SilkTone
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 24, 16 12:18 AM
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☄ Helpfulby pdlstl2 May 24, 16 2:14 PM
pdlstl2
Personally, I got over the track strip colors rather quickly this weekend. Since I only record for as a living, I have pretty rigid ways when it comes to grouping tracks together. After only one weekend, Mercury with the color track strips looks almost clown-ish to me now. And I was a "track color" power user. So for me, it's goodbye Mercury. And here's a couple of reasons.
I definitely understand those who currently use only one video monitor, it (the colors) could be a big deal. But because I've been using dual monitors (many years), I am able see the full screens of both the Track and Console View simultaneously. It would've been harder (for me) to accept Losing track colors on a single monitor. I say this because I can see the track color in the waveform on one monitor and the colors on the other. A border around the bottom as was suggested is a good idea IMHO. But nothing more than that.
A far greater reason for my digging the Tungsten theme, At 63 years old, diabetic and on dialysis, my vision is somewhat compromised in one eye. The change from the light Mercury to the dark Tungsten has been a Godsend.Literally, my experience working in Sonar has increased probably 50% both functionally and asethically. So there's that.
Lastly, because I do record others, my software is on display constantly. Tungsten has a stronger professional look/feel to it. And that's a factor when other people pay you to make records for them. Additional control over the UI would.will be much welcomed at my tiny little bungalow
So, rock on SONAR, rock on.
Anyway just my 2¢...
Earl
PS - Good on ya' for the lifetime deal! I used to use multiple monitors as well, but I switched to a 40" 4K monitor some time ago. AFAIC, that is by far the best configuration as it has the same number of pixels and same surface area as 4 x 20" HD monitors. But without the limitation of only being able to maximize an application on just one monitor at a time. So if I maximize SONAR on my monitor, it almost feels like having a physical mixing console in front of me, it's so gigantic. So as far as that is concerned, I'll never go back to small multiple monitors again. As for the theme, I'm sticking with Mercury for the reasons I gave previously. The loss of depth cues is a showstopper for me since I understand what it means, and what we lose when it is removed. I counted the number of controls I can interact with in SONAR on my monitor at one time (no scrolling), and it came to around 880! Maybe on smaller monitors it isn't such a problem. I like the Tungsten colors though. It would be great if they add another theme with the Tungsten colors but without the loss of the depth cues.
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 24, 16 6:53 PM
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SquireBum
Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
thepianist53
IMO, selected clips don't show the MIDI data as well, contrast is off, to me. I'm going to see if I can tweak this. it's the only criticism I have so far of the new theme, which mostly I like.
I don't see any difference with how selected MIDI clips are displayed with the Tungsten theme. Can you elaborate?
Perhaps you have some custom colors that are affecting this?
Noel,
Attached are screenshots of selected MIDI clips on the Mercury and Tungsten themes using the Normal color scheme in Preferences. On my system, the MIDI notes in the tracks 1, 4, and 5 are nearly invisible in the Tungsten theme. My monitor is calibrated and color managed, so my contrast and brightness are not turned up all the way as most monitors are set by default. I assume the theme designs were completed on a color managed monitor.
Hope this helps,
Ron
Thanks. This has been fixed for the release version.
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Reckedtrek
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 24, 16 8:13 PM
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I just downloaded it and think it looks pretty freakin' sweet! Perfect (for everyone) is not possible, but I find this much better!
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 10:50 AM
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I don't like it. I think it is bad. It is not better readable, orange color is awful, flat buttons looks amateurish in many places. And it has absolutely no sense without settings and editing. I still hope that further development would be better.
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smallstonefan
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 11:10 AM
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Sorry to hear that some don't like it. I'm loving it so far. I'm a huge fan of orange to begin with, and this is a nice orange. While it may not be perfect, it's a nice improvement for me.
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 11:27 AM
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I'm happy that so many people like it, but in the same time I'm disappointed that Cakewalk could think that they did something right. Somebody likes this orange, somebody doesn't, so why not to make it tunable? Am I wrong, that you can't change just this color? Why? Because of god complex.
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smallstonefan
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 11:44 AM
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Adq
I'm happy that so many people like it, but in the same time I'm disappointed that Cakewalk could think that they did something right. Somebody likes this orange, somebody doesn't, so why not to make it tunable? Am I wrong, that you can't change just this color? Why? Because of god complex.
Yeah, I'm sure that's the reason! 
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subtlearts
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 11:44 AM
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Adq
I'm happy that so many people like it, but in the same time I'm disappointed that Cakewalk could think that they did something right. Somebody likes this orange, somebody doesn't, so why not to make it tunable? Am I wrong, that you can't change just this color? Why? Because of god complex.
