Helpful Reply[Solved for me] The Bakery - I do not understand it...

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bapu
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 12:49:25 (permalink)
pwalpwal
damn!



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bapu
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 12:52:15 (permalink)
I wonder... will this thread be bigger, faster, stronger than the Updates For Life announcement thread?
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 12:55:09 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby bapu 2016/11/23 13:00:26
bapu
I wonder... will this thread be bigger, faster, stronger than the Updates For Life announcement thread?


If you keep posting......

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#63
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:01:20 (permalink)
bapu
I wonder... will this thread be bigger, faster, stronger than the Updates For Life announcement thread?


You wonder? Wonders me...

 
Let's give the Bakery a chance.
 
Since I don't know anyone from Cakewalk personally, I can only judge by looking what they did over the years.
 
What shows me one thing for sure: They are not dumb!
 

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:02:44 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Mesh 2016/11/23 13:04:19
Klaus
 
What shows me one thing for sure: They are not dumb!
 


Tell that to the people who still think Project 5 was the bomb.
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:07:28 (permalink)
Careful, Bapu. With the NSA monitoring this thread due to Ryan's careless allusion to the grays working at Cakewalk, they'll probably pick up the word "bomb."
 
Ooops, too late. that knock on your door right now is two Federal agents. 

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:08:47 (permalink)
Anderton
Careful, Bapu. With the NSA monitoring this thread due to Ryan's careless allusion to the grays working at Cakewalk, they'll probably pick up the word "bomb."
 
Ooops, too late. that knock on your door right now is two Federal agents. 


It's cool. I have my tinfoil hat on.
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:35:31 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby tlw 2016/11/23 14:48:24
scook
abacab
Is the Bakery just a replacement for the "Features & Ideas" forum, or is it intended to replace all of the other Cakewalk forums eventually?
 
I ask this because I have not seen this explained anywhere yet.


Reading http://bakery.cakewalk.com/How-It-Works it would seem the scope is larger than just replacing the "Features & Ideas" area.




Well scook, I really hope that's not the case. 
 
Moving the "Features & Ideas" area over to the Bakery seems like a great idea.  I really like this plan.  Anything to improve the process for getting the best suggestions from the community to the product managers and developers is a good thing.  This is one area of the forum that appears broken and needs fixing.
 
But moving the other forums over just seems like a decision to fix something that's not broken.
 
I honestly don't see how using the Bakery format for questions and discussions could improve anything in that regard.
 
I am also a member of several other web forums, including some on StackExchange and Reddit.  But I cringe every time I have to visit StackExchange or Reddit.  The StackExchange format is way too heavy handed in their moderation style, where a question quickly gets voted off the island.  Reddit is obviously anything goes, and a question can quickly get lost in a sea of muck over there.  They are both popular sites, but are they really more effective for questions and discussions than legacy web forums?  I am all for progress, but only if it solves a real problem.
 
The standard web forum format, and there are several varieties, has been successful for many  websites for many years because it just works.  It's like the GUI in an application.  Anything that slows down your workflow is not an improvement. 
 
I am disappointed that Cakewalk would risk it's potentially most valuable intangible asset, it's community, to embark on a great adventure.  What are they thinking???

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:42:04 (permalink)
OH NOOOOOoooooooooooooo...........
 
The Coffee House will be toast?
 
Will buffoonery be allowed in The Bakery? 
#69
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 13:59:28 (permalink)
Nosedive was a great episode!!!
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 14:00:30 (permalink)
The question has been asked but not explicitly answered. Will the Bakery replace the existing forums? I am assuming that, since it will be using a new software platform, full replacement is the intent.
 
A new easier to search forum, and a way to focus that search on results that numerous users find helpful is certainly a major improvement.  Making high ranking contributors (assuming the points system actually works) mini-moderators, will probably be useful, since helpful people are likely to be able to help with tagging etc. Those people are not hidden now to anyone who regularly visits the forum, but a first time visitor is not likely to figure out who is giving good advice on a brief visit. Way too much can be made of the apparent status class ranking a good point system will produce, and of the hurtful disaster a bad system might. If anyone is going to get his feelings hurt by earning a lower rating than Scook, then they have my sympathy. I expect any such simple minded system will both help and disappoint the users, and probably will not help the developers or marketers as much as they think it will. Assuming that only truly useless or destructive posts will be hidden, the option to find the least highly rated answers (which may in some uncommon cases be useful) will hopefully still be available. 
 
