ChuckC
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Danny Danzi
Once I found a happy medium of me and what I was being taught, then everything opened up just right. You'll see if you ever try it...like I say though, just be careful....if you come back sounding like Barry Manilow, I'm coming after you! Hahahahahaha! :)
-Danny
...So you don't wanna hear my version of Copacabana? LOL
ADK Built DAW, W7, Sonar Platinum, Studio One Pro,Yamaha HS8's & HS8S Presonus Studio/Live 24.4.2, A few decent mic pre's, lots of mics, 57's,58 betas, Sm7b, LD Condensors, Small condensors, Senn 421's, DI's, Sans Amp, A few guitar amps etc. Guitars : Gib. LP, Epi. Lp, Dillion Tele, Ibanez beater, Ibanez Ergodyne 4 String bass, Mapex Mars series 6 pc. studio kit, cymbals and other sh*t. http://www.everythingiam.net/ http://www.stormroomstudios.com Some of my productions: http://soundcloud.com/stormroomstudios
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trimph1
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You have a version of Copacabana?  I'd wanna hear this!!
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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Danny Danzi
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Sadly....would you believe someone challenged me to sing "Hold on to the Night" by Richard Marx? Yeah...I took the challenge and did it. LOL!!! Didn't turn out too bad considering it was all done on a 4-track cassette tape recorder and bounce after bounce after bounce. I so don't miss those days.
-Danny
My Site Fractal Audio Endorsed Artist & Beta Tester
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jbow
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I'm going to break Danny's (generally sound) rule about not just posting links and say that this thread is the best thing I have read on the internet about recording and mixing, and is worth more than all the other text on the internet about recording and mixing combined: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=29283 Hey John.... thanks for posting that. I poured over page one then saw that there are over 50 pages when I went to open page two. It seems like it is really going to be a great help. Really.. thanks! This thread is good too! I have a real strong tendency to over complicate anything I don't understand before I even get into it, so I start out discouraged. Much I have read both here and there have helped me to remember that first it is about the song. I've realized that I really need to learn where all my tracks sit in the frequency spectrum so that I can know whether to boost one thing or cut another to get the desired result... see, I am learning! Big thanks to Danny too! Julien
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mattplaysguitar
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It's a great thread, that one buy Yep. I'll have to have a smash through it again some time. I believe some guys on there have made a summary of all his answers only so if you look near the end you should be able to download a pdf of just the good stuff.
I like this comment he makes on the first page:
"Take a great-sounding CD and record it through your soundcard. Play back the recording. If it still sounds great, then you know that your soundcard is capable of rendering great-sounding recordings. No more blaming the interface.*
Next take the same CD and play it back through your monitors, recording the playback with your favorite mic (this is actually how the earliest records were duplicated). Still sound good? No more blaming the mic, cable, or preamp. If it doesn't sound good, then go back to the above post and make sure that your monitors and room acoustics are up to snuff. Even the lowly SM57 should reproduce a pretty accurate picture of whatever you point it at. "
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Philip
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-1 Unfortunately, I can't recommend Yep anymore to help with mixing issues.
Here's why:
With utmost respect to Matt and Yep, I feel Yep, while interesting and clever, became sort of a glorified-troll (know-it-all). He 'completely abandoned' our forum 2-3 years ago, iirc.
Yep has always been rhetorical ... to lovingly 'hook' us fearful noobs, IMHO. Then his statements have often left me hanging, becoming oversimplified, salesman-like, and swerving, like:
"Here's the secret to golden ears" ... "anyone can do it"
... "listen at low volumes" ... "
... "but it requires a certain amount of careful, educated, practiced listening"
(LOL! NOT!)
(In reality, Golden ears are rare and complex: They are rock-star singers and producers themselves: They perform multiple instruments with strong conviction and vibe. Such individuals sacrifice their time to listen for others, have great patience, great love, innate talent, and are compulsive composers who love music and art on numerous levels. They don't troll for attention. Their songs are extremely sincere and have message-hooks and vibe that edify others.)
Many worship Yep here and on the Reaper forum. JMO/IMHO. Can Yep even sing? Who knows?
