Anderton
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 15:43:14
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Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
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DrLumen
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 18:31:36
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Lots of great info in this thread.
When I have ran across these types of issues with USB DVD drives and midi gear it was due to the midi count limit, power saver settings or a flaky USB cable and hub. While having a rash of USB issues, I'm thinking the cable was flaky (like a scratchy mic cable) and would cause the gear to go offline in the app I was using but not show as unplugged and yet another instance would work ok for a while. I replaced the cable and hub and all the issues dissolved.
-When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
Sonar Platinum / Intel i7-4790K / AsRock Z97 / 32GB RAM / Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB / Behringer FCA610 / M-Audio Sport 2x4 / Win7 x64 Pro / WDC Black HDD's / EVO 850 SSD's / Alesis Q88 / Boss DS-330 / Korg nanoKontrol / Novation Launch Control / 14.5" Lava Lamp
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abacab
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 19:18:38
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This problem sounds very strange...
If I start Sonar with my controllers disconnected, I usually get a pop-up dialogue about 20-30 secs after I reconnect my controller:
"The above audio/MIDI device was connected to your system. Do you want Sonar to add this device now? Yes/No"
No Sonar restarts, no reboots, etc required. Plug and play!
I have several controllers and they all seem to function this way. Never had to reboot, but the most I ever had to do was restart the DAW or audio application after turning on a controller.
I wonder if you are doing something that prevents Sonar from showing this pop-up device found dialogue? Like is it popping up on a second monitor somewhere that you have defined that is not visible, or popping under a 32-bit plugin UI?
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 19:41:17
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Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
yes I did. The bat file opens the device manager. Either way, why would Sonar be the only app that won't accept MIDI input? I have Reason demo version on my computer too, I can play in that. Just not Sonar.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 19:44:32
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abacab
This problem sounds very strange...
If I start Sonar with my controllers disconnected, I usually get a pop-up dialogue about 20-30 secs after I reconnect my controller:
"The above audio/MIDI device was connected to your system. Do you want Sonar to add this device now? Yes/No"
No Sonar restarts, no reboots, etc required. Plug and play!
I have several controllers and they all seem to function this way. Never had to reboot, but the most I ever had to do was restart the DAW or audio application after turning on a controller.
I wonder if you are doing something that prevents Sonar from showing this pop-up device found dialogue? Like is it popping up on a second monitor somewhere that you have defined that is not visible, or popping under a 32-bit plugin UI?
funny enough, if I power cycle my MIDI controller, I get this dialog box too! The MIDI port is selected on the track, but when I hit the keys, I get no incoming MIDI data. Sonar is smart enough to detect the presence of the keyboard, but not smart enough to accept the data. This tells me it might be listening on the wrong port. I would suggest Cakewalk check into the code for what port to listen to. I have it on MIDI Omni by the way just as a side note. The only remedy when this happens is to reboot, or close Sonar, open Device Manager, delete the MIDI controller and scan for hardware changes, then re-open Sonar. And again, when this issue does occur in Cakewalk - i can open Reason or any other standalone synth and the MIDI controller works just fine. This is isolated to Sonar ONLY.
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Base 57
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 20:24:16
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Please forgive me if I missed where you have already answered this, but have you tried deleting the TTSSeq.ini file?
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Anderton
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 20:24:34
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AdamGrossmanLG
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
yes I did. The bat file opens the device manager. You also have to specify the showing of hidden devices after running the bat file. Either way, why would Sonar be the only app that won't accept MIDI input? Maybe it's aware of more MIDI devices than other apps and therefore ties up those ports...I don't know what's weird about your system. All I know for sure is I've used dozens of MIDI controllers over the years, probably close to 50, and SONAR has recognized every single one unless there was an issue with the MIDI port limit or a driver written so that the controller had to be used with a specific port. In the former case, I deleted the ghosted MIDI devices. With the latter, if I didn't remember which MIDI port I had used originally, I had to de-install and re-install the driver.
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DrLumen
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 20:36:31
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thedukewestern
Actually - I get this also - and am looking for control panel - power options... but I dont see any of the advanced menu items shown here in the screenshot..?
