Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]

Anderton

CakeAlexS
So hang on, to roll back do you run the patch again?
Otherwise my confusion (at least) is that it isn't in add/remove programs.

1. Navigate through the C: drive maze and locate SONARPDR.EXE in the Sonar X3 Producer folder.
2. Right-click on it and select Properties.
3. Click on the Previous Versions tab.
4. Windows will likely find a previous version.
5. Right-click on it and select Properties.
6. Click the Details tab, and under Product Version, you should see X3c.
7. If selecting the file enables the Restore button, click on it and X3c will return. If not, or the file isn't local, click OK, click Open, click Run, and cross your fingers.

 
However - bear in mind that this may affect other installations related to Sonar, so use it at your own risk. It did seem to work as advertised when I tried it, although after testing I then went back to X3c because I didn't think that unchecking the 64-bit audio engine would mean the end of my ability to create music.

Thats a very dangerous way to rollback Craig. The main problem is that with this you are only rolling back the SONAR EXE.
 
With any update we may potentially change several related files. In this case if you made this change SONAR will probably crash under some conditions since the TTSRES file is now mismatched.
If you really want to do a manual rollback you will have to backup all related files prior to the change and restore them.
I don't even recommend this procedure in general but this is a much safer option:
- Backup the entire Program Files\Cakewalk\SONAR X3 Prooducer folder
- Backup the entire Program Files\Cakewalk\Shared Utilities folder
 
Now to rollback you can restore the previous folders above. Note that this doesn't take into account any plugins that may have been updated by the patch.

Well,
Heavy [but calm]Confusion here,in re to^^^^^^
I just copied and pasted ALL my "cakewalk projects"along with the picture cache-all of it,moved it to a new folder elsewhere on the drive[or another drive]then Un Installed X3,and then Re Installed it.shouldn't that be cool?
 
By simply leaving Plugs [mine are standard default placement VST cakewalk,and x86 VST,as well as 2 folders for 32 ,and 64bit Free/Donation plugs in My Documents,plus the "shared utilities internal"[something I never noticed in X1 or maybe even X2]anyway I just "un installed"the WHOLE of X3 via Explorer and reloaded my download[even though I own the DVD's as well]and all went back where it was, with melodyne I just ticked "repair",and all 1,539 plugs all fine,and back to X3A[I checked].
 
Still this 6 track  lead guitar/Bonhamfest track that's a bit old,and been copied back and forth between "cakewalk projects,and similarly named folders on 2 different external HDD's[always copied with the latest "picture cache"as well-not that I have a clue,it just seems sensible,anyway still totally unplayable  [dropouts!:( [regardless of every "setting/buffer adjustment possible,even after removing EVERY plugin....same stuttery[if I'm lucky]with the "Dropout" flash card warning...I'm stumped,other projects are playing as they should,so maybe something has corrupted THAT particular project?
 
I'm well "over it" now,as other less plugin "infested"projects are now playing fine since reinstalling X3A from scratch.
 
Anyway,my question now is I'm obviously[so the "about" logo says] to X3A, I'm now in possesion of X3B X3C,and X3D,which one should I go for?
 
X3C was working like a charm until I installed X3D[coincidence I think now],so my gut is telling me to go with that,however,THAT is the version where the "64 bit precision engine"has been reccomended "un-checked",and yes after weeks of having both the preferences,and Export 64 bit options unchecked,and with my "still shocking" How Utterly Loud It Is Everyday-since October 20 something 1993 "tinnitus",my obviously "burdened" hearing absolutely cannot tell a difference,but I would appreciate eventually "checking" this option in the future,so[drumroll]which version????
 
I'm a tad leary of "d"after last night/today,and now tonight,but that has now been "semi" proven to be some "anomaly"with the project itself,not the patch,or X3 in general[though the ludicrously high buffer settings for the VS-100 are a tad maddening!- and like Iv'e said before, an RME UCX-lowest latency of ALL RME devices apparently the Lowest RTL of any interface on the market[Chris from ADK mentioned this yesterdayhttp://www.gearslutz.com/board/9685498-post24.html],or a Prism Lyra is something I lust for,though I'am impressed with the VS-100's AD/DA and clear as a bell mic pre's/playback is impressive,I just don't quite get why it's so hard to write a "low latency" Win7/8 driver,it has been around since 2009?
 
So without further possible product smears,or hi-jacks on this thread,I'm 64 bit as much as poss.,so is it A B C or D?
 Sleepless Bob

Guitarmech111
The safest patch rollback is to uninstall and reinstall SONAR.
 ....

 
Sure it is, but not exactly the most convenient.
 
The safest and most convenient method is to use software like "Acronis True Image: or "Paragon Backup and Recovery" to create backup images regularly and before every major update.
 
I've been doing the backup imaging thing for over a decade (Starting with Ghost 2003), and when it comes to major updates - any major update - I'm prepared -- utterly fearless, in fact, with no worries that something might go south due to an update...   Because even if it does, I can easily restore (rollback) to the previous state in a matter of minutes.
 
That's why I'm astounded when I hear about longtime, serious DAW users who forego this kind of safety net, and simply leave matters up to fate when applying updates.   Huh?!  Why?!
 
