Helpful ReplyFrontier Alpha Track

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 02:18:01 (permalink)
I've been riding on the back of all your efforts for the Alphatrack. I'm using it just not testing it. I'm about to download the latest version.
Just wanted to say thankyou.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 03:11:19 (permalink)
Wow is all I can say. It is just so much more responsive than the Frontier version  and for the first time in a long time, to have control of eqs and plugins.
 
Just a question. In some instances a control is exposed that should be on or off but the display and function operates in percentage. 50% >  is On while 50% < is Off.
The encoder starts at Labelled Off. Any movement clockwise then has to be rotated to achieve 50%=/> for On
 
If it has been explained please just mention the post. No need to repeat for me. I have read the thread but I'm sure to have missed things.

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azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 03:36:56 (permalink)
Sonar expose all parameters as 0. to 1., throw the whole set (0.2, 0.445, 0.734 as an example). They have foreseen "native" resolution hint (I mean it should return that the "resolution" is 1. for on/off parameters), unfortunately the have forgotten to implement it properly for all cases. That means that plug-in can not ask Sonar either the parameter is On/Off or support 1024 or more different "positions".
 
For most fixed parameters (band on/off, EQ type, etc) I have "hardcoded" the knowledge into the preset, so only one tick is required to switch (point me in case I forgot some). But for VSTs generic procedure is used. Sonar/VSTs process <0.5 as 0 and >0.5 as 1. I send whatever I think is the current value + encoder resolution increment (0.1 -> still 0, 0.2 -> still 0.... up to 0.5 -> 1).
 
CakeWalk is well aware about that inconvenience. For MCU they use separate (from Sonar/ACT) configuration files per VST, which list all parameters with range and resolution, also mentioning some of them are binary. I do not have such configuration yet, but it slowly "rise" in priority. In fact it is possible to scan for such information, so no user intervention will be required. That is relatively complicated to implement, please do not expect in the near future.
 

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 03:51:53 (permalink)
The work you've already done is astonishing and has helped me a great deal. I mentioned the issue in the hope I had missed something in a previous post. Nonetheless the other functionality is far in advance of where I was with the old Frontier plugin. I'm very happy. Thanks.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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subtlearts
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 07:11:43 (permalink)
I had wondered that myself but hadn't asked because I figured the explanation would be something like that... Anyway, yes, I think the preset is in a very good place to leave for a while...

tobias tinker 
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gswitz
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 08:16:07 (permalink)
Welcome to Alexey's party train! All aboard!
post edited by gswitz - 2015/05/29 17:18:19

StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen.
I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/05/29 16:30:01 (permalink)
gswitz
Welcome to Alexy's party train! All aboard!

I prefer a party boat, I am on the beach in Italy
 
And since you (attempt to) call me by name... I am Alexey. Other forms are: Loesha, Aleoesha, Leoha, Löscha, Alöscha, Löcha, etc... Some try to call me Alex, which I do not like (in Russian online games/chats that is an equivalent of N00b). But "Alexy" is not in the list

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azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/11 15:22:56 (permalink)
I think my "beta testers" read this forum more often than my... I have uploaded new test version. Complete display functionality is implemented (level/pan indicators, resolution, flip, etc). I have tested how it works with internal display and my MPKMini, but I do not want upload it as the release before someone can confirm that real Alphatrack display works as expected too.

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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/25 16:00:44 (permalink)
Bump... Is my party over?
I want release 0.4, but I need a confirmation it works. Common, full preset (all display features) + working ProChannel EQ + ACT SpeedDial + tunable encoders resolution. No interest?
 

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frankjcc
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/25 16:25:15 (permalink)
I tested minutes after you posted, and the things I understood did work, but there were some things I was not clear on, which is why I did not report back.  things like level and pan does display correctly on alphatrack.  
 
I like the way I can quickly moving with a parameter on a plugin using act the way you implemented it.  However I also did like to use the original way as in when I'm in plugin mode on alphatrack, my three most commonly used parameters are ready to use and page two was not faraway.  Is there a way to get close to best of both worlds on this?

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jimo
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/25 17:00:32 (permalink)
I'm late to the party but this is awesome news! I've been using the AT with limited functionality for so long can't wait to try this out. thanks for putting the work into this. -Jim
post edited by jimo - 2015/06/25 17:06:40

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azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/25 17:43:56 (permalink)
frankjcc
I tested minutes after you posted, and the things I understood did work, but there were some things I was not clear on, which is why I did not report back.  things like level and pan does display correctly on alphatrack.  

Thanks for the information.
 

I like the way I can quickly moving with a parameter on a plugin using act the way you implemented it.  However I also did like to use the original way as in when I'm in plugin mode on alphatrack, my three most commonly used parameters are ready to use and page two was not faraway.  Is there a way to get close to best of both worlds on this?

I can make a variation when the first page is "normal" ACT instead of select fx+select par.+tune. But the best of both worlds is still to be written (I have some ideas but the implementation is not trivial).

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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/25 19:04:08 (permalink)
 
 
azslow3
I can make a variation when the first page is "normal" ACT instead of select fx+select par.+tune.



