Ozz
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/28 21:24:04
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So what's the verdict, those that jumped and bought? Sample quality meet or better the toontrack stuff? (Superior drummer?).
It's hard to pass up a good deal if the stuff is actually good quality. (I'm hoping someone will tell me how nasty and unrealistic these are!)
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yorolpal
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/28 21:26:30
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Haven't loaded it yet but check my previous post...5 out of 5 in EM.
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Ozz
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/28 21:53:20
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Well, that's a plus, but I take magazine reviews with a grain of salt. (How often have you seen a magazine that advertises a brand or product really bash it in a review? Although...usually EM gives 3's and 4's...so that might be a good sign 
post edited by Ozz - 2010/10/29 15:49:14
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brundlefly
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 02:08:17
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So what's the verdict, those that jumped and bought? Sample quality meet or better the toontrack stuff? (Superior drummer?). It's hard to pass up a good deal if the stuff is actually good quality. (I'm hoping someone will tell me how nasty and unrealistic these are!)
I just got mine loaded up a couple hours ago so I haven't really given it an exahaustive workout, but I am extremely impressed with the interface, features, tweakability and inital impression of sound quality and playability (from the keyboard) - and I would be would be at twice the price. It's very easy and intutive to mold the sound of each kit piece with the micing, dynamics, damping and tuning controls, and then fine tune them with a dedicated EQ, and any two of several key FX, including Envelope Shapers, Compressors, Delays, etc, for each of the 16 channels plus the Master mix, and controls for the contribution of each channel to overhead and room mics. The video tour linked elsewhere gives a good overview of all these features. I can't say yet how well it would do against Superior Drummer, which I also have, but have not gotten to know really well. But I can tell you it beats the daylights out of Session Drummer on every level - even the pattern library seems much "groovier", though I generally prefer to roll my own. And the pattern player includes controls to intelligently quantize, humanize, "simplify" and swing the default patterns to your taste at the twist of a few knobs. For $49 with an added library and the cool little Musician's Friend flash drive, I think it's an astounding value. Definitely great for anyone who wants to get really decent sounding results fast with little effort - especially if the only thing they have now is Session Drummer. It remains to be seen whether it continues to impress when you're really shooting for that killer drum track - assuming you have the performance, composition and mixing chops to get there with any drum synth. This package really makes me wonder what the full monty might offer other than more channels, bigger sample and pattern libraries, and higher bit-depth sample playback.
post edited by brundlefly - 2010/10/29 02:10:58
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 07:23:23
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I thought you had BFD 2 Brundle? I would love to be in a position to compare the two but it's not looking like I'll be able to take advantage of this wonderful deal as I'm in the UK and no one has come forward and taken up my challenge :( A few things I do know BFD 2 will give you that eco wont, I guess the first thing a lot of people seem to over look when comparing BFD2 with superior is the fact that you get 10 (yes that's TEN!!) whole and quite different kits with BFD 2. So taking that on board and comparing prices between the two I'd say BFD 2 might a better deal than superior. You can have up to 32 pieces in your kit should you wish, I think you have just the 10 pieces in Eco?. Seems like something you might never need but if you're doing an orchestral score and you have the "BOMB" (Big Orchestral Marching Band) or the percussion expansion you'll soon fill them all up. I have quite often used more than 10 pieces in my projects where I've had other snares and hats going through an aux channel with delay and other fx on so it definitely gives you more scope creatively. BFD 2 gives you 4 (and not 2) fx per channel . BFD 2 gives you 17 fx and 4 reverbs. Don't know what Eco gives you though. Having said that I see that there is a built in eq per channel with Eco so that's technically 3 fx (and not two) per channel. BFD 2 gives you Overhead, Room and Ambient Channels I think Eco only gives you two (?) You don't get an ambient channel. Also you can adjust the width and distance for each of the mics on those channels. BFD Eco is much more "pre-set" driven than BFD 2 which will please a lot of people who don't want to spend hours tweaking their life away :) Anyway, these are a just a few things I that came to mind but I suspect there other advantages with BFD 2 that I can't think of right now. Here's a nice review ( http://www.homestudiotips...ansion-bfd-eco-review) Don't know why the author has a picture of Christopher Guest as his profile picture? Slightly confused me for a moment there :) Steve
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 07:50:13
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Jesse G
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 08:58:03
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I used the software last night and I was blown away by the ease of use and quality of sound. There are multple FX to use, the Greateast hits expansion kits was worth the time it took to order the software. I had a Demo copy of BFD that I used but that only allowed me to have stero outs, not individual tracks. I thought that BFD was too expensive to buy, so I just settled for the Cakewalk drum synths included in Sonar SD2, SD3 and I was happy using them. I though I needed a better drum synth and liked the BFD sounds and the kits and wanted somthing similar. Review is accurate - http://www.crawdaddy.com/index.php/2010/07/01/riot-gear-fxpansion-scores-with-bfd-eco/ What a blessing for me to have BFD Eco for $49.00 Peace
post edited by Jesse G - 2010/10/29 09:02:06
Peace,Jesse G.  A fisher of men <>< ==============================Cakewalk and I are going places together!
