Sonar moving in disturbing direction for me.

So I have been a Cakewalk user since PA8 and a "producer" level buyer/upgrader/user since Producer 6.  It seems like in the old days part of the bonus to buying producer was that you got plugs/instruments that no other version got and they were full versions, none of these "demo" feeling or limited plugs and instruments.  With X2 I suddenly felt like I was paying a ton of money extra for "limited" software versions designed to part me with another $100+ in order to actually utilize the useful features. (Overloud stuff, prochannel add ons etc.)  How is X3 in this regard?  It looks like it is getting worse.  It looks like AD is the real deal but how about the AAS stuff, Melodyne?  (Melodyne seems to be the worst for the ole bait and switch from how it reads).  It almost feels like Sonar has become a free to play video game that sets it up to get you money on the back end if you actually want to play the game.  I have spent many $1000s of dollars riding the Cakewalk upgrade train and now as I try to consider going to X3 this just feels like something is trying to violate me.

I updated Melodyne to the full version after playing with it for a while, so I know both.
 
When I want to try to pick a guitar part out of a CD, I will definitely turn to Melodyne and use features from the Editor version.
 
That said, I don't expect I'll do much of that. I did play with trying to do pitch adjusting on a vocal where there was tons of bleed between the microphones. I ended up not doing it. The bleed and my skill with Melodyne made it so I didn't like the end result. That said, I've never been able to adjust vocal pitch when recorded in a performance setting without random artifacts.
 
If you have a vocal track recorded with isolation it would be really helpful (Essential Version which comes with Sonar would do the trick). The Essential version that comes with Sonar has the features I'd be most likely to use on a recording I cared about. The multi tone thing is more of a toy for me at this stage.
 
I think Melodyne is actually a pretty great perk to throw us while expanding Sonar to handle a new type of plugin. So they are positioning themselves for the future plugins and giving us something pretty great to get us to fund this new development.
 
This is an example of Melodyne trying to pick out all the notes in a stereo recording...
 
I just got some new Zeta2 stuff so I made this goofy recording of How High the Moon...
http://stabilitynetwork.blob.core.windows.net/g-tunes/20131108_HowHighTheMoon.wav.mp3
 
Then, I bounced it down...
 
Now the midi looks like this...

 
And this is what Melodyne Editor Created on the bounced track...
 

 
You can see you could easily pick out the key, but it wouldn't be so simple to translate this back to the original midi.
 

I don't know about it being worse. I have bought every upgrade from Sonar 1 XL to X3 Producer. I have never felt cheated by CW on the included plugins. Dim Pro was included as an LE version for years and I  was happy to have it. Pantheon was not the full version but again I liked it as it was. I don't look at the plugins made by third party developers as cut down but rather meant exclusively for Sonar. Now the big deal in X3 is its ARA embedding and the Melodyne essential as being thrown in for free to get us started with ARA.  It also works with V-Vocal.
 
Overall X3 provides more useful stuff then any past version. This is from a guy that has BFD3 and really has no need for AD. 
 
To each their own. 
 
 

If you can't tell, I totally think X3 is worth the $.
 
I tried to address whether your should upgrade Melodyne from Essential to Editor -- a choice I also made.

I think the only "bait and switch" that comes with X3 is Melodyne, but that is not a complaint - or a bad thing. To secure a full version of Melodyne it would have drove the cost of X3 up quite a bit (that's a pretty expensive piece of software) and that would not have been fair to those that already own Melodyne. The basic version you do get is quite usable, and sounds great (imo - far better sounding than v-vocal, but that's a different discussion).
 
X3 Producer is worth it's cost for the extra's you get. 
 
What I really like is that the lighter versions of X3 keep the core functions (64 bit, unlimited tracks and busses, full vst support, ARA support, etc...). They are only stripping the extras out of those. Now you only need producer if you want all the 3rd party extras included.

My top Two favorite improvements in x3 are 1. The new color options. This really is a great feature for big projects and 2. The new Quad curve EQ. This is very helpful, especially if you're a blind old guy like me. having a built-in spectrum analyzer in the EQ is a great asset.
 
I also like the improvements in things like the new comping feature, VST 3, and all the fixes. All this without the third party stuff make the upgrade something to consider. but when you add in the third party plugs it becomes a no brainer to upgrade. The nomad collection is pretty cool so is Addictive Drums.
 
