markyzno
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 02:05:14
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Resonant Serpent
Anderton
That said, the specialty of one of Cakewalk's new engineers is MIDI.
Thanks for the heads up. This is the best news I've heard in a while.
Seconded!
Sonar Platinum 64 bit > Pro tools 10.3.2 >Intel i7 3770K > 16Gb Ram > Gigabyte Z77-D3H Motherboard> NVIDIA GeForce GTX 660 2 GB > ATi RADEON HD5700 > 240GB OCZ Agility 3 SSD> Win 10 home 64 bit> Delta 1010 > MOTU Audio Express > MA-15D's > NI Ultimate 9 > NI Kontrol S61 1.1 > NI MAschine Studio 2.3 / KORG MS-20 Mini - Arturia MicroBrute > KORG SQ1 - KORG Kaoss Pad KP3 > iPad and IO Dock 2 running various bits > Bunch of guitars >Sound Design on IMDB --
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 13:17:57
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Anderton,
your comparison to Abelton live not having Mix Recall is not valid here. Abelton Live TOUTS itself as a DAW catered for live performance right? You don't need Mix Recall in a live environment.
Cakewalk touts itself as an all-in-one recording DAW (Midi, audio, etc...), which means I expect its functions to work properly.
Not saving a synth preset after a freeze or tracks listening to MIDI data it isnt supposed to be, is not something Sonar just doesn't do as well as others.... it's just damn broken!
I also wouldn't say my issues are strictly me. The responses on this thread and many others I have made do show that other users are frustrated too!
I also wouldn't call my posts a "tantrum". That kind of labeling is the kind of wording politicians use to silence or their opponent or to make what the other person is saying invalid.
My points are VERY valid. I have multiple projects with missing synth sounds, MIDI data recorded all over the place that shouldn't be, etc... my synth projects are an absolute disaster.... because of Sonar... a software I have spent hundreds on.
I bought it expecting I will be able to create MIDI projects from start to finish. My expectations are NOT unreasonable. The product is flaky as well when it comes to MIDI. Of course I expect there to always be some small issues, nothing in life is perfect. I am not complaining about small stuff. I suggest you read through the past years posts that have to do with MIDI gripes (not just by me).
Anyway, the thing is.... just working with other DAWs for the last 2 days.... I feel I am stuck with Sonar simply because the learning curve is just too great. It will literally take me months to learn a new DAW, all its shortcuts, how to do the same things I do in Sonar, simply because I am a long time Sonar user.
I just want the MIDI stuff to work as touted.
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Sanderxpander
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 13:37:34
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I'm pretty sure, in Ableton, you could program those mix recall functions that are important for live use by using scenes and channel selectors. Analogies always go wrong somewhere though, and they don't really prove anything.
I would expect (and I have no data to back this up) that Sonar is used in way more project studios than high end recording studios. That would mean midi is important to most of the user base. Hopefully 2017 will get some more midi love. Look to Logic, Cubase, Sibelius and FruityLoops Studio please!
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 15:11:02
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Sanderxpander
I'm pretty sure, in Ableton, you could program those mix recall functions that are important for live use by using scenes and channel selectors. Analogies always go wrong somewhere though, and they don't really prove anything.
I would expect (and I have no data to back this up) that Sonar is used in way more project studios than high end recording studios. That would mean midi is important to most of the user base. Hopefully 2017 will get some more midi love. Look to Logic, Cubase, Sibelius and FruityLoops Studio please!
agree! Also look to Studio One for its "spiffyness". The code FEELS new. The GUI just loads. You don't have to wait for different modules (like the synth rack for example)... it feels nice. I don't know about the side of GUI programming, but I feel Studio One is built on some newer technology or something.
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stxx
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 16:35:05
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... Its so amazing that posts degenerate into personal attacks. Post you issue and if there is a solution great, if not why do people constantly feel the need to go back and forth. Sometime this can be entertaining but for the most part it is poor behavior. This is worst than the Real Housewives.....
