An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED?

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KyRo
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2010/12/08 22:07:49 (permalink)

An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED?

The out-of-nowhere announcement, the somewhat messy distribution, the lack of a reference guide with the program... I'm just wondering, Seth & co., HONESTLY, was the release of X1 rushed? Be it a response to the latest Pro Tools or WHATEVER. Some would argue so.

Not gonna slam you guys if it was. I'm just curious. Was this thing forced out somewhat prematurely? Or was this timeframe ALWAYS in mind for its release?
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    mikespitzer
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 22:13:22 (permalink)
    I had the same question at first ... but then I assumed this was a strategic move to keep the new version low profile and allow for a "surprise launch" on the market to keep the competition guessing.

    In any case, I never jump on the first version of anything new ....... so when SONAR X1 becomes X3, I may upgrade then.
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    Fess
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 22:13:33 (permalink)
    Thank you for asking this question I'm sure a few of us were thinking. I hope you (we) get an answer.

    Peace.
    #3
    daveny5
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 22:40:27 (permalink)
    I don't think so. My guess is that they've been working on this for 2 years and when they couldn't get it ready for last year's release cycle, they put some of it in Sonar 8 and called it 8.5.

    I've been a programmer and a massive change like this to an application is a HUGE and EXPENSIVE undertaking and a bold move for Cakewalk. I think this shows that they are serious about being the best DAW program on the market or at least being no less than #2 to ProTools with moving to #1 on their radar. Time will tell whether their gambit pays off. You folks like to call the Sonar developers the "bakers", but this is nothing like baking. As it is said, "cooking is an art, but baking is a science." I'd say they've cooked up quite a feast here.
    post edited by daveny5 - 2010/12/08 22:42:49

    Dave
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    ...wicked
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 22:44:19 (permalink)
    I don't think so either. If it was rushed they would've put it out back in OCT when they used to release stuff. Seems fine to me.

    Distro wasn't messed up for me either. They're using some kind of "cloud-based" service for downloads, so I don't fault them at all for the few glitches I've heard about. Figuring out the free upgrade folks is prolly also a function of their distro subcontractor. I don't got a prob with it.

    There's already a patch scheduled which to me shows that they finalized their feature set and said "go". You have to at some point. The fact that they're already on top of the few bugs that have been encountered just says to me that they're on top of it.


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    gtgarner
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 22:44:56 (permalink)
    Who cares if its rushed.  It works for me. Well worth the $99 and thats all I care about.
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    ba_midi
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:12:19 (permalink)
    This is total specualtion on my part, but my opinion as well:
     
    ALL software is rushed out these days.   Period.
     
    But, that being said ... I think there's a slight possibility that this is what would be considered a "paid beta test."   IOW, instead of having an open public beta test period, CW can get their money and have all of us debug it for them.
     
    Which we are already doing ;)
     
    There are, as always, a few bugs that probably never should have made it out here so quickly (one CW have admitted is being fixed in an ALREADY mentioned patch release coming this month!).
     
    In fairness, most of us know companies have deadlines to meet.   I dislike that mentality, but it happens to everything and everyone.  
     
    And this is a big overhaul (so big none of us know how to use it yet lol).  I don't know how many beta testers CW has, but I bet it's never enough.   So tag we're it now ;)
     
    But, we here on the forum at least get a chance to shake it out and help them fix things (those of us who participate here, that is).  So to a certain degree, we should expect some problems during this initial release period.
     
    That doesn't mean it's gonna be fun all the time.  But that's my take on it.
     
     

    Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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    Fess
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:21:10 (permalink)
    +1...and it makes sense because there is no manual yet either-which was coming how many hours ago??? If we had a manual, we could start from the beginning and test every function out and compile the bugs. I think Cakewalk are very aware of the bugs and they don't want us to know just how many there are. Maybe I'm over-reacting but some things about this whole release don't add up.
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    Bub
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:23:50 (permalink)
    ba_midi

    There are, as always, a few bugs that probably never should have made it out here so quickly (one CW have admitted is being fixed in an ALREADY mentioned patch release coming this month!).

    I bet he's regretting mentioning the patch release. It's not sitting well with people.

    "I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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    gtgarner
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:28:18 (permalink)
    It sits well with me.  Cakewalk can patch all they want.  Who cares?

    People don't know how to use it yet?  Are you kidding?  This is the simplest verion yet. If anyone used 8.5.3, then this is butta.   

    I know for sure that I am going to have used the 8.5 manual much more than I would an X1 manual. 
    ____________

    I am always amazed at people who buy something and then in the same day complain about what they bought. 
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    A1MixMan
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:28:49 (permalink)
    dimelives1


     I'm just curious. Was this thing forced out somewhat prematurely?
     
    Nope, someone just brought a case of Activia to the last office party...

    A1
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    Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:32:27 (permalink)
    No offense taken whatsoever, but let me clear some things up.

    1) The announcement was not out of nowhere. We did a month pre-announcement, made videos etc, and then official info on Dec 8th as stated. We designed a website, ads, did sound examples,a gallery, etc.
    2) The distribution is not a problem. The store is just swamped. Sorry, I know it sucks for people who can't get in.
    3) There is a manual. It's via online help chm file as 8.5 was. It's fully searchable, etc.

