesh 2017/10/06 12:51:10
I've read through this whole thread, weighed up the arguments on both sides, and there's still one thing that I just cannot get my head around. It utterly baffles me. Why is Byron still using Vista?
Jyemz Thrombold's Patented Brisk Weather Pantaloonettes with Inclementometer
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Mesh
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 12:52:02
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That made me chuckle....
Platinum Gaming DAW: AsRock Z77 Overclock FormulaI7 3770k @ 4.5GHz : 16GB RAM G.Skill Ripjaws X 250GB OS SSD : 3TB HDD : 1TB Sample HDDWin 10 Pro x 64 : NH-D14 CPU Cooler HIS IceQ 2GB HD 7870Focusrite Scarlett 2i4The_Forum_Monkeys
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bdickens
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 14:33:18
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What frustrates me is why people refuse to focus on the real crime. Murdering is the real crime, not posession of a mere mechanical object.
"But guns are dangerous," you argue. Well, of course they are. Guns are SUPPOSED to be dangerous. That's the point. But so are baseball bats, machetes and iron pipes, all if which have been used to commit murder. The tool is not important. The ACT is what is important.
"But with a gun someone can kill more people," you argue. Well, if we could magic away all the guns and some homicidal psychopath has to use a sword and could only kill 10 people during his rampage instead of 50, are you really suggesting that is somehow BETTER? 1 or 100, of is all horrible. People on both sides like to throw around statistics. But if that victim is your wife, son, mother, that is 100% right there. 100% of that person is gone forever.
People get wound all up about mass shootings because they are flashy. The media sensationalizes them and indeed glamorizes them. But they are a tiny fraction of the entire murder rate. The number of deaths in mass shootings is infinitesimally small - statistically irrelevant - compared to the number of murders that happen one at a time.
Cold? Perhaps, but like I said before, making public policy based on emotional reactions to shocking, tragic events makes for bad public policy.
Someone asked earlier if since people are going to commit crimes anyway, do we just let them? No, of course not, he answers. Rightly, he points out that we have laws, not because they prevent crime, but to punish it.
Again, I argue that it is not the mere posession of an inanimate object that should be the crime not the misuse of it.
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bdickens
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 14:37:53
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jamesg1213 I've read through this whole thread, weighed up the arguments on both sides, and there's still one thing that I just cannot get my head around. It utterly baffles me. Why is Byron still using Vista?
What? Where? I thought I changed that.
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bapu
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 15:25:38
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bdickens But they are a tiny fraction of the entire murder rate. The number of deaths in mass shootings is infinitesimally small - statistically irrelevant - compared to the number of murders that happen one at a time.
"But if you look at a real catastrophe like Katrina, and you look at the tremendous hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people that died, and you look at what happened here with, really, a storm that was just totally overpowering -- nobody has ever seen anything like this. What is your death count, as of this moment -- 17?" Hmmmm 17 deaths seems statistically irrelevant too? Great "talking points" especially to the people who lost 100% of their loved ones.
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jamesg1213
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 17:23:53
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bdickens
"But with a gun someone can kill more people," you argue. Well, if we could magic away all the guns and some homicidal psychopath has to use a sword and could only kill 10 people during his rampage instead of 50, are you really suggesting that is somehow BETTER?
Yes...because that would be 40 people that didn't die, and 500 that weren't injured. How is that NOT better? With that kind of logic, why stop him shooting?
Jyemz Thrombold's Patented Brisk Weather Pantaloonettes with Inclementometer
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Linear Phase
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 17:27:38
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bapu
bdickens But they are a tiny fraction of the entire murder rate. The number of deaths in mass shootings is infinitesimally small - statistically irrelevant - compared to the number of murders that happen one at a time.
"But if you look at a real catastrophe like Katrina, and you look at the tremendous hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people that died, and you look at what happened here with, really, a storm that was just totally overpowering -- nobody has ever seen anything like this. What is your death count, as of this moment -- 17?" Hmmmm 17 deaths seems statistically irrelevant too? Great "talking points" especially to the people who lost 100% of their loved ones.
Ok, really I have to agree. I thought that was totally inane. Thank Gosh we live in a country where we can say something like, "yeah, the President really fell flat on his face there.
too many lasers... Sonar = audio editing ninja of a music software!
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eph221
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 17:34:20
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☄ Helpfulby SteveStrummerUK 2017/10/06 21:39:02
I make these distinctions bdickens. it's not always logical. Weapons of mass destruction are banned. We don't stop their use completely. It's not a perfect solution. The crime is murder, I'm for keeping the murderers from having too strong of hand. (sorry for the gambling pun). Non-killers generally are not the people to ask for the solution. We need solutions from your side in order to make it stick. But our society will never get one as long as your side says it's not a problem. People who go in the military get extensive training on how to use those weapons. The same training should apply to their purchase.
*Q-TIPS ARE FUZZY!!* Is a lumineer a new dental appliance? i7 2.5 ghz 32GB RAM WINDOWS 10 My Ass Cubase 9.5
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sharke
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 17:35:56
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Linear Phase
sharke When you have to take the subway at rush hour every morning, you get a vivid insight into what it feels like to be a sitting duck.
An unarmed sitting duck. I grew up in NYC. It is hard to own guns in NYC. The only people I knew who had guns were criminals. The criminals in NYC have guns. The honest people have no way to defend themselves. Even martial arts, "a sport." I do some of the most serious, hardest martial arts around. I currently train (2 - 4 times a week) Brazilian jiu jitsu, and I've trained Boxing, Wrestling, Muay Thai, Krav Maga. Real self defense is carrying a firearm - which as a law abiding citizen you can not get so easily in NYC, but the criminals have them. Believe me the criminals have them, and the law abiding citizens are sitting ducks.
To be fair, I don't think being armed would protect anyone from a suicide bomb going off. Which is the main concern on the subway. In fact even if someone with a bomb was identified before it went off, shooting at him might actually cause the bomb to detonate because sometimes they hold a trigger in their hand which detonates the bomb when they release their grip.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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sharke
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 17:36:56
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Linear Phase And I was in and out of those towers my whole life. Both my parents worked downtown. I walked through those towers every day. Especially since I had a buddy who went to a high school around the corner - I will not name the school
Probably Stuyvesant High then lol.
JamesWindows 10, Sonar SPlat (64-bit), Intel i7-4930K, 32GB RAM, RME Babyface, AKAI MPK Mini, Roland A-800 Pro, Focusrite VRM Box, Komplete 10 Ultimate, 2012 American Telecaster!
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ampfixer
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Re: Las Vegas Country Festival Shooting
2017/10/06 17:38:48
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☄ Helpfulby Rain 2017/10/07 07:54:39
I don't know about this or that amendment, I don't care about any of your rights. This is not a healthy discussion for this forum because it brings out the worst in people. If you want to take a side, call your elected official and make your case. I've reported this thread and asked the powers that be to shut it down. What's wrong with you guys?
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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