Moving On

Have to use what works for you. In the last couple of months I upgraded from Artist to Professional to Platinum. Cakewalk made some attractive email upgrade offers.
 
 Sometimes I am a bit overwhelmed by new added features, redundant plug-ins, and "content". But I do find that I like the functionality of the core program for what I do. And all of the extra features are there should I run into a situation where they will be useful.
 
Apparently notation is very important to you. So the funtionality of the core program is not meeting your needs. I guess Sonar won't be the perfect tool for everyone.  I never use notation, so it is irrelevant to me. 
 
Good luck in your endeavors.
 
 
 
 

What are you moving to?

Hay Tom.
I am presently testing more and more software on PC, and now Mac.
 
I am trying out studio 1 (3) on 8 core mac. UAD dual firewire satalite/ via thunderbolt adapter, and Allen and Heath zed r16 x2.
Logic, and Protools 11....all work better on with Thundebolt.
Sound forge also has not given me any troubles on the Mac..
And other things...
I have crashed it a few times overloading plugings...Imagine that....lol
 
For song writing Studio 1 does have features for setting up chorus, bridge, and such on the time line, and once setup, one can move all tracks under the headings to change or try new mashing of...and bring it all back if needs be,...I also believe they have a Midi score freature addon one can use for extra.
I have Sibelius 7....on both PC and MAC...so I can do any editing on score in that...and render to midi, or audio.
 
Studio one also does Volume Leveling  for mastering of finished tracks for CD production...and it is kind of Just learning the new ways, different software address the word DAW...
 
Well thanks to the Grouve 3 website, any Daw you want to get, you can watch videos to get up and running, or just see it performing before you buy.
 
I think a worth while venture in payment is to Join Grouve 3, and check out some of what is out there before you buy anything...and even then check out the forums of any potential prospect, and see what is up with the people using it, before sinking into a cash cow....But it seems a pinnacle is now out, and stability can be reached in or on PC and MAC to a degree of merit.
 
I think for the PC side of things.
One really has to tweak the system for the purpose one wants to get out of it.
 
If you move to a system for audio video...?....Some of the bells and whistles Like wi fi, and even internet nics,...CAN CAUSE  issues With system performance.
 
And the new stuff just keeps on being added in...M2 ports, and Sata express, USB 3.1...new memory...new cpu, ...always new...But is it being perfected?....and the old tossed out ...
 
I think windows MS should bring back the early days ability to lock down IRQs on slots, on the MB, non plug and ply like..(to make exclusive to that device only)...through Bios also,... to exclusive states for designed designer setups of WS PC builds, and make selective boot ups, into different setups of the add on devises needed to work without interruption of the cpu, or memory, and work wanted to be done with Memory and HD/SSD/CD/DVD/Blu ray..
 
Some MB Bios let you make IRQ requests still?
 
Any hoot...Not sure about Studio 1 on a pc yet...
But I will be installing it shortly on a new x99/6core/32gb/Nvidia970 strinks/ thunderbolt 2 system Build.
I will also be testing win 10, and Sonar with this setup , using a Motu 828 TB Audio offerings.
 
I do think Protools works better on a MAC.
 
But no matter what you pick...I assure you, you will encounter issues!
 
In other thoughts.
I find turning off redundant devices ""in Bios"" more effective than using MS OS control panel.
 
Here is why,..."" I believe""....(No religious intent Meant)...LoL
 
When you boot up into windows..(with out tweaking the bios ), windows will boot up the drivers first, or install em, if it finds em, and drivers for nic, in its data base folder, or on its server when and if a nic is found, and installed for, when installing the OS, and load services up for them, then when entering the desktop, it will seek the instructions for Services once drivers are installed for all Main board devices...if it can find them...
 
Then you (enable or disable in control panel.)...((I believe))...and turn off lets say Wi fi in that control panel...But I believe also the services stay on waiting for it to be re enabled....running or checking for...that device...now disabled....windows logs..checks for connections...((see auto updates running as services?))(when this is checking it needs X internet nic...And services running for))...and this could cause issues with slight bits of time taken from the cpu doing your work...to do that check.
 
