mike_mccue

Crg

yorolpal


Mike...and I swear I'm not being perjorative or snarky here... because I've just been thinking you've been being hyperbolic on occasion for emphasis...but if working with X1 has truthfully made you unable to eat, I don't think that's a problem that Cakewalk...or your pals here on the forum can address.  In several of your posts you've alluded to "being sick" or (I'm paraphrasing here) "wanting to vomit".  I thought you were kidding.  Geeze, ol pal don't let it get that bad.  I don't think any DAW (or software...heck most anything) is worth degrading your health or well being.  If you ARE just being hyperbolic, please forgive me and go right ahead...I do the same thing all the time.  But if you're actually in distress, maybe X1 is really not for you.  Now, do me a favor, go have a sandwich will ya?

I'm beginning to think he might be yanking our chains.

I posted a video last night... I do take my my art making tools seriously... I feel like someone just wrote me letter and said my favorite music tool will self destruct in 5 years or something similar to that sentiment... I wanted to make some music yesterday... it didn't happen.

Look for the video and you can see how much fun I had trying to turn 4 bars of midi into a groove clip.

you all are great folks... Thanks for the concern.

best regards,
mike

You know I'm with you Mike...

I've been facing this daily too! The other day I simply needed to record and edit 8 bars of a guitar part.... the part was easy... I replayed it a number of times to get my "best" performance.... But for some reason, that took 6 hours of struggling with the program...

Keni

yorolpal


Well I was actually concerned for ol Mike.  I make my living with Sonar as well (and have for over 20 years) and I've had many an issue with it and all the other software and equipment we use.  And I've had moments (and days) where everything went south during a critical session with clients sitting right there that have caused me to have...er...indigestion.  But I've also reached a stage of life where I'm bound and determined not to let these kinds of things distress me so.  Life goes on.  My clients understand that not everything works correctly 100% of the time...it doesn't for them either.  I may lose a little money...but I won't lose my sense of humor.  And if X1 gives me fits in my music production studio I can just get the hell up from my DAW, scratch my ol Boxer on the head and go pour myself a nice glass of wine.  Ain't no Sonar gonna wreck my life, baby;-)

I truly am very pleased and happy that you're managing to continue your work as things stand... I wish I could adapt some of your attitude into my life, but as my life is so different, things don't work the same...

I guess if I was a Buddhist Monk I could let all these things pass as my only need in life is contemplation... But I'm not... I'm a 21st century American with dreams and goals sadly more materialistic than a monk... I like my house warm, a comfortable bed, electricity on demand etc.... So these things drain my attitude long before and after I work on my only pleasure.... Music. so when something interferes there, I'm already at my last straw...

Freddie H


If you all used mordern screens in HD format you wouldn't perhaps said that is huge..
So WE that use latest technology LED screens should suffer from those that still use CRT? 
try two 24# or up, it wasn't so big after all....
 
Think about it...

I have.... Many times and all I come up with is the sad needs/truth...

Not everyone can afford to change monitors... and some don't have space... and some are laptops... and many are not widescreen... So not working with these people as well would elliminate a large percentage of users/buyers...

It's really a simple task to cater to both.... Here for example... they already have all the shortcuts created... So why the couldn't allow a choice of Control bar or Toolbar? that would have made most of the current arguments silent! Maybe they will give us that "simple" fix? Time will tell...

If either in the meantime or later you'd like to buy me a widescreen, I'd be happy to move into your camp and tell everyone that doesn't have one to simply buy one and not be bothered by these issues.... Is this realistic?

Yeah, the future will always force us to have new things to use new things... but where there's no need to be forced, there's no reason!

This is the maximum number of minimized tracks you can display in X1 at 1920x1200 resolution
 
 

Rain

Personally, if I were running a huge monitor and a cutting edge graphic card, I wouldn't expect to take such a step back in the quantity of information I can display onscreen.

Exactly. I have two 1920x1080 24" screens. Not because I want everything on the screen to be big but because I want as much information available at the same time as possible.

UnderTow

I agree Keni.  I am having the same issues and concerns.  A person could make a lot of money by starting a lottery to bet on when , how and for what reason it will crash next.  This release is not fair to all the loyal usersvwho are still remaining loyal but very frustrated. the a patch was a bone where is the rest of the cow? What are the bakers saying ? I don't want to blame or fight with anyone.    I  just want a stable pro DAW. Not a pretty  unreliable DAW  that one could find on a freeware site. The work flow is almost as the stability problems. This Emperor Has New Clothes," approach adopted by some members  and cakewalk along with some of the flaming directed at loyal members expressing real concerns and telling it like it is, is not good for any one.  CAKE WALK admit the screw up and fix it. We don't have time to argue about this mess while the competition laughs and passes us by.