That would be awesome and greatly appreciated

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/25 22:10:31 (permalink)
Alexey: I've been busy with another project but will try and get some time over the weekend to test. Thanks for continuing with development.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/26 02:28:35 (permalink)
I'm using the latest test version 4r0b427.
 
With multiple plugins inserted. How do I make a plugin active by using the Alphatrack. I can't find a way. Or do I have to do something to make that happen? Thanks for any help.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/26 04:55:58 (permalink)
mudgel
I'm using the latest test version 4r0b427.
 
With multiple plugins inserted. How do I make a plugin active by using the Alphatrack. I can't find a way. Or do I have to do something to make that happen? Thanks for any help.

Can you do this with Frontier original plug-in? I do not activate plug-ins at the moment. When you turn left encoder in Plug-in mode (page 1) you select which FX you will control by Alphatrack. But it is not "focused" in UI, but that can be done.

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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/26 06:12:50 (permalink)
To be honest it was such a long time ago when I used the Alphatrack that I can't remember.

If I have 10 plugins and I cycle through them what's the point of seeing plugin 4 in the AT display and not have it be in focus. Then I have to find it out of the ten plugins using the mouse and click on it to give it focus. I might as well keep using the mouse.

I'll have to experiment some or with it. When I change tracks it automatically connects with the ProChannel eq and controls it without having to activate the PC window.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/26 07:52:43 (permalink)
mudgel
I'll have to experiment some or with it. When I change tracks it automatically connects with the ProChannel eq and controls it without having to activate the PC window.

It is the same with Plug-in Page1 at the moment. You select FX/parameter (you should see the names on the Alphatrack display) and can control it without activation of the plug-in/opening its interface.
 
But as I sad, if you want always focus the plug-in or open the interface for it, that can be implemented (for FX, while focusing ProChannel also works, I have not found the way to show prochannel interface).

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subtlearts
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/26 17:37:12 (permalink)
Hi Alexey, sorry I was away on a family trip that kind of turned into a family medical situation and was without any access to studio or Alphatrack or anything really. I'm back at home now, though very busy with a new show, but I had a quick look at the new test preset and it looks fine here! The 'fancy' display stuff all works perfectly from what I can tell, I hope the pictures I sent were helpful in getting there but of course the credit belongs with you, how much work was it to implement that?
 
I didn't notice anything else broken in the process either. Everything working well here, including Speed Dial and adjustable encoder resolutions. Awesome!
 
I did have one idea while playing around with it however: As it did on the Frontier plugin, on the Pan page, pushing the middle (marker navigation) encoder calls up a dialog for inserting a new marker. I was wondering whether something similar could be arranged for Sends - on the Send page, pushing the same encoder seems to do nothing. What if it called up the Insert Send Assistant dialog? I notice this is on the list of exposed commands on your Command menu, so I can assign it to a Function button, but it strikes me that it would be more useful and consistent if it were on an encoder push like the Marker insert. I just can't figure out how to expose the encoder push logic pages in the plugin to map it to.
 
OK thanks again for the amazing work, the display work is spot on. Even the little *asterisk to indicate fine encoder resolution! Applause...

tobias tinker 
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subtlearts
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/26 17:42:38 (permalink)
ps showing the ProChannel interface - in the Inspector - can be accomplished with a key command: Ctl-I ... maybe you knew this, but I didn't until quite recently - it isn't in the list of programmable / exposed key commands for some reason, it seems to be hard-wired. I haven't figured out if it's possible to open a ProChannel for the active track in Console view, though it would be a nice touch!
 
 
 
 

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 01:21:30 (permalink)
I th No I need to spend some regular time with my Alphatrack to get to know it again. Any pointers Tobias.

I'll have to dig up the old Frontier Designs layout for Sonar.

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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subtlearts
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 04:13:41 (permalink)
mudgel
I th No I need to spend some regular time with my Alphatrack to get to know it again. Any pointers Tobias.

 
Basically, at this point just use Alexey's plugin and preset. It's actually quite simple to set up - run the installer (from Alexey's site - the latest one with finished display code is in the Test downloads area but probably he'll move it over to Released shortly, if others test and confirm it's working), set it up as a controller with the Alphatrack as MIDI i/o, then open the controller page from Utilities, go to the Options page, down to the Tweak Current Configuration menu, third from the bottom, and pull down to Alphatrack. Ignore the customization settings, the defaults are probably fine, or tweak them if you want to (you can always come back and start with the preset again at any time to tweak them). Done.
 
It now works more or less identically to how the original worked - for that brief moment when everything worked (before the new EQ and other X-series changes left an unsupported AT hobbled and half-functional) - except a bit better due to customization and some other nice tricks like the ACT Speed Dial (instantly maps the last control you touched on the screen to an encoder for, umm, more knobby tweaking). Everything works - EQ, Plug-in control, fader flipping, the ribbon, WAI, control busses or tracks... plus if you want to dig into the plugin logic a bit, you have a FAR greater amount of control over everything - you can set up page-specific function buttons, for example.
 
