UnderTow

carlosagm79


Samplitude
Sequoia 
Reaper
Cubase
Nuendo
Wavelab
FL Studio
Pro Tools
PreSonus Studio One(just prop hardw)

and maybe other applications support ADM

As far as I am aware Studio One, Reaper, Pro Tools and FL Studio do not support ASIO Direct Monitoring. So on the DAW side that leaves us with Steinberg (of course), Magix and Soundscape/SSL that support ADM as far as I am aware. Add to that Line6, RME, Edirol, MOTU, Terratec and Echo and it makes you wonder what part of ADM is so hard to implement...

That said, my interface doesn't support ADM so who cares?

Oh yes, I do because I want Sonar to be a professional DAW and, this is important, the more DAWs that support ADM, the more likely it is that soundcard manufacturers, including mine, will implement ADM on their devices.

UnderTow

Pro Tools, it does have at list with DIGI proprietary hardware(the DIGI 001 have ASIO drivers)
FL Studio obviusly have, see:
http://flstudio.image-lin...ndow_diskrecording.htm
Reaper, well I just tested and its great

UnderTow

carlosagm79

Pro Tools, it does have at list with DIGI proprietary hardware(the DIGI 001 have ASIO drivers)
FL Studio obviusly have, see:
http://flstudio.image-lin...ndow_diskrecording.htm
Reaper, well I just tested and its great

As far as I know none of these are ASIO Direct Monitoring.

That FL page just mentions Direct Monitoring. As far as I can tell this is not controlled by FL. The term Direct Monitoring is quite common in music recording. It doesn't always mean ASIO Direct Monitoring.

If I can trust this discussion on the Cockos forum last week http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=74293 (and at least some of the posters seem quite knowledgeable), Reaper doesn't have ASIO Direct Monitoring either unless it has been added in the last week.

As for the Digi 001,, yes it has ASIO (For the 8 first I/O's if I remember correctly) but that doesn't mean it has ASIO Direct Monitoring.

Please correct me if I am wrong (with some references please. I like to check things thoroughly before I state them as fact ).

UnderTow

  For the DIGI your correct, I dont know if was exactly ADM protocol or a another propietary soft/hard way of do the same(but at least woks the ¨zero monitoring¨), Im curious , let me try Reaper again, now I m not sure about FL, yeah I read it again and its not ADM what are they talk about

I dont know but Steinberg proved over the years that manages to establish standards, and is very useful to control the mixer of a device from the ASIO host anyway.
The sooner Sonar can implement this function (although not perfect or compatible with all hardware) the better...

For reference, below is the statement from Noel I was referring to from this post:

http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.ashx?m=1515205

I'll let you in on a secret. In early SONAR 8 we actually implemented DM. ASIO DM is one of the poorest areas of the ASIO specification and very incomplete. We ran into so many vague areas with the ASIO spec and differences in manufacturers implementations that we ultimately ended up scrapping it. Additionally most if not all HW vendors have their own console applications that implement their own custom direct monitoring mapping that is superior than any host based ASIO DM implementation could rival. We decided that we'd let this one go for now.

If cake even implemented their own sort of ADM just for the V studios, i would never use another interface again, but it would have to handle fx as well, they could put a dsp card in the V 700 rack and and have reverb and compression and monitoring all handled from within  sonar and controllable from the V studio control surface..

Thats not to big a dream is it?

VigilantSound


Ha.... Some of you guys are confused...

But no matter, point is we all should want ADM so that our lives in the studio may be easy... 

Lets rally every one send a feature request for ADM at 12 midnight on The 23rd...

Yeah!, lets star requesting this feature!, haha

This is not how it works, several time explained in other post and still people confused! Each audio interface have it own driver, mixer and method of native hardware/soft monitoring (even cheap ASIO 2.0 compatible soundcards) The ASIO host (via the ASIO ADM protocol)just have to tell the interface: use it now!!!

Dear Carlo,

I really don't wish to seem adversarial.  In the big scheme of things, what YOU think makes absolutely NO difference to my studio and how it works ... NO CONFUSION HERE! 

ADM is NOT theory in my studio ... I've been using it for over three years!

