Anderton
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*This* Is How You Do It...
...and it also shows why this forum can be very, very cool. On December 10, THambrecht posted a thread " Mysterious Behavior After Splitting Audioclips." Even though my initial response about Cakewalk being aware of it but not able to reproduce it got dismissed as a "canned response," several forumites realized what I was saying and participated in finding out how to isolate and quantify the issue. Ultimately THambrecht gave a really lucid explanation, I gave some possible workarounds, there was enough info to reproduce the bug, and Keith Albright came into the thread to say Cakewalk would work on a fix because clearly, it was a potentially significant issue that affected all users, and therefore needed to be prioritized. Because I had been involved in the thread, Keith gave me a heads-up earlier today to say that the problem had been fixed, and the fix would be in the next update. I'm sure some people will be able to put some kind of negative spin on this - it's possible to put a negative spin on just about anything - but I think THambrecht, the forum, and Keith deserve some props for underscoring the tangible benefits to having a partnership between the users and the company.
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John
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 15:02:29
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OK I'll give it a negative spin. Why wasn't it done yesterday? 
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King_Windom
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 15:05:37
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☄ Helpfulby tlw 2017/01/12 19:41:49
I feel this forum and it's members have been very instrumental in the direction, development, and maintenance of Sonar. It is without a doubt the best most useful forum I have had the pleasure to belong to. The Bakers have proven once again that they listen and act to resolve problems..
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promidi
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 15:09:38
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It probably was , but it had to be passed on the the Secret Sonar BETA testers for evaluation for being released (even on the early release program). Of course, the Cakewalk BETA NDA prevents the BETA testers from even revealing that they are testing it.
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Anderton
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 15:17:11
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I did ask Keith for permission to mention it...
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Slugbaby
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 15:18:37
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King_Windom
I feel this forum and it's members have been very instrumental in the direction, development, and maintenance of Sonar. It is without a doubt the best most useful forum I have had the pleasure to belong to. The Bakers have proven once again that they listen and act to resolve problems..
Agreed!
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John
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 15:34:27
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☄ Helpfulby Zargg 2017/01/12 16:16:32
Well I see my negative spin didn't work.
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azslow3
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:39:05
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Anderton
On December 10, THambrecht posted a thread "Mysterious Behavior After Splitting Audioclips."
...
Keith Albright came into the thread to say Cakewalk would work on a fix because clearly, it was a potentially significant issue that affected all users, and therefore needed to be prioritized.
....
Because I had been involved in the thread, Keith gave me a heads-up earlier today
It is good to know that it works. Now my negative spin (tired today, so I am negative  ), but in fact just a suggestion for improvements for this procedure: why Keith could not inform users directly?  For the moment, yet another such story is ongoing, with "Insert marker" / "M" / "VS-100" etc. It is ALMOST the same, except the last part. I mean the bug is affecting almost all users, easy to reproduce, confirmed by CW. But since there is no information it is going to be fixed, the number of threads about it is growing, the air is heated, etc.
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John
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:41:56
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I am of the understanding that it is fixed (the marker insert issue) and will be in this month's update. I could be wrong though.
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Sycraft
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:47:35
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☄ Helpfulby abacab 2017/01/12 23:45:20
People should also take note that the best way to get bugs fixed is to have a reproduce-able method for causing them that you can thoroughly explain and that works all the time. QA for more places isn't lazy, stupid, or uncaring, it is just that issues are often not something they can reproduce. Someone says "My system does X," their system does NOT do X under the same circumstances, near as they can tell, so they don't know where to go from there.
Sometimes software bugs are an obvious thing, lots of users report a fault, developers look at the code, and it is a very simple mistake that they can fix no problem. However often the bug is subtle, relying on the interaction of a number of pieces of code, all of which function correctly in isolation. It can be hard to nail down, unless you know just what to do to cause it, and thus what to look for.
If a bug is something you really need fixed it can take some persistence on your part, not in convincing QA to fix it, but in really figuring out what the bug is.
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kzmaier
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:47:59
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Looking forward to the Jan release!!! Thanks to all!!!
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azslow3
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:52:19
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John
I am of the understanding that it is fixed (the marker insert issue) and will be in this month's update. I could be wrong though.
I also think so. But I have not seen any (semi)official reply. I remember we have discussed related topic, also in PM, ~2 years ago. I just take the opportunity to bump 
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bitman
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:53:01
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☄ Helpfulby bapu 2017/01/12 17:04:03
Pffft another Anderton canned response.... sigh.
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soens
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 16:58:56
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John
Well I see my negative spin didn't work.
Now your just being negative. 
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HighAndDry
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 17:17:51
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Good to hear. a lot of my crashes have happened while splitting clips and working with clips
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henkejs
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 17:21:12
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Anderton
...but I think THambrecht, the forum, and Keith deserve some props for underscoring the tangible benefits to having a partnership between the users and the company.
Well said, Craig! I wish more companies would appreciate the value of an open dialog with their users.
A few of my songs SONAR Platinum, Cakewalk by BandLab, Windows 10, Focusrite Scarlett 6i6.
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John
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microapp
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 18:16:15
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Anderton
...but I think THambrecht, the forum, and Keith deserve some props for underscoring the tangible benefits to having a partnership between the users and the company.
