Doktor Avalanche 
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 06:31:17
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On a scale of 1 to 11 for missing the original points that were made here, I figure we have reached 11. It just goes to show that either. a) The internet often can't handle any form of complexity, and all points must be turned into a boolean points. b) If the internet can handle it then best to shout out a boolean point out really loud in the hope that people will adapt that boolean point and somehow talk about that than actual points raised. c) If all else fails attempt to blow yourself up, your friends will hopefully rush in and repeat the boolean points that were never made for you. d) Even better, people will start making the boolean point for the opposite case,then we finally are able to divide the discussion between good and evil, us and them, polarisation completed. e) Process complete. We can question THEIR motivations. Witch!!! They probably don't make music. They are out to get our friends!! All they are moaning about is JUST bugs. They are making every trivial thing look bad. They are ruining the reputation of this software. What are their qualifications? We now don't need to even discuss what was origianally brought up. All out war has removed any slight complexities in any points that were made. Like for instance.. "So in summary yup it's better, but something seriously needs to be done to improve the current situation. Bring on regular stability releases and schedule them so we know in advance is my opinion. The current model is a good start, please tweak it." And "Sure the monthly updates are better than X3 and before, sadly however the QA results seem to be about the same. I don't expect bakers to find every issue, QA is hard, the product is complex, it's impossible to find everything. Heck I did it as a job for several years in silicon valley, I should know, and I know part of the model has to be the customers end up being the beta testers, that's fine by me. It's a fact of life we all must deal with if we want good and cheap software" I do love this forum sometimes... It can be quite a gladiator ring :) (Edited)
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/11/23 07:34:35
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gswitz
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 06:32:03
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StudioCat > I use Windows 10 and Sonar Platinum. I have a touch screen. I make some videos. This one shows how to do a physical loopback on the RME UCX to get many more equalizer nodes.
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John T
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 07:34:53
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☄ Helpfulby FCCfirstclass 2015/11/23 09:14:09
Another slab of typically self-absorbed waffle from the Dok up there.
No, it's not that the original point has been missed. The original point was disagreed with right back at the start. Which you, again, absolutely typically could not deal with.
Everyone knows your opinion by now. You are a pedant and a bore about it, and it's impossible to miss. Take a day off, for god's sake.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 07:51:50
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No they don't read them John. I've seen plenty of obvious references to me stating where I go wrong and then repeating the exact same point I've already made as though I don't agree with it... When I do. I would that's mostly down to people like you polarising... How can you say something was 'disagreed from the start'? You can say you disagree with it yourself fine, but you do not represent everybody's opinion here,and I certainly don't either.
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Bristol_Jonesey
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 07:53:18
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☄ Helpfulby FCCfirstclass 2015/11/23 09:15:03
The question was, "As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off?"
I'd say we are significantly better off.
Under the old model, we never knew (following a major release) exactly when or what bugs were going to be fixed, when if ever, new content/enhancements etc were going to be delivered.
This current model is sustainable and efficient, what more could anyone ask really, given the very finite nature of Cakewalk resources?
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Zargg
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 08:04:10
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I think this had all been blown all out of proportion. I do not believe that anybody has said they do not recognize the existence of, or do not want bugs fixed. It should be possible to have a discussion, without people getting personal / offensive / (even) petty. It seems like (to me anyway) someone always has to bring it back to things that seems uncalled for. There is always someone a bit too aggressive, and someone a bit too touchy. What about a discussion on a civil level? I have seen it done...  Ps. I am not pointing fingers either way. All the best. PPs. I am much better of with this new model.
post edited by Zargg71 - 2015/11/23 08:16:45
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 08:24:13
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+1. I just restated the current model is a good start, recognised we all have to live with the position somewhat, and the situation is better than X3E, among other points. Straight away somebody states everybody has disagreed with this from the start.. I hope not. I assume he's just conviently skipped over that bit.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/11/23 08:35:57
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lingyai
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 08:32:31
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Noel Borthwick [Cakewalk]
>>Do you really, truly believe
>>-- that people buy the software in order to complain about it, but never use it? Really?
No I didn't mean that at all. The vast majority of our users buy and use our software because it is a useful tool to them or lets them be more creative. I didn't imply that nobody has issues. You read what you wanted to read in my post.
>>-- that a) trying to make music with Sonar, and b) encountering Sonar bugs in the process, are somehow wholly unrelated?
Again that's not at all what I said. We have a specific place for reporting issues and discussing them in context. See below.
