guitar feedback

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7-string_guy
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2009/05/10 19:03:24 (permalink)

guitar feedback

I know that standing a certain distance away for an amp you can make it feedback, with higher gain settings it makes it happen faster, but how do you make a certain pitch.. ex...in a tool song, at the beginning of sober, he makes feedback in D. i have been trying to reproduce that for on stage in the band but always get a different key/pitch. Id like to know the dirty little secret to this. it just sounds so cool.

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    Marah
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/10 23:23:25 (permalink)
    I don't know the Tool song, but maybe they tune the feedback to the key after it's recorded?

    Wouldn't the feedback from a single played note be in pitch, or at least in tune with an harmonic?

    I would love to find a good set of fb samples, tuned and not, and set them up in a sample player like Drop Zone.
    post edited by Marah - 2009/05/10 23:33:19
    #2
    Ron Vogel
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/10 23:31:12 (permalink)
    I use feedback a lot. All you need to do is practice it. Everyone will think you're nuts sitting in front of an amp for hours on end doing it, but it is the only way. The angle of the guitar, harmonics, sitting the headstock on the amp at the right time....all different ideas.

    Not my best, but a decent amount of feedback stuff in it:
    http://www.soundclick.com/util/getplayer.m3u?id=6997418&q=hi
    The bridge/solo is all feedback, then I mixed in kids screaming at the top of their lungs

    I'm stuck in the past, but my foot's tapping forward 
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    #3
    Rbh
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/10 23:33:55 (permalink)
    The best way to induce a controlled Feedback is to choose a resonant frequency. I don't know the tool song either but I know the technique. If you have a high enough gain you simply need to dampen any tone that isn't a " D " and that will be only resonant frequency available to feedback.

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    #4
    ew
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/10 23:49:22 (permalink)
    Ah... the art of feedback :)

    1) Location. There's always two or three places on stage where you get excellent feedback. Take some time during soundcheck (if you have one) and find them. Mark them off with tape.
    2) Position. How far you're turned back towards the amp will determine the pitch to some degree.
    3) Pickup and tone control. I'm a Strat player; my pickup selection makes a big difference in what pitch I get. My neck pickup's great for those wolf tones, while the bridge is great for screeching bird noises. I use EMGs in all my Strats, with EMG's SPC as one of my tone controls (it's a midrange boost). A wah helps a lot in emphasizing what frequencies are feeding back.
    4) Muting. Mute those strings you don't want to feed back. If what you want to hear is a harmonic of what's feeding back, touch that string lightly with the edge of your fingernail at the appropriate harmonic node. Tapping the fingerboard right next to the string is sometimes all you need to excite it in a different way.
    5) Your amp. Have enough mids in your amp settings; your scooped mid sound doesn't work that well for feedback.

    ew
    #5
    RTGraham
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 01:24:59 (permalink)
    Guitar feedback will generally be a harmonic of one of the available sounding notes from one of the strings - if the strings are open, then it will be a harmonic of one of those; but you can "force" the guitar and amp to "choose" a note from a chord that you play if you finger the chord on the fingerboard while inducing feedback.

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    #6
    jerjabs
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 04:41:33 (permalink)
    Honestly, he's just fretting a D note somewhere on his guitar and standing at the right angle / distance for the feedback to roll in. If you look closely, headlining Metal acts with have an "X" marked on the stage floor (usually with duct tape) to show them where to stand and achieve the desired feedback they tested out during sound check.

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    #7
    sonRate
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 04:59:52 (permalink)
    I was thinking if you took a set of pickups and a tone control switch, (off an old guitar still mounted on the cover piece), and positioned it in front of an amp with the output jack plugged into a volume pedal and fed back into the amp - and of course your regular guitar plugged into another channel, you could use the volume pedal to create a seperate feedback gain loop controlled by the volume pedal.
    #8
    jerjabs
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 05:17:34 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: sonRate

    I was thinking if you took a set of pickups and a tone control switch, (off an old guitar still mounted on the cover piece), and positioned it in front of an amp with the output jack plugged into a volume pedal and fed back into the amp - and of course your regular guitar plugged into another channel, you could use the volume pedal to create a seperate feedback gain loop controlled by the volume pedal.


    I guess so, but why? That's alot of trouble for a very simple thing to get going. A decent amp with some gain and a guitar will do it. If your band jams in a small space and you amp is cranked to high heaven where feedback is out of control you may have issues getting the feedback you want...other than that, it's like walking your dog. Just do it.
    post edited by jerjabs - 2009/05/11 05:26:15
    #9
    sonRate
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 11:37:54 (permalink)
    I guess so, but why?/


    Well - I was thinking you could then keep your regular guitar channel at a low volume, and set the volume/gain on the amp to a high level on the feedback loop channel. That way you could create feedback in your room without cranking everything to 11. Then take your amp line output to your DAW and get the feedback recorded. You think that might be possible?
    #10
    kmillah
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 12:58:07 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: sonRate

    I was thinking if you took a set of pickups and a tone control switch, (off an old guitar still mounted on the cover piece), and positioned it in front of an amp with the output jack plugged into a volume pedal and fed back into the amp - and of course your regular guitar plugged into another channel, you could use the volume pedal to create a seperate feedback gain loop controlled by the volume pedal.


    I'm no expert, but I don't see how that would work at all! Some pickups will squeal and woof at volume, but we're talking harmonic feedback here, right?

    Here's how I see it - the sound from the amp causes the string to resonate at it's resonant frequency causing a constant feedback. High gain, high volume and compression make this easier, but the pickup needs a magnetic object above it to produce an electrical current. It is not a microphone and this is why a standard pickup does nothing on a nylon string guitar! The pickup near the amp won't pickup any magnetic fields, so unless it's slightly microphonic (which you don't want!) I don't see what it will do.