Guys -- please, please look into the backup imaging software.  Many of these products have a free version that does the job adequately.  Win7 - and presumably Win8 - even has this functionality built in (though it's extremely barebones - still, better than nothing!).
 
Start doing these backups, and I promise you:  No more wasted evenings/days/weekends reinstalling software.
 
(BTW, Windows System Restore is not the same thing.  If you rely on this to save your bacon, you will get burned sooner than later).

JonD

Guitarmech111
The safest patch rollback is to uninstall and reinstall SONAR.
 ....

Guys -- please, please look into the backup imaging software. 

I always use Acronis, before that it was Ghost.

the only problem about imaging your drive is making sure you have an image after every install. I would forget and it is much easier for me to keep everything else I installed and just reinstall SONAR.
 
Which reminds me I need to make another backup image...  ;)

The only real problem I have with Sonar X3d is me being too dang lazy. It works much better than I do... LOL.
 
J

Anderton
I hear you. The ones that give max roll-eye are the ones that act like some relatively small issue involving a feature that may never have even existed before is so crippling it has made it impossible for them to create music.

I'm curious, what are these features other people complain about that make them unable to create music? You keep brining it up in all your posts but we don't know what you mean.

CakeAlexS
Bring back the 64 bit precision engine debate!!!!!! :)
 

 
 

Hey I think I sat next to that woman on my train commute the other day...

Anderton
The ones that give max roll-eye are the ones that act like some relatively small issue involving a feature that may never have even existed before is so crippling it has made it impossible for them to create music.

Nice to see a Gibson archangel disparaging the users of its products.
 

Anderton

SilkTone

Anderton
I hear you. The ones that give max roll-eye are the ones that act like some relatively small issue involving a feature that may never have even existed before is so crippling it has made it impossible for them to create music.

I'm curious, what are these features other people complain about that make them unable to create music? You keep brining it up in all your posts but we don't what you mean.

The Great 64-Bit Engine Debate is a good example. But I would think the rest of the post would have indicated it was not written in a spirit of Utmost Seriousness.

Oh please. That thread was hardly a debate (leastwise, certainly not in the old cakewalk.audio ng tradition), and I don't recall anyone ever claiming it was impossible to create/produce music with the DPE disabled.
 
As for being an example, well, perhaps an example, when having the DPE enabled suddenly became problematic, of a backing away from what had formerly been touted as a "premium" feature (iirc the DPE was only migrated down to the "essential" version as of X2). Not that ample opportunity wasn't offered to step up (maybe too subtle?). At the least, some deft avoidance.
 
Perhaps in the new year a real debate might actually ensue...

Paul P

Anderton
The ones that give max roll-eye are the ones that act like some relatively small issue involving a feature that may never have even existed before is so crippling it has made it impossible for them to create music.

Nice to see a Gibson archangel disparaging the users of its products.

First, Goddard was right - it wasn't the 64-bit engine thread, it was the "Cmon, Cakewalk fix the 64-bit buzz" thread. I just remembered it had something to do with the 64-bit engine. Hey, I don't remember every title and story line of every thread here...
 
This was the one where someone said he didn't upgrade to X3 because other vendors don't have issues with bugs (!), and for the year of software he paid for it, it was mostly for months of bug fixes. And frankly, I don't read EVERY word of every post. So when I see reactions from other people in the thread saying things like "Surely you can still make good music without this one feature" and "So with all that we kind of whittle down the pool of people where this is a CRITICAL issue to be rather small," I figure they probably did read every word and had reasons for the conclusions they drew.
 
But beyond that, to blow that up into saying I was disparaging the users of Cakewalk's products doesn't take into account I was responding with a generalization. I'm sure you've seen the people who come in here, do a couple of posts about some absolutely crucial thing that Sonar doesn't do but Fruity Loops or Reaper or whatever does, how they simply cannot create music with that, and how we all suck for being so stupid not to use the software they use.
 
[And the backstory on the "impossible to make music" line: I was basically stealing a line from myself that anyone who's seen my seminars has probably heard, where I talk about an incident with Passport Designs' Master Tracks Pro (which had 240 PPQN MIDI resolution) back in the 80s. A user called up Passport support and DEMANDED a refund so he could buy Logic, which had 1024 PPQN resolution or something like that. He said that a sequencer with only 240 PPQN was "totally unacceptable to reproduce the nuances of my music." Well, Passport gave him the refund. Shortly thereafter, I did an article on sequencer jitter for Keyboard magazine and found that the timing inaccuracy for both Master Tracks Pro and Logic was EXACTLY THE SAME! This was because on a Mac Plus, the extra resolution stressed out the system to such an extent it ended up with far more jitter than the lower PPQN that didn't stretch out the system as much. So basically, he was saying that of two systems with identical timing accuracy, one was totally unacceptable while the other one was worthy of his musical genius. That made quite an impression on me ]
 
Furthermore, I do not always slave over edits when I'm writing a lot of posts in a short period of time. Anyone who's seen me on this forum for more than a single-sentence snapshot (I've been coming here for 10 years) knows I love this community, think it's one of Sonar's biggest strengths. I've often said when I need a question answered, I come here first. And as I've also stated many times in the past, one of the reasons I come here and try to figure out solutions for people is to give back because of all I've gotten from this forum.
 