    "The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG

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    ba_midi
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:33:12 (permalink)
    gtgarner


    It sits well with me.  Cakewalk can patch all they want.  Who cares?

    People don't know how to use it yet?  Are you kidding?  This is the simplest verion yet. If anyone used 8.5.3, then this is butta.   

    I know for sure that I am going to have used the 8.5 manual much more than I would an X1 manual. 
    ____________

    I am always amazed at people who buy something and then in the same day complain about what they bought. 

    Yes, I'll stand by my statement that (most) people don't know how to use it yet.  Especially if they were deep pre-X1 users with custom setups, custom keybindings, custom workflows, etc.
     
    YOu find it easy to know so quickly, well, I congradulate you.  Good for you.  Really.
     
     

    Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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    ba_midi
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:34:45 (permalink)
    3) There is a manual. It's via online help chm file as 8.5 was. It's fully searchable, etc.

     
    Not the same as the PDF Reference Guide -- which was a breeze to use, and could be used outside the program.
     
    CHM style help is also a tad outdated and harder to navigate.
     
     

    Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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    A1MixMan
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:35:27 (permalink)
    Well if they found a bug AFTER it went to print, and they are already working on it for the patch then that's a great thing. What more do you want? Do you want them to wait to release it after they find every bug? Then it would never get released.

    These guys are on it in my opinion.

    A1
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    Bub
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:35:49 (permalink)
    gtgarner


    It sits well with me.  Cakewalk can patch all they want.  Who cares?

    What I wonder about it is ... iirc there are normally 2 free patches then you have to purchase an upgrade. It's a little concerning if there's already a patch this early, that only leaves time for 1 more free patch. I'm not saying that's what's going to happen, but iirc that's how it's worked in the past. Announcing a patch the day your product is released is a little weird don't ya think?

    I personally think it was a slip of the tongue when it mentioned.
    post edited by Bub - 2010/12/08 23:37:31

    "I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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    Living Room Rocker
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:35:54 (permalink)
    dimelives1


    The out-of-nowhere announcement, the somewhat messy distribution, the lack of a reference guide with the program... I'm just wondering, Seth & co., HONESTLY, was the release of X1 rushed? Be it a response to the latest Pro Tools or WHATEVER. Some would argue so.

    Not gonna slam you guys if it was. I'm just curious. Was this thing forced out somewhat prematurely? Or was this timeframe ALWAYS in mind for its release?


    Rushed!  Are you kidding me?  It's two months late!  Besides, how can you accuse X1 of being rushed?  After all, they put up extra severs and bandwidth to accommodate all the downloads and make the download faster than ever.

    Gee, the public is never satisfied.

    Kind regards,


    Living Room Rocker

    I kid, I kid....
    #17
    gtgarner
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:36:48 (permalink)
    A1MixMan


    Well if they found a bug AFTER it went to print, and they are already working on it for the patch then that's a great thing. What more do you want? Do you want them to wait to release it after they find every bug? Then it would never get released.

    These guys are on it in my opinion.


    +1
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    ba_midi
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:37:42 (permalink)
    Brandon (or any CW'er) ...
     
    Did the bakers remove the visual feedback for CapsLock, NumLock, etc?  I can't find them anywhere.
     
    I really used that visual feedback, so I just would like to know if I should stop looking for that.
     
     

    Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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    Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:39:43 (permalink)
    ba_midi



    3) There is a manual. It's via online help chm file as 8.5 was. It's fully searchable, etc.

     
    Not the same as the PDF Reference Guide -- which was a breeze to use, and could be used outside the program.
     
    CHM style help is also a tad outdated and harder to navigate.
     
     
    Understood. PDF is forthcoming to the best of my knowledge.

    "The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG

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    Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:42:25 (permalink)
    Bub


    gtgarner


    It sits well with me.  Cakewalk can patch all they want.  Who cares?

    What I wonder about it is ... iirc there are normally 2 free patches then you have to purchase an upgrade. It's a little concerning if there's already a patch this early, that only leaves time for 1 more free patch. I'm not saying that's what's going to happen, but iirc that's how it's worked in the past. Announcing a patch the day your product is released is a little weird don't ya think?

    I personally think it was a slip of the tongue when it mentioned.



    It was absolutely no slip of the tongue. It was deliberate information. We do not know how many patches there will be to X1 before the next major version. I would think people would be pleased they are getting a batch of fixes and improvements so quick.

    "The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG

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    Brandon Ryan [Roland]
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:43:35 (permalink)
    ba_midi


    Brandon (or any CW'er) ...
     
    Did the bakers remove the visual feedback for CapsLock, NumLock, etc?  I can't find them anywhere.
     
    I really used that visual feedback, so I just would like to know if I should stop looking for that.
     
     


    Not sure Billy , but it's entirely possible Will verify when I can or perhaps someone else will chime in.

    "The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel." WG

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    A1MixMan
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:45:47 (permalink)
    I didn't know you guys were giving away free patches.

