Voxengo Mastering Plugins vs. Ozone - buying advice...

This post started with this thread (http://forum.cakewalk.com/HarBal-Anyone-use-it-m3355391.aspx) but it morphed enough into a new topic that I figured it made sense to start a new thread...
 
I'm interested in buying mastering tools.  I'm mostly a hobbyist, although I've starting making a little bit of money here and there for different projects - I want to up my game a little.   Big learning curves are ok with me - I really like spending time learning the ins and outs of products and would prefer something with more control and a steep learning curve rather than a product that has great presets and can get me up and running quickly...
 
As far as money is concerned - I'm not in a position to spend a lot, but the money I'm making from my projects is going right back into gear/plug-ins/soft synths.  But I don't have a lot to throw around... 
 
With that said - I've tried Ozone 7 and Voxengo products.  It appears to me that the Voxengo products are much better...  However, it seems that many many people are recommending Ozone.  From a price standpoint, it appears to me that I could get everything I need in individual plugins for less than Ozone advanced - and Ozone standard doesn't seem to have the same functionality that Voxengo does...  
 
So let's hear it!  What do you use?  Am I off base with my assessment above?  I understand a lot of this is subjective...  
Part of what is enticing about Voxengo is that I can slowly build my collection and take the time to learn each tool, then get a new one.
 

cclarry
Ozone 7...especially Advanced.  Best purchase of 2015 for me...

Please give us more details what make you like it so much. I consider buying it too.

I use Voxengo - Elephant and EQ.  Great stuff that just works.

Based on the fact that you are trying to keep the cost down, here is what I recommend for mastering:
Use Sonar and Voxengo Elephant and (free) Voxengo Span.
 
Sonar has all the necessary vst tools such as: LP EQ, LP Multiband, various compressors, various equalizers.
Here is a simplified example of how to go about using Sonar for mastering:
 
Mix and render your song to a 32 bit file.
Open a new project in Sonar and name it: "Master_My Song", or whatever you want.
Import your rendered 32 bit mix.
Listen to the song and decide what it needs.
In the main subgroup: Add EQ if necessary, add "glue" or multiband compression if necessary, add stereo widening if necessary, add whatever else if necessary, finally add Voxengo Elephant.
Automate volume of song in Sonar if necessary, example: make choruses 2 dB louder than verses.
Bring the input level up in Elephant to hit your target loudness (maybe -13dB RMS average, but that is your call).
 
Notes: Voxengo has a real-time display of RMS level, You can set the input level and watch the RMS level to get it roughly at the volume you want. 
Voxengo span (and your ears) can help you find where EQ may need adjustment, such as low-mid build-up.
Place Span after the EQ but before the compressor and Limiter.
Voxengo can also be set to K-14 if you choose to use that method of setting loudness.
if you can't reach your target loudness without making the mix sound completely squashed then you need to go back to the mix and modify it. 
 
if you are mastering multiple songs you can import them all in the Sonar mastering project and keep them all muted except the one you are working on. The goal with multiple songs is to get them all adjusted, tone-wise and volume-wise, so that they all play well together and that none of the songs stick out like a sore thumb.
 
I hope this helps. Read everything you can find on mastering, Watch all the videos you can find.
 
 PS. I discovered that we have a Blue Tubes brickwall limiter included with Sonar.
I have not tried it but it may be good enough to use as a mastering limiter.
Give it a try.
Now you have a mastering environment that didn't cost you anything extra.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Thanks Mike - That's almost exactly what I'm doing so I think I'm probably on the right track.  I've been using that Blue Tubes limiter.  It's not bad...  But I downloaded the Demo of Elephant and plugged in the two side by side.  Same exact thing you suggested with a separate project for the master, etc.  Literally everything the same except the limiter.  Then I adjust both as I would normally - even made sure the readouts were the exact same in Span.  Then I mixed it down and listened side by side in my car, different headphones, my nice living room stereo, the crappy speakers I have at work, etc...  
 
Voxengo was clearly the winner.
 
 
 
Bass sounds defined and smooth.  Around 300-500hz was abrasive on the Blue Tubes version (could have been a problem with the mix, but for whatever reason Voxengo took care of it...)  Also, looking at the wave forms in Audacity, it looks like I could have bumped the Voxengo version up even higher, whereas the Blue Tubes version would have been noticeably squashed...
 
I've only been at this a couple of years, and the reasons could have been some sort of setting or something - but Voxengo definitely got the job done and addressed some of the sonic issues that I've been struggling with...  
 
I also liked that Voxengo has a transient shaper of sorts...  I was able to dial in some of the things I wanted to do using that when I haven't been able to do it before.
 
That's what I'm leaning so hard towards Voxengo over Ozone...  I can't imagine something performing better.  And I'd have to get the Advanced version of Ozone which is 500.  If I buy all the mastering plugins included in the mastering bundle from Voxengo, I'd only pay 300ish...  (Elephant, Soniformer, Curve EQ, Polysquaher) - Would Ozone do anything these couldn't?