Finally, if you looked at the entire post, it had this whole silly Microsoft Word scenario about me starting a thread in the Microsoft forums. I think it should have been clear by then that I'm not so totally DEADLY SERIOUS about all this, and I'm not adverse to putting my tongue in my cheek from time to time. If what I said came across as being a deadly serious statement, I'll try to be more careful in the future and not forget to add the
 
However, just to clarify, my comment about not understanding why Kim Kardashian is famous was serious. I really don't know why she's famous

Fair enough. Yeah, memory can play tricks on ya.
 
Why, sometimes it seems like only yesterday that we got a 32-bit floating point mix engine (which was a big deal back then)...
 
https://groups.google.com/d/topic/cakewalk.audio/6ODdqUfebxw/discussion
 
https://groups.google.com/d/topic/cakewalk.audio/sJFuj-MJwIk/discussion
 
(the second thread may lend a bit of perspective)

Andrew Rossa [Cakewalk]
The majority of feedback from users is that SONAR X3d is quite stable. There's no reason not to update to it, if that's a question at all. And of course we are working on even more improvements. I think the spirit of the OP's question was how many issues can be attributed to SONAR X3 and how many have to do with the overall DAW set-up, including hardware, 3rd party software, etc. It's a valid question. Have an optimized system is of course important and addressing issues that users may have with X3 is obviously important to us as well. The title of this thread is a little misleading IMHO. But overall, we are pretty happy with the response and feel like we have the best DAW out there right now. And yes, I am bias but I can say that SONAR X3 is a huge leap forward for us as a company. And of course, making customers happy is really important to us so we appreciate all the feedback. Thanks again for all your input and of course for buying SONAR X3. Looking forward to even more great stuff in 2014. 

Hi,
So without actually ever referring[surprise surprise] to my question[now I've reinstalled back to X3A]I can only assume you [and Craig A.] are wholeheartedly recommending X3D,even though after installing it in my plug heavy "little" 6 track 5 buss Project that was nowhere near "peaking" the dreaded  "first thread"[when will intel or whoever fix that?] on X3C,instantly became unplayable,i.e. DROPOUT,straight after installing X3D?
 
This Xps L502x is getting a bit tired I suppose,so "IT" could have been any one of a zillion other culprits,that just happenned to berzerk the CPU meter after installing "D"[with the 64 bit engine turned OFF of course!,both in prefffs and in export].
 
I'm going to go for C again,just in case,but what will I be missing out on[if anything?] by going C?
Sincerely
Bob

Grivanov
Really Bad ? Yes.

There you go - the detailed and justified argument from an X1D user on 5 posts :).
 

CakeAlexS

Grivanov
Really Bad ? Yes.

There you go - the detailed and justified argument from an X1D user on 5 posts :).
 

yup
+1

Vastman
bob, guitar guy...what you will be missing out on was publicly posted for all in the frackin' world to view, in the Cake post announcing "D"... do your homework... and go back to C if it works for you... the vagaries of pc machines is so crazy I've struggled with things for years and if something works, use it!!! For me, D is working and I'm very happy...Then again, for the money you spent on any of those sweet guitars and amps, you could upgrade to a 4930... doubt you'd have a problem then...

Bob, I am going to cross-thread this but I made a few posts on this thread specifically about how utterly baffled I am with some posts and why. The second post I made after the one above shows a (badly recorded) video of me playing two different songs via ASIO (one in X3, the other in Melodyne Editor (stand-alone)).
 
The "kicker" to me is look at my system specs... i7-2600K (not overclocked), and 8GB RAM! As I research more, I think 2 major hardware pieces (I have) come into play... one is the SSD on my OS/program drive, and the other is the audio interface. I do minimize programs running, but I "violate" guidance of hardcore DAW users all the time in that I run my onboard audio in tandem (dedicated to Win7) and multi-task all the time (Alt-TAB is my best friend). I have not done excessive tweaks to this system, and X3 (all patch levels) run great.
 
The audio interface is the #1 component to streamlining things... getting sounds in and out of a machine as efficiently as possible.  The SSD has been #2 for me in that I let Win7 control its own paging file (virtual memory) and it has done very well performance-wise.
 
The factor I avoid is "plug heavy"... I avoid it like the plague actually. If a plug is that aggressive on CPU/RAM usage, then I feel that it is poorly scripted. 15 years ago I had a friend say something funny which was "programmers get complacent... they assume massive resources are available, and code this way... it is sloppy code, and in no way efficient." That was what first attracted me to Cakewalk... the code is forced to be efficient, or else the concept of a DAW is impossible. By piling inefficient plugs into an efficient engine, the system will be effected! Someone made a funny comment the other day about hardware... "Is like sticking 13" rims on a Porsche 911" The same applies to plug-ins.
 
Take a step back and look at the piece parts you have running/supporting X3... there is nothing catastrophically wrong with X3... it is actually pretty damn slick in my opinion.