John T


I promise you that how to find the synth rack is in the on-line help and the PDF for Sonar X1.

Well, that surprises me, I must say. I have been disappointed by the docs so many times that I don't waste my time with them anymore.

John T


Well, you know, that's a ridiculous position to take. No wonder you're having problems.

With many years' experience of having the manuals prove themselves to be consistently out-of-date, it's the last place I'd recommend for new or changed features.

Sad but true.
 
Edit: The reference manual for X1 really does seem to undergone a comprehensive overhaul. This is good.

I tend to think dictionary definition battles are anathema to constructive discussion, but since that's where we are, it's probably worth noting that none of the three definitions you've looked up have anything to say about previous learning. That really isn't what the word means.

I think you could make an argument that understanding users' previous learning is relevant to design; probably better to just make that argument.

Bristol_Jonesey


Hey John - it's fairly quick just to press 'B'

Agree 100%.
But I was making a point of principle about user choice; accessing audio effects is an area where the user CAN choose the way they access these, but other areas have been needlessly 'improved' (e.g. synth rack view access, or MIDI Processes/Velocity) to align with the new GUI flavour, sometimes needlessly blocking off user choices that were available in 8.5, or making them more difficult to access.
 
John

Is the problem solved now, or should we continue to argue all week-end?
 
I will keep it going by adding my favorite complaint about Sonar help: incomplete statements like this:
 
"To open the Magic Widget, click on the Magic Widget icon."  No description, no picture, no location.  Well, hey, if I were familiar with the freaking Magic Widget icon, I wouldn't be looking in Help.
 
(If you are new to Sonar, there is no Magic Widget: this is just an example of a formulaic statement used repeatedly in Sonar help.)

konradh


Is the problem solved now, or should we continue to argue all week-end?
 
I will keep it going by adding my favorite complaint about Sonar help: incomplete statements like this:
 
"To open the Magic Widget, click on the Magic Widget icon."  No description, no picture, no location.  Well, hey, if I were familiar with the freaking Magic Widget icon, I wouldn't be looking in Help.
 
(If you are new to Sonar, there is no Magic Widget: this is just an example of a formulaic statement used repeatedly in Sonar help.)

Yeah, that drives me up the wall. It's not rare, either, seems to be the house style of the help files.

Or to look at it another way: someone who's grasp of what might be happening is at that level ain't never going to be a recording engineer no way no how. So it's kind of not worth worrying about that kind of user.

And actually, how you would know what browser they were on about would be to kick it old skool and, as discussed already, RTFM.

Jeez.

I reckon the 8.5 group would fare better, but the world may never know... how many clicks it takes to get to the center of a pop song.

 
Classic.   
 

The picture of the synth on the button was pretty obvious to me but to each his own.  I actually feel pretty sorry for you if you don't think so.    Man just think in the time it took you to look up the definition how much you could have learned about your software

brundlefly


It would be a very interesting exercise to set 50 noobs loose with X1, and another 50 with 8.5, and see which group makes the most progress in the first 72 hours.

I reckon the 8.5 group would fare better, but the world may never know... how many clicks it takes to get to the center of a pop song. 

Hmm.. I think you should be surprised...

I can remember my first "contact" with Sonar (version 4), was not at all that easy. A lot of icons looked the same (as beginner), and searching for the "right" one was often a painful exercise. It took me relatively long to get things up and running (I do not mean the setup here, but actually working with it). In contrast - I wached a friend of my taking his first steps with X1 (demo version) and he was up and running in a very short time. I must point out he had no experience with Sonar version 8.5 or lower. In short - he was doing a lot more in a lot less time than I did starting with Sonar 4.

You could argue that maybe he is smarter than I am, but I do not think that's the case. I think a lot of people here have too much "8.5 or lower" in the back of the head, to be really objective.

Anyway - it is painfull to see this discussion about how easy or not it is to push one button on the keyboard. I my opinion someone is searching for a stick to beat a cavia. If you argue the value of software is good when using a mouse click and bad when using a key press... Well - in my opinion this must be the summon of non-usefull discussions here...

It is fun to see this tough...

oops double post...

I wached a friend of my taking his first steps with X1 (demo version) and he was up and running in a very short time. I must point out he had no experience with Sonar version 8.5 or lower. In short - he was doing a lot more in a lot less time than I did starting with Sonar 4.

And you sat back and watched him struggle without giving any guidance? Really? This anecdote sounds too good to be true, in addition to being anecdotal.


Let me know when you have the results from your other 49 friends starting with X1, and the 50 that start with 8.5. 

bobguitkillerleft

    Hey "Sykodelic" back in the prime "EVIL" world of SONAR 6 with yo buddy didnt or were you not able to RTFM!?? he he he.

Yeah that was the problem everything we tried to do was so buried it required us to pull out the manual to figure it out.  He found most of these same things that were such a chore in X1without even referencing the manual.  He found X1 shall I say it, more INTUITIVE