The Orchestral Shootout, Phase Two: now with PRIZES!

(Note: If you haven't been following the shootout saga, the backstory is here.)

The orchestral shootout has turned out to be very popular, with 30 submissions received at the time of this writing and more coming in every day. And as of today, those files are finally available for listening via a website crafted for this purpose by Randy Bowser.

Here's the site. I think you'll agree that Randy's done a bang-up job in a very short timeframe. But wait, don't go there just yet -- you'll want to read the rest of this post first!

In the previous thread, wherein we initially kicked off this exercise, it was stated (several times) that "this is NOT a contest and there is NO PRIZE". Well, that is no longer the case. It is now officially a contest and there are in fact multiple prizes!

And not some crummy joke prize you wouldn't want to win, no sir. We're talking about a grand prize of no less than the entire Garritan collection, plus individual Garritan libraries for the runners-up. Is that just too cool, or what?

If you visit the site today you'll see that there is currently no provision for voting for your favorite trek-track. Polling won't be open until after the submission deadline. But starting today you will be able to hear all the submissions there. Note that they are anonymous numbered files, so as to encourage objectivity. Details will only be given after the end of voting. For now, jot down the numbers of your favorite entries for future reference.

If you've been sitting on the fence about maybe participating in this project, now's the time to get crackin' because you have until August 15th to send in your submissions. On that date we'll turn on the polling and you'll have the following two weeks to vote for your favorite entry.

WARNING: You'll only get to vote once, so listen to them all before voting.

NOTE: if you have already sent in a submission, you're already a contestant. You don't need to send the same file again.


The Rules

In Phase One we left the rules of the game pretty much open and vague. Our objective was simply to hear what could be done with a common MIDI file using various libraries. But now that there are prizes (!) at stake, we have to be a little more specific. So here are the rules:

1. Only minor modifications to the MIDI file are allowed, in order to accommodate your libraries. You cannot write new parts. Examples of acceptable modifications: stretching notes for better legato, moving percussion hits to a different MIDI note, adjusting velocities, adding articulation switches, copying sections or even entire tracks to accommodate switching between patches.

2. Stick to the original voices. Substitutions that don't compromise the original arrangement are acceptable, such as a tuba in place of a bass trombone. But please, no choirs to replace violins or fuzz guitar for the trombones.

3. Although we'd prefer you to use a single library for the benefit of the original purpose of this exercise, multiple libraries are acceptable. Please use only one library per section, though. For example, one library for strings, another for brass - that's OK. Just make sure to list all synths and libraries that you used when you submit your entry.

4. Submit only MP3 files. They can be high bit rate for best quality but please, no uncompressed waves. (And although it's not a rule, it would be nice if you trimmed leading and trailing silence from the files before sending, to save Randy from having to do that for you.)

5. Any and all DAW tricks and processing are fair game. Just make sure you document your techniques when you send in your submission so others can learn from you.

6. Email your submissions here. Please include your full name in the email, as well as your SONAR forum handle if applicable, and any relevant notes about the tools and techniques you employed.

7. Please limit the number of submissions to no more than 6 entries, and only send multiple entries if they are different from one another. Flooding the inbox will not increase your chances of winning. Sending in different variations with different libraries might, though, and is encouraged.

8. The deadline for submissions is Sunday, August 15th. Anything received after that date will still be posted and made available for listening, but will not be eligible for the contest.

9. Voting begins on Monday, August 16th. You may only vote once, and any attempt to rig the voting will result in a late-night visit from my cousin Guido, whose day job is collecting past-due loan payments.

10. Voting ends September 1st. At that time, the details of all submissions will be revealed, including who did what with which libraries, synths, plugins and DAWs.

11. Winners will be notified via email on September 2nd, and the winners will be posted on the site shortly after. There will be a grand prize consisting of the complete Garritan collection, plus individual libraries for the runners-up.

OH MAN! -- Does Gary Garritan know about this?  --KIDDING!  hehe--- Gary is justifiably well known for being an extremely generous guy, always wanting to encourage musicians to do the most they can with their music.

It was still a huge and fantastic surprise when Gary G. said he wanted to stir up even more interest in this event by supplying prizes.

The entire Garritan Library for the Grand Prize - That's one heck of a great prize.  GPO, Concert and Marching Band, Jazz and Big Band, The Authorized Steinway - !---And I think the up-coming Garritan World Library is going to be in the offing also.

SO - go ahead, BURY me with entries - I'll be glad to get them up on the website.

Live long and orchestrate!

Randy B.

John6528


Ooops... I changed bones and some winds to open voicing. thought bones were too muddy and close winds caused loud partials and fuzziness in my synth. Don't know how to compensate for that. Also finally just dropped the 2nd flute out.

Will try and do another.

John

Hi, John - I see - You mean you re-wrote the MIDI file to make the voicings more spread out.  Right, that is against the rules.  If you think the bones sound too muddy, you need to try thinning out low frequencies with EQ.  The loud partials and "fuzziness" with the winds - could be a unique artifact from the software you're using.

Dropped the 2nd flute out--you mean you erased the bottom line?---Don't do that, you need to use those notes.

We have 30 submissions so far, and they've managed to use the file as it is - It's working great because when listening, the same arrangement is very discernible, but the results vary a lot because of the soft synths used, and what the contributor did to make the recording.

You can do it.  Put things back, and do your best to make your chosen synth sound as good as you can manage.  That's all anybody's done!

Randy B.

I hate you Bit!  You told me there was no prize :-P

Naw, this is really awesome guys.  You both have done a great job here, for sure.