If you turn off redundant issue causing Devices in Bios, the redundant devices is not dected or loaded any drivers for OS on boot up...Windows does not even load the drivers for it...as it is not detected at all, as Bios turns it off on the MB before booting up win OS....check control panel...Not listed in there eh?...so no log...no service?
 
Now some may or may not agree....
But from my testing and seeking to route issues with audio ...and it has been a nightmare since the dawn of..PC.
So many things plague it in the MS world....That it becomes a troubleshooting nightmare the more you try to get all the bells and whistles working on some motherboards with 3rd party devices,...and the wide range of ports to use...mostly because of funds, and cost being high on new gear...and perhaps not enough cash flow to play with more than one ...at first.
 
Which one is best?....and can it work if..X, Y , or Z is used with....and if removing this, does it help or worsen?....
 
Round we go...and then the standards change on everyone.(new os)(new software with bugs attached)..and it starts over....""troubleshooting""....I wish this hat would be retired in my house...
 
Yet it is always something needs addressing, or was corrupted via the new.....or the change...or the added or taken out due to failure.
 
Yet it is as I know to be the cash cow method, of reselling the same old, with a new face, and new port, new this, new that.....
 
8 track Tape my friend was much easier, to capture the magic of murh, with a good old Multi FX processor or two, and a small mixing board....(and a reel to reel)( Imagination, and methods made much more fun, because it mostly worked right out of the box )...and a few cables and mics in the room....methods bent time....Until needed repairs entered the scope of field of dreams.
 
Now time is Method lost wasting away seeking bliss....in a box...
 
Remember, Music comes from the minds that melds it....you do not need the box....to write score!
 
 Have a look at Reason Propellerhead on Gouve 3...also...
a scanner to scan paper score...into x is possible.
 
Just try n have fun!
Hope you find your bliss inside you, already made!
 
Cheers!
 
 
 
 
 

TomHelvey
 I'm not that great at song writing, but I can produce the crap out of a well written song.
 

I find that is the last thing you need to do to a well written song Tom! A trained monkey with a dictaphone could capture a great song that stands on its own merits. The not so brilliant ones maybe:)
 
I use Sonar mostly to produce backing tracks for live shows as well and am yet to find any other DAW hat has a playlist function like Sonars. I would miss that, amongst other things.
 
I hope you find something that suits your workflow.

I agree Cactus Music...too much change...too many updates...to much to get it working, or making it not work as one does update...(dependent on So many variables)...But if and when one does Get it working (whatever is being used for Music or video, or all things Rainbow'd in the specs of said or proclaimed by, and one has it all working, as said it would or should)...Unplug the internet...and make sure you back up the drive, clone it, and then some...notes taken on setup as one goes through the process of making it on that system, a log booking of tweaks to get it running with...verisons and such of drivers /software ....
 
Just unplug that cloned drive once tested , put it away in a static free bag on a self well labeled....and continue with the system drive set to that spec...no more internet/wi fi on that system....(It becomes a music /video editing system only)...So a second system is then used to do the downloads and scanning, and or making portable content for the Work Station system...making sure one backs up before any changes,or setting a restore point first....
 
Make sure everything brought into the WS system hence forth...Is scanned with a outside system for virus.
 
Should be able to keep that WS system working for a long time if no changes take place....for a long time, with out change at all, if it is working perfectly.
 
Anything found over time to not be working as it should be, or was, can only be attributed to, and or addressed by devices becoming old, and failing parts there in due to age, or over stressed in voltages...or change done by the user.
 
Thing is, it is never perfect perfect here to get to that stage...it seems.
 
So I have fun testing new stuff....to try to find the magic mix of device per blissful experience encounters on OS.
 
