vintagevibe
Max Output Level: -51 dBFS
- Total Posts : 2446
- Joined: 2003/12/15 21:45:06
- Location: Atlanta, Ga
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 20:31:19
(permalink)
PaPi,
There is a reason that people tend to be loyal to Cakewalk. I know of no other company that listens to its customers more. I know of no other company that has had their Chief Technical Officer come on their forum and discuss technical issues. I know of no other company that has had their and CEO/Founder come on the forum. Long time Cakewalk customers know people like Brandon Ryan because he is on the forum talking to users. When you dismiss a new product with cavalier rudeness and misinformation it does seem like a personal attack on people that we know. If you had said that you don't feel it is a good investment for you or that another product or products would be cheaper or better and said it in a constructive, adult way you would have received a very different reaction. But you came on and totally dissed a product that these people have worked very hard to bring to market and are probably quite proud of. And you did it like school kid in detention talking about the teacher. Meaningful, constructive discussions begin with a very different approach.
|
Brandon Ryan [Roland]
Max Output Level: -40.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3458
- Joined: 2003/11/06 03:29:12
- Location: Los Angeles, CA
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 20:41:28
(permalink)
"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG SONAR Platinum | VS-700 | A-800 PRO | PCAL i7 with SSD running Windows 8 x64 | Samsung 27" LCD @ 1920x1080 | Blue Sky monitors with BMC | All kinds of other stuff
|
InstrEd
Max Output Level: -65 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1276
- Joined: 2004/10/13 20:55:03
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:01:06
(permalink)
Only thing I'm disappointed in with the unit is why no ADAT in at least. This way the unit would be a total winner. You get the fader plus audio interface plus the expandability with the unit.
Still I'm very interested in the unit. I was going to buy a Alphatrack yesterday, but thought, I must wait and see what Cakewalk has to offer. Glad I did. Hey Brandon can you just use the unit as a control surface without the audio interface part and what is the lowest latency the unit can go down to?
Ed
|
Brandon Ryan [Roland]
Max Output Level: -40.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3458
- Joined: 2003/11/06 03:29:12
- Location: Los Angeles, CA
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:06:04
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: InstrEd
Only thing I'm disappointed in with the unit is why no ADAT in at least. This way the unit would be a total winner. You get the fader plus audio interface plus the expandability with the unit.
Still I'm very interested in the unit. I was going to buy a Alphatrack yesterday, but thought, I must wait and see what Cakewalk has to offer. Glad I did. Hey Brandon can you just use the unit as a control surface without the audio interface part and what is the lowest latency the unit can go down to?
Ed
You can indeed use the control surface part w/o using the audio interface aspects. Currently the driver allows latency of 2.2ms (same as VS-700)
"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG SONAR Platinum | VS-700 | A-800 PRO | PCAL i7 with SSD running Windows 8 x64 | Samsung 27" LCD @ 1920x1080 | Blue Sky monitors with BMC | All kinds of other stuff
|
Zo
Max Output Level: -25 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5036
- Joined: 2008/01/25 20:49:55
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:11:38
(permalink)
Hey papi i don't even know why you're talkin price ? to do so you have to be sure that your fastrack ....has as good quality converters as the thing , don't speak about tha alphatrack cause i know it rocks , but i would definitly not compare any m audio gear to this , specially about the poor quality drivers they make !!
Don't know about drivers and convertors of the vs 100 but to talk price you have to test it ( i don't compare cars before driven them ;))
And no i'm no Cake religions , and i'm (like most of use) the type of guy that want the best for the best price (like you i suppose) but more than reviews and expectations , the judge is me , my set up , my workflow !!
For sale (PM me) : transfert ilok includedEventide Ultrachannel make offersSoftube Summit EQIK Neve 1081 , Neve precision Comp/LimEastWest GoshtwriterSoundforge Pro 12
|
PaPi
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1032
- Joined: 2008/12/27 18:02:03
- Location: SoCal
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:15:09
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Zo
Hey papi i don't even know why you're talkin price ? to do so you have to be sure that your fastrack ....has as good quality converters as the thing , don't speak about tha alphatrack cause i know it rocks , but i would definitly not compare any m audio gear to this , specially about the poor quality drivers they make !!
Don't know about drivers and convertors of the vs 100 but to talk price you have to test it ( i don't compare cars before driven them ;))
And no i'm no Cake religions , and i'm (like most of use) the type of guy that want the best for the best price (like you i suppose) but more than reviews and expectations , the judge is me , my set up , my workflow !!