>>-- that the "primary objective" of the forum is not to talk about bugs, but rather, is to talk about how one >>makes music with Sonar (avoiding mentioning bugs)? (If so, a lot of folks apparently didn't get the memo, and >>you'd better take a machete to the vast majority of posts here, because they are about problems users have, >>to which they seek solutions by coming here.)
That is correct - the primary objective of the SONAR forum has always been to discuss the use of the software rather than bugs or general software development opinions. Here is the "memo" right on the forums landing page:
SONAR
Discussion focused on the use of SONAR Producer, Studio, Essential and Base
Problem Reports
A place to document verified problem reports regarding the use of Cakewalk products.
As above we have specific places to discuss problem reports and a different place to discuss the use of the software. Here are some useful links to our forum guidelines for anyone who missed reading them.
http://forum.cakewalk.com/Feedback-Loop-Handbook-Please-read-before-posting-m3151738.aspx
Welcome to the Feedback Loop! This area of the forum is here specifically for sharing your ideas and reproducible problems. We do ask that this area is kept on-topic and focused. Discussions and questions about products will be moved to the appropriate forum. First, a few ground rules:
Be courteous
Be constructive
http://forum.cakewalk.com/Code-of-Conduct-m3096118.aspx
These forums have a reputation of providing a friendly environment to get help with Cakewalk products, discuss ideas, and connect with other members. Much of this is because our members treat each other with respect and courtesy, and we are dedicated to continuing this tradition.
Noel, I did quote you directly and completely. I used your actual words. If they do not mean what you meant, perhaps you should say what you mean, and not something else. As for the rules re where to post about problems ... well, you are being very lawerly here, which is fair enough, citing the governing forum rules... but your selectiveness in doing so undermines the credibility of your point. If what you say is true, then people "misuse" the forum left right and center by not posting in the right place, and I've not seen you object before ; in fact I've seen you respond to the subject, without saying "hey, wrong place". This particular thread of all places, asking what we think about the model, does seem to be a place to discuss what we think about the model, praise and criticism. The latter not surprisingly involves bugs. Lastly, if disagree with someone specific, perhaps better to make that clear, or otherwise specify what you're objecting to, because as it stands, your use of "some people who" is vague; it could be interpreted as "all people who," this being the internet and all. I also dislike it when the forums get nasty / personal. I have been annoyed by Doktor A at times (and I suppose vice-versa) but I do think he's made some valid points here. I think they should be addressed on their own merits.
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John T
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 08:42:45
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☄ Helpfulby FCCfirstclass 2015/11/23 09:16:49
lingyai
I have been annoyed by Doktor A at times (and I suppose vice-versa) but I do think he's made some valid points here. I think they should be addressed on their own merits.
They have been. He thinks the approach to updates should be different, and involve periods of feature lock and bug-fixing only. Cakewalk don't seem to agree. That's it. The rest is tedious repetition.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 09:53:20
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John T
They have been. He thinks the approach to updates should be different, and involve periods of feature lock and bug-fixing only. Cakewalk don't seem to agree. That's it. The rest is tedious repetition.
Er nope once again I said it should be 'tweaked', no issue with monthly updates. Actually Cake has been doing this when major bugs have been found, and the latest update has a lot of bug fixes as well (fixes some old bugs anyway). We shall see how this plays out... I'm suggesting stability releases with feature freeze should be pubically and regularly scheduled,and there is too much of a backlog. Cake really hasn't tackled this specific point at all head on.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/11/23 10:07:31
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jb101
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 09:55:48
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Doktor Avalanche
John T
They have been. He thinks the approach to updates should be different, and involve periods of feature lock and bug-fixing only. Cakewalk don't seem to agree. That's it. The rest is tedious repetition.
Er nope once again I said it should be 'tweaked', no issue with monthly updates.
Actually Cake has been doing this when major bugs have been found, and the latest update has a lot of bug fixes as well (fixes some old bugs anyway). We shall see how this plays out... I'm suggesting they should be pubically and regularly scheduled,and there is too much of a backlog.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - November 23, 15 3:06 PM
Freudian negligee? edited to add DA's edit
post edited by jb101 - 2015/11/23 10:09:36
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musicroom
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 10:08:45
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☄ Helpfulby charlyg 2015/11/23 10:26:27
I read through this well intended thread and will offer that I LIKE the new model. Took me a bit to trust but it wasn't long until I realized I was getting way more bang for my dollar than the previous yearly models. IMO, Sonar is leaving the pack with new tools and workflows for quickly getting to great sounding results! Which is why I like it.
As far as bugs go - they are a small part of any software and are being dealt with at satisfactory pace IMO. Never had a bug stop me from recording and mixing. I have a hard time understanding the never satisfied expectations of a few users. By all means report findings, but don't turn it into a bug religion. Way too many whiny words for me to read about something that is not broke.