    It's about the right settings, position and technique. Or get on of those Fernandez Sustainer pickups. Hit the note and it'll still be there tomorrow.
    , but I don't think I'd be able to control that kinda thing!!!
    post edited by kmillah - 2009/05/11 13:03:34
    #11
    FastBikerBoy
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 16:30:57 (permalink)
    I was thinking if you took a set of pickups and a tone control switch, (off an old guitar still mounted on the cover piece), and positioned it in front of an amp with the output jack plugged into a volume pedal and fed back into the amp - and of course your regular guitar plugged into another channel, you could use the volume pedal to create a seperate feedback gain loop controlled by the volume pedal.


    Or if you don't want to use the traditional methods outlined above get a pedal with a feedbacker. I use my GT-6's feedbacker for neighbour friendly volume levels in my studio, in a mix it's okay but you can't beat a loud amp.
    #12
    marcos69
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 17:05:44 (permalink)
    You can also use an e-bow to generate some feedback and harmonics thereof.

    Mark Wessels

    At CD Baby

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    #13
    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 17:14:55 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: sonRate

    I guess so, but why?/


    Well - I was thinking you could then keep your regular guitar channel at a low volume, and set the volume/gain on the amp to a high level on the feedback loop channel. That way you could create feedback in your room without cranking everything to 11. Then take your amp line output to your DAW and get the feedback recorded. You think that might be possible?




    Your missing the part about the fact that feedback is a perpetual loop whereby the speaker to STRING looping connection is made through sympathetic resonance. No strings = very little feedback.

    The real question is; why make feedback if you are not going to bask in it's glory?

    Play it loud and proud. IMO, feedback is best experienced as an act of discovery. Enjoy!


    #14
    Guitarhacker
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 19:30:29 (permalink)
    The Art of Feedback..... practice with distance...generally the closer the better, and gain on the preamp stages, as well as sufficient volume on the outputs.... leaky preamp tubes may help, and of course, the guitar itself plays a major part.... as well as fingering technique.

    Also the amplifier, I have found, plays a big part. Some amps.... like Boogie, just have a fat sound that lends itself well to the vibrations needed to achieve feedback..... with my Boogie, I can get feedback at very low volume levels.... sweet!

    Practice.

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    #15
    skullsession
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 21:00:13 (permalink)
    Right...absolutely nothing feeds back better than a good tube amp - at any volume.

    The amp that I'm currently in love with is my Mesa Mark IV....every guitar I have feeds back differently, but my Les Paul through the Mark IV? Hell...that's just better than ice cream.

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    #16
    skullsession
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 21:02:08 (permalink)
    On a related note...have you ever noticed that guitarists can feedback all day long....but the minute you put a mic in front of their cab, they'll spend all day TRYING to make it happen - but have no luck?

    COMPLETELY frustrating.

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    Guitarhacker
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 21:24:27 (permalink)
    With a tube amp.......there will be some internal coupling of the signal from the output plates back to the input grids..("leaky preamp tubes")........especially at the higher gain levels..... and that will allow the feedback I was speaking about earlier....at the lower volume levels.

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    #18
    sonRate
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 21:54:57 (permalink)
    most all the above


    Got it - you need the string across the pickup. Oh well.
    #19
    The Maillard Reaction
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/11 22:03:58 (permalink)
    Does anyone make a small solid state single ended amp?



    #20
    Bristol_Jonesey
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/12 07:09:45 (permalink)

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    mcourter
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/12 14:19:13 (permalink)
    What we really need is a feedback plugin! Who's going to be the bright guy to come up with that?

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    kmillah
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/12 16:47:40 (permalink)
    Softube acoustic feedback vst I do believe!!!!
    #23
    mcourter
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/13 10:11:50 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: kmillah

    Softube acoustic feedback vst I do believe!!!!

    Hey that looks great! Let me rephrase: what we really need is a CHEAP (or free) feedback plugin!

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    #24
    kmillah
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/13 17:50:49 (permalink)
    Not sure when or how, but I definitely tried it (demo?) and didn't like it!!
    #25
    toddsam14
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/14 11:23:53 (permalink)
    Different Guitar tunings will help you achieve those song(s) you are copying. Tuning down a whole step etc..
    That will change your feedback pitch in those sweet spots.
    #26
    Bristol_Jonesey
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/14 15:09:37 (permalink)
    When you consider exactly what feedback is - interaction between strings/pickup & amp, I don't really see how you can possibly model this for a vst or any other sort of plugin.

    Maybe I'm just being stupid.

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    skullsession
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/14 20:37:15 (permalink)
    They DO make a killer plugin for feed back.

    It's called a 1/4 inch instrument cable.

    Plug it in. Turn it up.

    Be a rock God.


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    #28
    AdamFH
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/16 17:35:46 (permalink)
    I actually like Softtube, but it doesn't really give perfect feedback. And timing is also a b**** with it. At least for me. I guess it's because I don't really put a lot of drive into my pedal though to create enough feedback to kick into the VST

    ORIGINAL: skullsession

    They DO make a killer plugin for feed back.

    It's called a 1/4 inch instrument cable.

    Plug it in. Turn it up.

    Be a rock God.




    Lets rephrase the above:

    1. Distortion
    2. 1/4 inch instrument cable
    3. Plug it in.
    4. Turn it up.
    5. ??????
    6. PROFIT!!!
    #29
    Guitarhacker
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    RE: guitar feedback 2009/05/16 22:00:46 (permalink)
    High gain tube preamp stages and tube outputs.....cranked...... face the amp..... experiment.

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    #30
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