Once you go into Control Panel | Power Options you should see a few power options available. Out to the right of the names click on "Change Plan Settings" for whichever one is selected. Then in the next dialog box near the bottom should be "Change Advanced Power Settings". That will then show the various devices and you can then select "Disabled" for the USB settings. The other setting is in the Device Manager under the USB controllers. Right click on the various hubs and select Properties, then go to the tab for Power Management and you will see a check box for "Allow Computer To Turn Off The Device To Save Power". Uncheck it. There may be several hubs listed so you will want to look at them all.
-When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
Sonar Platinum / Intel i7-4790K / AsRock Z97 / 32GB RAM / Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB / Behringer FCA610 / M-Audio Sport 2x4 / Win7 x64 Pro / WDC Black HDD's / EVO 850 SSD's / Alesis Q88 / Boss DS-330 / Korg nanoKontrol / Novation Launch Control / 14.5" Lava Lamp
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DrLumen
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 20:46:22
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Anderton
AdamGrossmanLG
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
yes I did. The bat file opens the device manager.
You also have to specify the showing of hidden devices after running the bat file.
Either way, why would Sonar be the only app that won't accept MIDI input?
Maybe it's aware of more MIDI devices than other apps and therefore ties up those ports...I don't know what's weird about your system.
All I know for sure is I've used dozens of MIDI controllers over the years, probably close to 50, and SONAR has recognized every single one unless there was an issue with the MIDI port limit or a driver written so that the controller had to be used with a specific port. In the former case, I deleted the ghosted MIDI devices. With the latter, if I didn't remember which MIDI port I had used originally, I had to de-install and re-install the driver.
Wow, I just got a flashback of when Cakewalk shipped some versions with a midi breakout for the old gameport. I think I may still have it around somewhere.
-When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
Sonar Platinum / Intel i7-4790K / AsRock Z97 / 32GB RAM / Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB / Behringer FCA610 / M-Audio Sport 2x4 / Win7 x64 Pro / WDC Black HDD's / EVO 850 SSD's / Alesis Q88 / Boss DS-330 / Korg nanoKontrol / Novation Launch Control / 14.5" Lava Lamp
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abacab
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 21:27:12
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AdamGrossmanLG
abacab
This problem sounds very strange...
If I start Sonar with my controllers disconnected, I usually get a pop-up dialogue about 20-30 secs after I reconnect my controller:
"The above audio/MIDI device was connected to your system. Do you want Sonar to add this device now? Yes/No"
No Sonar restarts, no reboots, etc required. Plug and play!
I have several controllers and they all seem to function this way. Never had to reboot, but the most I ever had to do was restart the DAW or audio application after turning on a controller.
I wonder if you are doing something that prevents Sonar from showing this pop-up device found dialogue? Like is it popping up on a second monitor somewhere that you have defined that is not visible, or popping under a 32-bit plugin UI?
funny enough, if I power cycle my MIDI controller, I get this dialog box too! The MIDI port is selected on the track, but when I hit the keys, I get no incoming MIDI data.
Sonar is smart enough to detect the presence of the keyboard, but not smart enough to accept the data. This tells me it might be listening on the wrong port. I would suggest Cakewalk check into the code for what port to listen to. I have it on MIDI Omni by the way just as a side note.
The only remedy when this happens is to reboot, or close Sonar, open Device Manager, delete the MIDI controller and scan for hardware changes, then re-open Sonar.
And again, when this issue does occur in Cakewalk - i can open Reason or any other standalone synth and the MIDI controller works just fine. This is isolated to Sonar ONLY.
Well, if I just rolled over to your place and handed my computer to you, you could plug your controller in and use Sonar just fine. At that point, you would need to answer the question, "what is the difference between those two computers?". You would see that the problem is isolated to your computer, for whatever reason, and not Sonar only.
DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ...
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abacab
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 21:35:12
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AdamGrossmanLG
I only have 1 device for my Impact LX49+ so nothing for me to do here, oh and I am able to load up any standalone softsynth and it plays using my keyboard just fine. Just not Sonar (yet the problem can't be Sonar, Sonar simply is never broken).