The main question to my mind is how long it will take to populate a new system with useful content. There are currently many hundreds of thousands of words of useful advice accessible here, albeit disorganized and largely irrelevant to anyone actually looking for help. I expect it will take years to reproduce that amount of content on a new system. Some of that content is irrelevant to the now current (this month?) version of SONAR, but many users are not on the current membership boat. More to the point is the question of what will happen to the current content. Will it be lost like the Library of Alexandria, or will it remain accessible on a server indexed to a Google search? 
#71
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 14:21:33 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby abacab 2016/11/23 16:03:58
FWIW in 2017 Harmony Central is slated to start some communities for manufacturers who don't have the bandwidth to create their own, but recognize the value. We are currently talking with some companies that are much larger than Cakewalk. 2017 is also when we'll be updating the site to be more mobile-friendly, as now over 50% of our traffic comes from mobile devices. 
 
It would be easy enough for Cakewalk to make the existing forums read-only for the wealth of information they contain, and have us start new forums for the Cakewalk community over at HC. All you'd need to do is bookmark a different URL (although you'd probably need a different sign-on).
 
Our goal wouldn't be to compete with the Bakery, because regardless of some early knee-jerk reactions it's a valuable idea that will serve Cakewalk and SONAR users well once it reaches escape velocity. We could cover the hangout/social aspect that a forum like the Coffehouse currently provides.
 
Communities is what we do at HC (on the other hand we write crappy DAWs). Just thinking out loud here, but the more I think about this...hmm...I'm going to send an email to the powers-that-be at Cakewalk and see what they think. I already talked to HC's Director about this, and he's into it. 

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#72
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 14:44:57 (permalink)
So I read Ryan's main post but am doing stuff so am not going to read the rest of the thread (well not yet anyway).
 
Yeah, I get it and actually kind of got it yesterday after poking around a bit.
 
Here are my concerns/suggestions and they may have already been addressed.
 
I will do my best to participate in the new "Bakery" because it seems to me to solve some of the problems with the forum, especially lately when being flooded with new users (not a bad thing but the forum has indeed changed significantly the past couple years). I see the benefit of urging the more serious folks to participate in a "Stackoverflow" type system both for Cake Developers and end users (particularly power users/professionals).
 
My main concern at this point is, and perhaps this has been covered already, is that the "Bakery" will replace this forum. I would much rather this forum remain mostly as is (aside from pretty much the entire Feedback Loop section... that could easily be shifted to the Bakery IMO).
 
By removing this forum entirely in favor of the new model I think a huge pile of extremely helpful regulars may not participate and/or users/threads that are interesting/productive/useful but don't have a lot of "upvotes" (or karma points or whatever) will not get any eyeballs on them. I prefer the current linear timeline threads/comments for general stuff and just lurking/poking around. Even some of the more annoying posts can contain little tidbits about techniques/features/etc that can be learned from. Also we've seen quite frequently that certain posters who are spazzing out at first (which would likely get them downvoted) or aren't skilled enough to convey what they want/are asking a mundane question (which may simply be ignored and thus disappear in an upvoting scheme) can be helped and become extremely skilled/helpful members.
 
Meh... probably not explaining that correctly but this forum, despite some of its failings is still top notch and should remain as is so us die hards can continue doing what we do uninterrupted.
 
Might I suggest that some threads that get deemed top tier get moved to the "Bakery" with a link in the OP here so that this place remains the same but the creme de la creme is accessible to those who migrate to the Bakery and the Bakery acheives what seems to be it's stated goal (improved signal to noise).
 
I am also VERY concerned about what would happen to THIS forum's archives and how any full migration/replacement would affect searches. I frequently look up old posts as reference (mine and others) via google. What will happen to this massive resource?
 
aaaand then there is the matter of all the subcommunities/friendships/collabs/etc that go on in the background. A full migration might dash some less obvious community activities.
 
