i7-6850k vs. i7-7700k vs. Ryzen 1800x

Bill Gabbert
FireBerd
I have an (older) intel my self.
It’s Jim who says he is on the Intel Train. (See Jims link above)
Yes, I wish I had the resources to build 3 machines to test myself…So I like most rely on comprehensive test like the Benchmark scores collected from hundreds of persons  confirming the performance/Value of the Ryzen series processors. See>www   cpubenchmark.net/high_end_cpus.html
 
{I do not doubt Jims results- If anyone (Using "Reaper") feels the need to have a couple hundred tracks of nothing, with only 1 VST on each and NO MIDI...Intel is the way to go.}

This is humerous...  
 
I've been building DAWs professionally for over 20 years.
We have no agenda... except to build the best possible DAWs for our clients.
We've used Athlon CPUs in the past (when they were out-performing Intel).
Had Ryzen 1800x performed superior to the latest Intel 7700k, 6850k, etc... we would have happily used them.
Had the 1800x lived up the the hype of performing nearly identical to the 6900k (at half the cost), it would have been great for our clients (and for business).  
For working with low-latency audio, based on audio specific stress-tests, this is not the case.
 
We use Intel CPUs... because (right now) they're the top performers.
If the 1800x lived up to the hype (for low-latency audio), why would we pump Intel at the cost of losing business? The short answer is... we wouldn't.
 
Even if the 1800x performed identical to the 6850k (both $500 CPUs), that's not enough of a reason to go AMD.
You forgo Intel USB, Thunderbolt-3 with full "PCIe via Thunderbolt support, etc.
 
If the 1700x or 1800x is enough CPU for you... more power to you.
We're building professionally.  Clients want the best possible machine.
I'm on the "Intel Train" because it's the best performance choice for myself and our clients.
If you were paying someone to build your next DAW... and going with a $500 CPU, would you want the top-performer, or would you be OK with a CPU that's "good enough"?
 
The proof is in low-latency audio specific stress-tests.
If/when AMD is outperforming Intel (running heavy loads at a 32/48/64-sample ASIO buffer size), that's when we'll use AMD.  
 
 
 

Jim Roseberry

loopyd

BobF
<sigh>
 
I just bought an i7-6700 and I already feel inadequate 

Don't.  Kabylake sucks.  Skylake has better support.  Just don't make the mistake of getting a Z270 chipset with your skylake.  Kabylake boards don't like having to backwards compat them (even though same form factor, support for LGA1151, backwards compatible support is never good).
 
That one mishandled number (bold and big for you), causes so much frustration for so many people.

Where do you get this information???
 
The 6700k isn't Kabylake... it's Skylake.
Great balance of cost/performance... and runs super quiet.
The 7700k is about $30 more... and is slightly faster running at 4.5GHz vs. 4.2GHz for the 6700k.
 
There is no problem with Kabylake or the Z270 chipset.
 
If you want to see problematic/flaky motherboards, build a Ryzen 1800x machine with X370 motherboard running 32GB of DDR4/3200.  That's a whole world of "flake-dome"... deserving of its own post.  
 
 
 

You misinterpreted what I said.  I was being critical of a Kabylake's chipset support for a Skylake (backwards compatible support on a Kabylake board for a Skylake processor installed is spotty).  Was saying not to feel inadiquite about owning a Skylake.  Because all the kinks are not out of the Kabylake boards.  I've always recommended to stay one architecture behind and off the bleeding edge as far as reliability.  Which is why when someone talks about their Ryzen screwing up and unexplicably baking their mobo, BSODs and everything else, I get the runs from laughing.  I told the kids in PCMR choo choo stay off the hype train, you'll get burned.
 