I have a Fast Track Ultra 8R. It rocks. Fantastic preamps, great sound quality, great drivers, even in 64-bit. I actually have two of them, one broke and M-Audio replaced it with a brand new one the day after.
|
PaPi
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1032
- Joined: 2008/12/27 18:02:03
- Location: SoCal
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:16:47
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
Yes I saw these as well, but frankly who knows what these ebay sellers would sell a V-Studio 100 for... I seriously doubt Roland/Cakewalk would let anyone sell a V-Studio on EBay. Searched for the VS-700. Zero results.
|
Jon Con
Max Output Level: -85 dBFS
- Total Posts : 275
- Joined: 2006/04/17 06:37:07
- Location: South Wales
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:20:00
(permalink)
papi i think the USP of the VS100 when compared with other products bundled together is it can also be used as a standalone product which may determine the price difference. Some people prefer to write music and come up with songs away from the computer (diane warren seems to write songs and ideas by playing to an old tape recorder) and if it means just setting up a mic and pressing record and not worry about cueing tracks, starting up a computer, issues with latency, possibility of a crash etc. then it would be a handy product for alot of people. For some people it may be exactly what they wanted. I know a couple of people who I'm recording at the moment who could really do with this to be able to record something down quickly and then show me the basic structure of the song that I could dump straight into Sonar, they like writing music and don't really get on with the technology side of things. If its as simple as plugging a guitar into an amp and just having to press record, I can see quite a few people interested in this. all the best anyways man 
|
PaPi
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1032
- Joined: 2008/12/27 18:02:03
- Location: SoCal
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:21:53
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: vintagevibe
PaPi,
There is a reason that people tend to be loyal to Cakewalk. I know of no other company that listens to its customers more. I know of no other company that has had their Chief Technical Officer come on their forum and discuss technical issues. I know of no other company that has had their and CEO/Founder come on the forum. Long time Cakewalk customers know people like Brandon Ryan because he is on the forum talking to users. When you dismiss a new product with cavalier rudeness and misinformation it does seem like a personal attack on people that we know. If you had said that you don't feel it is a good investment for you or that another product or products would be cheaper or better and said it in a constructive, adult way you would have received a very different reaction. But you came on and totally dissed a product that these people have worked very hard to bring to market and are probably quite proud of. And you did it like school kid in detention talking about the teacher. Meaningful, constructive discussions begin with a very different approach.
Cavalier rudeness? And what do you think of the abuse I received for expressing an unpopular opinion? Right, you don't care... Sorry, I'm not loyal to any company. These are TOOLS we're talking about. When I need a new hammer, I buy a new one according to my needs, not the company that sells it. And BTW, by MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, Cakewalk doesn't have a great customer service at all. I purchased the Rapture upgrade and they didn't send me a SN until I started to email and phone them. On the other hand, M-Audio replaced a faulty product with a new one in a couple of days. Now that's good customer service. Still, that doesn't mean my next whatever will be necessarily made by M-Audio...
|
DonM
Max Output Level: -34 dBFS
- Total Posts : 4129
- Joined: 2004/04/26 12:23:12
- Location: Pittsburgh
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:23:15
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: InstrEd
Only thing I'm disappointed in with the unit is why no ADAT in at least. This way the unit would be a total winner. You get the fader plus audio interface plus the expandability with the unit.
Still I'm very interested in the unit. I was going to buy a Alphatrack yesterday, but thought, I must wait and see what Cakewalk has to offer. Glad I did. Hey Brandon can you just use the unit as a control surface without the audio interface part and what is the lowest latency the unit can go down to?
Ed
Brandon; Nice product - agreed it's not just a CS and interface - a lot to offer. I would love to see a firewire based 8-16 channel, with ADAT, moving fader surface, DSP 8 out under $2000 to replace my O1X. I've been avoiding the tascam line waiting for a surface, mixer, interface with DSP - ADAT is tremendously helpful for those of us with pre amps that we need to interface. Let me know if you want assistance on a design team. -D
|
PaPi
Max Output Level: -70 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1032
- Joined: 2008/12/27 18:02:03
- Location: SoCal
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:24:18
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Jon Con
papi i think the USP of the VS100 when compared with other products bundled together is it can also be used as a standalone product which may determine the price difference. Some people prefer to write music and come up with songs away from the computer (diane warren seems to write songs and ideas by playing to an old tape recorder) and if it means just setting up a mic and pressing record and not worry about cueing tracks, starting up a computer, issues with latency, possibility of a crash etc. then it would be a handy product for alot of people.