I think I found a helping hand with Thunderbolt 2...on PC...and windows 7-10
 
Thunderbolt 2 supposedly address memory directly..(cpu does not need to involve itself?).I was told, (could be a security issue perhaps?)...Perhaps not if one disables the networking and internet nic....
 
why it is not such a problematic with me any more, the glitching, drop outs, and latency...even lost drivers in said software perhaps?..... setting up firewire or usb audio so much today, when using those two ports, with some of the devices that plagued my experiences in troubleshooting that Firewire  card/cards of plenty 400/800 TI/LSI VIA solutions with audio interfaces of a few...and with usb being some what slow..and hindering things also with noise...espcially mouse movements...and or HDMI on video....also hindering progress...in that last stages before Thunderbolt was employed here.
 
Never finding the bliss myself until trying Thunderbolt PC ASUS z87 quad board with onboard TB... many say they have found just with firewire (and some saying no tweaking necessary in win 7 and or 8.1?)...I found some bliss, in XP and *98 se via tweaking the snot out of the OS and sytem Bios , and making configured boot setups for music, and another for internet..selectable on boot...A, b, or c...each one a different configuration for the task needed when turning it on..MS allowed for higher hands on tweaking,to configure the cards as exclusive to a specific irq,, so no sharing would occur at all, and memory ranges could also be setup to not conflict....
 
But do they truly have that perfectly working now....Automaticly?.....hmmm?
 
Yah, it is getting too confusing, too much updates all around the table....sure makes a programmers offerings for cost...a problematic also....I am sure the bakers of any software...must be hairless, with all the third party this, and OS changing to ?....and stay stable...is impossible to do!
 
 
 
Cry if one needs to let out wheens...whelps ...Truly we all know it is frustrating to get things working sometimes, due to choices made, or hidden defects, even pilot error...(not all the same...remember, plus or minus % on some capacitors/resistors, diodes, and transistors...and rf / magnetic fields play havock also on ...simular if not identical gear...but one may not perform as the other...with same employed gear.....
 
I do see it getting better, and then I see the methods being employed to keep it off balance...So it always needs fixing....for a cost no doubt about it....and more troubles...keeping us out of trouble with troubles......wink.
 
still rain songs sung, then some thunder bolt to enlighten me came forth, a rainbow dream started a new method, and new hair growth has begun, for over the hills and far from there yet, away just out of the crime of the century.....I do see a solution coming more so, that is rock solid!
 
cheers.
 
 
 
 
 
 

I think Cakewalk put themselves behind the 8-ball when they announced monthly updates with new features.  The start up screen was IMHO not necessary and half-baked.  If the bakers would say  "we are working hard on improving the notation portion of Sonar so there may not be an update this month" then come through with it a lot more users would be happy.  I know that they don't announce things that are coming but if they did in this case I think most users would welcome it.  

I believe that they should stop implementing 'improvements' that effect other usable things, like when an update messed up the Custom module.  Noted that the bakers are super when repairing such problems but as anyone in research knows it may take more than a month to totally examine a new feature.

This is just my opinion and you may not agree.

I agree with some of what has been said. I think the monthly thing is putting too much pressure on Cakewalk's resources. The start screen looks more like alpha code to me, and this was the sole "big" feature for the month. Maybe it's time for Cakewalk to consider bi-monthly.
 
Les wrote "Logic, and Protools 11....all work better on with Thundebolt."
Better than Sonar? If so that's absolutely not true. If it works better thank the driver not the DAW (which is abstracted from such things).

Cactus Music
http://www.jdkoftinoff.com/main/Historic_Projects/The_Pro_MIDI_Player/

 
Too orange for me. I'm outta here.

Good luck on your musical journey. Hopefully you can find a DAW that neatly matches your needs and you may need to never upgrade it. Some people still make do with 8.5 for example. I think DAWs are converging to the same place.

RD9
I suggested quarterly updates might be more convenient for most users.

 
The reason Cakewalk structured updates the way they did is you can update quarterly if you like. Or if you want to be on the bleeding edge, you can update every month...or update one month if there's a feature you really like, then not do anything for another six months. Or jump off for a year and come back in again later.