May the best entry win :-)

Could people please check in on this:

--I'd like to know if the MP3 player on our Shootout site is playing OK for you, with a minimum of starts and sputters.

--I'd also like to know if it would be helpful for me to have an alternate page, just a simple page with all of the full rez MP3s available for downloading.  If we had that, it may avoid the complaint that the Wix MP3s are compressed.  Is it worth it for me to set that up?

Thanks.
Randy B.

Hi, Mattplaysguitar - Thanks for letting me know the MP3 player is working OK for you.  That's obviously rather key - to have the files play for people interested in listening!

Did I consider "finding the most quiet track, then turning down all the other tracks..."---I did the opposite.  I brought the levels of all the tracks up so their loudest sections are at peak value and the same on all tracks.  The rest of the volume difference is the nature of the files, like some people wanted the first half to be much quieter than the second half.  ---I think people are able to turn their own volume knob if they're inclined to.

As for the design of the site - I felt it would be fun to have a sci-fi looking flashy presentation, so that's what I made.  It matters exactly Zero to me if it's not to everyone's taste.  It's the MP3s which matter.  And later, the polling page will matter, and then the big unveiling of all the info on these tracks - the synths used, who did them, and whatever notes they wanted to pass on about their projects.

Let's see--Anyone have something positive to say--? 

Randy B.

The showcase of the library was supposed to be the point of this great exercise...Doesn't that effectively change the scope of the "contest"?

Yes, it does. And I frankly had some misgivings about switching horses midstream. But the prospect of giving somebody a cool prize for their work helped me to get past those reservations.

Anyway, the original intent is still as valid now as before. We'll still be able to glean useful information from this exercise, both by doing it ourselves and by learning from others. Some of the folks participating here are quite experienced at orchestration. Most are not, including yours truly. So the pros get to show off and the rest of us get to pick their brains. Win-win, I think.

For my own participation, I used six different synths in six separate versions. I approached it as a challenge to see what each synth could do, and I did all of them rather quickly (because I am lazy). Obviously, I wasn't out to impress anyone with my skills! But you'll be able to hear all 6 of my submissions side-by-side and know that if one sounds better than another it isn't because of the user's skill, but rather because it was just a better library. Or at least, better for lazy people like me.

since I already knew many people here have many of the same libraries I do (EWQL, Kontakt/VSL, SampleTank, etc.), I figured that by submitting, I'd be duplicating someone else's effort in showcasing the library.

The total number of submissions is important. The more samples we have, the more valid the conclusions we can draw from them. If the top ten files were made by ten different people but they all used the same library, well I'm guessing some credit cards may get exercised shortly after. If I'm thinking about buying a given library, and there were ten entries that used it, I can get a pretty good feel for the product even if those ten creators aren't all at the same skill level. Bottom line: lots of duplicate submissions = a good thing.

Hey... listening to about half of them it sounds like some are all string bass Pizz, some are all bass arco and some are a mixture. Made mine all arco but what is the legal way? My midi doesn't seem to catch patch changes.

John

Hi. A quick question about what modifications that are allowed or not.

Since the midi file is restricted to 16 channels I assume some instruments where removed (like flute and tuba). Are we allowed to add those back in?

John6528


Hey... listening to about half of them it sounds like some are all string bass Pizz, some are all bass arco and some are a mixture. Made mine all arco but what is the legal way? My midi doesn't seem to catch patch changes.

John

Hi, John - The patch changes are in relation to the General MIDI spec where all instruments have the same numbers.  So those changes wouldn't apply to any non-GM synth.

Bass - arco or pizz - that's a good example of people making their own choices about articulations.  My version is all arco too, it's legal.  That sort of decision is just one of many someone has to make when working with the raw MIDI file.

Randy B.

Ranietz


Hi. A quick question about what modifications that are allowed or not.

Since the midi file is restricted to 16 channels I assume some instruments where removed (like flute and tuba). Are we allowed to add those back in?

Hi, Ranietz - Yes.  The original MIDI file is a General MIDI sequence which uses one full set of MIDI channels, 16, but to expand that to flesh it out more to what an orchestra would actually play is fine, and in fact, encouraged.

The fine line, perhaps, is that we can't actually change the arrangement - we can't add new instruments like sax, electric guitar, harpsichord - I'm just throwing some out off the top of my head.  But look at the "piccolo" track for isntance.  That's actually two lines - piccolo and flute.  You definitely should split that out and assign the high line to the picc, low to flute.  If you want to beef up any section - do so.  There's one "bass trombone" line which can be tuba, or bass trombone Plus tuba, or a whole Fleet of tubas--as long as they're all playing the data which is in the file.

Have fun and good luck!

Randy B.

This may be a little over my head, but nothing ventured- nothing gained.

That's the spirit, Dan! The worst that can happen is you have some fun and learn something.

Lovely experiment.  When will the voting begin?

For people who have already submitted but are having second thoughts about the files they sent in, please don't ask me to swap out new versions of your work.  That wouldn't be fair at all at this point, now that the other submissions are open for public hearing.  You may want to correct the error of having used too low an MP3 resolution to begin with, but there's no way for us to know that a new version of your submissions wouldn't also include new edits made in light of what you've heard at the site.

So, please don't ask me to swap out your files.  I won't be doing any swaps.  Things need to stand as they are now.

Randy B.

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=275423

Out of fairness to the rest of you I am holdiing back my awesome version.  (Star Moog)

Just got SampleMoog and was playing around....

Any rate this is the comic relief portion.  (Think Spike Jones...)

JR