Dan DAmico
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 14:23:29
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ORIGINAL: Desperate Dan
My temps are about 20c cooler than they were with the stock cooler at 100% load in Prime 95.
I Have found that TAT (thermal Analysis tool) From Intel stresses the CPU more than Prime 95 does and 100% CPU on prime doesn't give the Same Temperature that TAT generates. Also it's made by Intel so it should be accurate, also you can have the stress levels set to 50% for 20 seconds then 60 etc etc to stop borderline overheating before it get's to CPU shutoff temperature. I mistakenly set my 2.4 CPU to 3.6 and it just ran a little bit hot but I could see it approaching the 63 Degree limit and went back and checked my settings and found incorrect Multiplier values.
I'm aware of the TAT, but my goal in testing with Prime95 is to check for stability at 100% load, and not to drive the CPU to thermal shutdown temps. Under normal usage, my CPU temps never come anywhere close to what I see with 100% Full load under Prime95. Do you know what acceptable motherboard temps are with the P35 chips? I'm testing with 1600 FSB now, and my motherboard temps read by the onboard sensor are about 33c when under full load, after about an hour. That's about 3c higher than 1333, and 5c higher than 1066. Does that seem OK? The heat sinks aren't very warm.
post edited by Dan DAmico - 2008/04/23 14:25:58
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losguy
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 14:50:18
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Re: BIOS settings not working / sticking after a flash... sometimes BIOS controllers like to be reset after a flash. If the Gigabyte supports it (and you haven't already tried it), you may want to attempt a CMOS Reset. (For the ununitiated: Be sure to follow the MOBO manual EXACTLY on the reset procedure. Some MOBOs can fry if you don't do it right!)
post edited by losguy - 2008/04/23 15:09:00
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Lanceindastudio
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 14:53:10
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battery out for 30 minutes, or as I read here, put in the opposite way for 5 seconds does the trick. I had the bios not sticking problem and this worked like a charm.
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losguy
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 15:45:59
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I was curious, so here's your MOBO manual. You can clear the CMOS (reset the BIOS) either by the battery method (page 30, section 19) or with the jumper method (page 29, section 18). It looks like both do the same thing. The jumper method saves wear & tear on your battery holder. Whichever you do, be sure that 1) the power is off and the PSU is unplugged from the wall before you do it, and 2) you put the jumper or battery back the way it was before you plug back in and power back up.
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dewdman42
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 16:23:37
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Can some of you guys who have had success with the Beta Bios please confirm that after resetting the CMOS everything in the BIOS is functioning normally, including vcore settings and everything else?
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Dan DAmico
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 16:42:32
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ORIGINAL: dewdman42
Can some of you guys who have had success with the Beta Bios please confirm that after resetting the CMOS everything in the BIOS is functioning normally, including vcore settings and everything else?
I flashed back to the last official BIOS for my board, F3, and everything is working as it should. EDIT: I think I misunderstood you. I haven't tried resetting the CMOS with the beta BIOS yet, but I will.
post edited by Dan DAmico - 2008/04/23 17:02:31
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Desperate Dan
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 16:42:40
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I'm aware of the TAT, but my goal in testing with Prime95 is to check for stability at 100% load, and not to drive the CPU to thermal shutdown temps. Under normal usage, my CPU temps never come anywhere close to what I see with 100% Full load under Prime95. Hi Dan, No I didn't mean push it into the red temp wise,Mine happened to go there because a) It was a real hot day and b) I had overclocked it to 3.6 without realising it. I just meant that you can set your CPU load and that 100% on TAT is more than 100% on Prime 95, that's at least according to my calculations. I Can runother programs with Prime95 running, I can't run anything with TAT speeding along at 100% load on the CPU cores. Do you know what acceptable motherboard temps are with the P35 chips? I'm testing with 1600 FSB now, and my motherboard temps read by the onboard sensor are about 33c when under full load, after about an hour. That's about 3c higher than 1333, and 5c higher than 1066. Does that seem OK? The heat sinks aren't very warm. The Board temperatures vary from board to board, my previous Intel board never shut down but the ASIC chips were reporting 50 Degrees C in the Zone 2 which was right next to the CPU it never shut down but was always too hot under load, I figured a Dud ASIC chip as the Board was really well cooled and all the rest of the temp zones were way within bounds. Now back to Gigabyte being such a nice company and replying to my request for a new Bios, the F3e version they gave me the download link for actually made my DPC latency even worse, needless to say I'm somewhat dissapointed. I Have spent some time stopping and starting different services and have found a few culprits that were causing some spiking and have removed them. With regards resetting the CMOS in the Gigabyte manual they reccomend shorting the Two battery terminals with a flat screwdriver which won't wear out the Battery compartment, although how many full resets does one actaully have to do?