Also, I'm afraid Yep's lingo is old school; a has-been artist of sorts; and/or a performance driven guitarist who appreciates little about sampling and dancing, etc.,
... who never listened to your/my recordings, never produced anything public, nor collab'd with any of us. Please prove me wrong (any of you) ... and I will retract my observations as false witness.
IOWs, there are too many *teachers*, like Yep, who talk the talk but never walk the walk. OTOH, Yep did love dialogue, all of us have loved Yep at one time or other.
Now I know many of you believe you love Yep, so you can hand-wave me as an trolling idiot who knows nothing at all (LOL).
A better solution, IMHO:
Without trying to patronize anyone, my mixes seem to benefit greatly via dialogues, collaborations, "ears" (not necessarily golden-ears) ... with many of own proven veteran teachers, friends, etc. (and even my enemies) here ... but those who are decent enough to post their music, whose music we can hear, feel, taste, and touch:
Like Bit, Robbie, RLD, NoHow, TruckerMusic, Reece, Larry&James, MGH, Yoyo, Danzi, Bat, Matt, Herb, Jeff, Jon, Yoropal, Julianna, Ben (yes Ben) and all the FAITHFUL listeners/singers on songs-forum, etc., etc.
Note: I'm always willing to try to collab or dialogue with any of you ... just PM me.
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BenMMusTech
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Philip
-1 Unfortunately, I can't recommend Yep anymore to help with mixing issues.
Here's why:
With utmost respect to Matt and Yep, I feel Yep, while interesting and clever, became sort of a glorified-troll (know-it-all). He 'completely abandoned' our forum 2-3 years ago, iirc.
Yep has always been rhetorical ... to lovingly 'hook' us fearful noobs, IMHO. Then his statements have often left me hanging, becoming oversimplified, salesman-like, and swerving, like:
"Here's the secret to golden ears" ... "anyone can do it"
... "listen at low volumes" ... "
... "but it requires a certain amount of careful, educated, practiced listening"
(LOL! NOT!)
(In reality, Golden ears are rare and complex: They are rock-star singers and producers themselves: They perform multiple instruments with strong conviction and vibe. Such individuals sacrifice their time to listen for others, have great patience, great love, innate talent, and are compulsive composers who love music and art on numerous levels. They don't troll for attention. Their songs are extremely sincere and have message-hooks and vibe that edify others.)
Many worship Yep here and on the Reaper forum. JMO/IMHO. Can Yep even sing? Who knows?
Also, I'm afraid Yep's lingo is old school; a has-been artist of sorts; and/or a performance driven guitarist who appreciates little about sampling and dancing, etc.,
... who never listened to your/my recordings, never produced anything public, nor collab'd with any of us. Please prove me wrong (any of you) ... and I will retract my observations as false witness.
IOWs, there are too many *teachers*, like Yep, who talk the talk but never walk the walk. OTOH, Yep did love dialogue, all of us have loved Yep at one time or other.
Now I know many of you believe you love Yep, so you can hand-wave me as an trolling idiot who knows nothing at all (LOL).
A better solution, IMHO:
Without trying to patronize anyone, my mixes seem to benefit greatly via dialogues, collaborations, "ears" (not necessarily golden-ears) ... with many of own proven veteran teachers, friends, etc. (and even my enemies) here ... but those who are decent enough to post their music, whose music we can hear, feel, taste, and touch:
Like Bit, Robbie, RLD, NoHow, TruckerMusic, Reece, Larry&James, MGH, Yoyo, Danzi, Bat, Matt, Herb, Jeff, Jon, Yoropal, Julianna, Ben (yes Ben) and all the FAITHFUL listeners/singers on songs-forum, etc., etc.
Note: I'm always willing to try to collab or dialogue with any of you ... just PM me.
That almost brought me to tears Philip, you are a true scholar and a gentleman. I wish I could say more but I think I don't need to with you. Hugs and Peace Ben
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John T
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He may or may not be able to sing and you think his lingo is old school? That's your criticism?
Whatever.
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Beagle
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John T: that's not what I got out of Philip's post. those were just secondary complaints, the main complaint Philip made was:
Yep has always been rhetorical ... to lovingly 'hook' us fearful noobs, IMHO. Then his statements have often left me hanging, becoming oversimplified, salesman-like, and swerving, like:
"Here's the secret to golden ears" ... "anyone can do it"
... "listen at low volumes" ... "
... "but it requires a certain amount of careful, educated, practiced listening"
or in other words: he didn't ever really give practical, real life answers. I don't necessarily agree with Philip on this completely. Yep did give some good practical advice. I have some of his advice on compression and recording vocals on my website. But I do see where Philip is coming from on some things that yep didn't really explain.