@Mikebeam,
 
I did try out the TB Barricade mastering limiter and it works.
This would be a good low cost way of getting a mastering limiter.
You could order the back issue of Computer Music magazine for 5 dollars then get access to the download for CM TB Barricade.
 
Also, don't forget to try the Blue Tubes brickwall limiter that we already have.

mikedocy
 They are quality plug-ins and you won't out-grow them.

Yeah - I think this might be what I was looking for...  

Vilovilo
Hi,
My small contribution to this thread,
Ozone is a great tool because you have the whole chain in one plug-in even if you don't have the hand on what happens.( for example you have some algorithms with the limiter but then all you can do is moove a fader) .
If you go towards Elephant you will have very versatile limiter but you will need a compressor then an eq and an exciter and meters so in terms of cash it can pull you out of bounds.
But from where I am,I am satisfied with Elephant and Soniformer,I did not like Vox's eq so I got another one( very expensive but satisfying DMG Equilibrium to name it) . It gives me a good plug-in chain but the bill is heavier than Ozone7. Also I don't have the over acclaimed multiband (though I'm doubtfull about this kind of tool when it comes to vst. Too long to explain why...) . And if I want an exciter I will have to pay again....( I sometimes use Voxengo's Warmifier but I'm barely convinced ).
Just to feed your thoughts.
Olivier.

Actually:
 
Elephant + Soniformer ($180)  + DMG Equilimbrium ($250) = $430
Ozone 7 Advanced = $500
 
Your bill is cheaper than Ozone!  I'm interested (right now) in FabFilter's EQ ProQ-2 (180) 
 
Which would give me a plug in chain of ProQ-2, Soniformer, and Elephant for $360...  I could add Polysquasher to the mix and still be paying less.  However - and I get the added benefit of slowly building my chain.  Pick up Elephant and Soniformer now, then add ProQ and whatever later...  
 
 
 

olemon
And this just in from IK Multimedia, Lurssen Mastering Console.  Free for an iPad, $199 for PC or Mac....
 
http://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/lurssen/

There is an entire thread on this Oleman...
http://forum.cakewalk.com...d-Mac-PC-m3355509.aspx

yep... wait till NAMM reports come in...

At least our farts are musical 

wst3
mastering is NOT about the gear, although there is gear (hardware and software both) that is optimized for mastering. Mastering is a process, and more to the point, it's about the  ears of the mastering engineer. The number one reason to send your tracks to a mastering engineer is their ears, and a close second is that they represent a second set of ears - ears that have no baggage with respect to the tracks.

Hey Bill, how's it going?
You are 100% correct about the concept of mastering.
 
The OP did say that he wanted to learn how to master. He said that he thought he was doing good with his mixes and wanted to take his skills to the next level by learning how to master his recordings. In this case I think it would be  counter-intuitive for him to send his mixes to a professional mastering engineer unless he could sit in on the session and learn something.
Don't you think that it is great that someone wants to take on a new learning experience?
That said, the OP's original question was about acquiring equipment for mastering since he has none except that which came with Sonar.
What equipment do you think he needs in addition to the vst that came with Sonar? 
 
73
Mike
N8MIB
 

Yeah - I agree with everyone.  Most of my music is not going to be released commercially...  Some of it might be used with some independent films, and if the production company wants to budget in enough for mastering - great!  Typically I'm getting a few hundred bucks to put something together.  I also sell some rough CDs at my shows in exchange for tips...  I'm looking to get things as close to a 'real' master as possible.
 
Ideally - I would like to spend more money on treating my room and quality monitors, however there are other constraints to that.  Some day!  Building a quality studio is a process too.  Getting good plug ins is a part of that process.  I've gotten pretty far with the Sonar plugins - been using them for a couple of years.  Learned a lot - it was time to pull the trigger on something better.
 
I spend a few hours last night comparing Ozone vs Voxengo vs Waves...  Voxengo is the winner for me.
 
I just bought Elephant and Polysquasher.  $175 - I think it will suit my needs right now and that's the exact amount I was paid for a gig last weekend so BAM!  It works...  
 
I'll add a quality EQ soon - but it looks like the Sonar LP-EQ is getting an upgrade!  Might wait for that...  But that FabFilter ProQ-2 seems pretty snazzy!  

Fleer
Oh god, keep me away from FabFilter. That stuff looks and sounds almost too good.

I took a long look at Voxengo's Curve EQ - doesn't look as pretty, but it seems solid.  It has the same EQ match feature and I gave it a go against a commercial recording...  I had to adjust loudness and such before-hand.  It definitely improved my track.  Of course - it needed a lot of tweaking because my track had slightly different instrumentation and everything - but it was a great jumping off point.  For learning about EQ - it's a really cool feature.  
 
Futher - I actually made a curve in LP-EQ that matched the one from CurveEQ and the Curve EQ sounded much better.  Even after I went into LP-EQ to make adjustments...  Very smooth...  My original original post highlighted that there was an abrasiveness to my tracks that I just couldn't pinpoint.  The PolySquasher and Elephant have taken care of most of that and the CurveEQ seems like it will knock out the rest...
 
Voxengo's Curve EQ is about 1/2 the price of FabFilters...  Just sayin'