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emwhy
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 16:44:14
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Hey Lanceindastudio, I see we're using the same board. Keep us posted as to how you fair with the beta BIOS, I'm knee-deep in some projects and can't do any tweaking. That being said I did roll-back this past weekend to F3 as I stated upthread and all is well, the spikes are gone. I had a session last night where I was tracking a guitarist, bassist (both through Amplitube) and myself on keys at the same time with a soft synth. I was at 2.2 ms on my Edirol UA 101 and no glitches or dropouts at all. I didn't really get them before, but things seemed more stable.
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Lanceindastudio
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 20:36:50
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hmm ok well F3 where the heck do I get that? Is it on the site? Also, do you overclock?
I lowered back down to 3ghz as 3.2ghz was running the cpu hot with stock cooling during Prime95 torture test
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dewdman42
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 20:47:28
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Yea I tried all kinds of different ways to go higher than 3.0ghz and every time the CPU just got a little bit too hot for comfort in Prime95 or else if I lowered vcore it would not pass the tests for very long. The Vcore requirements start to jump up considerably beyond 3.0ghz. My conclusion is that stock cooling is meant for no higher than 3ghz. I fully plan to get better cooling and go to 3.2 or 3.4 later, but for now I'm pretty happy with the stock cooling except for the noise, at 3ghz.
There is a huge difference in performance as measured by benchmarks between the stock CPU speed and 3.0ghz(with optimized FSB and ram speed also). Not as much of a noticeable difference between 3.0 and 3.2, but the difference is definitely there. I want the better cooling anyway just be quieter, so once i have it I will bump up to 3.2 or maybe even 3.4 and call it a day. But 3.0ghz is like the easy everyone-should-by-default-do-it-OC for the Q6600.
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Lanceindastudio
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 21:47:09
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yeah well I was going from 1.8 on my e6320 and 3.0ghz all day hehe
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emwhy
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 21:50:01
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Hi Lance....No I do not overclock...yet. I've only had this rig for about 2 months and so far it more than meets my expectations at 2.4ghz. The F3 BIOS was listed on the BIOS page for the board. I read either on this thread or the other one that it worked for someone with our board so I tried it out Sunday. So far so good.
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Mahlon
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/23 22:45:10
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Hey there. Got a GA-P35-DS3L here and getting the same spikes that other users of this motherboard are getting. Sent a request to Gigabyte to look into it. Will report back if any news. EDIT: On F5, by the way... Mahlon
post edited by Mahlon - 2008/04/23 23:04:02
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Lanceindastudio
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 00:20:52
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Ok cool man. My spikes are pretty low overall, spiking in the green still close to 500. Im using bios F8a
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SteveD
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 08:07:32
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ORIGINAL: Mahlon
Hey there. Got a GA-P35-DS3L here and getting the same spikes that other users of this motherboard are getting. Sent a request to Gigabyte to look into it. Will report back if any news.
EDIT: On F5, by the way...