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 16:42:16
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stxx
... Its so amazing that posts degenerate into personal attacks. Post you issue and if there is a solution great, if not why do people constantly feel the need to go back and forth. Sometime this can be entertaining but for the most part it is poor behavior. This is worst than the Real Housewives.....
my initial post was 100% technical stuff only. I only veer off into the "human element" when I am attacked or spoken to about my character, as I do need to respond to things like that.
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JayCee99
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 17:00:12
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First, I will agree with the OP that Sonar has plenty of MIDI bugs and things that just don't work right. I really hope Sonar works on some of the MIDI features, particularly the step sequencer and programming drums.
I work 90% with MIDI and VSTi's, but I'm not a composer so I only will have 6-8 tracks usually and not a ton of plugins. I don't use advanced MIDI features. As much as new features are cool, I'd prefer they spend more time on bugs and enhancing existing features.
However, I've also tried Studio One 2, Studio One 3, Reaper and Cubase repeatedly. I've actually spent more time demoing new toys and switching DAWs and plugins than actually creating music, which is why I decided to reformat, bought lifetime updates, installed only the SONAR stock plugins and Komplete 10 (which I also own), and refuse to install anything else. I need to learn to use what I have to its full capabilities, which will take years as-is! I find the Lifetime Updates to be a relief. . . now I'm committed to a DAW and I don't have to worry about paying more to upgrade to the next version. It simplifies my life.
Other DAW's will always look shiny and better, particularly when watching videos or reading reviews online. Their features seem awesome and super useful when I watch a pro using them in a video. I watch Hans Zimmer use Cubase and it seems like I could do the same thing if I just had Cubase!
However, like all things in life, most of it is just advertising and the fantasy that this new software is going to revolutionize your music making (and life) for the better. Once you start using them, you start to notice the bugs and things that don't work right. They all have them.
After trying out other DAW's repeatedly, I always came back to Sonar because it provided the best mix of features for me.
I say this only to give you some food for thought. It sounds like you're an advanced user and you've used Sonar for a long time, so it may be the right choice for you to change. But make sure you separate the marketing hype from reality when you decide!
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ampfixer
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 17:09:51
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☄ Helpfulby gustabo 2017/01/05 17:25:12
If you feel strongly that Cakewalk is messing up, the best thing to do is let your feet an wallet do the talking. If your money moves elsewhere, that's a message that can't be spun or manipulated. If you feel that the change of tools would be time consuming then you have to ask if that time would be greater than the time you spend dealing with the current shortcomings you can't live with.
Nobody is forced to do anything. I personally don't think you should spend hours trying to convince folks to agree with your views. You know there are people here that will never be swayed and the Cake folks have their own agenda that must be served to keep their livelihoods intact.
Pick your battles and make decisions that serve your best interests. That's all you can do at the end of the day.
Regards, John I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps. WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig, Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6
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SuperG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 22:31:24
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Most people don't like to be manipulated - whiny posts lacking objectivity tend to rub people wrongly.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 23:20:52
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SuperG
Most people don't like to be manipulated - whiny posts lacking objectivity tend to rub people wrongly.
I would hardly say my post lacks objectivity. I paid good money for this product and it caused me data loss and hassle. Should I end each post with a smiley because my patches are gone?
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SuperG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/05 23:49:05
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SilverBlueMedallion
I would hardly say my post lacks objectivity.
Of course, you would. The title of this thread is about as as subjective as it gets, because while most people are willing to help one another, they don't need to need to know that you're about to leave, about how you paid good money, and so on. We all paid good money. No asking for smiley's, just the facts. It's a public forum and it's about Sonar - not you.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 00:26:21
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SuperG
SilverBlueMedallion
I would hardly say my post lacks objectivity.
Of course, you would.
The title of this thread is about as as subjective as it gets, because while most people are willing to help one another, they don't need to need to know that you're about to leave, about how you paid good money, and so on.
We all paid good money.
No asking for smiley's, just the facts. It's a public forum and it's about Sonar - not you.
no one NEEDS to know I am about to leave and how I paid good money - BUT it is true, so why not? I don't see the need to filter how I feel about the product in the products forum. What I don't get is why it bothers you? Can you not separate the DAW and the 'self', hence someone leaving the DAW is leaving you?