God complex? Seriously? It is their software, they can make it whatever colour they want. However, they have said in various places that this is the first alternative theme. Not the only one, just the first one, released concurrently with the first release that supports the theme engine. And they have also indicated that there will be support for not only more factory themes, but editing tools and a way to post user-created themes. Those things are not in this release, but they are in the pipeline. I'm sorry you don't like this theme, but it seems a bit hyperbolic to start diagnosing CW with dark psychological disorders based on that fact. In any case nobody is forcing anyone to use it. It's pretty trivial to switch back to Mercury and wait for a theme you like better, or the possibility to make one. But yes, it would be great to be able to change the orange, for those of us that don't love it.
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 12:48 AM
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It is base not only on this case, but the whole last years conception. There is too many hard-coded things in Sonar and there is lack of crucial settings, because... and so on. May be it changes, but there are more words than actions. And read this: http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3420226I'm very afraid of this "We're about to move on to discussions" and "But we may introduce".
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subtlearts
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 12:52 AM
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Adq
... And read this:
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3420226
I'm very afraid of this "We're about to move on to discussions" and "But we may introduce".
Well fair enough - it's hard to argue, that's a bit more vague than one might hope for...
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dcumpian
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 2:21 PM
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Adding themes to a native Windows app isn't simple. Particularly in this case where there are lots of standard Windows controls combined with custom coded controls. To theme the whole app (including all dialogs and menus) is going to take a long time to do. That's assuming Cakewalk decides to theme the entire app and not just the track and console views.
Once done, however, any new controls will (should) automatically be theme-aware. That's when you can build an easy to use theme editor. Until then, hardcoding is probably the only way to do it.
Regards,
Dan
Mixing is all about control. My music: http://dancumpian.bandcamp.com/ or https://soundcloud.com/dcumpian Studiocat Advanced Studio DAW (Intel i5 3550 @ 3.7GHz, Z77 motherboard, 16GB Ram, lots of HDDs), Sonar Plat, Mackie 1604, PreSonus Audiobox 44VSL, ESI 4x4 Midi Interface, Ibanez Bass, Custom Fender Mexi-Strat, NI S88, Roland JV-2080 & MDB-1, Komplete, Omnisphere, Lots o' plugins.
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 2:55 PM
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☄ Helpfulby SuperG May 25, 16 4:04 PM
dcumpian
Once done, however, any new controls will (should) automatically be theme-aware. That's when you can build an easy to use theme editor. Until then, hardcoding is probably the only way to do it.
Bolded for truth.  It takes a while to refactor 20+ years of legacy UI. Adq
It is base not only on this case, but the whole last years conception. There is too many hard-coded things in Sonar and there is lack of crucial settings, because... and so on. May be it changes, but there are more words than actions. And read this:
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3420226
I'm very afraid of this "We're about to move on to discussions" and "But we may introduce".
We already have an internal tool for designers/developers, but it's not ready for primetime. Hence "we're about to move on to discussions" about this. There's nothing nefarious here, it's just part of the monthly product cycles. Once the integration between SONAR and the theme tool is ready, if a color bothers someone, they'll be able to easily change it and share it with others. "But we may introduce enhancements and expansions over time." is just that. We're already working on another theme, but themes themselves will need to adapt along with application updates. For instance, we'll need to properly handle greater than 4k resolutions soon, and themes will need a bit of tweaking as a result. Most importantly themes are a community driven feature, and this all depends on feedback cycles. We need to be open to introducing new enhancements over time.
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 2:58 PM
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Good to hear it, thank you for clarification.
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 3:05 PM
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Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
Most importantly themes are a community driven feature, and this all depends on feedback cycles.
What about new Feedback Portal? Is it gonna be ready anytime soon?
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 3:27 PM
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Adq
Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
Most importantly themes are a community driven feature, and this all depends on feedback cycles.
What about new Feedback Portal? Is it gonna be ready anytime soon?
I don't have a date for you, but I know it's being worked on. Our Webteam is handling this task, and I don't regularly sit in on those meetings to know for sure.
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SilkTone
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 3:30 PM
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Well I guess one can argue that CW won't be thinking of developing a public theme editor if SONAR was to be EOL'ed on June 1, based on some of the crazy theories floating around in various threads. Just saying.
I just hope the theme editor does more than just allow changing colors of flat controls.
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 3:30 PM
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 4:04 PM
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☄ Helpfulby dcumpian May 25, 16 4:42 PM
SilkTone
Well I guess one can argue that CW won't be thinking of developing a public theme editor if SONAR was to be EOL'ed on June 1, based on some of the crazy theories floating around in various threads. Just saying.
I just hope the theme editor does more than just allow changing colors of flat controls.
Flat/3d can be controlled via the images used in the theme. For example, we (or the user base) could potentially offer a flat mercury and/or 3d tungsten down the road. Honestly, I'm really interested to see what Panup and the community comes up with. 
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SilkTone
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 4:22 PM
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Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
SilkTone
Well I guess one can argue that CW won't be thinking of developing a public theme editor if SONAR was to be EOL'ed on June 1, based on some of the crazy theories floating around in various threads. Just saying.
I just hope the theme editor does more than just allow changing colors of flat controls.
Flat/3d can be controlled via the images used in the theme. For example, we (or the user base) could potentially offer a flat mercury and/or 3d tungsten down the road.