 
I haven't really found the updates disturbing my workflow. Something like the Drum Replacer is just another module I can use or not use. A lot of the other updates enhance something that already exists, like VocalSync or MixRecall, so you can use them the way you used to use them and ignore the new options if you don't want to have to deal with them. 
 
But, there's an important caveat here: I use SONAR almost every day...I just did a couple video soundtracks last week, and am finishing up another one tonight. So I'm really, really familiar with the program. If someone works with SONAR on a less regular basis - or any other complex DAW, for that matter - it's like being a guitar player and losing your callouses because you haven't been playing. 
 

Surprisingly good comments from several contributors.   I'm in the camp of sonar user since long ago, so it's comfortable to me, but I agree with many of the comments above:  monthly updates are too frequent, and the broken record comments: fix the problems don't introduce new 'features' with new problems.    For the next big Sonar move, hire a program manager with discipline: no more wild changes, some contractor adding something here, some contract programmer adding something there, some documentation team completely lost and resorting to adding endless links to other lost documentation.    There is really still a market.  Cubase, seems like the market leader, is still imperfect and hasn't caught up to the fact that modern monitors and tiny print don't work well together, and that 'logical editor' is perhaps too illogical for most ordinary users.   The soundforge model might be the best one: do what you do really really well and don't agonize over not doing other things.

What's CTRL+D meant to do that it doesn't do?

Vastman
It's kinda sad... I've spent time on other DAW forums... most are very poor compared to Cakes, which is by far the most vibrant... but the one thing I see everywhere is the same old TomHelvey post, the parting shot out the door.... "Moving On"...
 
Don't really get it... the need to blah blah blah... I like the Craig's perspective... different strokes for different folks... and they're all different.  Each DAW deserves respect and I think the nasty petty mememeism's are sad.
 
I may add a new daw someday, as I really would like better song arranging...but can't imagine pissing on the marvelous job the bakers are doing... nor ever dumping Sonar as it is pretty amazing and is wonderful to work within.  
 
Respect is sorely lacking in certain humans these days.  

I like your comment!  I was just marveling to myself the other day how cool Sonar is, and that there's so much available at my fingertips to get things done so conveniently. I would have been awe of what I can do now if I was sitting in my studio several years ago.  Useability and functionality have remarkably advanced, and to our advantage.  I can't see reason to complain. Just compliment.

+Ah my friend Alex..?..I did not say Protools or any other work better than Sonar....I said that it works better on a Mac....and in my case with thunderbolt 2.
 
 
 
Right Alex?

Anderton
The reason Cakewalk structured updates the way they did is you can update quarterly if you like. Or if you want to be on the bleeding edge, you can update every month...or update one month if there's a feature you really like, then not do anything for another six months. Or jump off for a year and come back in again later.

 
Windows 10 update comes with a slow ring and an insider programme. You decide if you want to be fast and bleeding edge or slow and stable. You have a choice. With Sonar seems every month we are on a bleeding edge updates, and sure we don't have to update.
 
I think it's fairly safe to assume that this month the start screen was rushed out the door half baked, worse still it is the first thing that happens when you start Sonar. It's a first impression thing. Sure you can switch it off, but here is the thing:
 
a) This gives a first impression for people running demo's who might buy Sonar.
b) I would suggest that the customer expectation in general is that each monthly release should be stable, esp in a DAW environment.
c) The start screen was more of less the only thing this month.
d) The perception is features will be rushed out the door every month come what may.
e) Every month we are left wondering when and if Cakewalk will fix regression issues quickly or not.
 
Now if there was a fast ring and a slow ring much like windows 10 update, maybe customer expectations could be managed. Of course a customer can hold back, but if beta code is introduced upon each release they are left with a choice of evils every month.
 
So far Cakewalk have done a brilliant job management our expectations in the forums, but this month there's has not been much communication (e.g. little acknowledgement with start screen issues). And this is understandable as it's clear they are extremely busy working on those audio enhancements, but I would not say it is ideal.