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SuperG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 01:01:23
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☄ Helpfulby Sheanes 2017/01/06 01:37:17
SilverBlueMedallion
no one NEEDS to know I am about to leave and how I paid good money - BUT it is true, so why not? I don't see the need to filter how I feel about the product in the products forum.
So why do so? It actually takes effort to subjectivize an issue, so it's certainly not filtering if you do not do so. It comes off as pandering, especially so in an alarmist fashion. SilverBlueMedallion
What I don't get is why it bothers you? Can you not separate the DAW and the 'self', hence someone leaving the DAW is leaving you?
No, you're projecting there. I'm simply responding to this thread because it interests me. Many people have have posted to this thread, and there seemed to be something missing in why some people thought you might be an attention seeker. I needed to put my finger on it, as they say.
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mudgel
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 03:56:21
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Mike V. (MUDGEL) STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64, PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz. Storage: 7 TB SATA III, 750GiG SSD & Samsung 500 Gig 960 EVO NVMe M.2. Monitors: Adam A7X, JBL 10” Sub. Audio I/O & DSP Server: DIGIGRID IOS & IOX. Screen: Raven MTi + 43" HD 4K TV Monitor. Keyboard Controller: Native Instruments Komplete Kontrol S88.
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Kamikaze
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 04:15:04
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ampfixer
If you feel strongly that Cakewalk is messing up, the best thing to do is let your feet an wallet do the talking.
You can't after you've paid for lifetime membership. No more money to give. Well not until 2037 
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Loptec
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 08:28:07
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markyzno
Resonant Serpent
Anderton
That said, the specialty of one of Cakewalk's new engineers is MIDI.
Thanks for the heads up. This is the best news I've heard in a while.
Seconded!
Same here! Great news! 😊
SAMUEL LIDSTRÖM
 DAW: Sonar Platinum (64bit) with Melodyne Studio - Controllers: Roland VS-700C, Cakewalk A-500 Pro, Yamaha P90Desktop Audio Interface: RME HDSPe RayDAT - Laptop Audio Interface: RME Babyface Pro
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tlw
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 09:57:45
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SilverBlueMedallion
MIDI data recorded all over the place that shouldn't be, etc...
I don't have that problem. Wonder what I'm doing wrong? As for Sonar being mistly used in home/project studios, that's almost certainly true of all DAWs. Even Pro Tools after it split from the HD system that required a limited range of extremely expensive hardware.
Sonar Platinum 64bit, Windows 8.1 Pro 64bit, I7 3770K Ivybridge, 16GB Ram, Gigabyte Z77-D3H m/board, ATI 7750 graphics+ 1GB RAM, 2xIntel 520 series 220GB SSDs, 1 TB Samsung F3 + 1 TB WD HDDs, Seasonic fanless 460W psu, RME Fireface UFX, Focusrite Octopre. Assorted real synths, guitars, mandolins, diatonic accordions, percussion, fx and other stuff.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 10:50:01
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tlw
SilverBlueMedallion
MIDI data recorded all over the place that shouldn't be, etc...
I don't have that problem.
Wonder what I'm doing wrong?
As for Sonar being mistly used in home/project studios, that's almost certainly true of all DAWs. Even
Pro Tools after it split from the HD system that required a limited range of extremely expensive hardware.
you must not play a lot with MIDI-out from synths
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bitflipper
01100010 01101001 01110100 01100110 01101100 01101
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 11:09:58
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SilverBlueMedallion
...you must not play a lot with MIDI-out from synths
I think that would be a true statement for most of us. The only synth MIDI-out I use is the 5-pin DIN cable from my Kronos. I'd be interested to learn how you use this feature. Perhaps I'm missing something cool.