Other things like the new bifilter2 and the Tape emulator are great too. When I add all this up the upgrade makes sense to me, It is true they swap out third party stuff from time to time, but in my opinion it is always for something better. TH2 is better than Guitar rig. breverb is the best third party reverb they have had so far.
 
Over all I think things are improving in the Sonar X series. Sonar itself is improving. The upgrade is not just a collection of new third party plugs. In my opinion it just keeps getting better. 
 
 

+1 to all the responses. IMO, X3 was a quantum leap above X2. The value in that alone was worth the upgrade to me.
 
As far as "bait and switch" with Melodyne...
   1) Melodyne Essential will suit many user's needs without the upgrade to Editor.
   2) The upgrade to Editor was a bargain as well ($150 versus $300).
   3) Melodyne released a patch to improve the ARA functionality (with X3) so this partnership is a great one. X3 coming out of the chute with ARA on board and it being as nice as it is is rather impressive to me.
 
People love to find bugs, but so much of it WORKS (very well actually).

CakeAlexS

 
It's about time we had a "Like" button

I think Cakewalk provides tremendous bang for the buck. I don't follow the logic of the OP at all.
 
Regards,

Mystic38
I simply cannot agree with any part of your sentiment whatsoever..

I have to agree too that I cannot agree with the OP.  My suggestion would be to move on to Pro Tools or Cubase if you really feel that what the Cake people are doing is disturbing.
 
They don't HAVE to give us anything extra.  I had already purchased Melodyne Editor several months before X3 came out so my serial for Essentials is still sitting quietly in my account.  Was I aggravated that X3 included a free version of Melodyne?... of course not.  I felt as though I got more than enough other free stuff anyway.

LIKE

while I agree that the bang for buck is great for a user who doesn't have many 3rd party plugs already, I think the bundled stuff distracts from the daw itself

i would rather they bundled less & lowered the price

lawp
i would rather they bundled less & lowered the price

You probably have more than your share of plugins, but think of the people that are just getting started and with a lot less money to buy these things.
 
A regular DAW retails in or around  400 euro. You only pay 134 euro and you want to pay less, because you have more plugins and still want to lower the price?
 
I wonder what all the bakers who have spent hours,days, weeks,months,and sometimes years to create the quality they have brought out in X3 and you want it cheaper?
 
Shame on you.

I guess I need to clarify my post a bit.
 
#1.  From a quality and useful piece of software perspective you will never find a bigger Sonar supporter.  I was taking money away from pro tool studios around here with my little Cakewalk based studio in back in 1999.  I have always preferred and staunchly stood by my "toy" software as some of my professional peers would say back in the day.   PT's uber-expensive hardware integration was the only thing sonic that PT had on Cakewalk back then and I always had decent interfaces and pres so the so that was a moot point.

Fast forward to recent days where you no longer need proprietary hardware and I now have a version of PT.  Still hate it, think it is overly complicated and it just sits idle and is only there so when people ask, "Yes I have PT" is my response. 

My point is in X2, the Overloud stuff really did give you just enough functionality that you could discover you needed more.  The Pro Chanel plugs are good, but the best tools for the Pro Chan has to be bought after the fact (CA2A).  I know the new trend in marketing is to give a decent initial software solution for a reasonable price with the plan to sell additional content and functionality on an ongoing basis.  It felt like Sonar had not adopted that model based on 8.5 and X1.  If you had software that came bundled, it was the full blown thing.  I do suppose that it was not third party software as much so that may be the difference.  I was simply musing and lamenting over the new state of marketing.  It does contain at least an element of bait and switch.

My biggest question for X3 has pretty much been answered:  "Is the version of Melodyne that comes with X3 useful as is?"  (thanks gswitz)  Honestly, that and the comp tools are the only reason I would upgrade from 2 to 3 right this moment.  I have a bass soloist doing the vocals for his album and in his really low stuff, (B and below) he is having a tough time holding solid pitch on anything he is supposed to sustain.  So far V-Vocal and Autotune are giving me mixed results that are less than subtle.  I have the original version of Autotune and I am trying to decide whether to drop the bucks on AT-7 or just try Melodyne and get the comping tools to boot.  (also useful on this project)

I think I will try it as $149 for something I am already a fan of is better than risking $399 on upgrading software that is single function and may not help this particular situation.