Mahlon
http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.asp?m=1365807
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Mahlon
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 10:38:32
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Thanks Steve,
Rolling back to F3 -- I'll try that. But I want to upgrade my processor soon... so I hope we get a fix.
Mahlon
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emwhy
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 13:38:45
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Thanks Steve,
Rolling back to F3 -- I'll try that. But I want to upgrade my processor soon... so I hope we get a fix.
What CPU are you using now? I have the Q6600 and have had no issues with this BIOS. As far as I can tell the new BIOS revs are for the Penryn series that Intel has come out with.
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SteveD
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 13:55:36
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ORIGINAL: emwhy
Thanks Steve,
Rolling back to F3 -- I'll try that. But I want to upgrade my processor soon... so I hope we get a fix.
What CPU are you using now? I have the Q6600 and have had no issues with this BIOS. As far as I can tell the new BIOS revs are for the Penryn series that Intel has come out with.
Yes... Q6600 processor here as well. Mahlon... Unless you're think you might end up with a Yorkfield or Wolfdale processor... f3 BIOS will suite you just fine.
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Dan DAmico
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 15:15:38
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Here's an update: I tried flashing to the beta BIOS, then clearing the CMOS. The BIOS still would not respond to changes in vcore. I flashed back to the last official release BIOS and set up a 3.2 GHz (8x400) overclock. This time I flashed to the beta BIOS and didn't clear the CMOS, and as in my previous testing, it held my overclock settings. So I ran the Sonar 6/7 benchmarks: 3.2 GHz (8x400) RAM at 800 Beta BIOS WDM 64 samples = 62 multibands 128 samples = 101 multibands 256 samples = 122 multibands 512 samples = 134 multibands ASIO 64 samples = 38 multibands 128 samples = 68 multibands 256 samples = 87 multibands 512 samples = 134 multibands Official release BIOS with DPC Spiking ASIO 64 samples = won't play at all without pops and clicks 128 samples = 52 multibands 256 samples = 86 multibands 512 samples = 108 multibands WDM 64 samples = 62 multibands 128 samples = 101 multibands 256 samples = 122 multibands 512 samples = 132 multibands
post edited by Dan DAmico - 2008/04/24 15:38:40
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Lanceindastudio
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 16:28:47
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ORIGINAL: SteveD
ORIGINAL: Mahlon
Hey there. Got a GA-P35-DS3L here and getting the same spikes that other users of this motherboard are getting. Sent a request to Gigabyte to look into it. Will report back if any news.
EDIT: On F5, by the way...
Mahlon
http://forum.cakewalk.com/fb.asp?m=1365807
Hey Steve thanx for that link. I hadnt caught that. I will try the F3 bios tonight! Cheers! Lance
post edited by Lanceindastudio - 2008/04/24 16:49:38
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foxwolfen
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 16:57:23
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I have not read this entire thread, so if this has been stated already, please forgive me. But the problem is with the Intel P35 chipset and not the motherboard or bios. My Asus board shows the same problems with the chipset with the same spikes. My other ASUS board with a different chipset (VIA with a similar CPU/Bios) does not.
I personally believe it has to do with DMA memory management for devices such as IDE/SATA. The regularity of the spikes suggest its occuring when the system polls a device such as a drive. This would explain why disabling every other driver but essential does not seem to have an effect.
There are periods where I get dropouts in music if I have something going on that is accessing a drive such as a SATA based DVDR. Most annoying and I have yet to actually spend any time troubleshooting it as I tend not to have any problems with recording or working in the DAW and that is what I would rather be doing heheh.
I am using a Q6600 @ 1200mhz FSB OCed to 2700mhz. I could take it higher but I do not like how much voltage it takes to get it to go higher, and keeping memory synchronous is more important to overall performance, than having a faster CPU thats asynchronous with memory in a Vista environment (with Vistas new preloading cache that really requires memory bandwidth to be smooth).