 All else is in doubt, so this is the truth I cling to. My Stuff
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Anderton
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 12:54:55
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☄ Helpfulby coolbass 2017/01/06 22:31:41
SilverBlueMedallion
your comparison to Abelton live not having Mix Recall is not valid here. Abelton Live TOUTS itself as a DAW catered for live performance right? You don't need Mix Recall in a live environment. I know how Ableton Live touts itself, I wrote the manual for Version 2. Live not recording solo button presses is solely a live performance issue. The reason it's buried so deep in the code that Ableton can't fix it is because Ableton considers it a diagnostic tool when using Live in the studio. They do not say Live is solely for live performance and never have. That's why there are two separate views. Live performance is their priority. Audio recording, editing, mixing, and improving the efficiency of same is currently SONAR's priority. Nowhere have I said your complaints aren't valid (except where you didn't know the program well enough to do something, so I told you how to do it). But if I had a problem with synths not retaining settings when freezing (although that hasn't happened to me), I wouldn't freeze. I'd save the preset first, bounce to audio, archive the track in case I needed to use it again, and continue making music. And I didn't call your posts a "tantrum." Many users apparently feel the way to get the attention of software companies (or Comcast for that matter), is to do public tantrums. I said I would not take that approach. Anyway, the thing is.... just working with other DAWs for the last 2 days.... I feel I am stuck with Sonar simply because the learning curve is just too great. It will literally take me months to learn a new DAW, all its shortcuts, how to do the same things I do in Sonar, simply because I am a long time Sonar user. If you know how to use a DAW, you can learn another DAW's basics in a few days. You can make cool projects in a week. You can become proficient in a month. In a year, you can become expert enough to create a laundry list of all the things you hate about it.  I just want the MIDI stuff to work as touted. Who doesn't? I want all functions in all software to work as touted. But consider that in some cases, just because something doesn't work the way you want it to doesn't mean there isn't an option. For example, you may find it an impediment to your workflow that SONAR doesn't preserve notes of 4 ticks duration when converting from PRV to SS. Yet SONAR has a Find/Change function where you can change those notes to 4 ticks. Read what I write. I'm not disputing your complaints. I'm disputing your approach of trying to effect change. Nor am I disputing that you are frustrated. My question is whether you want to solve your problem. If so, I see four options: - Learn another DAW (but do so with realistic expectations).
- Choose another program to work with SONAR (e.g., a ReWire client) that fills in any gaps SONAR has.
- Learn to work within the limitations of what you have.
- Continue using SONAR, and hope that your priorities coincide with those of other users and therefore are prioritized as fixes.
I do think insisting that your only option is Cakewalk fixing all bugs is not an option. Choose one of the options that are available now, and get on with making music. Meanwhile, I've said everything I've wanted to say and it's clear you won't respond to several of my comments that merit a reply. So, I'll spend my time helping others get the most out of SONAR, which is not only the intended purpose of this forum, but I think also represents a more productive use of same. (P.S. I'm not sure you're aware of what's involved in doing a fix. First it has to be reproduced. Second, it has to be fixed. But the third and often lengthiest process is QC. It has to be tested with all operating systems Cakewalk supports, including 32- and 64-bit, as well as any other SONAR variants [like SONAR Artist] that require the same fix. It also has to be tested in different hardware systems, from clean installs to computers with tons of programs on them. Then it has to be released to beta testers. This is why CW tends to do batch fixes on related functions so that, for example, multiple Matrix View issues can be addressed and tested all at once.)
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 13:15:34
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Anderton,
Some of the quotes are not ones I meant directed at you. You never used the word "tantrum" I believe. I think that was to someone else.
OK look, do I expect a software to be PERFECT? No, absolutely not. I wouldn't looking into other DAWs if it was just some bugs or things Cakewalk didn't do as well as others.
If you were working with me in my studio, you would 100% agree with me on this. I record a bunch of synth tracks, freeze them to save on CPU, come back the next day, the sounds are gone. Or all the sudden, I notice my bass track is nuts because every note from a MIDI-out arppegio somehow made it to my bass track.
The problems are constant. And I shouldn't need to as you say, save every patch, archive, etc... it's a giant pain in the ass. The whole point of that "freeze" button is to be quick and efficient. If a dialog prompt came up when I was freezing a track saying "WARNING: your synth parameters might be lost upon unfreeze, well, then I say its on me", but there isn't and I am not psychic.
You keep saying things to the effect that well Sonar just doesn't do things the way "I" would like, or that I don't want to bother with workarounds. I say its worse than that. I have projects literally destroyed by Sonar at this point. I consider it data loss when I re-open a project and a custom synth patch I made is lost or I come back and notice erroneous notes all over the place.