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Lord Tim
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 10:16:57
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☄ Helpfulby charlyg 2015/11/23 10:29:25
I think maybe I'm missing something here and I'm not getting the counter arguments people are making. It's late here so maybe I'm too tired to understand?
In the old model we get an update a few times a year. We're never sure when it'll be. It usually has fixes and some new features. There's a big possibility there's new bugs introduced, as there is in all software. That gets fixed either with a hotfix if it's serious enough, or we waited until the next patch, whenever (if at all) that would be. Sometimes the product cycle would end before anything was fixed.
In the new model we get a new version every month, with bug fixes, new features and - yes - the possibility of new bugs. Taking that on face value, sure - that's 4 times the amount of chances of bugs being introduced.
However - and this is the bit I'm not getting - you don't need to update every month. If you want, you can do it 3 or 4 times a year, sitting back to see how people are travelling with their updates, and how the new features and potential new bugs are affecting them. The difference between this and the old model is that rather than everything happening behind the scenes and we get everything dumped on us at once in a quarterly update for better or worse, we get to see the incremental monthly updates and pick and choose what we install, if we want to stick to the same rough update timeline.
I've had a very positive experience with this so far, as I said in an earlier post, and any show-stopper bugs meant I either rolled back to the previous version (which was painless) and I waited for a month because I knew when the next update was due, or there was a quick patch posted within days which solved the problem.
How are we blowing that up into something negative and arguing about semantics? No disrespect to anyone with a different point of view, or people who have had a bad time with the current model, but yeah - I just don't get it...
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FCCfirstclass
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 10:28:06
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Lord Tim
I've had a very positive experience with this so far, as I said in an earlier post, and any show-stopper bugs meant I either rolled back to the previous version (which was painless) and I waited for a month because I knew when the next update was due, or there was a quick patch posted within days which solved the problem.
How are we blowing that up into something negative and arguing about semantics? No disrespect to anyone with a different point of view, or people who have had a bad time with the current model, but yeah - I just don't get it...
+1 for my 2 cents worth.
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kevinwal
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 10:35:47
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☄ Helpfulby charlyg 2015/11/23 11:04:46
Doktor Avalanche
John T
They have been. He thinks the approach to updates should be different, and involve periods of feature lock and bug-fixing only. Cakewalk don't seem to agree. That's it. The rest is tedious repetition.
Er nope once again I said it should be 'tweaked', no issue with monthly updates.
Actually Cake has been doing this when major bugs have been found, and the latest update has a lot of bug fixes as well (fixes some old bugs anyway). We shall see how this plays out... I'm suggesting stability releases with feature freeze should be pubically and regularly scheduled,and there is too much of a backlog.
Cake really hasn't tackled this specific point at all head on.
What action would constitute Cake tackling your point head on? I mean, the CTO has stated his opinion here and in numerous other threads in which you've made this case, so what would it take? Edit: You disagreed with John T's summary of your position by stating almost exactly what he said as far as I can tell.
post edited by kevinwal - 2015/11/23 10:52:46
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 10:53:23
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Just read my first post on this thread. So far people have been taking little bits out of it, paraphrasing and making comments that really were not out of my mouth. You would think I'm disagreeing with absolutely everything at this stage...@Lord Tim I notice your comment about not updating frequently (something I agree with) and roll back, I take a slightly different angle here, again tackled on my first post. I've pasted it several times already I will spare people this time. Thx.
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John T
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:08:48
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Doktor Avalanche
I will spare people this time.
Awesome news.
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Jim Roseberry
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:12:30
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☄ Helpfulby BobF 2015/11/23 12:13:12
I like the new subscription model.
It provides a more steady/reliable stream of revenue.
It allows Cakewalk to be a more sprite/dynamic/responsive company.
Monthly updates have brought significant new features.
With more updates... the possibility for new bugs does increase.
FWIW, I've not encountered anything that was a major show-stopper.
As with anything business related, tasks have to be defined/prioritized/executed within the means of the company.
It's a complicated multi-faceted situation.
Without inside information, it may be hard to understand the "triage" or prioritization.
This is especially true if you're having a particular issue... or want to see a particular feature implemented.
The Internet has *never* been good with expressing the finer nuances of communication.
I think it's human nature to extrapolate or try to read-between-the-lines.
This opens the door to misunderstanding.
Just like the old "telephone" game, the original message/intent can get mangled.
I'm not privy to all the details at Cakewalk...