Again... I may not be expressing myself properly (I've got a million things going on right now and of course this is all new so I don't think any real answers are available yet) but I hope you guys are careful not to throw the baby out with the bathwater.
 
tl;dr
 
Leave this long standing forum as is side by side with the new Bakery to avoid unintended consquences.
 
Create a system for the best threads from this forum to be moved to the Bakery based on content/popularity/etc.
 
Make sense?
 
Cheers.
#73
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 14:58:39 (permalink)
Anderton
2017 is also when we'll be updating the site to be more mobile-friendly, as now over 50% of our traffic comes from mobile devices. 

 
Please resist the temptation to send iPads and other tablets the same view of the site you send to phones. Desktop-style browsers work perfectly well on tablets and there's little more annoying than to be fed a "cut-down and styled for phone version" of a site when you're looking at an ipad-size retina display.
 
Also please resist the urge to copy the "bakery" and use gigantic typefaces and a layout that's shedloads of glaring migraine-inducing white space.
 
For some reason web developers seem to think tablets and phones are the same, and the less useful information displayed at a time the better. Not to mention avoiding the "scoring" system Cakewalk seem to be heading down. It's a troll, astroturfed or disrupter's dream system and I've seen a few seriously big websites ruined that way.
 
Unfortunately my definition of "ruined" - knowledgeable people leaving and being replaced with one-line snarky drive-bys - seems to be someone's idea of "perfect modern trendy forum design".

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 14:58:58 (permalink)
Beepster, see the post just before yours. Do you see a downside? It makes sense to me.

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 14:59:39 (permalink)
Well, I made one comment on the "bakery" and now can't find it, or the "discussion" it was in. At least, I can't find it after a few minutes looking and I can't be bothered to fight the software any longer than that.
 

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#76
scook
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:03:47 (permalink)
I suspect it is because I changed the topic to more accurately reflect the issue
Click on your user ID in the upper right of the Bakery, open My "Profile" and scroll down to see "Recent Activity"
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:04:53 (permalink)
tlw
Anderton
2017 is also when we'll be updating the site to be more mobile-friendly, as now over 50% of our traffic comes from mobile devices. 

 
Please resist the temptation to send iPads and other tablets the same view of the site you send to phones. 



We don't, it already scales based on the target. We're looking at additional enhancements specifically for mobile experiences.

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:13:49 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby SteveStrummerUK 2016/11/24 20:05:32
Is this about the Cakewalk forums or shifting traffic to HC and improve their bottom line. Do I see a conflict of interest here??
Cakewalk is the owner/operator and will do exactly what they want regardless of how many people don't, or do, like it. All I want is to have a good give and take of information. Setting things up so that your value is measured, voted on and judged is nonsense. It will discourage new comers and if it becomes cumbersome we may lose input from some of the really knowledgeable folks. 
And please kill the stupid slogans. - SERVICE GUARANTEES CITIZENSHIP -  What does this even mean, comrade?
I'm offering what I believe to be constructive feedback, not simply complaining, and my comment should be taken as such.

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#79
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:16:05 (permalink)
Google "big data"  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_data or "data science" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_science
 
Maybe Cakewalk could hire a "big data" guru to write some software to sift through this forum database and create a usable knowledge base from all the good info contained here.  Instead of manually moving things around to a Bakery.
 
Because it seems that the ultimate goal of the Bakery concept is to make the forum info more accessible and useful.

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#80
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:26:47 (permalink)
What's going to happen to this forum and its content? Will it be kept online for searching but no longer able to be posted to? Will it slowly be grokked into the new Bakery? I have several posts bookmarked I return to for info.
 

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:28:40 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby bapu 2016/11/23 15:35:31
But the best link in the Bakery so far is this
 


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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:32:26 (permalink)
azslow3
Kamikaze
I'm confused. Where is this information. I've not seen and email or link. Or have I missed it?

Try to use "Features & ideas" board


 
It's announced in the Stickies. No wonder I didn't see it.