Craig, you are an Executive Vice-President at Gibson Brands, correct? I know you have a vested interest in softening my thread, however I stand by in saying Sonar's MIDI engine needs a serious and complete overhaul.
I am a lifetime member, so for me - my money is in already, but its sad that most likely I am going to have to make a purchase with Cubase to program MIDI effectively.
I just hope one day Sonar comes to realize their MIDI solution (for advanced MIDI users) is sub-par (at least in my opinion) and advances their MIDI engine to the next level.
A GUI overhaul would be nice too. Load up Presonus Studio 1. It's just FAST. It 'FEELS' very 2017. It doesn't feel clunky. I am not waiting for modules to load. While this isn't a huge deal, it is nice to work with something that 'FEELS' nice and quick. Load it up, try it. Tell me what you think.
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JayCee99
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 13:54:03
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SBM, I saw your posts on Facebook and this forum about the synth parameters not being saved when freezing. No doubt that is happening for you.
I agree with your point about workarounds. . . I never like the idea of having to use a convoluted workaround for a feature that's supposed to work well.
HOWEVER, while some people said in the past they have experienced similar problems, every single person that tried recently on both of the threads you have said they can't reproduce the issue.
You mentioned that various plugins display the issue across various projects. Based on that, it seems like something is corrupted with your Sonar install.
I would suggest trying the following:
If you have another computer, setup the needed software and copy the project over and see if it happens on the other computer.
If you CAN'T reproduce it on the other computer, it's probably something with your install or system.
- Backup your personal data and completely uninstall Sonar, clean the registry and system of the Sonar items (instructions online), and then reinstall Sonar
- Format your system and set up a clean install of everything
- Run diagnostics tests on your memory and hard drive
If you CAN reproduce it on another computer, then it's probably something about the project file or the specific combination of plugins or data, either corrupted or a bug. Check with other users with the specifics and if it's not reproducible, send your project file to Cakewalk. If it is reproducible, then it's probably a bug.
Sonar Platinum Audio Interface: Focusrite 18i8 ASIO Interface Keys: Korg Kronos 88, Alesis VI25 Windows 8.1 x64 Laptop, 8GB RAM, i7 CPU
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azslow3
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 15:04:42
(permalink)
Plug-in parameters are a BULK data. Sonar (or other DAW) has no way to intentionally modify them directly. So, there are several possibilities:
1. modifications are not saved. For example you have changed some parameter and it is reverted back to previous value on load.
2. plug-in has a bug in saving/restoring its own configuration. But you mention that "many" plug-ins do this, also plug-ins which are not doing that for other users.
3. Sonar randomly corrupts saved data... There was such reports. But not many, I mean not sufficient to blame Sonar or some plug-in delivered with it. My best guess, some other plug-in has a bug. Yes, ANY plug-in in use can corrupt EVERYTHING in Sonar.
And finally, you can modify something by mistake. That is easy without intention, by grouping, MIDI learn, "remote control", ACT, keyboard shortcuts or bad MIDI routing (since you mention some "notes").
I have tried hard to reproduce you Z3TA2 video, click by click. I put the same preset as your default. There was 2 things I could not reproduce: current parameter change at 1:00, it is theoretically possible to move mouse this way, but that is hard within timing in the video... and the bug.
Do you have ANY control surface connected?
Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc. www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 17:54:42
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rlared
SBM, I saw your posts on Facebook and this forum about the synth parameters not being saved when freezing. No doubt that is happening for you.
I agree with your point about workarounds. . . I never like the idea of having to use a convoluted workaround for a feature that's supposed to work well.
HOWEVER, while some people said in the past they have experienced similar problems, every single person that tried recently on both of the threads you have said they can't reproduce the issue.
You mentioned that various plugins display the issue across various projects. Based on that, it seems like something is corrupted with your Sonar install.
I would suggest trying the following:
If you have another computer, setup the needed software and copy the project over and see if it happens on the other computer.
If you CAN'T reproduce it on the other computer, it's probably something with your install or system.
