Vista and Sonar

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John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/10 21:22:41 (permalink)
Readyboost doesn't use the flash drive as RAM. It uses it as disk cache. And it does work.

That was my understanding too. I am just scratching the surface of Vista what about stacks? One other thing is how well things are organized and easy to get at. BTW I have had no need to turn Aero off for any reason so far. CPU and mem are not being bothered by it.

One more thing I have a USB flash multi drive. It has no Vista drivers yet Vista found some on its own. The web site for it listed none so the only thing on my system that doesn't work to date is my Cubase dongle that is because I have not installed the software for it. I may or I may not but I am sure it will work. Every thing works and works well. This is something that also is a well kept secrete. It boots faster and runs faster. At this point I don't see myself ever going back to XP.

Sorry one more thing, many things that were addons in XP or third party programs are now built into Vista. Autoruns a Microsoft tweak program is in Vista. The backup is fast and good. The way it displays disks is far better then just a silly icon. The list goes on with small and big things that are improved greatly in Vista or were never in XP.

This is a fully customizable user friendly OS that is way and above XP. I would say its as much of a leap as Windows 3.1 was to DOS.

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John
#61
aleef
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/10 23:18:43 (permalink)
John, im' glad you are enjoying your Vista experience, its good when experienced & knowledgable members have positive feedback regarding Vista.. maybe your perspective will finally spare us of the negetive comments of the reluctant non-user..

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#62
SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/10 23:21:17 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: aleef

John, im' glad you are enjoying your Vista experience, its good when experienced & knowledgable members have positive feedback regarding Vista.. maybe your perspective will finally spare us of the negetive comments of the reluctant non-user..

Amen to that!

 Music:     The Coffee House BandVeRy MeTaL

#63
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/10 23:37:41 (permalink)
John, im' glad you are enjoying your Vista experience, its good when experienced & knowledgable members have positive feedback regarding Vista.. maybe your perspective will finally spare us of the negetive comments of the reluctant non-user..

What a really nice post.Although my intent is not to berate any body I do feel that I have been sold a bill of goods regarding Vista. I was expecting a really awful experience with it. A sort of I have to bite the bullet and see if I can get this thing working. Well it has been the easiest install of an OS I have ever done since DOS. Right now I am updateing it as I wish. I no longer have to go to MS in order to do that. I can choose what gets updated and when. I feel as if the bad publicity that has followed Vista has made me think I shouldn't even think of using it. Here I am with a great OS doing all the things I want with ease. No pain. No trauma. No anything except bliss.

This OS is deep and powerful. It is what us PC users have been waiting for. I am a little angry at the unnecessary time I was without it.

I am not an MS fan but I have nothing against them either.

Things could change down the line when I find something I don't like. At this time I am very happy with it and I see no reason to not embrace it.

I still have an HD with XP on it ready to go if needed. Just in case. But I really don't see a need for it. I do wish I could go full 64 bit but that will come when it is the right time.

Best
John
#64
twisted6s
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/11 05:50:44 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: John

John, im' glad you are enjoying your Vista experience, its good when experienced & knowledgable members have positive feedback regarding Vista.. maybe your perspective will finally spare us of the negetive comments of the reluctant non-user..

What a really nice post.Although my intent is not to berate any body I do feel that I have been sold a bill of goods regarding Vista. I was expecting a really awful experience with it. A sort of I have to bite the bullet and see if I can get this thing working. Well it has been the easiest install of an OS I have ever done since DOS. Right now I am updateing it as I wish. I no longer have to go to MS in order to do that. I can choose what gets updated and when. I feel as if the bad publicity that has followed Vista has made me think I shouldn't even think of using it. Here I am with a great OS doing all the things I want with ease. No pain. No trauma. No anything except bliss.

This OS is deep and powerful. It is what us PC users have been waiting for. I am a little angry at the unnecessary time I was without it.

I am not an MS fan but I have nothing against them either.

Things could change down the line when I find something I don't like. At this time I am very happy with it and I see no reason to not embrace it.

I still have an HD with XP on it ready to go if needed. Just in case. But I really don't see a need for it. I do wish I could go full 64 bit but that will come when it is the right time.

Very Cool

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#65
AJ_0000
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/11 20:27:32 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: John
I do feel that I have been sold a bill of goods regarding Vista...I am a little angry at the unnecessary time I was without it.