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brundlefly
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 12:18:52
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twaddleI thought you had BFD 2 Brundle? Nah, you must be thinking of some other movie character around here.  I bought Superior when Guitar Center was running their deal a while ago, and CJay recommended it over BFD (IIRC) for ultimate sound quality and capability, if not ease of use (though he disputed others claims that it couldn't be dumbed down for new users). Unfortunately, I've spent way too much time talking tech on the forum when I should be composing and learning synths, which is why I couldnt really compare the two.  Looking over BFD2's features, I would agree that the much larger libraries (with 96 layers vs. 24 in Eco), larger kits, longer FX chains, etc, make BFD2 worth the difference. But with the low price of Eco, I think you can actually come out ahead by starting with Eco and getting a BFD2 (or even BFD3) upgrade verison, as opposed to shelling out for BFD2 from the get-go. Anyway, thanks for the overview. Good info. As for the issue of getting a copy shipped to the UK goes, my own reluctance stems mostly from wanting to avoid the rigamarole of shipping it, but I'll think about it if nobody else steps up.
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yorolpal
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 14:43:48
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I'm pretty sure you're correct about it being cheaper to buy ECO then upgrade to BFD2 than just buying BFD2 in the first place...considering the $50 price. If you also add in the free Expansion pack it is waaayy cheaper!
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brundlefly
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 18:07:45
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Incidentally, I've been playing around with this today, and discovered one confusing/misleading/wrong statement in the Manual that I thought I'd try to clear up for posterity. On the second to last page in the section on inserting BFD in SONAR, the Manual says: In the synth properties dialog box that appears, you can choose to set up BFD Eco’s additional outputs in the Sonar mixer. Unfortunately, this dialog box does not include an option to create all the required stereo and mono outputs, so it is recommended to choose ‘All Synth Audio Outputs: Stereo’, and afterwards manually change the stereo channels created for BFD Eco’s mono 1-16 outputs to mono channels.
Problem is, Eco doesn't have "1-16 outputs"; it only goes to 11 The 3 Tom, 3 Cymbal and 3 Percusion "channels" in the mixer share three common outputs, respectively. So you have Kick, Snare, Hihat, Toms, Cyms, Perc, OH, Room, Aux 1, Aux 2 and Master outputs. Of those, only the Room channel generates a true stereo output with unique left and right signals, and the Master and Aux outputs probably won't be used if you're using individual outputs to SONAR, so you can pretty much just delete those and have the 6 "instrument" outputs and the Overhead as mono tracks, and the Room as stereo - 8 tracks in all.
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/29 20:31:11
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As for the issue of getting a copy shipped to the UK goes, my own reluctance stems mostly from wanting to avoid the rigamarole of shipping it, but I'll think about it if nobody else steps up.
Is it much more rigmarole posting over seas than internal?
I'm wondering if they'll be ok with me paying for it and then shipping it to you? I ought to check with them before hand I guess.
Steve
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brundlefly
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/30 00:58:21
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Is it much more rigmarole posting over seas than internal? No, just more rigamarole to post anything than to sit here on my duff eating Cheetos, and tweaking BFD patterns.
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brundlefly
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/30 01:15:34
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First strangeness encountered with BFD: I haven't researched it yet, but I just enabled offline mode, and froze a full pattern with individual audio outputs from a groove dragged from BFD to a MIDI track, and all of the transients are perfectly aligned... with the end of each 30-tick MIDI note event, rather than the beginning.  Since all notes are the same duration, all the hits are synced to eachother, but they're all 20ms late vs. the timeline (and audibly vs. the metronome). Very interesting little anomaly. EDIT: Confirmed it's a rendering problem. Realtime re-recording of Eco's output is right on the money with the MIDI driving it. The screenshot below shows the problem. EDIT 2: Mystery solved... sort of. A while back I set BounceBufSizeMsec=20 in AUD.INI to solve a problem with Rapture crashing on freeze with ASIO buffer at 2ms, and to improve bouncing/freezing efficiency in general. Changing it back to 0 solves the problem if I leave my buffer at 2ms so that SONAR uses that value for freezing, but if I increase my buffers to 20ms, I get the same effect. No other synths that I've checked are doing this. It seems Eco is inserting one empty buffer at the front of every track, so everything is delayed by the buffer size. I'll have to check Fxpansion's Support and Forums, and file a bug with them and/or Cakewalk. In the mean time, I can easily avoid it. EDIT 3: And what were the odds that BFD's default event length of 30 ticks just happened to be exactly 20ms at 92BPM, which just happened to match my BounceBufSizeMsec setting so that it looked like BFD was triggering at the end of MIDI events? Amazing. 
post edited by brundlefly - 2010/10/31 01:56:51
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/30 04:54:40
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brundlefly
No, just more rigamarole to post anything than to sit here on my duff eating Cheetos, and tweaking BFD patterns.
