• SONAR
  • SOLVED! - Dim Pro No Longer Responds to Live Sustain Events...? (All Notes Off Problem) (p.2)
2010/09/03 00:25:47
digimidi
I hope that this thread doesn't soon because I've had troubles in the past with the sustain pedal using Roland keyboards, i.e. Roland D-50 and JX-8P.  If I use TTS-1, no problems, but some of the other soft synths, even EWQL Symphony Orchestra Silver or Fab Four, will not respond.  I usually record the material live using TTS-1 and then change the VST plugin's output to what I originally wanted to use in the first place.  It's sort of a work around, but it tends to not inspire the creativity that I envisioned using the desired soft synth.  Anyone got any ideas for me and BrundleFly?
2010/09/03 03:38:08
brundlefly

Anyone got any ideas for me and BrundleFly?
 
I'm coming to the conclusion that this has always been an issue, and I just haven't encountered it, because I stopped using my RD-300s as my main controller before I really started using soft synths. I started using it again just a couple months ago, and have not used Dim Pro or Rapture on anything this Summer. I'm not sure why I didn't encounter it immediately yesterday. All I can think is that one of the sticky keys on this 22-year-old keyboard was down, causing sustain to work normally for other notes on my first pass.
 
It's still not clear to me whether the synths that have trouble with this are at fault, or whether the MIDI Spec does not clearly indicate what the priority should for a synth receiving All Notes Off while Sustain is active. It seems the majority give priority to the Sustain.
 
I will probably just go back to using my QS8 as my primary controller, but I imagine there is a MIDI FX plugin out there that can fix this. I found an old one that was aimed precisely at this problem in the SONAR 4/5 era at http://tencrazy.com/gadgets/mfx called SustainFix, but I cannot get it to show up in SONAR 8.5 despite apparently successfully registration with regsvr32. Maybe it's an x64 compatibility issue; I don't know.
 
If I find a really transparent fix, I'll let you know. Some combination of MIDI-OX and MIDI Yoke may be able to do it, but I don't want to have to set up anything that complex for a problem I can solve just by using my other controller. Also, some synths have a built-in capabiity to globally remap incoming control messages, allowing CC123 to be mapped to do nothing. I don't know the nuts and bolts of Dim Pro or Rapture that well, but I don't think they can do it. EWQL might be one that can, however. Here's an old post about this with regard to VSampler: http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=1468
 
EDIT: Here's a thread confirming that the TenCrazy MFX are not x64 compatible: http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=2064189
2010/09/11 12:10:11
brundlefly
Turns out Cakewalk's own MIDI Event Filter MFX can take care of this (i.e. block the All Notes Off, CC 123); it's just a little tricky because the interface is buggy.
 
Here's how to make it work consistently (go straight to step 7 after step 2 if you're goood with a mouse, and don't want to understand the bug, and how to work around it):
 
1. Insert the MIDI Event Filter in the MIDI FX bin for the track echoing MIDI to the synth (if you're starting with an Instrument Track, you'll have to split it to get access to the MIDI FX bin).
 
2. In the Event Filter  dialogue, check the box next to Controllers in the upper righthand corner to enable that filter.
 
3. Drag the righthand range pointer at the top of the histogram down below the midpoint.
 
4. Drag the lefthand range pointer at the bottom of the histogram up above the midpoint.
 
5. You should now have a dark "exclusion" zone in the center of the histogram; these are controllers that will not be passed. Note that the value at the top of the histogram is now smaller than the one at the bottom.
 
6. This is where the bug comes into play: You would think that to adjust the range to exclude CC 123 you could edit the top value to 122, and edit the bottom value to 124, keeping the exclusion zone by having the top number smaller than the bottom number. But if you do this, the values and exclusion zone will display as expected, but it won't work; it will pass only CC123, instead of passing everything but CC 123. The trick is to edit the top number to 124, and the bottom number to 122. This will give the correct behavior (CC 123 is blocked, and sustain works normally with Dim Pro et al), and you will find that after closing and re-opening the Event Filter dialog that the numbers display correctly with 122 at the top, and 124 at the bottom.
 
7. The other way that works reliably (and intuitively) is to edit the values using only the sliders, and drag the left hand range pointer on up until the bottom box reads 124, and the righthand pointer down until the top box reads 122. But this can be fiddly, because of the very fine mouse control needed to hit the marks.
 
8. And, last but not least, once you have this working, type something like "Block CC 123" into the Preset window, and click the save button so you can easily recall this setting. It might also be worthwhile to save a MIDI track template with this MFX already inserted.
 
9. Stop fiddling with SONAR, and make some music.
 
2010/09/11 13:39:47
ba_midi
9. Stop fiddling with SONAR, and make some music.

 
_Sometimes_ that's not an easy trick ;)
 
2017/07/16 00:15:17
DanBailiff
It took me hours to find this, but by golly this fix works! Thank you so very much.
 
It's too bad we cannot apply a MIDI filter globally somehow.
12
© 2026 APG vNext Commercial Version 5.1

Use My Existing Forum Account

Use My Social Media Account