As a test: if you disable ALL devices under Sound, Video, and game controllers, EXCEPT Impact LX49+ and Realtek High Definition Audio, does the problem go away?
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Cactus Music
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 23:18:54
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Ya I noticed that too, I don't get all those Microsoft devices under Audio, the HD Video audio ( that should be disabled anyhow) and the on board.. so what's with all that ? I'd certainly zap them. But that said, we are talking MIDI not audio, I fail to see why a audio driver would have anything to do with a midi driver. As I said earlier, the problem most likely is the MIDI driver, Midi drivers are sort of like audio drivers and just like we all recommend using good audio drivers,, I also beleieve you need a good midi driver. Sonar is picky. A simple test would be for you to borrow a Roland or Yamaha controller and see what happens. And as I said, don't let W10 install a generic driver if your controller has a proper driver posted or on DVD.
post edited by Cactus Music - 2017/10/26 01:48:54
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 23:36:02
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Base 57
Please forgive me if I missed where you have already answered this, but have you tried deleting the TTSSeq.ini file?
I did not try this, but it seems like a very simple file: [Options] PumpDataMsec=250 UseAlias=1 [MIDI Input Devices] 0=Impact LX49+ 1=MIDIIN2 (Impact LX49+) MaxInPort=1 [MIDI Output Devices] 0=Impact LX49+ MaxOutPort=0 [MIDI Echo Devices] MaxEchoPort=-1 The reason I did not try this, is because I shouldn't have to delete a file every time to get my keyboard to work (especially this happens on many versions of Sonar (dating back to X1) and follows me from computer to computer. I also did not see any reason given to delete this file. I *assume* also it will remove my control surface info as the MIDI Device will no longer be here? Not sure there though, also think it is highly unlikely this will resolve the issue, AND even if it does, the answer here is to delete the file every time? Also I did not delete the file as Anderton assured me its not a Sonar issue. This is a Sonar file, not an OS file. If it helps with the troubleshooting I will be glad to try it though. I just didn't know what the end game here was.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 23:39:48
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Anderton
AdamGrossmanLG
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
Anderton
Did you follow the instructions on MIDI Port Limits to the letter? It's not just enough to show hidden controllers, you HAVE to run the .bat file first.
yes I did. The bat file opens the device manager.
You also have to specify the showing of hidden devices after running the bat file.
Either way, why would Sonar be the only app that won't accept MIDI input?
Maybe it's aware of more MIDI devices than other apps and therefore ties up those ports...I don't know what's weird about your system.
All I know for sure is I've used dozens of MIDI controllers over the years, probably close to 50, and SONAR has recognized every single one unless there was an issue with the MIDI port limit or a driver written so that the controller had to be used with a specific port. In the former case, I deleted the ghosted MIDI devices. With the latter, if I didn't remember which MIDI port I had used originally, I had to de-install and re-install the driver.
I did "show hidden devices" I followed the article 100%. It is pretty fool-proof anyway, not much to mess up here. To add, Sonar DOES recognize it. When I power on the device, I get that message: The above audio/MIDI device was connected to your system. Do you want Sonar to add this device now? Yes/No".
So Sonar IS recognizing it, but I *think* it might be listening to a cached port instead of the current port. This is only speculation. I seem to remember a post a long time ago, back in 2009 or so actually about the caching of USB ports, and how it was recommended to not use a USB hub (which I do not). I am not sure what kind of caching is going on here, but I think its a problem somewhere along those lines. This issue has followed me through 4 different DAW desktops, different controllers and dating back to at least X1, maybe prior.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 23:41:55
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To add..
USB Selective Suspend Setting: Disabled (I've tried enabled too)
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/25 23:43:55
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DrLumen
The other setting is in the Device Manager under the USB controllers. Right click on the various hubs and select Properties, then go to the tab for Power Management and you will see a check box for "Allow Computer To Turn Off The Device To Save Power". Uncheck it. There may be several hubs listed so you will want to look at them all. I am unchecking these right now. I will report back here with the results. Thank You!
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Base 57
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 00:07:16
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Delete the TTSSeq. When you reopen SONAR It will build a new one. You will have to fix all of your friendly names if you use them. You will only need to do this once. It may not fix the problem. Then again it may.