I've been using Vista since it was released. When this subject has come up, I've tried to tell people. It is a considerably higher-quality product on all fronts than anything MS has put out before.
#66
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 20:54:30 (permalink)
OK I just did a search for Sonar help. I inputted just that "Sonar help". Guess what came up Sonar help. I am loving Vista.

Best
John
#67
dgrm44
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 21:31:22 (permalink)
John,

You obviously work for Microsoft. No one loves an OS this much. Vista is the Fisher Price of Operating Systems....glad you like it.
#68
SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 21:32:27 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: John

OK I just did a search for Sonar help. I inputted just that "Sonar help". Guess what came up Sonar help. I am loving Vista.

Hasta la Vista eh John

A year since I got it and I couldn't see me going back to XP for any reason now.

 Music:     The Coffee House BandVeRy MeTaL

#69
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 21:42:04 (permalink)
John,

You obviously work for Microsoft. No one loves an OS this much. Vista is the Fisher Price of Operating Systems....glad you like it.


I don't work for MS though I wish I had stock with them. I am at a point where I am just scratching the surface of Vista. So far there is nothing to dislike. But when I look at my other drive sitting off to the side with XP on it I wonder if I will ever plug it in and boot it up. In a way I am reacting to the rumors and bad press Vista got for in my opinion no good reason. When I think about Vista in this context it makes me very angry that such nonsense has been allowed. Its good to see MS fighting back but it is long over due.

Best
John
#70
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 21:44:23 (permalink)
A year since I got it and I couldn't see me going back to XP for any reason now.

Me too. The difference is so much more then going from 98 or 2000 to XP. This is a whole new world. Its deep and at the same time simple.

Best
John
#71
dgrm44
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 21:55:25 (permalink)
I have a few issues with Vist and Microsoft.

1. What did we really get from Vista that couldnt be a minor upgrade to XP?

2. Aren't we just about at the end of the road with an OS...I mean come on...I am much more interested in the applications than the OS...the OS should get out of your way and let you work with your apps. Nothing that I have seen from Vista just makes me say 'I HAVE TO HAVE IT'. But yet, microsoft will eventually force us all to have it.

3. Vista has many editions and complicates the whole situation. Vista Home, Business, Ultimate, Enterprise, blah blah blah....

4. DRM. This is a can of worms for another thread.

It is great that people are having positive experiences with Vista, but there are us that have spent good money to have apps crashing for no apparent reason. Meanwhile XP works perfectly. If I had my way I would stay on XP forever and just upgrade my apps as they continued to improve...I just don't see transparent window forms as a reason to purchase a new OS. Sorry.
#72
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/23 22:24:46 (permalink)
1. What did we really get from Vista that couldnt be a minor upgrade to XP?

Super fast searching for one. Quick booting for another. Fast program launch.
2. Aren't we just about at the end of the road with an OS...I mean come on...I am much more interested in the applications than the OS...the OS should get out of your way and let you work with your apps. Nothing that I have seen from Vista just makes me say 'I HAVE TO HAVE IT'. But yet, microsoft will eventually force us all to have it.

I not sure what you are saying here. An OS is the back bone of computing. Its what lets programs run at all. As for getting out of the way I am not sure how Vista gets in the way. If anything its further from interfering with a program then XP is.
3. Vista has many editions and complicates the whole situation. Vista Home, Business, Ultimate, Enterprise, blah blah blah....

As if that is an issue. I have Vista Ultimate. The reason is I have XP pro so it made sense to go with the same level or perhaps a little more then XP pro offered.
4. DRM. This is a can of worms for another thread.

Not really if you create your own content or have licence to use other content. Any complaints about it are it helps prevent pirates from their thievery. Besides it can be overcome if needed.
It is great that people are having positive experiences with Vista, but there are us that have spent good money to have apps crashing for no apparent reason. Meanwhile XP works perfectly. If I had my way I would stay on XP forever and just upgrade my apps as they continued to improve...I just don't see transparent window forms as a reason to purchase a new OS. Sorry.

Vista is far better and if you haven't used it you really have no idea what you are missing. You forget I am a long time user of XP Pro. I don't come to this from a view of not understanding OSs going back to DOS 1. I am saying that I find Vista to be far and away superior to XP in every area. You can not know this with out having used Vista or seeing some one who knows how to use it. You are basing your view on lies.