I'm not one of those kind of people that pushes a button and hopes something works.  I've EXTENSIVELY studied music theory and computer programming in college because I CHOOSE to not only use something, but I also try to understand HOW it works and WHY!  (And I will admit, there is A LOT I don't know ... it took me a while to understand and learn how to use ADM as implemented by RME, but I  DO understand it and use it every day.)

You may wish to buy a jet aircraft so you can get to the grocery store faster because, "Yes, jets are faster than cars!".  But, until the grocery stores build runways, you'll never be able to land and do your shopping via your jet aircraft.  (This is what you're "ADM ranting" is beginning to sound like to me ... lol ... I'm speaking in jest, just in case you're aerophobic.)

TRUE ADM requires accessing the digital audio data immediately after the A<D conversion but BEFORE it reaches the cpu, and, generally speaking, audio hosts "tend" to manipulate audio data AFTER it hits the cpu ... hence you're complaining on the wrong forum.  You need to go to the DIGI or Presonus forums, or whatever hardware you use if it doesn't have ADM.  (Or you could buy an RME or Lynx or MOTU or find some hardware that has successfully implemented ADM in their hardware...and not all ADM implementations are equal.)

If some host claims to have ADM, my guess is they can only guarantee it works on their own hardware ...

Now it's time for me to go and actually do something IN my studio ... which is why you don't see me on this forum more frequently.  This will be my last word on the subject. 

Don't be taken in by slick marketing phrases and "buzz" words. 

If you wish to NOT see a "yellow" world, then take off the yellow sunglasses ...

Respectfully yours,

Lance "koolbass" Martin

 

koolbass

This is not how it works, several time explained in other post and still people confused! Each audio interface have it own driver, mixer and method of native hardware/soft monitoring (even cheap ASIO 2.0 compatible soundcards) The ASIO host (via the ASIO ADM protocol)just have to tell the interface: use it now!!!

Dear Carlo,

I really don't wish to seem adversarial.  In the big scheme of things, what YOU think makes absolutely NO difference to my studio and how it works ... NO CONFUSION HERE! 

ADM is NOT theory in my studio ... I've been using it for over three years!

I'm not one of those kind of people that pushes a button and hopes something works.  I've EXTENSIVELY studied music theory and computer programming in college because I CHOOSE to not only use something, but I also try to understand HOW it works and WHY!  (And I will admit, there is A LOT I don't know ... it took me a while to understand and learn how to use ADM as implemented by RME, but I  DO understand it and use it every day.)

You may wish to buy a jet aircraft so you can get to the grocery store faster because, "Yes, jets are faster than cars!".  But, until the grocery stores build runways, you'll never be able to land and do your shopping via your jet aircraft.  (This is what you're "ADM ranting" is beginning to sound like to me ... lol ... I'm speaking in jest, just in case you're aerophobic.)

TRUE ADM requires accessing the digital audio data immediately after the A<D conversion but BEFORE it reaches the cpu, and, generally speaking, audio hosts "tend" to manipulate audio data AFTER it hits the cpu ... hence you're complaining on the wrong forum.  You need to go to the DIGI or Presonus forums, or whatever hardware you use if it doesn't have ADM.  (Or you could buy an RME or Lynx or MOTU or find some hardware that has successfully implemented ADM in their hardware...and not all ADM implementations are equal.)

If some host claims to have ADM, my guess is they can only guarantee it works on their own hardware ...

Now it's time for me to go and actually do something IN my studio ... which is why you don't see me on this forum more frequently.  This will be my last word on the subject. 

Don't be taken in by slick marketing phrases and "buzz" words. 

If you wish to NOT see a "yellow" world, then take off the yellow sunglasses ...

Respectfully yours,

Lance "koolbass" Martin

Nice, maybe I have to do more research , because I still don't believe AMD its a ¨copy of streams¨or that require to access the digital audio data, besides I'm not interested in the way that direct monitoring(no ADM, they are different things) its implemented in you interface ,ADM its just a set of commands that suggest the hardware interface which input to open and which output to send the input, along with panning and gain,where you are deeply wrong is in the fact that I'm complaining, I'm not , and I'm in the correct forum asking for Sonar to support this ASIO feature, for a future, and for the cards/interfaces that already support it(because its not just about the hardware manufacturer, its also about the ASIO host)


Respectfully yours,



Carlos

VigilantSound


If cake even implemented their own sort of ADM justfor the V studios, i would never use another interface again, but it would have to handle fx as well, they could put a dsp card in the V 700rack and and have reverband compression and monitoring all handled from within  sonar and controlable from the V studio control surface..