Is that a 21 inch Jim?

 
I'm running a 28" monitor at 1920x1200

Did I read correctly?

Are there really people in this thread suggesting that they can see more on 1080p screens than I can see on my 1200p screens? And that I complaining because my screen isn't big enough?

That's not even worth explaining.....

anniedog


I agree Keni.  I am having the same issues and concerns.  A person could make a lot of money by starting a lottery to bet on when , how and for what reason it will crash next.  This release is not fair to all the loyal usersvwho are still remaining loyal but very frustrated. the a patch was a bone where is the rest of the cow? What are the bakers saying ? I don't want to blame or fight with anyone.    I  just want a stable pro DAW. Not a pretty  unreliable DAW  that one could find on a freeware site. The work flow is almost as the stability problems. This Emperor Has New Clothes," approach adopted by some members  and cakewalk along with some of the flaming directed at loyal members expressing real concerns and telling it like it is, is not good for any one.  CAKE WALK admit the screw up and fix it. We don't have time to argue about this mess while the competition laughs and passes us by.

I agree with you too... (mostly)... I don't need them to make any statements, simply fix/change what needs doing and let it go... That's all I believe is necessary. I don't for a second believe they did this to make things worse for us, but I do think there may be some thinking they didn't come across in their testing...

Tho pretty is nice... it's not my primary issue... There's a time and place for appearances to be important and it's just not a priority (for me) in this place... (tho all this off-white-on-gray and silver colors are killing my eyes... Very "silverlight"! ???)

X1a did nothing for me here that I'm aware of...  The issues I need resolution on are more the snap-2grid and the locate/select methods... and I'm hoping that they'll simply import these things from 8.5 (tho the snap2grid graphic will obviously persist... I'm ok with that as long as it has two seperate settings and that the remember bug is fixed there! ;-)... We'll see... they may also ignore these items thinking I'm only one voice.... thanfully a number of others have chimed in about some of these issues so I still have hope...

and extra tools such as benstats X1 Helper are covering other issues with more promise...

So I still have hopes of working with X1 (and enjoying it) in the coming days... But it's hard to wait for so many reaosns... and in my nasty little slife of life it may be too little too late if not soon... <sigh>...

Keni

...there are several/different monitors out there...

...thus the optimum would be to get the chance to adapt SONAR to (almost) any possible situation/solution...

It's that SIMPLE......

As it was ONCE possible, it should be achievable NOW....

Again, I think it's JUST that SIMPLE.............  

If you can live with things like slight bruises on the screen or making your own stand, you can probably half that, too.

I don't see any meters Jim. I'm not working without my meters. The number of tracks I can use that way in X1 is greatly reduced when compared to previous SONAR versions.

 
My Mike,
 
The meters are vertical in that screen-shot.
More like peak/activity indicators at that height  
If you want to see full horizontal meters on all tracks, you can get 17 on a 1920x1200 display.
 
When I'm finished with a particular track/s, I'll usually minimize it (to leave more workspace for other tracks.  I've yet to feel particularly constrained... 
 
Using a competing application...
I can display 41 minimized tracks at 1920x1200 resolution... with horizontal meters.
This app isn't using a multi-dock... and the scribble-strips and meters are short.

Jim Roseberry

1920x1200 with a 2ms or 3ms response... But I can't afford a hot dog....

 
Hi Keni,
 
If you catch a sale, you can get a decent 28" 1920x1200 monitor for ~$250.

Thanks Jim...

I have found a few in that range... tho often the response rate is too slow (5-6ms is too slow... 2-3ms is acceptable)...

But the truth is, I sit on the brink of not only foreclosure, but nowhere to go, so I can't even imagine spending any money right now tho I continue to dream and hope that somehow I can save myself from becoming homeless...

In 2010, I spent $120 (rounded off - and $60 was credit from a situation the year before) to buy X1 (boxed)...

Other than a bunch of blank disc/paper/ink/jewel boxes, I bought nothing else outside of minimal food and "bills".... My most modern machine (only a core 2 duo) was a gift to me a number of years back from a very dear friend who felt badly for me because I was in a similar predicament when Sonar 7 couldn't run on my old P4 win2k machine (I'm on that now as it's my web/graphic machine - This monitor is a 19" at 1600x1200 and I was very comfortable running Sonar on it... Small items, but I could get a lot on screen and manage the tiny...