Years ago I had a problem very similar to yours. Back then Cake had phone support. Delete that file was the first thing they told me to do. It worked.
If you are nervous about deleting it, just rename it.
YMMV
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.
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 00:14:02
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Could you not rename the file, or move it elsewhere, then if it doesn't help rebuilding a new one just either revert the name the original file or copy it back from where you stored it, thus not loosing anything, or does it not work like that? Just thinking aloud, similar procedure works fine in a lot of other situations.
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Base 57
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 00:17:11
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Sorry Matron, I edited my post while you were making your suggestion.
You were quick.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 00:20:24
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OK, well let me try these new power settings first. I would like to pinpoint what fixes it. I will try this and see how this works.
By the way, having to delete a file = bug. FYI. I was told this is not a bug, so I didn't go down this route.
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.
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 00:27:02
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It very well could be a bug, a lot of people will discount it from being a bug because it does affect everyone or even the majority, but only a few, it still could be a bug, a bug that is triggered specifically by an individuals personal configuration, that's the way I look at it as apposed to the knee jerk "It's not a bug because I am not seeing it" types of responses anyway. I don't think that just because something only affects a few immediately rules out it being a bug. I could be wrong, but . . .
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abacab
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 00:45:36
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Cactus Music
Ya I noticed that too, I don't get all those Microsoft devices under Audio, the HD Video audio ( that should be disabled anyhow) and the on board.. so what's with all that ? I'd certainly zap them.
But that said, we are talking MIDI not audio, I fail to see why a audio driver would have anything to do with a midi driver. As I said earlier, the problem most likely is the MIDI driver, Midi drivers are sort of like audio drivers and just like we all recommend using good audio drivers,, I also beleieve you need a good midi driver. Sonar is picky.
A simple test would be for you to borrow a Roland or Yamaha controller and see what happens. And as I said, don't let W10 install a generic driver if your controller has a proper driver posted or on DVD.
Yup, I hear ya! It could be this thing or that thing over there. Poking around at one thing at a time may seem productive, but at the same time it leaves too many variables roaming around unaccounted for. So I have learned over several decades of working with computers, that usually the quickest method of isolating a problem is to strip it down to as few components as absolutely necessary to operate, get it working again, then add back one thing at a time until it breaks again. That usually always works, unless multiple things are causing the original problem. That always isolate a single point of failure.
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Anderton
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 01:08:17
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Matron Landslide
It very well could be a bug Well of course it very well could be, and it's even likely. But whether it's a bug in SONAR, Windows, the controller, USB handling, hardware, or the user's understanding of how all these work together is the question. The problem with assuming something is wrong with SONAR is that if you become invested in proving that, if something isn't wrong with SONAR you won't find where the problem really lies. It's like the people who have a problem and so they re-install Windows and re-install SONAR...then find out updating their audio interface driver was the correct solution.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 01:11:59
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Anderton
Matron Landslide
It very well could be a bug
Well of course it very well could be, and it's even likely. But whether it's a bug in SONAR, Windows, the controller, USB handling, hardware, or the user's understanding of how all these work together is the question. The problem with assuming something is wrong with SONAR is that if you become invested in proving that, if something isn't wrong with SONAR you won't find where the problem really lies. It's like the people who have a problem and so they re-install Windows and re-install SONAR...then find out updating their audio interface driver was the correct solution.
But Mr. Anderton - If the MIDI keyboard is able to send data to standalone softsynths and also Reason 9, and the only issue here is receiving data in Sonar... wouldn't it be logical to say MOST LIKELY it is something with Sonar? Sonar needs Windows to reboot somehow. Personally, I have no steak in the matter, I don't care who's bug it is if its even a bug at all. I would just like to get to the bottom of it. Anyway, it might be several days or even a week or two as this problem doesn't always present itself, so stay tuned, I will report here if the power management settings helped. If not TTSeq is next.
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Anderton
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 01:22:21
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AdamGrossmanLG
But Mr. Anderton -
If the MIDI keyboard is able to send data to standalone softsynths and also Reason 9, and the only issue here is receiving data in Sonar... wouldn't it be logical to say MOST LIKELY it is something with Sonar?