Honestly, I'm really interested to see what Panup and the community comes up with.
Excellent, thanks Seth!
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pdlstl2
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 4:44 PM
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Seth Kellogg [Cakewalk]
It is base not only on this case, but the whole last years conception. There is too many hard-coded things in Sonar and there is lack of crucial settings, because... and so on. May be it changes, but there are more words than actions. And read this:
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3420226
I'm very afraid of this "We're about to move on to discussions" and "But we may introduce".
We already have an internal tool for designers/developers, but it's not ready for primetime. Hence "we're about to move on to discussions" about this. There's nothing nefarious here, it's just part of the monthly product cycles. Once the integration between SONAR and the theme tool is ready, if a color bothers someone, they'll be able to easily change it and share it with others.
"But we may introduce enhancements and expansions over time." is just that. We're already working on another theme, but themes themselves will need to adapt along with application updates. For instance, we'll need to properly handle greater than 4k resolutions soon, and themes will need a bit of tweaking as a result.
Most importantly themes are a community driven feature, and this all depends on feedback cycles. We need to be open to introducing new enhancements over time.
Thanks so much for thyour post on this Sethh!
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subtlearts
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 5:12 PM
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This is all very hopeful sounding. Being a pretty poor excuse for a graphic designer myself (a few mediocre-at-best websites and CD covers) I am not likely to take on anything too ambitious, but I know there are people with skills and ideas well beyond my own that might cook up some fun stuff that the core team can't devote the resources to, so I'm looking forward to when the tools are made available!
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Reckedtrek
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 6:02 PM
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"Because of God Complex"?! 
Sonar...sorry... SONAR Platinum, HP Envy PC I5 2.7Ghz, Focusrite Scarlett 18i20, Behringer X Touch, Lots of strats, Marshalls, and Fender Twins! Just here to learn and share ideas about music and find lots of tricks to make me sound better than I actually am.
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Adq
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 25, 16 6:28 PM
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Reckedtrek
"Because of God Complex"?!
I mean that few years ago somebody (or few peoples maybe) in Cakewalk decided that he is the god of software design, and that Cakewalk could make perfect product with minimum settings that would be better that somebody could imagine, and would suit everybody. They dropped PRV tools settings, many color settings, automation recording now automatically produce awful smoothing without any settings, windows docking possibilities are made strictly limited to somebody's vision, and so on, so on. Of course this concept could not succeed, because there are no gods on the earth. It is good that last 1.5 years Cakewalk slowly moves away from it. Just want it to be faster.
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synkrotron
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 27, 16 6:31 PM
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Cakewalk are not the only guys that use a nice orange-ish theme:- 
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SilkTone
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 27, 16 7:30 PM
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synkrotron
Cakewalk are not the only guys that use a nice orange-ish theme:-
Note however those guys understood the importance of depth cues When using depth cues you don't need to rely on high contrasting colors to clearly separate and identify controls. They do have all-flat themes for lower resolution tablets though. Of course on the phone you don't need it at all since you have like what, 11 controls or something. Makes me wish I had an Android tablet instead of an iPad. While my initial impression of eyoControl was good, it turned out to be really buggy and basically unusable (pretty bad connectivity problems).
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CL2Zero
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 27, 16 7:59 PM
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Here is my 2 cents on the new color scheme.
I am getting older and like a lot of people I have to stare at a monitor at work, too.
My time using Sonar in the last 6-8 months has drastically dropped mostly because of eye fatigue.
With the new look in Sonar, I can sit here working for hours on end and my eyes are no where near as tired as they would be in 45 minutes worth of time with the old way Sonar looked. I have only been using Sonar since X1, so not sure how it looked before that.
In short, the new look rocks, in my opinion. And of course my opinion and $5 will buy you a can of soda.
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Gregmang
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 27, 16 8:33 PM
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Duckbar owners fear not.
Just installed Dark Side 2015 theme and it replaced the default Mercury. So now I can change seamlessly between Tungsten and my favorite Panu Dark Side 2015 !!
Happy !!
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papercut
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 28, 16 9:47 AM
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Count me among those who like the Tungsten theme. First impression is that it is better for late-night sessions after a long day of open eyes. Looking forward to seeing what other themes are in the works. Now, what I'd really love is the freedom in Sonar to makes actual letters and numbers bigger and more defined.
post edited by papercut - May 30, 16 11:54 AM
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SilkTone
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 28, 16 2:02 PM
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BTW, it's not orange, it's gold. Says so right in the theme description so you all can stop complaining about it being orange It reminds me of California's "golden hills", which is what they came up with to describe what the hills look like 95% of the year over here. No, it's not golden, it's dead!
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S.L.I.P.
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Re: Dark Theme in Sonar
May 28, 16 6:02 PM
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I can be a little slow...wondering why that color choice...hot day on the east coast, and I break out my t-shirts...grab my cakewalk tee, DUH, colors are black and orange. I'm not sure if I'm completely sold on the colors, but the new theme helps out with these old eyes.
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