So my dream of somthing as simple as a new monitor simply isn't in the cards... and as I'll possibly be hauling this machine around as most do a laptop, I'm stuck with it for the time being... shy of our (currently announced) coming out of our recession (did they miss the depression that followed? I don't think we've finished that yet)...

So without any more whining from me (sorry if I sound that way - Fear dominates all)... I truly hope you make much wonderful music on your system... Maybe even write a song about the plight of the fallen? ;-)

Best Always...
Keni

I will bounce myself back to Presonus studio one next version they release, i should never have left for false Promise in X1, They have managed to get a clean clutter free Gui and it works, and I know It will always be this way no matter what they add, as their Programmers are Boss and they listen to their users and implement things that work 99.9% as suppose to a hit and miss 50/50.
I  only left becuase of a few lacking things at pesent, but from day one it was clear they have the winning formula and once you have used what the Programme does have, you will laugh at Sonar and find all this mental, i made the biggest mistake by going Trusting cakewalk, should of trusted what my inner mind kept telling me, oh well! i give cakewalk sonar one Thumbs up, they do do the talk when it comes to their hyped adds.

Personally i think this will other DAW's  be as clutterd all comes down to The developers etc, Reason is Fine ableton is fine if not a little ugly but it works,  Reaper has promise, But have to be careful as they may just be on the verge of a buggy daw like sonar, but at lesat they have Developers that care!

It really is hard to be Contructive about sonar I siad it once before, if Cakewalk sonar developers Got some logic like Spock, and Beta tested more , This is where Reaper holds it own, they make beta testing open, Again great logic!
I think i had beter leave it with that, before i get in trouble, wish their would be a miracle cure for x1, But we all know that aint going to happen, i think X1 should be recalled and refunded, Becuase i dont want to wait months and months to no resolve, quite frankley i got ripped off,

Yours Sincearally a thorn in the side, suppose i aint even worth the price of tweezers to cakewalk,Better spent on their nice lifestyles, if only they cared that many of us are in pain now, more so than ever, i want  a refund for a Fualty Product!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. their aint no Reasoning anymore.

Rain


Did a bit of testing just for the sake of it. 

Running Logic on a MacBook Pro 13", w/ screen resolution of 1280 x 800.

I stopped at 50 tracks displayed because there was no point in getting any further - but I could have jammed a couple more in there. That's with the transport bar displayed an nothing hidden except the tools icons at the top (I prefer text only anyway).

To be perfectly honest, in a real-life situation, this might be a bit uncomfortable. I mean, I could navigate, click buttons and select tracks, but 40 tracks at once would probably be the limit of the real comfort zone.

But the point is that, things are scaled and optimized to take advantage of the screen. Hopefully, Cakewalk will be doing something similar in the future w/ X1.

Thanks for that...

This is an issue for me as well... I understand the idea (and feeling) for an uncluttered look, but that's not at the cost of "practical usability"... In 8.5 All things are much more scaled to the needs of monitors (remember all the 96 and 102 input consoles? Try keeping an eye on that many tracks in the analog world! ;-))

The goal of X1 is admirable, but the implementation is in need of more thought and work...  Some meeting of the two mindsets that allows for a user to stretch in either direction based on personal need(s)...

We've been talking here about how many tracks can be visible... when at least as important is how many tools and settings can be seen at one time! I don't know about you or the other users, but gazing at settings (spread across many tracks) while working is a big part of my work as I identify issues...

I see less of this info on screen now even with a single track maximized let (alone 40 tracks on screen) than ever before... Unless I start breaking the screen up into little pieces to reveal each of these new "popups" (let's face it - a divided screen is sharing space no matter what you call the method of displaying both)...

So along with needing/desiring toolbars as an alternate or additional part of Sonar, I would like to see the wasted space within these areas considered as well!

Too many issues of tools not even duplicated across views where we must go from view to view to see these things... Such as buttons in TV that aren't in Inspector/CV etc....)

If there were complaints that Sonar seemed cobbled together as it had been modified for so long and how the new gui was giving a fresh start...? things are now far more disorganized, and fragmented forcing far more time/work waste to accomplish the equivalent jobs previously... Here has been the focus of everything I've complained about (other than bugs)... Work is much slower in far too many ways... Fragmented, changing/changing/changing.... the whole idea of the single-window interface that so long ago became the direction of ALL DAW softwares demands much more attention to these issues...

Keni