- Backup your personal data and completely uninstall Sonar, clean the registry and system of the Sonar items (instructions online), and then reinstall Sonar
- Format your system and set up a clean install of everything
- Run diagnostics tests on your memory and hard drive
If you CAN reproduce it on another computer, then it's probably something about the project file or the specific combination of plugins or data, either corrupted or a bug. Check with other users with the specifics and if it's not reproducible, send your project file to Cakewalk. If it is reproducible, then it's probably a bug.
Thank you 'rlared'. I appreciate it. I would normally try this first, but believe it or not, I've had Sonar on 3 different machines so far, and have had this problem on all of them. I know, sounds crazy right? This machine I am on now is so new too. Newly purchased, clean fresh Windows install, then Office, then Sonar. That's it! (ofcourse my plugins after). It is strange that I get this on every install, no matter the computer. I do appreciate your effort to help though. Thank you very much!
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 17:59:16
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azslow3
Plug-in parameters are a BULK data. Sonar (or other DAW) has no way to intentionally modify them directly. So, there are several possibilities:
1. modifications are not saved. For example you have changed some parameter and it is reverted back to previous value on load.
2. plug-in has a bug in saving/restoring its own configuration. But you mention that "many" plug-ins do this, also plug-ins which are not doing that for other users.
3. Sonar randomly corrupts saved data... There was such reports. But not many, I mean not sufficient to blame Sonar or some plug-in delivered with it. My best guess, some other plug-in has a bug. Yes, ANY plug-in in use can corrupt EVERYTHING in Sonar.
And finally, you can modify something by mistake. That is easy without intention, by grouping, MIDI learn, "remote control", ACT, keyboard shortcuts or bad MIDI routing (since you mention some "notes").
I have tried hard to reproduce you Z3TA2 video, click by click. I put the same preset as your default. There was 2 things I could not reproduce: current parameter change at 1:00, it is theoretically possible to move mouse this way, but that is hard within timing in the video... and the bug.
Do you have ANY control surface connected?
Hi azslow3, Agree with you on your points, but on #3, this happens with NONE of my extra plugins loaded, just the latest Sonar and the latest Z3TA+2. I doubt a plugin that is not loaded into memory or even the project could cause this issue. I agree with you I could modify things by mistake (MIDI Learn, Remote Control, etc..) however I can say 100% that is not the case. Event Viewer is just notes, and I checked any possible MIDI Learn, remote control, etc.. It's as clean as clean can be. If you see the video below, you can see how clean and simple I made it. Nothing should be causing this. I did edit the video, but just to save time for the viewer, I had to answer an IM in between doing things lol. I didn't edit out anything in Sonar. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovunWzz20B0 Thank you for your efforts though. Much appreciated! -Adam
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Genghis
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 18:03:24
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SilverBlueMedallion
tlw
SilverBlueMedallion
MIDI data recorded all over the place that shouldn't be, etc...
I don't have that problem.
Wonder what I'm doing wrong?
As for Sonar being mistly used in home/project studios, that's almost certainly true of all DAWs. Even
Pro Tools after it split from the HD system that required a limited range of extremely expensive hardware.
you must not play a lot with MIDI-out from synths
I use it quite a bit, but I pay attention to what I"m doing and how I route my tracks. Never been a real issue. Noticed it happen once and figured out why it did, so I actually make sure my MIDI is routed right.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 18:14:21
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Genghis
SilverBlueMedallion
tlw
SilverBlueMedallion
MIDI data recorded all over the place that shouldn't be, etc...
I don't have that problem.
Wonder what I'm doing wrong?
As for Sonar being mistly used in home/project studios, that's almost certainly true of all DAWs. Even
Pro Tools after it split from the HD system that required a limited range of extremely expensive hardware.
you must not play a lot with MIDI-out from synths
I use it quite a bit, but I pay attention to what I"m doing and how I route my tracks. Never been a real issue. Noticed it happen once and figured out why it did, so I actually make sure my MIDI is routed right.