Thats not to big a dream is it?

Willy Jones [Cakewalk
]

I guess Noel is just too shy to send an email to Steinberg to ask clarification for those 5 parameters he can't figure out... Surely he could contact the techs at Edirol that managed to implement ADM in their interfaces, no?

Absolutely - but then that would result with an implementation that is only guaranteed to work for Edirol interfaces,

Well get yourself an RME interface too and maybe a couple of others and test whatever you have implemented with those too. It isn't exactly rocket science.

if it was as simple as 5 parameters then we would done have it.  Unfortunately - it's not, device manufacturers each handle it differently and we try our hardest to support as many ASIO devices as possible. 

If there are more than the 5 ADM parameters you can see in my other post in this thread, please tell me which they are.

And are you saying that Steinberg and Magix have implemented a different version of ADM for every different interface out there that claims to use ADM? I simply do not believe that. Make sure that whatever you implement works exactly the same way with any interface as Cubase or Nuendo do and you know you have figured out the ADM standard. Again, not rocket science. Obviously Cakewalk already have a system running Cubase in their war room. (That is where Cakewalk test and make sure that any new feature they think up and implement is at least as good if not much better than that of their direct competitors Steinberg and Avid. Aah one can dream...)

With ADM specifically the devices that do support it offer additional functionality (RME or Lynx's mixers for example) that cannot be accessed via ADM so we found that users rarely used it.

Well Sonar users indeed rarely use it because Sonar doesn't have it but Cubase users with interfaces that support ADM do use it. It is very nice to be able to control things directly from the DAW. Seems like the kind of thing Cakewalk/Roland should have implemented with the VS series stuff... Maybe a bit more universally useful than a ROMpler synth, no?

I'm not saying that ADM isn't cool or doesn't have any uses but that it's implementation is not as clear as one would think. It's not something that we have totally tossed off the table but in the grand scheme of feature requests we receive it is pretty small.

That is a vicious circle. Sonar appeals to a certain market because of the type of features it has (and how they are implemented) and that market will in turn ask for certain features but not others. Slowly but surely Sonar appeals less and less to the professional market and more to the hobbyist market. There is nothing wrong with that if that is what Cakewalk want but I hope you guys realise that that is what is happening.

Anyway, you didn't answer my original question: Which part of ADM isn't clear?

UnderTow

I would LOVE it if Sonar could access this directly from it's tracks because it would allow (presumably) the use of a control surface as opposed to using the mouse on the profire's software mixer/router. I actually like the mixer/router software for the profire (I have it on it's own monitor), I don't mind it being outside sonar, I just wish that I could control it with my MCU or C4 or SOMETHING.

I havent read anymore post but wanted to add:
actually Motu cue mix says it works via mackie MUC by switching between controlling Cue mix and the daw   I have not seen or tried this. nor I'm I trying to get you to buy a new interface. just adding my 2 cents. as I've been looking at new interfaces and control surfaces..particularly the ones I've mentioned.  nor am I sure how well this is all implemented.

Even if you have hardware that has ADM, Sonar still doesn't support it...

Hardware that has ADM?

rabeach

Even if you have hardware that has ADM, Sonar still doesn't support it...

Hardware that has ADM?

A -The ASIO host(Cubase, Sonar have to support the protocol)
B - The hardware (the audio interface) OF COURSE have also to support the protocol!
People its like simple ASIO, remember when Sonar did not supported ASIO?, no matter the soundcard you have with ASIO driver?

Wow its amazing! with this topic I've noticed why Cakewalk does not have enough ADM feature request!, most user are misinformed, uninformed or simple don't know about the existence of it.

if you cant figure it out too bad .your a nasty person, and I wont engage you again. begone to the blocked users as you belong. uh buh-bye..

na na na na boo boo , poopy head.