To underline the searching in Vista. Try searching for Sonar help just as written in XP over 5 HDs from 500 GBs to 320 GBs with lots of data on all of them. See if you even get an answer or that it doesn't take a week to do so.
post edited by John - 2008/09/23 22:38:07

Best
John
#73
ericyeoman
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 08:38:02 (permalink)
Hi,
fcdsa
post edited by ericyeoman - 2009/01/25 20:20:42
#74
SteveStrummerUK
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 08:55:30 (permalink)

Great tip Eric - thanks for sharing that.

I've had mine permanently turned off but now I'm going to switch it back on and try what you say for my Cakewalk programs.

Steve

 Music:     The Coffee House BandVeRy MeTaL

#75
John T
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 09:10:04 (permalink)
Vista is fine, really. I've used it a bit at work and there's nothing really wrong with it. The only significant issue for musicians has been the lag on getting drivers written for it, so it can be a no-go for people with certain hardware. But that's all getting a lot better as time wears on.

On the other hand, it doesn't really give you any massive improvements over XP. Fast search is nice, but not really a huge deal. John is right when he says it's a better overall experience, though; it is generally more responsive and user-friendly.

My view is that I can't see any hugely compelling reasons to upgrade (my current main music system is running XP pro), but the next time I get a whole new setup, which won't be for a few years, it won't bother me at all if I can only get Vista for it. Suyre, it doesn't add much, but the claims that it's somehow worse than XP appear to be bunk as far as I can see.
#76
Blades
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 10:59:18 (permalink)
I've had some Vista issues that are not really either Cakewalk nor MS's issue, I don't think - though I think the combination of the two along with Echo's drivers don't give me joy. Of course it could be that I abuse the computer for too many things.

At any rate - for everything except Sonar right now, I much prefer Vista to XP. I have it on my tablet and it's been great to work with both from a pen and non-pen perspective. I have some rebuilding to do of my Vista partition at this point to give Sonar another whack with the updates to Vista SP1 and such (and a squeeky clean install).

Regarding the UAC thing: Ya' know, I'm an IT guy for a living, so security in the places I go IS important - user access being only part of that. There was huge pressure on MS to up the security, and the reason it "constantly" lets you know when administrative things are happening is so that you are aware that they are. In a connected environment, especially with multiple people who have time on their hands to browse dangerous web sites and whatnot, it at least tells you when things are happening that you weren't expecting - processes you didn't launch.

So, I have UAC left ON on my systems. I'm still an administrator and I have my credentials cached, so it's just a matter of hitting Alt-C to get past the "are you sure you want to do that" dialog. And, honestly, if you are interacting with your system on an administrative level THAT often that it bothers you, your machine is likely going through more than a normal amount of system changes (after initial setup). I mean, if I want to install a new VST or something, the fact that I have to hit ALT-C ONE TIME is really not a big deal for as many times as it would catch stuff trying to sneak onto my system without my knowledge - any without having to run a bunch of other system-burdoning applications to assist (like symantec or whatever name you want to put here).

Just my thoughts...

Blades
www.blades.technology  - Technology Info and Tutorials for Music and Web
#77
dgrm44
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 11:48:27 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: John
To underline the searching in Vista. Try searching for Sonar help just as written in XP over 5 HDs from 500 GBs to 320 GBs with lots of data on all of them. See if you even get an answer or that it doesn't take a week to do so.


I have tried using Vista and it gave me the BSOD on two games and it went Glitch crazy on Edirol sound card. My point remains that everything you mentioned could be a simple add-on to XP, not an entire new OS.
#78
cmusicmaker
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 13:09:48 (permalink)

ORIGINAL: John

This may be of interest to some Vista tweaks Tweaks

A nice site that may be of use to some.



...and another.
#79
aj
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 16:08:23 (permalink)
I have posted on this elsewhere but to really prove the point I set my new laptop up to dual-boot between Vista and XP. Vista was more efficient running Sonar than XP - as tested on Room For Clarity, probably 5% less CPU overall. Vista can put the laptop to sleep and on resume my UA25 still works, which was definitely NOT the case with XP on the same hardware.

This BTW is Vista 32 bit. So at present I have to say Vista is a good solution and works well for me.
#80
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 16:18:35 (permalink)
I have tried using Vista and it gave me the BSOD on two games and it went Glitch crazy on Edirol sound card. My point remains that everything you mentioned could be a simple add-on to XP, not an entire new OS.