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#83
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:35:48 (permalink)
abacab
But the best link in the Bakery so far is this
 



I won't. I'm a bapu.
#84
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:37:30 (permalink)
ampfixer
Is this about the Cakewalk forums or shifting traffic to HC and improve their bottom line. Do I see a conflict of interest here??

 
Of course not. Jeez. HC is already in discussion with various companies about hosting communities. It would be ridiculous and very rude NOT to offer the same opportunity to Cakewalk. 
 
A community like the Coffeehouse is very close-knit and I would hate to see that go away, if in fact that's what's planned (if it's not, never mind). I know about communities, the one I started on AOL has done three moves and been in continuous operation for over 21 years.
 
I saw the comments here and thought "Gee, I can actually do something to solve this" because I'm in a position where I can make sure that the community will have a home regardless. So sue me.

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:39:00 (permalink)
abacab
Because it seems that the ultimate goal of the Bakery concept is to make the forum info more accessible and useful.

I was born in the USSR.
When something has "ultimate goal" (Communism), has invented ultimate way to "objectively" count everything and based on that make "correct" decisions what should be done (Planned economy)... That is too good to be real (I mean it does not work at all ).
 
PS. It will be nice if "mighty people" which have already participated in this thread can, in addition to describing the shining perspectives of not yet finished thing, answer on a strait and simple question from my first post and already repeated by other.

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:40:42 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby tlw 2016/11/23 16:31:02
Sad that cakewalk is closing this forum ,
imo it´s the best of all  .
#87
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:50:31 (permalink)
azslow3PS. It will be nice if "mighty people" which have already participated in this thread can, in addition to describing the shining perspectives of not yet finished thing, answer on a strait and simple question from my first post and already repeated by other.

 
There may not be an answer. It may be an if-then situation. I don't know, nor would I.
 
What I DO know is that I can keep the community going if all else fails. You're welcome...not that anyone said "hey, cool, thanks for thinking of us." Instead I hear "conflict of interest" and "improving HC's bottom line." 
 
I guess it's just not cool to give a damn anymore, and propose things based on thinking "it's the right thing to do." 
 
I'd take the time to explain the difference between support and community, and a forum and a community, and why it sure looks to me like Cakewalk decided to take complaints about wanting more support and a better way of dealing with the Features and Ideas concept seriously. But I suspect I'd be wasting my time.
 

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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 15:52:14 (permalink) ☄ Helpfulby Kamikaze 2016/11/23 21:13:38
Anderton
ampfixer
Is this about the Cakewalk forums or shifting traffic to HC and improve their bottom line. Do I see a conflict of interest here??

 
Of course not. Jeez. HC is already in discussion with various companies about hosting communities. It would be ridiculous and very rude NOT to offer the same opportunity to Cakewalk. 
 
A community like the Coffeehouse is very close-knit and I would hate to see that go away, if in fact that's what's planned (if it's not, never mind). I know about communities, the one I started on AOL has done three moves and been in continuous operation for over 21 years.
 
I saw the comments here and thought "Gee, I can actually do something to solve this" because I'm in a position where I can make sure that the community will have a home regardless. So sue me.




With all due respect Craig, I feel you straddle too many fences to be truly objective about this. You have a finger in every pie and will win regardless of the outcome. This is one case where you can't say you're just a software user like the rest of us. The fact that you are hovering here speaks volumes.

Regards, John 
 I want to make it clear that I am an Eedjit. I have no direct, or indirect, knowledge of business, the music industry, forum threads or the meaning of life. I know about amps.
WIN 10 Pro X64, I7-3770k 16 gigs, ASUS Z77 pro, AMD 7950 3 gig,  Steinberg UR44, A-Pro 500, Sonar Platinum, KRK Rokit 6 
#89
abacab
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Re: The Bakery - I do not understand it... 2016/11/23 16:01:09 (permalink)
ampfixer
 
With all due respect Craig, I feel you straddle too many fences to be truly objective about this. You have a finger in every pie and will win regardless of the outcome. This is one case where you can't say you're just a software user like the rest of us. The fact that you are hovering here speaks volumes.




Hey Amp.  See my earlier post #82.

DAW: CbB; Sonar Platinum, and others ... 
#90
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