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Lanceindastudio
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 17:14:00
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I told gigabyte about people here thinking it is the southbridge part of the shipset, or something ot do with intel's P35 setup, and they said I should try rolling back drivers for the chipset by downloading older ones from Intel's site.
I was like, gee, thanx. lol It's there board, they should solve the problem. This was after they had me try a different bios. Apparently this guy isnt actually aware of any chipset problem.
But, I will try F3 tonight. If it solves the problem, this would tell me that it is probably the bios that is a problem afterall. Then again, it could be a combination of chipset/bios problems, like, perhaps, the chipset is set up in a way that the bios has to be written a certain way for it to work correctly. Otherwise, maybe the chipset is "picky".
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Dan DAmico
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 17:54:38
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ORIGINAL: foxwolfen
the problem is with the Intel P35 chipset and not the motherboard or bios. My Asus board shows the same problems with the chipset with the same spikes. Foxwolfen, Which Asus board do you have that is showing DPC spikes?
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Dan DAmico
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 17:59:40
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ORIGINAL: Lanceindastudio
If it solves the problem, this would tell me that it is probably the bios that is a problem afterall. On my system, with all the same hardware and drivers, just a change to the beta BIOS, all of the spiking is gone. That seems to prove that it can be solved with a BIOS fix. Maybe different drivers from Intel might solve the problem with the BIOS that has the spiking, but I spent quite a bit of time disabling things and trying different drivers to no avail. But I am going to see if Intel has any older drivers posted, and I'll try them out. I'm currently back on the official release BIOS.
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foxwolfen
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 18:10:32
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ORIGINAL: Dan DAmico
ORIGINAL: foxwolfen
the problem is with the Intel P35 chipset and not the motherboard or bios. My Asus board shows the same problems with the chipset with the same spikes.
Foxwolfen,
Which Asus board do you have that is showing DPC spikes?
ASUS P5K with AMI Bios (V0901 - 01/02/08) P35 CS with Intel 82801B (ICH9) southbridge - spikes go as high as 1012us with one spike going up to 2000+ during the run. If you got the spikes out with the bios, then I am probably stuck as ASUS is really slow updating bioses these days, and intel has not released an update for this chipset for well over a year. 
post edited by foxwolfen - 2008/04/24 18:37:36
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mr. moon
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 18:27:22
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ORIGINAL: foxwolfen
I have not read this entire thread, so if this has been stated already, please forgive me. But the problem is with the Intel P35 chipset and not the motherboard or bios. My Asus board shows the same problems with the chipset with the same spikes. My other ASUS board with a different chipset (VIA with a similar CPU/Bios) does not.
Well, please read the entire thread. If you do, You will find some screen captures I posted of my ASUS P5K which does not have any DPC spikes whatsoever. I even include a screen capture of all the processes I had running on the system, as it is an internot computer of mine, not a DAW. My ASUS P5K-SE does not have any spikes either, nor does my ABIT IP35 Pro. The only mainboard of mine that has these spikes is my Gigabyte board (but no longer with the beta BIOS update I'm running). ...Just wondering, how can you have 270 posts in less than a month around here? -mr moon
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Dan DAmico
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 18:34:20
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ORIGINAL: foxwolfen
ASUS P5K with AMI Bios (V0901 - 01/02/08) P35 CS with Intel 82801B (ICH9) southbridge - spikes go as high as 1012us with one spike going up to 2000+ during the run.