Ahh, I see your dilemma. LIfe is indeed a ****  Steve
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/30 05:13:12
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BFD 2.2 will have more features for saving BFD2 presets as Eco compatible... and you can load Cymbals and Toms into Eco's percussion slots -- so generally that's not a big issue (unless you have a huge BFD2 kit)
Hey Rail
It seems you're the man in the know as to what's going on behind the doors at Fxpansion, you say BFD 2.2?
So it's not going to be a "version 3" just yet then? Can we expect to see it before Christmas? By my reckoning it should have showed up around July to August according to something Rob or Drew said back in May.
I wish they'd make some kind of announcement, if only to say sorry folks we're way behind with this one.
Steve
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Platinum Samples
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/30 19:51:36
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twaddle
BFD 2.2 will have more features for saving BFD2 presets as Eco compatible... and you can load Cymbals and Toms into Eco's percussion slots -- so generally that's not a big issue (unless you have a huge BFD2 kit)
Hey Rail
It seems you're the man in the know as to what's going on behind the doors at Fxpansion, you say BFD 2.2?
So it's not going to be a "version 3" just yet then? Can we expect to see it before Christmas? By my reckoning it should have showed up around July to August according to something Rob or Drew said back in May.
I wish they'd make some kind of announcement, if only to say sorry folks we're way behind with this one.
Steve
Hi Steve, FXpansion have said on their forum that 2.2 should be the last update for BFD2... and I can't say when BFD 2.2 will be released... I can tell you they're working on it though, and I'd be surprised if it wasn't released before Christmas. They're also getting ready to release Geist in November. Cheers, Rail
post edited by Platinum Samples - 2010/10/30 19:52:59
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/30 20:34:25
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Hi Steve,
FXpansion have said on their forum that 2.2 should be the last update for BFD2... and I can't say when BFD 2.2 will be released... I can tell you they're working on it though, and I'd be surprised if it wasn't released before Christmas.
They're also getting ready to release Geist in November.
Cheers,
Rai
l
Thanks for that Rail
I thought there was actually going to be a new version BFD 3 but being an update I'm assuming I can
put my wallet away till next year at least so that a bonus
Steve
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brundlefly
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 02:04:34
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I just discovered that loading Eco with Jbridge instead of Bitbridge eliminates the rendering problem I described in post #73. Time to visit the Cakewalk Problem Reporter.
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superdan54
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 02:33:41
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So none of the presets & kit presets in the expansion pack will work on ECO, eh?
Please tell me there is a workaround, as that would be a huge bummer! Someone said that BFD 2.2 will allow you to save presets in an ECO-friendly format...surely then they can make these presets available to us ECO users....right?
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Platinum Samples
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 04:42:41
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superdan54
So none of the presets & kit presets in the expansion pack will work on ECO, eh?
Please tell me there is a workaround, as that would be a huge bummer! Someone said that BFD 2.2 will allow you to save presets in an ECO-friendly format...surely then they can make these presets available to us ECO users....right?
I don't have that expansion pack.. but you should post on the FXpansion forum and I'm sure they'll create Eco presets for you if they aren't already in the Download section of the FXpansion website. Rail
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 15:05:41
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Hey
Quick question my friend has a friend who's in the US at the moment and is going to ask him if he'll order it for me. My friend raised a very good question,
how does the 50% rebate work? Is it one of those rebates where you have to spend the money you've saved on good from musicians friend?
Basically, are there any gotchas or do I just get the $50 back to do what I please with? It doesn't seem clear on the site and I've seen things like this where it's carefully worded NOT! to be clear.
So you guys that have your copies, yorolpa? Jesse G? Do I really just pay the $49?
Cheers
Steve
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Platinum Samples
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 16:33:36
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twaddle
Hey
Quick question my friend has a friend who's in the US at the moment and is going to ask him if he'll order it for me. My friend raised a very good question,
how does the 50% rebate work? Is it one of those rebates where you have to spend the money you've saved on good from musicians friend?
Basically, are there any gotchas or do I just get the $50 back to do what I please with? It doesn't seem clear on the site and I've seen things like this where it's carefully worded NOT! to be clear.
So you guys that have your copies, yorolpa? Jesse G? Do I really just pay the $49?