But I do know that there are some great minds/individuals behind Sonar.
I've spoken with Noel numerous times. He's bright... and absolutely committed to making Sonar the best it can be.
I've learned/absorbed technical things from Craig Anderton for the past ~30 years.
Software is a musical tool...
If that tool is a major source of frustration, it's probably not the right fit.
Think about it like an instrument.
ie: I absolutely love the sound of Ric 4003 basses, but I just can't get along with the ergonomics.
I've owned two of them. Ultimately sold them both...
Other folks love playing the 4003 (witness the numerous avatars on this forum).
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Lord Tim
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:21:39
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@ Doktor - OK, you're basically saying in your OP that we're being forced into being beta testers because of the release cycle, right?
So expanding on that, in the old model we had a release (say, for simplicity's sake) every 4 months. The software goes through various stages of internal testing and then goes out to the beta testers, and then ultimately to us end users, where we undoubtedly will find stuff that the testers have missed; everyone uses software in their own way, and there's no way to test every possible combination of usage + hardware + conflicting software. Anyone that's worked in development knows this song and dance.
In the new model, yes - the updates are more frequent, which could mean less time for beta testers to check stuff out, but then what? Let's say they had even double the amount of time to test as the old model. Great. They might catch more bugs, and then the software is released and once again we start the "oh but I cut tracks using a keyboard shortcut, but only when I have the console view open on my 3rd monitor using a Radeon video card with v28.07 drivers and it's crashing for me" dance. No amount of internal beta testing will pick up that kind of thing - it's got to go out to the userbase at large to expose a lot of these things.
More frequent updates = more chances for the userbase to help make the program better, which is ultimately something we all want, Bakers and users inclusive.
Sure - one could argue we're all beta testers. You could argue that about ANY software release, really. But getting back to the point of the thread, are we better off with the new model, as compared to the old one? Yeah, I honestly think we are when we look at the big picture.
Again, no disrespect intended and apologies if I've missed the point again. Too many hours editing vocal tracks tends to fry your brain a bit! HAHA!
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JonD
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:23:22
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Like some people, I had my doubts in the beginning, but by six months in, all those concerns went away. Every month is like Christmas, and we're getting a ton more fixes/new features than under the old model. What's not to like? 
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John
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:23:29
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Doktor Avalanche
Platinum for me is an improvement. For me I thought the break off from Roland was a positive. Splat certainly started off with a bang and it's certainly better with Gibson.
Sure the monthly updates are better than X3 and before, sadly however the QA results seem to be about the same. I don't expect bakers to find every issue, QA is hard, the product is complex, it's impossible to find everything. Heck I did it as a job for several years in silicon valley, I should know, and I know part of the model has to be the customers end up being the beta testers, that's fine by me. It's a fact of life we all must deal with if we want good and cheap software. But I still do question the model of releasing unstable or buggy software with bug fixes at the same time.
Monthly is great if all we are is beta testers, and some people want to be, and that is fine by me. The situation we have now basically. But for the rest of us, we want to run on stable releases, and there needs to be another path for us to follow. If there was a situation where there were additional stability releases every quarter with a feature freeze, a true alternative path to follow, that would be a huge improvement. That could run in parallel or part of the normal cycle. Whatever...
To say that there is no demand for stability releases (as has been stated only recently) is a ridiculous statement. This is audio software we are talking about. Some of us just want to spend time recording without issue.
Of course the arguement would be you can simply roll back, this is true and is a good feature... However..
a) We are still put into the position of having to be beta testers whether we want to or not when we upgrade. That's a pita when all some of us want to do is record, and with paying customers is a big no no.
b) Rolling back may resolve an issue, but just leaves us with other different bugs to cope with. You takes yer choice.
So in summary yup it's better, but something seriously needs to be done to improve the current situation. Bring on regular stability releases and schedule them so we know in advance is my opinion. The current model is a good start, please tweak it.
You start with "Platinum is an improvement" but its all about short comings for most of the rest of the post. Plus at the end you offer a solution. Some of us don't see a need for any solution. We like what CW is doing. Now I'm sure you will say I am for bugs. I want bugs and more bugs. That would be untrue. What it is is we recognize the need to have bug fixes and new features. We think the way CW is doing this is a good way. A balance between the two. Some of us want particular features included. What do we do about them? Until you see the need for features such as much better notation or has been recently included inline track recording with the addition of patch points what do you propose for that kind of improvement? A slew of bugs fixes only? That will sell a lot of Sonar. Also as an alternative to posting endlessly on every thread why not write up a white paper proposal laying out just how CW can do a better in fixing bugs and submitting it to CW. This would spare us from being assaulted by a never ending discourse.