For some people it may be exactly what they wanted. I know a couple of people who I'm recording at the moment who could really do with this to be able to record something down quickly and then show me the basic structure of the song that I could dump straight into Sonar, they like writing music and don't really get on with the technology side of things. If its as simple as plugging a guitar into an amp and just having to press record, I can see quite a few people interested in this.
all the best anyways man
Yes, absolutely. I only expressed a PERSONAL OPINION, that IN MY OPINION the VS-100 is severely over-priced for what it offers (same with the VS-700.) I did not deserve the abuse thrown at me. No one pointed it out, not even the board administrator who's supposed to not let it happen...
|
Brandon Ryan [Roland]
Max Output Level: -40.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3458
- Joined: 2003/11/06 03:29:12
- Location: Los Angeles, CA
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:29:01
(permalink)
Please everyone let's have a discussion based on the facts (or opinon if you so choose) and refrain from any personal attacks and/or name-calling as this is a violation of the forum TOS.
post edited by Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk] - 2009/04/01 21:36:07
"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG SONAR Platinum | VS-700 | A-800 PRO | PCAL i7 with SSD running Windows 8 x64 | Samsung 27" LCD @ 1920x1080 | Blue Sky monitors with BMC | All kinds of other stuff
|
doncolga
Max Output Level: -60 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1519
- Joined: 2006/01/03 17:15:48
- Location: Statesboro, GA USA
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:30:06
(permalink)
Thank you Brandon. I'm VERY interested in the VS-100 from what I've seen. It's obvious that it offers a unique feature set not available in any other unit. ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
ORIGINAL: PaPi
ORIGINAL: strikinglyhandsome1
First costing: UK £599 inc.VAT - not concrete though
Basically an Alphatrack + an M-Audio Fast Track Pro at THREE TIMES the combined price...
That's just simply not true. Love how people grossly oversimplify from an apparent half-reading.
The VS-100 has a solid state SD recorder, a stand-alone digital mixer with effects, an ACT control section, full software suite, etc. How is that like an Alphatrack and a Fast Track Pro (at 3x the price)?
post edited by doncolga - 2009/04/01 21:46:12
HP Z220 Workstation I7 3770, 8 GB RAM, Windows 10, Sonar Platinum, RME Multiface II via PCIe, JBL 4326 w/sub, AvanTone MixCubes
|
Fog
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 12302
- Joined: 2008/02/27 21:53:35
- Location: UK
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:35:23
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: PaPi
I seriously doubt Roland/Cakewalk would let anyone sell a V-Studio on EBay. Searched for the VS-700. Zero results.
think about it though, in the sense of.. 1) it's a relatively new product 2) not exactly a cheap thing to buy.. people would do a LOT of research before spending that amount of money in these times 3) it is aimed at a specific market also. whats the most expensive thing you have bought.I'm sure you looked into it before forking out the money.. I know I did with my 824's and the same with the RME card I'll probably get. Neither of which would probably end up on ebay. some things you buy and you buy them as a "keeper" . Unless you have unlimited funds, then buying stuff on the fly, isn't something most do. As for whether they allow it or not is a different matter. I really think that people that invest that sort of money aren't gonna sell it on so quick. Can say the same for other none cake/roland products. if you want to take that tact, how many second hand pro tools rigs do you see on there? I'm talking about the high end ones, not sub $1000 as for the new product itself.. I can see it's interesting, but being honest if I was looking to buy it. I'd do more research into it. It's nice in the fact it's NOT so locked like other things are, that are aiming for the same sort of market. Thats where I would have issue using a v700.. I'd really have to be a solid sonar user to justify it. I'm not , so can't and that's being objective.
post edited by Fog - 2009/04/01 21:45:17
|
MaestroGeek
Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
- Total Posts : 302
- Joined: 2007/12/18 00:24:01
- Location: away from the stinky onion
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:40:11
(permalink)
BTW, American made or just designed in US & made in China?
SONAR X1c Producer; SCOPE 5; Windows 7 x64 PowerPulsar+PulsarPlus+PulsarSRB+A16 Ultra; DIGIMAX FS; MTP AV USB Core2 Q9300+DP35DP+8GB PC6400 DDR2 DIMM+GeForce 8600 GT MCU PRO; BCR2000; Lemur/Dexter
|
Brandon Ryan [Roland]
Max Output Level: -40.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3458
- Joined: 2003/11/06 03:29:12
- Location: Los Angeles, CA
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 21:47:20
(permalink)
It is designed in US & Japan by Cakewalk and Roland. It is manufactured in China (by Roland).