 

tobias tinker 
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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 07:44:16 (permalink)
Alexey, I don't know if it's any help for your Alphatrack work, this link is for the Frontier Alphatrack & Frontier Tranzport in Sonar document.
https://onedrive.live.com...g&ithint=folder%2c

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 14:09:18 (permalink)
mudgel
Alexey, I don't know if it's any help for your Alphatrack work, this link is for the Frontier Alphatrack & Frontier Tranzport in Sonar document.
https://onedrive.live.com...g&ithint=folder%2c

That is the documentation I have used to make my preset, it is available at Frontier site, together with other required documentation (MIDI mapping).

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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 16:52:00 (permalink)
I have made a release out of 0.4r0.
 
frankjcc
I like the way I can quickly moving with a parameter on a plugin using act the way you implemented it.  However I also did like to use the original way as in when I'm in plugin mode on alphatrack, my three most commonly used parameters are ready to use and page two was not faraway.

Implemented (select ACT mode during preset generation).

mudgel
If I have 10 plugins and I cycle through them what's the point of seeing plugin 4 in the AT display and not have it be in focus.

Implemented (select Direct Focus/Open option during preset generation).

subtlearts
The 'fancy' display stuff all works perfectly from what I can tell, I hope the pictures I sent were helpful in getting there but of course the credit belongs with you, how much work was it to implement that?

Quite some work... But I have learned a lot about my plug-in during doing that, and so I have rewritten this (and all other except MCU) build-in preset with more clear C code. Alphatrack preset generation code is 1.5k C lines now (was 2.5k).
 

I did have one idea while playing around with it however: As it did on the Frontier plugin, on the Pan page, pushing the middle (marker navigation) encoder calls up a dialog for inserting a new marker. I was wondering whether something similar could be arranged for Sends - on the Send page, pushing the same encoder seems to do nothing. What if it called up the Insert Send Assistant dialog?

Implemented. Note, you have to be on Send mode  Page 2 (pressing middle encoder in Page 1 change encoder resolution, as for other modes/encoders controlling continuous  parameters).
 
subtlearts
ps showing the ProChannel interface - in the Inspector - can be accomplished with a key command: Ctl-I ... maybe you knew this, but I didn't until quite recently - it isn't in the list of programmable / exposed key commands for some reason, it seems to be hard-wired. I haven't figured out if it's possible to open a ProChannel for the active track in Console view, though it would be a nice touch!

Sending "Ctrl-I" is the only way I know. But I can not check either it is already shown and that key combination is always toggling it. So, no automated use possible.
 
 
 
 








Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
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frankjcc
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 18:02:58 (permalink)
Thank you so much, works perfectly

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subtlearts
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/06/27 19:49:05 (permalink)
Brilliant work! I love the Open UI mode for plugin handling, really a nice touch. Thanks for the Insert Send Assistant action, that's great too, and makes sense on pg2. Awesomesauce!

tobias tinker 
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dede
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/09/08 05:51:29 (permalink)
Alexey, thanks again for your work and latest updates.
Just run the last version on your site to update the one I've been using (so from azctrl_0_3r8b215M to azctrl_0_4r1b281) cause my PAN control stopped working on AlphaTrack.
Now I see that, when choosing AT preset I have an Options dialogue, can't recall having this when I first installed you controller.
Can you please advice on the ideal settings and possibilities s of this? I'm just going with the default values to what what happens.
I'm reading the previous posts now cause it seems many things changed and some nice upgrades added, bravo!
Thanks
dd
 

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mudgel
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/09/08 06:09:20 (permalink)
Anyone have it working in Win 10?

Mike V. (MUDGEL)

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azslow3
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Re: Frontier Alpha Track 2015/09/08 06:43:28 (permalink)
dede
Alexey, thanks again for your work and latest updates.
Just run the last version on your site to update the one I've been using (so from azctrl_0_3r8b215M to azctrl_0_4r1b281) cause my PAN control stopped working on AlphaTrack.
Now I see that, when choosing AT preset I have an Options dialogue, can't recall having this when I first installed you controller.
Can you please advice on the ideal settings and possibilities s of this? I'm just going with the default values to what what happens.
I'm reading the previous posts now cause it seems many things changed and some nice upgrades added, bravo!
Thanks
dd

I keep the first post in the thread http://www.azslow.com/index.php/topic,172.0.html up to date.
http://www.azslow.com/index.php/board,2.0.html has the history of all changes between versions. 0.3r9 had many Alphatrack related changed.
Ideal settings are subjective, it also depends either you observe connection problem with your device (you can significantly speedup display update otherwise).

Sonar 8LE -> Platinum infinity, REAPER, Windows 10 pro
GA-EP35-DS3L, E7500, 4GB, GTX 1050 Ti, 2x500GB
RME Babyface Pro (M-Audio Audiophile Firewire/410, VS-20), Kawai CN43, TD-11, Roland A500S, Akai MPK Mini, Keystation Pro, etc.
www.azslow.com - Control Surface Integration Platform for SONAR, ReaCWP, AOSC and other accessibility tools
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