And if it's only happening for you, wouldn't it be logical to say it's MOST LIKELY something specific to your system or installation? Seriously, if SONAR didn't recognize MIDI input devices, this forum would be lit up like a Christmas tree. You want to believe it's something with SONAR. Fine, maybe it is and I realize that's your go-to. But if it isn't, you're wasting your time and everyone trying to help you in this thread. I bet if I was sitting in front of your computer I'd have this solved in under 30 minutes. But I'm not.
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 01:24:36
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Anderton
AdamGrossmanLG
But Mr. Anderton -
If the MIDI keyboard is able to send data to standalone softsynths and also Reason 9, and the only issue here is receiving data in Sonar... wouldn't it be logical to say MOST LIKELY it is something with Sonar?
And if it's only happening for you, wouldn't it be logical to say it's MOST LIKELY something specific to your system or installation? Seriously, if SONAR didn't recognize MIDI input devices, this forum would be lit up like a Christmas tree.
You want to believe it's something with SONAR. Fine, maybe it is and I realize that's your go-to. But if it isn't, you're wasting your time and everyone trying to help you in this thread. I bet if I was sitting in front of your computer I'd have this solved in under 30 minutes. But I'm not.
Well it has happened to another user on this post, but still, seems like a rarity I guess, but there's not much the user can be doing here. I'd invite you to Teamviewer in, but you can't press my keyboard buttons. ;)
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pwalpwal
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 10:47:53
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AndertonIt's like the people who have a problem and so they re-install Windows and re-install SONAR...then find out updating their audio interface driver was the correct solution.
re-installing sonar or windows to fix a problem is recommended far too often around these parts
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AdamGrossmanLG
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 13:26:05
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pwalpwal
AndertonIt's like the people who have a problem and so they re-install Windows and re-install SONAR...then find out updating their audio interface driver was the correct solution.
re-installing sonar or windows to fix a problem is recommended far too often around these parts
this cant be an audio interface problem, I am not using the MIDI on my audio interface, plus I've had this with 3 different audio interfaces now. Scarlett, Audient and Behringer.
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Cactus Music
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/26 16:49:12
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abacab
Cactus Music
Ya I noticed that too, I don't get all those Microsoft devices under Audio, the HD Video audio ( that should be disabled anyhow) and the on board.. so what's with all that ? I'd certainly zap them.
But that said, we are talking MIDI not audio, I fail to see why a audio driver would have anything to do with a midi driver. As I said earlier, the problem most likely is the MIDI driver, Midi drivers are sort of like audio drivers and just like we all recommend using good audio drivers,, I also beleieve you need a good midi driver. Sonar is picky.
A simple test would be for you to borrow a Roland or Yamaha controller and see what happens. And as I said, don't let W10 install a generic driver if your controller has a proper driver posted or on DVD.
Yup, I hear ya! It could be this thing or that thing over there. Poking around at one thing at a time may seem productive, but at the same time it leaves too many variables roaming around unaccounted for.
So I have learned over several decades of working with computers, that usually the quickest method of isolating a problem is to strip it down to as few components as absolutely necessary to operate, get it working again, then add back one thing at a time until it breaks again. That usually always works, unless multiple things are causing the original problem. That always isolate a single point of failure.
I think we both agree and at no point has the OP done this. As I said, I don't understand why people obsess about audio drivers when the issue is a midi driver.
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Anderton
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Re: Long Running MIDI Input Issues With Sonar
2017/10/27 02:39:31
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AdamGrossmanLG
Also I did not delete the file as Anderton assured me its not a Sonar issue.
That's not true, and if you can't read what I wrote correctly, it begs the question of whether you can read the solutions that others have offered correctly. For the record, I said: "Well of course it very well could be [a bug], and it's even likely. But whether it's a bug in SONAR, Windows, the controller, USB handling, hardware, or the user's understanding of how all these work together is the question." And: "And if it's only happening for you, wouldn't it be logical to say it's MOST LIKELY something specific to your system or installation?" And: "You want to believe it's something with SONAR. Fine, maybe it is and I realize that's your go-to." Facts are facts. Good luck.
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