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jamesyoyo
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Philip
-1 Unfortunately, I can't recommend Yep anymore to help with mixing issues.
Here's why:
With utmost respect to Matt and Yep, I feel Yep, while interesting and clever, became sort of a glorified-troll (know-it-all).
Well, any guy that would title his mega-post "Why your recordings sound like @$$" certainly has the know-it-all part down cold! After reading what Philip wrote, he did cause me to reconsider Yep some. While I don't doubt that much of what he knows is indeed true, he is so jaded that he can't really explain it anyone other than those on his knowledge level. Thus, for everyone else it comes across as confused and patronizing. And there are tons of know-it-alls on the X1 forum who seem to know everything about recording, yet their own work (if they ever bother to post it) is shockingly amateurish. And I mean I was completely shocked in a few cases. Being not much more than an advanced hobbyist myself (I make a couple bucks here and there), I still would never spout off so much, pick fights over how right I am, and then produce such slapdash crap. It is embarrassing. But that's the Internet for ya.
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John T
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Well, pulling out that particular "golden ears" stuff, Philips specific complaint is that Yep is wrong that this is something anyone can do, and he asserts this is because "In reality, Golden ears are rare and complex: They are rock-star singers and producers themselves: They perform multiple instruments with strong conviction and vibe. Such individuals sacrifice their time to listen for others, have great patience, great love, innate talent, and are compulsive composers who love music and art on numerous levels. They don't troll for attention. Their songs are extremely sincere and have message-hooks and vibe that edify others".
http://johntatlockaudio.com/Self-build PC // 16GB RAM // i7 3770k @ 3.5 Ghz // Nofan 0dB cooler // ASUS P8-Z77 V Pro motherboard // Intel x-25m SSD System Drive // Seagate RAID Array Audio Drive // Windows 10 64 bit // Sonar Platinum (64 bit) // Sonar VS-700 // M-Audio Keystation Pro 88 // KRK RP-6 Monitors // and a bunch of other stuff
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John T
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Now that's just plain claptrap.
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John T
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For starters: there are loads of really good engineers out there who don't play, sing or write songs at all.
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trimph1
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Weeeellllll....  I'm not sure that Yep is all that bad...he may be a little bit more salty for some however. But I am not going to quibble with his expertise that is for darn sure....
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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Beagle
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Yes, there are plenty of excellent engineers who aren't good musicians. one job is not equivalent or even a prerequisite for the other.
BUT if someone claims to be able to do both and declare themselves an expert, then when they post their stuff and it's obviously amaturish, then they have no credibility to back up their self proclaimed expertise.
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John T
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Well, that's certainly true.
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Philip
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Thanks John, Reece, James, Ben, and all.
The blind leading the blind has been a concern of late. I don't consider any of you blind leaders, however. But Yep left us because he was not of us. He never went to war for any of us, despite his loving words.
My personal opinion(s) on "golden ears" may be wrong. The definition of 'golden ears' has a compound meaning anyway. Perhaps all of us have golden ears some of the time ... those all-penetrating ears that can decipher vibe, beatz, acoustics, etc. etc.
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John T
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What does "go to war" mean, in this context?
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Philip
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"Go to war" with our song battles:
Yep never critiqued our songs, never collab'd, never immersed himself in our song struggles, never demo'd his *excellence* for us noobs to follow. He was all talk and no bloody (song) action.
Yep, IMHO, preferred to be 'teacher of babes', with ear-tickling words about every facet of song creation. All of us noob-pioneers were amazed by Yep! He 'understood' DAW domains and rock; he encouraged us to finish our battles ... but without ever getting his own hands dirty. Yep seemed a beloved politician working on paper alone. He only critiqued our words, iirc!
"Finished is better than perfect" ... hahahahaha! Ear-tickling stuff!