I know of no "add-on" that would allow me to search 5 HDs in seconds. As for your Edirol issue that could be due to any number of things that are not OS related. Games, well I can't say much about that I only have FSX and Cassacks2 as games plus what MS bundled. All run on Vista much better then they did on XP.

Best
John
#81
Geokauf
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 16:41:06 (permalink)
I know of no "add-on" that would allow me to search 5 HDs in seconds.

Hello,

X1 sho-nuf will. Superior to Vista search and works in Vista too.

http://www.x1.com/products/xds.html

GK
post edited by Geokauf - 2008/09/24 16:43:09
#82
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/24 16:49:32 (permalink)
$50 for what is already built in to Vista. Reading about it it offers nothing that I can see that Vista search doesn't offer. Superior to Vista search, I am not convinced.

Best
John
#83
DonaldDuck
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 00:08:31 (permalink)
I just built a new PC, and opted for XP since i KNOW it works with my hardware. I might get vista eventually, but XP works.. my quad core FLIES through it. If XP were a woman, we'd be hitched until she is pulled from my arms!
#84
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 02:37:47 (permalink)
I felt much the same way about XP. After all it did work and I know it well. It didn't help that so much misinformation was spread about Vista either. I to bought into the notion that Vista was not a good replacement for XP. It was only after I had it on my system and running that I was floored by the ease of use and how it got all my hardware working. It wouldn't give up on finding drivers for everything I had. It didn't do it by hijacking the system and tying it up it looked for them in the background. My fears of not being able to run Sonar because my hardware was not going to work were put in the trash very quickly. It made me think just how I had been led to believe the worst about it. That made me angry. I am still a little peed off about it.

There are so many things that are "fixed" in Vista that it really is hard to give a full accounting of it. One thing its much harder to infect it with a virus then XP is.

Best
John
#85
Timur
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 03:59:37 (permalink)
Hey there, John asked me to come around this thread. I'll start with posting the article link from the other thread:

"Summary of relevant advantages in Vista for Pro Audio work": http://www.ableton.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=82202&highlight=vista

Somewhat dated, but mostly still valid. Also read page 2 of that thread. Feel free to ask questions. One question I do have myself is wether Sonar 7/8 makes use of Vista's extended disc I/O features. I'll ask Noel about that, though he might be quite busy at the moment.

We're all mad in here...
#86
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 04:04:39 (permalink)
Somewhat dated, but mostly still valid. Also read page 2 of that thread. Feel free to ask questions. One question I do have myself is wether Sonar 7/8 makes use of Vista's extended disc I/O features. I'll ask Noel about that, though he might be quite busy at the moment.

I am just getting into that. I have seen a huge improvement in disk I/O on the same machine with Vista vs XP. I set it up in device manger to use high performance for the internal disks I have. All of which are SATA 2. It made a noticeable difference.

Oh, excuse my manners. Thanks for coming here and posting.
post edited by John - 2008/09/25 04:06:34

Best
John
#87
Timur
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 04:34:40 (permalink)
You mean that disk I/O improvements happen with both Vista and XP or with Vista over XP? That wasn't clear out of your comment. ;)

Thanks for inviting me over.

PS: Ah, you just edited the "vs" into it.
post edited by Timur - 2008/09/25 04:36:17

We're all mad in here...
#88
mudgel
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 04:38:35 (permalink)
I have 2 identical drives one running Vista Home Premium and the other running XP Pro. jury's not in yet. With Vista I think it depends on when your perspective was gained ie at release or since SP1. This is on a DELL XPS 1710 Core 2 Duo 2.6ghz Laptop with 2 gig RAM and an external eSATA 500GiG HDD

I certainly think things are better since SP1 from what I read not from personal experience as I said I haven't made up my mind yet.

BTW I have all the same programs loaded on both drives but it's not easy trying to quantify the experience of using one then the other of the 2 OS's. Not enough time to do it thoroughly but in the end I don't notice too much difference while I'm in SONAR 7.02 for example.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

STUDIO: Win 10 Pro x64, SPlat & CbB x64,
PC: ASUS Z370-A, INTEL i7 8700k, 32GIG DDR4 2400, OC 4.7Ghz.
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#89
John
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RE: Vista and Sonar 2008/09/25 04:39:14 (permalink)
LOL All I did was add the bottom part thanking you. To be clear Vista is much better with disk I/O then XP is.

BTW I also want thank you for that thread. It is very interesting. I see you were as excited about Vista as I am now. I wish you had told me not to worry! LOL

Best
John
#90
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