I'm okay with my Skylake.  I can OC it to near 5 ghtz with a good liquid cooler.  Liquid nitrogeon and freeon coolers can get it higher.  But I'd rather not have to legally put a biohazard sticker on my machine.  Let alone deal with a condensor and an evaporator to prevent the humidity in the air liquifying and shorting things.  (guy on overclocking forums in foldathon pushed a skylake to 7 ghtz before it fried with a modded air conditioning loop)
 
My XSPC/Bitspower/Ek custom loop setup with a push/pull 360 radiator is more than well enough to bump a Skylake to 5.2 ghtz with no stability issues.  It sure will heat up a chilly room, though, the amount of heat coming off that radiator.
 
I type on an IBM model M, not a razor mechanical.  That should say something about my rock-solid-steady and reliable approach at building.  I tell everyone you get to close to that bleeding edge and you will be bleeding.  From the bank account.

Bill Gabbert
Jim: "I've been building DAWs professionally for over 20 years.
We have no agenda... except to build the best possible DAWs for our clients....would you want the top-performer, or would you be OK with a CPU that's "good enough"?
 
Although a "personal Budget System " the studio I'm upgrading is far superior to the pro system that you built 20 years ago. So do I need the "Best"? No,  20 years ago one needed the best , just to operate. Today one only needs a system that will do the job.
 
So pinching pennies.. What is the best VALUE that will do the job? That's the question the Average musician is asking. For the same money One gets an "RME card" with an AMD set up.... or a "Resident Audio TB" with Intel.
 
{And actually the "Recording Studio" is a thing of the past. In today's world ; If you don't have a Video to go with it ..It's not done....So rendering is a consideration} 

 Recommended minimum system specifications for a newer daw:
 
Intel i5 processor (Quad Core, sixth generation, 2015 second-quarter release or newer, minimum base clock:  3 ghtz, speedstep and smartcache optional.) -> https://ark.intel.com/products/family/88393/6th-Generation-Intel-Core-i5-Processors
If you want the cheap server setup, consider a 2013-2014 release Xeon (Generation E3 or newer) (much much cheaper than the newer Xeon chips and i5, i7, up to 44 threads (Oct core+, limited base clock) -> http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/processors/xeon/e5-processors.html  thats the e5 line, but browse around for older on ebay.
Integrated graphcs controller capable of 1920x800 or any basic widescreen aspect ratio (16x9) in true color (32 bit color graphics mdoe) - most updated DAWs utilize widescreen format space quite nicely, gives you more room for your consules, racks, plugins, and libraries.
At least 16 GB DDR3, PC2300  or better, DIMM module RAM (I've seen ECC (error checking) RAM from servers used, works fine for a Xeon setup)  Large amount needed for project loading and fast sample processing.
Soundcard with either gameport to MIDI (old SBLive or Yamaha), or native MIDI-in/out, optical in/out, 3.5mm or 5mm in/out (headphones, mics, mixer in), PCIe card (I recommend Sound Blaster Z series), you can do without,
Powered USB hub for USB serial interfaces on hardware
No SSD needed, seagate or wd 5 tb drives are fine, seagate over wd, their mechanical drives suffer corruption a lot less than the newer, faster wd blacks.
If you want the rendering these specs change drastically.  You'll be looking at the NVidia Quadro line for that, and a samsung m.2 ssd, but a GTX 1060 is enough to get 4K rendering at reasonable speeds.  GTX line is more for gamers, Quadro for transcoding, number crunching and rendering, but you can squeeze by with a cheap newer GTX just fine (go a few generations back, before 1080, half the price).
 
If you're doing the server thing obviously some 3m thermal transfer tape and some block heatsinks to replace the junk thats there.  most server boards that support the old and good xeons are second hand ebay lucky finds.  and expect to have to mod a case for a server board to fit.  (unconventional full atx and power supply).
 
The server deal lets you skip the quadro and gtx because you can use all those extra threads as rendering threads.  You can slide in a budget of $650 for a "good enough" daw setup with lucky searches on ebay for old xeon chips and server mobos.
 
Otherwise, if you're not the build-savvy type, Dell XPS machines works just fine.