Why are mix controls on cloned instrument tracks linked?

The more I look around, the more I'm convinced this is a bug. The X2 documentation on cloning tracks doesn't mention anything about linking the mix controls. 

I have only cloned audio tracks, and this certainly doesn't happen with them. Is it just simple instrument tracks?

I'm not at my DAW, but will have a look later. Out of interest, can you change sounds on the two synths independently? Is I t only the mix controls?

Interesting one this because I have been suffering the same problem but I just put it down to my own stupidity and assumed I just wasn't doing something correctly.
 
But on reading JB101's post I have tried this today and cloning works fine on audio tracks without linking all the controls such as pan,volume etc. 
 
However when I clone an instrument track all of these controls are linked making it a royal pain in the arse and pointless in cloning the track as I cant treat it independently of the original.
Is this how it should be or am I missing something?

There are options when you clone tracks, but I can't remember them all, and I'm not at my DAW.

When you choose "clone track" a dialogue box gives you several options, but off the top of my head I can't think of one that would only effect S.I.T. I will look later if I have a chance.

Just had a quick look in manual. When cloning a S.I.T. a new MIDI track is created, and assigned to the same soft synth. So there you go.

It's not a bug, it is intended behaviour, which is why it's in the manual.

While there doesn't seem to be a Control Group option in the Clone dialog what is being described is actually Selection Group behavior I won't paste the entire manual entry (it's long) but it is on page 914 of the PDF manual. Check to see if somehow the track parameters got added to a Control Group.

jb101
My quote is from page 120 - cloning tracks.

Just read it. That is ridiculous. I guess they could simply call any bug "intended behavior" by putting it in the manual 
 
Let's take a look at their statement "When cloning an Instrument track, a new MIDI track is created and assigned to the same soft synth as the cloned instrument track." I just tried this, both in the project I'm working on and in a new blank project. In the project I'm working on, cloning an instrument track just creates another instrument track. In the blank project, cloning an instrument track creates another instrument track, plus an extra track that has the track icon Sonar gives to the audio part of the track when you split an instrument track. So I don't know what's going on there - cloning the instrument track gives different results in the new project than the project I'm working on. Also, in this new project, if I split one of the instrument tracks and then select "create instrument tracks" to rejoin them, I get the "Making an instrument track requires that a single audio and MIDI track are assigned to the same synth." So if you split them, you can't rejoin them. 
 
Anyway, if it's just the case that cloning an instrument track "creates a new MIDI track" then why wrap that new MIDI track up in a "new" instrument track that really has its audio part linked to the parent track? What is the point of having a second set of mix controls that are linked? If the user only wanted to clone the MIDI part of the track, then surely they could simply split the instrument track, clone the MIDI part and then rejoin the original instrument track. The whole point of an instrument track is that you get a single unit which handles both audio and MIDI. So the expected behavior when you clone one of them is that you get a brand new instrument track that is identical to, but which performs independently from the parent track.
 
So I guess Cakewalk's logic is that if someone wants to clone an instrument track, all they really want to do is to create a new MIDI track with the same clips in it, and have it output to the same synth instance. I'm guessing that this is not what they want at all, and if that's what they wanted then they wouldn't even bother with instrument tracks in the first place.  

Ah... yeah I don't use simple instrument tracks either so IDK. I figured wee were just talking about clones in general. Seems odd SITs would behave differently. Sorry if I added confusion.

I only tend to use S.I.T. when I am sketching an idea out, and replace them with synth and MIDI tracks when I get going. I guess that's why I've not noticed this.

Mostly I clone audio tracks, e.g. to process a bass part as separately as D.I. and through an amp sim.

jb101
I only tend to use S.I.T. when I am sketching an idea out, and replace them with synth and MIDI tracks when I get going. I guess that's why I've not noticed this.

Mostly I clone audio tracks, e.g. to process a bass part as separately as D.I. and through an amp sim.

Have you ever tried putting the amp sim on a bus and mixing it into the D.I. track via a send? It means one less track to worry about in your track pane...

sharke
 
Have you ever tried putting the amp sim on a bus and mixing it into the D.I. track via a send? It means one less track to worry about in your track pane...

Yeah but that just adds another track to the bus pane instead. At least the track pane has folders which allow one to group the tracks into a folder and collapse it. I have used both clones and sends sometime both at the same time, it may depend on sunspot activity as much as anything else as to what method gets used.

Back in the day:

Simple instrument tracks were a feature added due to users requests about a simple way to add a ss, then route it to a midi track, then route it to an added audio track.

It was meant to be different.

It's not a bug.I don't believe it is anyway.

So have we figured out how to unlink the parameters though? I mean it doesn't really make any sense to have cloned SITs follow every change. All that would do is just make things louder and even if you did it just to have the same synth setup for a different performance within the project not being able to mix that new performance independently... well, that's just weird.
 
IDK... maybe I'm missing something. I usually am.

Beepster - "So have we figured out how to unlink the parameters though? I mean it doesn't really make any sense to have cloned SITs follow every change. All that would do is just make things louder and even if you did it just to have the same synth setup for a different performance within the project not being able to mix that new performance independently... well, that's just weird.

IDK... maybe I'm missing something. I usually am."

If you clone a S.I.T. It only creates a new MIDI track linked to ONE soft synth. There are no linked controls, as there is only one soft synth, that both the original track and the cloned track use.

You cannot unlink the two "Audio tracks", as there is only one. Two MIDI tracks, if you will, both routed to ONE synth.