Yes, I can do the same.... but HERE is the problem. I think I am figuring this out. So, if I start Sonar with my keyboard UNPLUGGED, the input has no option but to go to "NONE" (which is really "OMNI" (see: http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3541278) so when that happens, MIDI goes everywhere. I shouldn't have to keep watching all the inputs all the time. They change randomly.
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azslow3
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 19:06:27
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☄ Helpfulby coolbass 2017/01/06 22:36:46
Hi Adam, Some of your problems can not be reproduced by other. In such case they can not be fixed. SilverBlueMedallion
Hi azslow3,
Agree with you on your points, but on #3, this happens with NONE of my extra plugins loaded, just the latest Sonar and the latest Z3TA+2. I doubt a plugin that is not loaded into memory or even the project could cause this issue.
In the video, I see VST scan during startup... depending on scanning settings, other plug-ins can disturb operations. So, please turn automatic VST scanning off.
I agree with you I could modify things by mistake (MIDI Learn, Remote Control, etc..) however I can say 100% that is not the case. Event Viewer is just notes, and I checked any possible MIDI Learn, remote control, etc..
I have already asked that question, and from your previous post the answer can not be "no". Which controllers and other MIDI equipment is enabled in Sonar MIDI settings? Try disable them ALL. Event Viewer is not showing everything, in fact Sonar by default sending TONS of MIDI messages which you normally can not notice. Have you disabled "Reset controllers on play stop" in the Project / MIDI preferences ?
It's as clean as clean can be. If you see the video below, you can see how clean and simple I made it. Nothing should be causing this. I did edit the video, but just to save time for the viewer, I had to answer an IM in between doing things lol. I didn't edit out anything in Sonar.
I was not assuming you have manipulated the video. Just in case you have not focused the parameter by mouse, it could be focused by something else, which in turn could point in some direction to understand the problem. The video is not clean in respect to MIDI. And SOMETHING is changing the parameter. I do not think this something is Sonar, the only way it can do this is explicitly setting it throw automation API. But so far there was no evidence it ever did that (as long as you are not using Control Surfaces and do not have Automation lanes in the project). In this particular case, I can imagine that Z3TA has a bug (which we can not reproduce because of some specific MS runtime you have... in the video, you have plenty of "bloatware" installed and partially running... do you have it on your other computers as well?). The value after the project loading correspond to the default preset, shown in the beginning of the video. Try to change default preset in Z3TA and repeat the test. Does is still revert to the same value?
Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc. www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
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gustabo
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 20:44:17
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SilverBlueMedallion
Thank you 'rlared'. I appreciate it. I would normally try this first, but believe it or not, I've had Sonar on 3 different machines so far, and have had this problem on all of them. I know, sounds crazy right?
This machine I am on now is so new too. Newly purchased, clean fresh Windows install, then Office, then Sonar. That's it! (ofcourse my plugins after).
It is strange that I get this on every install, no matter the computer.
I do appreciate your effort to help though. Thank you very much!
Have you tried with a clean install of Sonar and no additional plugins installed?
Cakewalk by Bandlab - Win10 Pro x64 - StudioCat Platinum Studio DAW - 32 GB Ram - MOTU UltraLite-mk3
M-Audio Keystation 88ES - Akai MPD26 (hot-rodded) - Alesis DM10 - a few guitars, a few amps
Novation Launch Control - Korg nanoKONTROL2 - PreSonus FaderPort - DAW Remote HD on iPad
Adam A7X - Behritone C50A
PreSonus Monitor Station v2 (controlling the mons)
https://www.facebook.com/groups/sonarusergroup/
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abacab
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Re: Poor MIDI Implementation Is Going To Cause Me To Leave Cakewalk
2017/01/06 21:03:34
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gustabo
Have you tried with a clean install of Sonar and no additional plugins installed?
I was wondering about this ... I don't doubt the problems being experienced ... but ... I have a modest i3 system with 8GB RAM that runs Sonar Platinum like greased lightning Comments like this leave me wondering about the OP's computer setup. " Also look to Studio One for its "spiffyness". The code FEELS new. The GUI just loads. You don't have to wait for different modules (like the synth rack for example)... it feels nice. I don't know about the side of GUI programming, but I feel Studio One is built on some newer technology or something."
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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