PRV Controller Pane - is this the "as intended" behavior?

Before installing X3 just a few weeks ago now, I was still using 8.5.  The differences between the two versions are still very fresh in my mind.  In 8.5 a consistent part of my workflow was:
 
--Always have the controllers pane option on.  I have no use for velocities superimposed on top of the note display on the grid.
 
--During some phases of editing, I would only need to see the notes.  The divider between the panes and the grid would be swooped down so the panes were out of sight and not taking up room.
 
--When I wanted to work with the controller panes, I would swoop the divider up and divide the screen as needed to see both controllers and notes.
 
In X3, if I move the divider all the way down, the only logical thing to do, as per the above, that makes the "use controller panes" option turn off, and the velocities and everything else are suddenly superimposed on the grid again.
 
The only way to avoid having the panes option turn off is to make sure I don't drag the divider quite all the way down - a sliver of it has to be left.--- It's fairly minor, but it's still a PITA, requiring extra moves if I accidentally collapse the panes too completely, and having to aim the divider so it doesn't go all the way down.
 
Sure seems like funky programming to me, like something was broken since the 8.5 days.
 
Is that just the way it is for everyone?
 
Randy B.

http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3009034
 
It worked as intended in X1 but X2 introduced a "bug" that still persists in X3, wherein, pulling the controller pane bar all the way down makes it disappear forever. It's the only pane bar that does this now. You have to use the menu bar OR shift+C to get it back. Not good for work flow.

Actually, "Manage Track Visibility" is the Track Manager, isn't it? Why didn't I realize it when I was typing the post...

soens
 
Pulling the controller pane bar all the way down makes it disappear forever. It's the only pane bar that does this now. You have to use the menu bar OR shift+C to get it back. Not good for work flow.

I just pulled the controller pane in the PRV down all the way, and if I hovered the mouse over the line just above the scroll bar, was able to click and drag up...works the same way as the bus section in Track View as far as I can tell. Tried it with velocity, too...same results. Can you elaborate on the conditions that cause it to "disappear forever?"

Anderton

soens
 
Pulling the controller pane bar all the way down makes it disappear forever. It's the only pane bar that does this now. You have to use the menu bar OR shift+C to get it back. Not good for work flow.

I just pulled the controller pane in the PRV down all the way, and if I hovered the mouse over the line just above the scroll bar, was able to click and drag up...works the same way as the bus section in Track View as far as I can tell. Tried it with velocity, too...same results. Can you elaborate on the conditions that cause it to "disappear forever?"

 
When you pull down the pane all the way, do it very slowly.

Anderton

soens
Pulling the controller pane bar all the way down makes it disappear forever. It's the only pane bar that does this now. You have to use the menu bar OR shift+C to get it back. Not good for work flow.

I just pulled the controller pane in the PRV down all the way, and if I hovered the mouse over the line just above the scroll bar, was able to click and drag up...works the same way as the bus section in Track View as far as I can tell. Tried it with velocity, too...same results. Can you elaborate on the conditions that cause it to "disappear forever?"

The conditions for this are unknown. It happens most of the time but not all the time. On very rare occasions it will operate properly and not disappear.
 
Here is a side-by-side comparison between X1 and X2:

 
The fact that this does not happen all the time, and when it does happen the controller lines reappear, indicates that Sonar has invoked a view that was not intended.
 
jlien: It disappears whether I do it fast or slow.

abb
Yes, [PRV opening in the multidock by default] is annoying...
 
But what's really a PITA is when you're switching back and forth between the track view and the PRV and have to keep expanding the PRV pane, fit the notes to the vertical axis of the window (fit content), and then scroll to center the notes within the selected time window on each iteration.  It would be great to be able to simply click on your selected MIDI tracks in the track view and then have the PRV automatically pop up fully expanded with all the notes fit to the full size of the vertical (pitch) and horizontal (time) axes of the window so that you can get right down to editing rather than wasting time clicking needlessly.

Leaving the PRV open in the multidock is the solution to this problem. If you leave it open, you won't have to resize panes all the time, and double-clicking any clip should scroll and vertically zoom the view such that the position you clicked in the clip is roughly centered in the view and all the notes numbers are showing. Then use D and Shift+D to show/hide/maximize/restore as necessary. 

I don't understand. If, say, you're editing notes in Track 1 in the PRV, and collapse the MultiDock and then want to edit notes in a clip in Track 10, what do you do? Even if you click Track 10 in the TV and hit D to expand the MultiDock, you still see Track 1 in the PRV, don't you? So, double-clicking the clip to open the PRV is easier, and Fit MIDI Content can be assigned a keyboard shortcut.

The layout in the screenshot posted above is exactly the same as mine. The real PITA for me is that when you double-click a clip in, say, Track 10, the PRV opens as expectd BUT hides the clip so I can't efficiently do simultaneous editing of the clip and the notes. In another daw I use (Studio One), if you double-click a clip in the track view, the piano roll opens and the track view automatically scrolls to show the track just above the PRV. It's really helpful (I've already requested this to CW).

Jlien X
The real PITA for me is that when you double-click a clip in, say, Track 10, the PRV opens as expectd BUT hides the clip so I can't efficiently do simultaneous editing of the clip and the notes.

SONAR normally does autoscroll the focused track into view, but in this particular case it doesn't work as expected because at the moment you double-click the clip, that track is already in view so no scrolling is needed. But the pop-up of the docked PRV changes the Track view window.
 
To fix this, SONAR is going to have to anticipate what the size of the TV will be after the PRV opens, and scroll the view according to that "future" state.
 
In the mean time, a workaround is to move focus back to a track currently showing in the TV, and then click the track in the Tracks pane of the PRV track to move the focus back to that new track. The TV will then scroll as needed to show that track in what's left the smaller TV.
 
 
 
 

What I find difficult is that you can't have more than one PRV window in the multidock. Double clicking another clip opens that PRV window in the same spot as the previous one.
 
Yes, you can open several clips in one PRV window, but that is not always conducive to my work flow. Having several PRVs in the multidock would speed things up immensely for me.
 
Is there is a setting to make this happen?
 
And how does the View menu "Fit MIDI Content" work? It seems to do nothing here.

scook

soens
What I find difficult is that you can't have more than one PRV window in the multidock. Double clicking another clip opens that PRV window in the same spot as the previous one.
 

Right-click on the existing PRV tab and enable "Lock Contents" then double-click another clip to open another PRV window.

Yes this works. But what I found is that I work much faster with all the midi trks I need in the same PRV. And if I only want to see one, two, or more, just click the appropriate music note icon for that trk in the track pane to the right and you can have everything you want.
 
Can anyone answer:
Where does Cakewalk hide the PRV hotkeys? I would like to be able to open close the Track Pane while in the PRV. I have looked, (briefly) for it and found all kins of other hot keys, but no PRV specific hot keys. 

Grem
Can anyone answer:
Where does Cakewalk hide the PRV hotkeys? I would like to be able to open close the Track Pane while in the PRV. I have looked, (briefly) for it and found all kins of other hot keys, but no PRV specific hot keys. 

In Preferences - Keyboard Shortcuts click "Area:" and select "Piano Roll View".
Then scroll down to "Show/Hide Track Pane" and assign a key to it.

Can anyone answer:
Where does Cakewalk hide the PRV hotkeys? I would like to be able to open close the Track Pane while in the PRV. I have looked, (briefly) for it and found all kins of other hot keys, but no PRV specific hot keys. 

 

Grem, you didn't read my previous posts, did you? ;)

 
http://forum.cakewalk.com/FindPost/3038837

And thanks for the quotes, soens. I'm on a smartphone and it's PITA to edit quotes :/