"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG SONAR Platinum | VS-700 | A-800 PRO | PCAL i7 with SSD running Windows 8 x64 | Samsung 27" LCD @ 1920x1080 | Blue Sky monitors with BMC | All kinds of other stuff
|
Mooch4056
Max Output Level: -0.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 7494
- Joined: 2005/02/19 17:40:35
- Location: Chicago
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 22:59:23
(permalink)
papi
I think what EVERYONE is trying to say is that... the alpatrafastrack combo -- and the vs-100 have different sets of features......
and you wont admit that they dont have the same features or specs ...
no one cares if ur a fan of the product ......instead of googling prices -- google the spec list of the alphafastrack combo -- and the spec list of the vs-100..... this is where every one disagress with you
holy shmoly......!!!
From Now On Call Me Conquistador!
Donate to the cure Bapu Foundation Email: mooch4056@gmail.com for more info
|
...wicked
Max Output Level: -1.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 7360
- Joined: 2003/12/18 01:00:56
- Location: Seattle
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 23:27:40
(permalink)
Wow, I just came back to this thread after a day out of the studio. Holy cow Papi you just want to fling poo all over the place! Why so aggro?
On that note: your ebay link: "Factory B Stocks" units may be demos or refurbs. Not the biggest deal, but lets be clear you're not comparing apples to apples. Which, like Brandon has pointed out to you about 100 times, you're just taking two arbitrary numbers without doing a legitimate feature comparison.
And, y'know, an RME interface is THREE TIMES the price of a comparable one by Presonus or some such. They don't make any apologies because their units are fantastic. I think ultimately where the rubber meets the road is going to be how good the unit is in performance. If it has great drivers and is super low-latency, I frankly don't give a rat's butt if you can score an M-Audio interface and a Alphatrack for cheaper... it would be worth it to have a single unit that does both functions with better performance.
But, to leave your personal vendetta by the wayside, I'm curious about WHO the unit is made for. I think it's a cool product, but as with the V-Studio unit I'm a little puzzled and I think that's because I already have bought into Cake's software.
I remember when the V-700 came out and the user base said "oh damn, can't we just have the controller, who would buy all that?" and Cake's response was "well, we've already been selling like gangbusters so we don't know what the heck you're talking about." Now I don't have access to sales figures, but I also don't know anyone using the whole VStudio package. The fact that the controller is now available separately would indicate to me a stronger (and better) effort to get people into the platform.
Now, for me, I own an audio interface, I own SONAR (Producer, not this VS version). So, I'm not sure what about these units would interest me. Okee sure, if I had cash to burn (which NO ONE does these days) I might pick it up on the lark that I go skipping around wanting to field record... but I also own a portable DAT.
So, if I wanted a dedicated controller I would get one. If I wanted a field recorder I would get one (prolly that Zoom thingee which looks cool). If I wanted an audio interface I would get one. Is there really a market for people that simultaneously want to get ALL of that? I dunno, I'm not that person. I hope there is tho, I'd like to see Cake succeed and the unit looks pretty cool.
=========== The Fog People =========== Intel i7-4790 16GB RAM ASUS Z97 Roland OctaCapture Win10/64 SONAR Platinum 64-bit billions VSTs, some of which work
|
Zo
Max Output Level: -25 dBFS
- Total Posts : 5036
- Joined: 2008/01/25 20:49:55
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/01 23:30:04
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
It is designed in US & Japan by Cakewalk and Roland. It is manufactured in China (by Roland).
so to have some made in japan we must go for the vs 700 ?
For sale (PM me) : transfert ilok includedEventide Ultrachannel make offersSoftube Summit EQIK Neve 1081 , Neve precision Comp/LimEastWest GoshtwriterSoundforge Pro 12
|
MaestroGeek
Max Output Level: -84 dBFS
- Total Posts : 302
- Joined: 2007/12/18 00:24:01
- Location: away from the stinky onion
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 00:01:53
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Zo
ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
It is designed in US & Japan by Cakewalk and Roland. It is manufactured in China (by Roland).
so to have some made in japan we must go for the vs 700 ?
Oh? VS-700 is made in Japan?