Geez, what did you guys do...have a meeting to discuss a way to deflect requests (in recent threads) for more openness and transparency? And at the same time, why not spin ignoring (for too long) the not insignificant number of easily reproducible bugs that your user 'partners' have been reporting. So if users only described issues more clearly, they would be fixed ? Give me a break. How's that for negative?
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henkejs
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 18:32:06
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microapp
Geez, what did you guys do...have a meeting to discuss a way to deflect requests (in recent threads) for more openness and transparency? And at the same time, why not spin ignoring (for too long) the not insignificant number of easily reproducible bugs that your user 'partners' have been reporting.
I should have been clearer in my remarks. Many companies, including Cakewalk, would benefit from better communication with their users. I don't always think Cakewalk is as transparent or as responsive as I'd like them to be, but I'll still offer some positive reinforcement when the process works.
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microapp
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 18:35:30
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henkejs,
Sorry I did not mean you,I meant Cakewalk et al. I will remove quoting you.
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BASSIC Productions
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 19:42:26
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Positive spin done in a negative way kind of cancels out the effort. We users could use more support and we are telling Cakewalk that by taking the time to comment on this forum. It is good for all of us. It can be difficult for a user to be positive when something isn't working correctly. Mr. Anderton, when something isn't working and you offer a complicated work around, it has a very "... then let them eat cake" kind of feel to us users. We aren't at blame for the problem; we are offering insight into a sophisticated DAW that many of us have chosen to use and support.
We are hoping that Gibson will make an investment in Cakewalk the same way that we users have done.
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Sheanes
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 20:19:50
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Try bying a perfect car, or a perfect house...or build one yourself would be even better !
Haven't had any 'bug' that was a showstopper ever.
If ones not satisfied with Cakewalks customer focus/support they're gonna feel so a lot of times with other manufacturers imo.
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John
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 20:24:06
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☄ Helpfulby mmarton 2017/01/14 15:02:34
BASSIC Productions
Positive spin done in a negative way kind of cancels out the effort. We users could use more support and we are telling Cakewalk that by taking the time to comment on this forum. It is good for all of us. It can be difficult for a user to be positive when something isn't working correctly. Mr. Anderton, when something isn't working and you offer a complicated work around, it has a very "... then let them eat cake" kind of feel to us users. We aren't at blame for the problem; we are offering insight into a sophisticated DAW that many of us have chosen to use and support.
We are hoping that Gibson will make an investment in Cakewalk the same way that we users have done.
Hold on its kinda funny in a way when you think what this forum is. Its a PEER to PEER forum. CW people are not required to be here at all. The fact that they do show up from time to time is really a pure bonus. Yet the funny part is you are complaining on a forum that was never meant for CW to user interaction about the lack of CW to user interaction. I find that hilarious.
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listen
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 20:46:10
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telecharge
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 20:47:42
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AndertonI'm sure some people will be able to put some kind of negative spin on this.
Support is still broken. Haven't been able to book a phone slot for nearly 9 months now. BASSIC Productions
Positive spin done in a negative way kind of cancels out the effort. We users could use more support and we are telling Cakewalk that by taking the time to comment on this forum.
+1 John
CW people are not required to be here at all. The fact that they do show up from time to time is really a pure bonus. Yet the funny part is you are complaining on a forum that was never meant for CW to user interaction about the lack of CW to user interaction. I find that hilarious.
That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it, but Cakewalk should have staff on the forum. Their competitors do. EDIT: Glad you guys squashed a bug, though. Thanks to all who helped.
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jb101
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 20:56:34
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telecharge
That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it, but Cakewalk should have staff on the forum. Their competitors do.
Really?
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telecharge
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 21:32:54
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jb101
Really?
Not all, but most do.
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Anderton
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 23:34:10
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telecharge
John
CW people are not required to be here at all. The fact that they do show up from time to time is really a pure bonus. Yet the funny part is you are complaining on a forum that was never meant for CW to user interaction about the lack of CW to user interaction. I find that hilarious.
That's your opinion, and you're entitled to it, but Cakewalk should have staff on the forum. Their competitors do.
Every minute developers spend on the forums is a minute not spent fixing bugs or implementing requested features. Is that what you want?
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Anderton
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 23:36:25
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I knew people would come in here and say "so why are my favorite bugs not fixed" or "why aren't they more transparent all the time" or whatever.
Positive reinforcement makes progress happen much faster than negative reinforcement. You can choose to contribute to a positive feedback loop, or you can choose to contribute to a negative one. If the latter, expect it to affect the developers as well as other people in the forum.
I presented an example of "this is how you do it" that applies to the community and to Cakewalk. I don't see how anyone can deny that the way this bug was identified and fixed as a perfect example of the value of a forum. I'm more interested in identifying a model that creates future progress rather than complaining about why something has or has not been done in the past.
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Anderton
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Re: *This* Is How You Do It...
2017/01/12 23:50:26
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BASSIC Productions
Mr. Anderton, when something isn't working and you offer a complicated work around, it has a very "... then let them eat cake" kind of feel to us users. I didn't realize you spoke for all users, but thanks for the heads-up. It never occurred to me that trying to help people with problems they're having would be seen as my being callous. I figured people who are having some kind of problem would appreciate any solution compared to no solution. We are hoping that Gibson will make an investment in Cakewalk the same way that we users have done. If it wasn't for the investment Gibson made in Cakewalk, and continues to make a needed, there probably wouldn't even be a Cakewalk.
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