    I want a free Sonar X1 patch for my denim jacket!

    Are these in the Cakewalk store? No wonder it's so busy.

    A1
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    chrisharbin
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:52:41 (permalink)
    I have mixed feeling on this. I knew without a doubt that I was going to get this update, the marketing worked.

    Though the cakewalk store was swamped, I managed to get through it, the download was a breeze, and it's installed without any un-normal incident. Quite frankly, it really did go much better than expected and I feel guilty that it did while so many others are having difficulty.

    But there does seem to be allot of little things that IMO should have been caught. My newest glitch is the "gain" knob which moves side to side when being moved (I mean the whole knob) Of course the PDF MANUAL has been mentioned quite a bit and I have to agree with ba_midi that it's a far cry from the help (though of course I'm using that) It's just allot of little naggy detail stuff that I'd think would have been nipped.

    I knew there would be issues, I knew what I was getting myself into and I don't regret it, so please don't take my complaints that way (I see some people moaning about such things)

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    Bub
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/08 23:56:56 (permalink)
    Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk]

    I would think people would be pleased they are getting a batch of fixes and improvements so quick.

    It is great that there's a patch to address some things. I just personally wouldn't have mentioned it on the day of release.

    "I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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    ba_midi
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/09 00:11:05 (permalink)
    Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk
    ]

    ba_midi


    Brandon (or any CW'er) ...

    Did the bakers remove the visual feedback for CapsLock, NumLock, etc?  I can't find them anywhere.

    I really used that visual feedback, so I just would like to know if I should stop looking for that.




    Not sure Billy , but it's entirely possible Will verify when I can or perhaps someone else will chime in.


    BTW, just as a heads up -- I'm up to 6 crashes in a 24 hour period of using the program for only about 4 hours.

    I have a quad core, 4G, XP Pro 32bit system that as most know runs very smoothly here.

    I'm concerned.

    All I'm doing to get these crashes is to do things like:
    Close a project.
    Click on things like EQ graph.
    Undock something.
    Cancel something.

    IOW, nothing esoteric at all yet.




    Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

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    Music gives me life, so I give life Music.
    Thanks for listening - Let's Dance to the rhythm of life! :)
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    ba_midi
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/09 00:13:23 (permalink)
    But there does seem to be allot of little things that IMO should have been caught. My newest glitch is the "gain" knob which moves side to side when being moved (I mean the whole knob) Of course the PDF MANUAL has been mentioned quite a bit and I have to agree with ba_midi that it's a far cry from the help (though of course I'm using that) It's just allot of little naggy detail stuff that I'd think would have been nipped.


    I just had some sticky-ness with the new EQ of the Pro Channel.  Clicked on the graph, and my mouse gets "stuck" there for awhile.  It lets go eventually.

    Very weird and disconcerting.



    Billy Arnell (ba-midi)

    http://www.ba-midi.com/music/files
    Music gives me life, so I give life Music.
    Thanks for listening - Let's Dance to the rhythm of life! :)
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    Fess
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/09 00:14:48 (permalink)
    No surprise to me. That's why Brandon didn't click on anything in the videos and just talked his way through them. Hate to say it, but it seems like this release has more bugs than my first apt...
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    pbognar
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/09 00:15:01 (permalink)
    Brandon Ryan [Cakewalk
    ]

    Bub


    gtgarner


    It sits well with me.  Cakewalk can patch all they want.  Who cares?

    What I wonder about it is ... iirc there are normally 2 free patches then you have to purchase an upgrade. It's a little concerning if there's already a patch this early, that only leaves time for 1 more free patch. I'm not saying that's what's going to happen, but iirc that's how it's worked in the past. Announcing a patch the day your product is released is a little weird don't ya think?

    I personally think it was a slip of the tongue when it mentioned.



    It was absolutely no slip of the tongue. It was deliberate information. We do not know how many patches there will be to X1 before the next major version. I would think people would be pleased they are getting a batch of fixes and improvements so quick.
    I haven't had time to read all threads on release day, and I will most likely wait for boxed meda to update and perhaps after the first patch - but from what I've seen, it's nice to see Brandon around here trying to be as helpful as possible especially when the environment is ripe for quick criticisms. 
     
    Luckily I never had time to master 8.5 - to me, the X1 UI already looks like it will be easier to navigate. 
     
    I was disappointed that the staff editor got no love, but I figure the UI improvement bodes well for the overall presence of Sonar in the marketplace.  (even the guys on KVR are impressed)
     
    And the better X1 does, the more likely there will be resources for staff editor improvements.
     
    Just my 2 cents.
     
     
    #29
    Bub
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    Re:An Honest Question: Was This Release RUSHED? 2010/12/09 00:17:08 (permalink)
    Fess


    No surprise to me. That's why Brandon didn't click on anything in the videos and just talked his way through them. Hate to say it, but it seems like this release has more bugs than my first apt...


    How's that butt feelin' Fess? LOL!

    "I pulled the head off Elvis, filled Fred up to his pelvis, yaba daba do, the King is gone, and so are you."
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