SONAR X1c Producer; SCOPE 5; Windows 7 x64 PowerPulsar+PulsarPlus+PulsarSRB+A16 Ultra; DIGIMAX FS; MTP AV USB Core2 Q9300+DP35DP+8GB PC6400 DDR2 DIMM+GeForce 8600 GT MCU PRO; BCR2000; Lemur/Dexter
|
Brandon Ryan [Roland]
Max Output Level: -40.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 3458
- Joined: 2003/11/06 03:29:12
- Location: Los Angeles, CA
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 01:47:38
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: MaestroGeek
ORIGINAL: Zo
ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
It is designed in US & Japan by Cakewalk and Roland. It is manufactured in China (by Roland).
so to have some made in japan we must go for the vs 700 ?
Oh? VS-700 is made in Japan?
Yes it is.
"The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG SONAR Platinum | VS-700 | A-800 PRO | PCAL i7 with SSD running Windows 8 x64 | Samsung 27" LCD @ 1920x1080 | Blue Sky monitors with BMC | All kinds of other stuff
|
bermuda
Max Output Level: -52.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 2271
- Joined: 2004/04/28 12:34:40
- Location: Bermuda
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 09:23:26
(permalink)
Can we please learn more about the VS-100 it's integration with Sonar, other functionality and application. I'm not interested in other products. If I was I'd be on their forums.
|
Desertgirl
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
- Total Posts : 9
- Joined: 2008/12/30 13:20:42
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 10:38:59
(permalink)
|
...wicked
Max Output Level: -1.5 dBFS
- Total Posts : 7360
- Joined: 2003/12/18 01:00:56
- Location: Seattle
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 13:46:19
(permalink)
Okee, I think I'm starting to get it some more. This whole SD thing kind of baffles me tho. If you can playback and record to it simultaneously does that mean it's multitrack capable? Maybe I need to do some of my own research....
=========== The Fog People =========== Intel i7-4790 16GB RAM ASUS Z97 Roland OctaCapture Win10/64 SONAR Platinum 64-bit billions VSTs, some of which work
|
Saintom
Max Output Level: -58 dBFS
- Total Posts : 1749
- Joined: 2005/12/17 14:09:34
- Location: Portland Oregon
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 15:33:06
(permalink)
does that mean it's multitrack capable? This is what I would like to know also. I would love to use it as a backup recording device for my live recordings. Tom
Sometimes we see the light, Sometimes we stare at the light, and wonder why it is so bright...
|
mgh
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 8594
- Joined: 2007/05/10 05:15:56
- Location: betwixt and between
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 16:27:58
(permalink)
according to the brochure it has 2 channel recording on the SD. no multi-track there then...
|
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 17:58:18
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
ORIGINAL: MaestroGeek
ORIGINAL: Zo
ORIGINAL: Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]
It is designed in US & Japan by Cakewalk and Roland. It is manufactured in China (by Roland).
so to have some made in japan we must go for the vs 700 ?
Oh? VS-700 is made in Japan?
Yes it is.
VS-100 is manufactured in China but uses many of the same parts as the VS-700 (e.g. buttons, fader, encoders).
|
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 18:07:17
(permalink)
ORIGINAL: mgh
according to the brochure it has 2 channel recording on the SD. no multi-track there then...
It does have a mode where you can playback a stereo file (e.g. pre-recorded backing track) and then simultaneously record to a new file (2 channels). You can choose whether it records the entire mix (including the backing tracks), or just what comes through the mixer (mics, line devices, etc.).
|
headwerkn
Max Output Level: -90 dBFS
- Total Posts : 7
- Joined: 2009/04/02 18:14:33
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/02 19:27:07
(permalink)
That's interesting - kinda a digital equivalent of bouncing from one tape player to another while playing the next track.
--- bar bar bar, bar barbara ann....
|
yorolpal
Max Output Level: 0 dBFS
- Total Posts : 13829
- Joined: 2003/11/20 11:50:37
- Status: offline
RE: Sonar VS-100
2009/04/04 11:06:30
(permalink)
Wail, I thank I'm finally gettin the hang of these here 3-D glasses cause this thang is lookin better'n better. Lessee, I got two mic pres, a mixer, an effects unit, an audio interface with 2.2ms latency, an SD recorder so's I can play my tracks at a live venue, plus an ACT controller and, as ol Brandon says, it's built like a tank. So, sounds like a purty good deal to me at around seven c-notes. Just one question tho...will it julienne or puree? ps: how do the mic pres rate against...say...a MOTU Ultralite? 
post edited by yorolpal - 2009/04/04 11:07:03
|