Cheers
Steve
Hi Steve, It's an instant rebate -- you pay only $49 I personally think this is a mistake at Musician's Friend, and it's meant to be the same as at Sweetwater, where there's no rebate... but grab it while you can ;^) Cheers, Rail
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 16:42:41
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Thanks for that Rail You wouldn't know how long it would take from payment to delivery. The guy who's over there at the moment is in Hawaii and coming back to the UK on the 5th which I'm worried might be cutting it a bit fine but if it's next day or no more than 3 days that should be fine as I'll order it tomorrow. Thanks again Steve Yeah it could well be a pricing error but the kind I like :)
post edited by twaddle - 2010/10/31 16:47:46
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Platinum Samples
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 17:16:06
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twaddle
Thanks for that Rail
You wouldn't know how long it would take from payment to delivery.
The guy who's over there at the moment is in Hawaii and coming back to the UK on the 5th which I'm worried might be cutting it a bit fine but if it's next day or no more than 3 days that should be fine as I'll order it tomorrow.
Thanks again
Steve
Yeah it could well be a pricing error but the kind I like :)
USPS Priority Mail -- probably 6-7 business days is normal... UPS can ship 2nd or 3rd Day Air for a premium... as long as they have it in stock... Have him call Musician's Friend on Monday. Cheers, Rail
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Rbh
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/10/31 18:11:32
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Vastman
It took me awhile to find demo mp3 files on the free expansion kit they're including.... it's here: http://www.fxpansion.com/index.php?page=90&tab=245
Just downloaded all the mp3 sample files.... there are gobs of um! listening on my android phone... pretty sweet!
Thanks for the tip... just what I need... to spend more $$$. My wife's gonna cut my noodle off!
By the way, just got the new NI Komplete and still haven't even tried Battery yet... do I really need this (it does look quite nice and more intuitive and sounds great)?
Battery has some great acoustic samples. They are very teakable at the sample/processing level in a way that isn't available with BFD. What BFD gives you is a great mix environment that Battery doesn't even pretend to do. There are no pattern grooves or anything of that sort with Battery. Personally I like Batteries samples better. My brother has the full BFD 2 and he does get some great mixes using BFD samples. They are truely different animals...so you'll have to figure out what method you like to produce from. RAW samples and tons of internal processing..... or RAW samples with a great mixer and grooves.
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/11/02 07:09:24
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Ok, apologies first to Karyn and Bristol_jonesy
I have a friend of a friend who's over there at the moment and he persuaded his lady friend to post it if it arrives after he has left so I ordered it last night.
Since I don't know either of them I didn't want to push my luck and ask her to post for other people.
My question to those who have purchased it, I noticed there were two payment methods, I chose paypal as it was quicker but also the other "secure" payment didn't alow for people outside the states.
Just wondering how long it takes for the rebate to show up. Since it's through paypal and not my bank I'm guessing paypal will email me to say that money has gone in. Anyone else used paypal for this?
Steve
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craigfowler
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/11/02 11:15:00
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The rebate should simply have been deducted at checkout - i.e., you should only have paid the $49 'up front', so long as you entered the ECO code at checkout.
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twaddle
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/11/02 11:33:03
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Oh good god,
I wondered why paypal sent me e receipt for $99.00 dollars.
It seems I completely forgot to enter the "eco" code.
Placed order late last night, have emailed them to see if it's too late to amend the order but suspect I might have missed the boat.
Doh!!!!
Steve
soundcloud SoundClick Myspace Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R, Intel i7 930, 3.40Ghz, 12GB Corsair DDR3 1TB WD SATA 6Gb X 2 Emu- 0404 PCIe Sonar X1d Expanded BFD3 + BFD2 + BFD Eco Dual boot windows 7, 32 & 64bit
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twaddle
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- Location: Bristol UK
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/11/02 11:39:40
(permalink)
I don't get it.
I just went through the buying procedure again but didn't commit.
When paying with paypal, you just click where it says add to cart,
and then I click, "checkout with paypal" and there is nowhere to enter the code?
Where was it? It wasn't on my paypal page and I cant see it on the
"shopping cart" page so how was I supposed to enter it?
Slightly annoyed now
Steve
soundcloud SoundClick Myspace Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R, Intel i7 930, 3.40Ghz, 12GB Corsair DDR3 1TB WD SATA 6Gb X 2 Emu- 0404 PCIe Sonar X1d Expanded BFD3 + BFD2 + BFD Eco Dual boot windows 7, 32 & 64bit
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Platinum Samples
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Re:BFD ECO $49.00
2010/11/02 12:02:30
(permalink)
I believe the rebate was an error and may have been corrected.... However, the product page still lists the rebate.. so call MF and ask for it... see what they say... Rail
post edited by Platinum Samples - 2010/11/02 12:04:28
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