By old-school mixing: I meant: performance driven wide-dynamics 80's music (vs. sample driven): Yep spoke highly of real expert (garage) guitarists, singers, and drummers (to me) ... while eschewing fake ROMplers, Samplers, hip-hopsters, and recent pioneering ... that never involves real expert guitarists, expert singers, nor expert drummers.
Yep loved Motown (when I cornered him to state his favs). Hahahahaha!
Yep gave us some invaluable signal chains and such to be sure.
I love Yep but wish he would have joined in some of our battles ... as many of you joined in my battles. What good is an advisor that never shares your battles.
Today the beatz-master and DJ rule in skating halls and dance halls ... world-wide.
IOWs, Yep was a godsend for us noobs, an excellent politician (except for monster cables) who encouraged his troops to go to rock-war, but hid himself during our serious song-battles.
Who was this Yep anyway? What were his songs and song motifs? Could Yep even tune a guitar? Did Yep ever sing a message at all?
Where are you my old friend, Yep? I miss you! You are the fantom phantom of hope for us all!
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jamesyoyo
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For all we know Yep could be Bruce Swedien, or he could be some kid in his basement. Without hearing anything, how can we tell anything of what he says is right?
The old Russian proverb comes to mind:
trust, but verify.
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John T
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Finished *IS* better than perfect. In that "hypothetically perfect but not finished" is worth more or less nothing. Also, I'm not sure why anyone is obligated to participate in the Songs forum. I don't particularly myself.
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John T
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Got to be honest Philip, this all reads like some personal beef you've got. All the way through that thread he says over and over "If you think this is bad advice, or it doesn't apply to you, please ignore it". He also states very clearly that he's not worked on anything particularly massive or earth shattering. The guy's just an ex-jobbing engineer. The very *last* thing he does is invite people to worship him as some kind of guru.
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John T
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And what does this mean? "Yep loved Motown (when I cornered him to state his favs). Hahahahaha!" Are you seriously saying that rating Motown is somehow credibility damaging?
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FastBikerBoy
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IIRC Sonar is THE Motown DAW.
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trimph1
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I don't know. Yep might have been anyone actually, so what? The point is/was that he had some very good ideas/points as well. I do not believe that he was all bad, just as he may not have been all good either. People are a little more than just one side or the other... 
The space you have will always be exceeded in direct proportion to the amount of stuff you have...Thornton's Postulate. Bushpianos
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Philip
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trimph1
I don't know. Yep might have been anyone actually, so what? The point is/was that he had some very good ideas/points as well.
I do not believe that he was all bad, just as he may not have been all good either. People are a little more than just one side or the other...
+1 Triumph, John, FastBikerBoy, Jim, Interestingly, I love Motown an aweful lot! Who doesn't? Unfortunately, I suffer like the Op. Ironically, the Op has helped me mix much better than Yep! Of the 30-40 songs I've posted, the Op has critiqued every one of them and encouraged me to excel. You guys that never critique me nor post songs ... I have little love and respect for, just like Yep. To each his own I guess. OTOH, I do hear the little Yep's voice in my consciousness every time I mix. :) fwiw.
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John T
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Feel free to arbitrarily have "little respect or love for" people for flimsy reasons. I imagine you'll reap what you sow. incidentally, I have no view on the qualities of your music, but your song explicitly equating atheists with chIld molestors is not winning me over, conceptually.
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John T
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Ah sorry, it's not atheists, it's anyone who thinks evolution is real. Forgive me.
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Chappel
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John T
Ah sorry, it's not atheists, it's anyone who thinks evolution is real. Forgive me.
Well, I believe in evolution and yet I don't have the urge to molest children. Maybe I'm unique? I do, however, have a renewed understanding of why I quit going to church.
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BenMMusTech
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Enough!! JT, you have hit a new low, NO RELIGION!!! Even I don't touch this subject!!!
I don't listen to Philips songs and hear what you are hearing, I hear some really cool production, I know there is some quasi religious message undeneath the layers but the thing is the wondeful layers.
You can inhabit these boards and no one can stop you except The Cake but your treading on thin ice, this thread has gone way off topic, even though funnily enough what Philip has written is on-topic, in that those of who do post in the song forum are trying to help each other, become better engineers, producers, songwriters and musos. And that is what BOTR original post was about.
It's time to move on and put away our schoolyard slings and arrows away and this includes me, everybody brings something to the table/forum.
Peace Ben
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