Is it simply a P5K or one of the P5K-* boards? The reason I ask is I have a P5K Pro sitting here, brand new and unopened, which I purchased to replace the Gigabyte board. I was under the impression that the Gigabyte boards don't suffer the problem, and some users have posted DPC latency results that don't show spikes with P5K boards. I can still return it, and probably will. I think we need to see what we all have in common. Aside from two Seagate SATA II drives on the Intel controller, I also have a PATA DWD-RW on the onboard Gigabyte (jMicron) chip. I disabled it in the BIOS and still had the spikes. I also disabled it in Device Manager and still had spikes. Are you using any PATA drives? I'm on Windows XP Pro 32-Bit. I see you are on Vista. Have you ever run the DPC test on your motherboard with XP?
post edited by Dan DAmico - 2008/04/24 19:12:02
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mr. moon
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 18:36:53
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Dan, Read my post above. I have 2 ASUS boards; a P5K and a P5K-SE, *neither* of which have DPC spikes. I have posted screen captures in this thread to demonstrate this. -mr moon ORIGINAL: Dan DAmico
ORIGINAL: foxwolfen
ASUS P5K with AMI Bios (V0901 - 01/02/08) P35 CS with Intel 82801B (ICH9) southbridge - spikes go as high as 1012us with one spike going up to 2000+ during the run.
Is it simply a P5K or one of the P5K-* boards? The reason I ask is I have a P5K Pro sitting here, brand new and unopened, which I purchased to replace the Gigabyte board. I was under the impression that the Gigabyte boards don't suffer the problem, and some users have posted DPC latency results that don't show spikes with P5K boards. I can still return it, and probably will.
I think we need to see what we all you in common them. Aside from two Seagate SATA II drives on the Intel controller, I also have a PATA DWD-RW on the onboard Gigabyte (jMicron) chip. I disabled it in the BIOS and still had the spikes. I also disabled it in Device Manager and still had spikes. Are you using any PATA drives?
I'm on Windows XP Pro 32-Bit. I see you are on Vista. Have you ever run the DPC test on your motherboard with XP?
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kp
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 18:39:09
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Ditto - I have a P5KC with a Q6600 and it's solid as a rock. I've never been a fan of Gigabyte BIOSes since ages ago, and I'm very glad I went with the ASUS board (again - my previous board was an ASUS) rather than listen to some of the pro-Gigabyte people here.
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foxwolfen
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RE: Gigabyte P35 motherboards and DPC
2008/04/24 18:58:09
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ORIGINAL: Dan DAmico
ORIGINAL: foxwolfen
ASUS P5K with AMI Bios (V0901 - 01/02/08) P35 CS with Intel 82801B (ICH9) southbridge - spikes go as high as 1012us with one spike going up to 2000+ during the run.
Is it simply a P5K or one of the P5K-* boards? The reason I ask is I have a P5K Pro sitting here, brand new and unopened, which I purchased to replace the Gigabyte board. I was under the impression that the Gigabyte boards don't suffer the problem, and some users have posted DPC latency results that don't show spikes with P5K boards. I can still return it, and probably will.
I think we need to see what we all have in common them. Aside from two Seagate SATA II drives on the Intel controller, I also have a PATA DWD-RW on the onboard Gigabyte (jMicron) chip. I disabled it in the BIOS and still had the spikes. I also disabled it in Device Manager and still had spikes. Are you using any PATA drives?
I'm on Windows XP Pro 32-Bit. I see you are on Vista. Have you ever run the DPC test on your motherboard with XP?
PK5 SE I am beginning to agree that it might be peripheral related. Here are the Spec of my whole system As mentioned, I have an ASUS MB with a Quad Core OCed 4GB DDR2 OZC RAM 250GB PATA HDD (Seagate), one SATA 160GB (Seagate) and one SATA DVD-RW (LG). Creative Platinum Fatality with Breakout box (2 Midi in and one mic) ASIO driver Nvidia GF 8800GTX (768MB) Network is onboard (ANTASTIC) IGB PCI-e Mon is Apple 23" Cinema HD @1920x1200 - with 2USB and 2Firewire running a 20GB external USB HDD and a CF Drive Wacom Tablet (USB) Logitec G15 (134 keys - 16 programmable macro - great to automate the DAW by the way) Korg USB Midi controller/keyboard (off during test) M-Audio PK 88 USB (not pluged in during test) Vista Ultimate SP1 No, I have not tried the test in XP. Cheers Shad
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