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mettelus
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:26:06
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Lord Tim
In the old model we get an update a few times a year. We're never sure when it'll be. It usually has fixes and some new features. There's a big possibility there's new bugs introduced, as there is in all software. That gets fixed either with a hotfix if it's serious enough, or we waited until the next patch, whenever (if at all) that would be. Sometimes the product cycle would end before anything was fixed.
^^ Memory gets selective at times, but X2 is a good example of "then vs. now." With X3 "on the horizon" and of "unknown content," many of us were anxious during the interim between X2a and X3(a). For those of us that experienced this, the new model is completely opposite (in a very good way). Newly introduced bugs get fixed in pretty short order (even with the "monthly machine" running in the background), which is significantly better than the X2a "Nope, we are stopping here... that is all you get..." I personally am more attentive to fixes and workflow changes (or ideas) monthly, but also realize CW must cater to a larger audience than just me. It is sometimes comical to watch people's expectations shift without an "anchor to reality (or the past)." I still keep an old Tascam 424 under my desk in its original box so that in my moments of frustration I can think "Oooh... I could go back to that.... NOT!"
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kevinwal
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:28:07
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Doktor Avalanche
Just read my first post on this thread. So far people have been taking little bits out of it, paraphrasing and making comments that really were not out of my mouth. You would think I'm disagreeing with absolutely everything at this stage...@Lord Tim I notice your comment about not updating frequently (something I agree with) and roll back, I take a slightly different angle here, again tackled on my first post. I've pasted it several times already I will spare people this time. Thx.
I read your first post back when you posted it. In fact I've read the whole thread and I'm pretty sure I'm able to parse who said what fairly successfully and I'm even reasonably sure I understand what you're asking for and why. I don't think you're disagreeing with everything. I'm simply curious about the comment that Cake hasn't addressed "the point", which I assume to mean your point, head on. So again, I'm asking what you meant by that and what you would have them do to address the point head on?
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Lord Tim
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 11:33:07
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mettelus I still keep an old Tascam 424 under my desk in its original box so that in my moments of frustration I can think "Oooh... I could go back to that.... NOT!"
HA! Wow, I have a Tascam 488 sitting in the next room, which this just reminded me of. I'm almost nostalgic for it! .... almost!
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 14:13:32
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John
You start with "Platinum is an improvement" but its all about short comings for most of the rest of the post. Plus at the end you offer a solution. Some of us don't see a need for any solution. We like what CW is doing.
Fair comment, bit less of the 'us' please. You don't represent everybody on this forum and nor do I. People can speak for themselves. John
Now I'm sure you will say I am for bugs. I want bugs and more bugs. That would be untrue.
If you have a full quote then use it, otherwise stop putting words into my mouth. Thankyou. John
what do you propose for that kind of improvement? A slew of bugs fixes only? That will sell a lot of Sonar.
I propose you read the thread and my posts more carefully, perhaps quote me rather than stuffing more words into my mouth. JohnAlso as an alternative to posting endlessly on every thread why not write up a white paper proposal laying out just how CW can do a better in fixing bugs and submitting it to CW. This would spare us from being assaulted by a never ending discourse.
'Assaulted' eh... Nice words..And 'Us' again. Pass... Ta.
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Doktor Avalanche
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 14:15:38
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kevinwal
I'm simply curious about the comment that Cake hasn't addressed "the point", which I assume to mean your point, head on. So again, I'm asking what you meant by that and what you would have them do to address the point head on?
What I wrote first post. Not what John is writing that I am saying nor anybody else for that matter. Had enough of looping and so has everybody else :) Ta.
post edited by Doktor Avalanche - 2015/11/23 14:27:38
Sonar Platinum(64 bit),Win 8.1(64 bit),Saffire Pro 40(Firewire),Mix Control = 3.6,Firewire=VIA,Dell Studio XPS 8100(Intel Core i7 CPU 2.93 Ghz/16 Gb),2 x 1TB SSD (Samsung EVO 850),GeForce GTX 460,Yamaha DGX-505 keyboard,Roland A-300PRO,Roland SPD-30 V2,FD-8,Triggera Krigg,Shure SM7B,Yamaha HS5. Rap Pro,Maschine Studio+Komplete 9 Ultimate+Kontrol Z1,Addictive Keys,Waves Silver,Izotope Nectar elements,Overloud Bundle,Geist,Acronis True Image 2015.
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John
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 14:19:33
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I didn't change anything in your post Alex.
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John T
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 14:30:55
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Doktor Avalanche
kevinwal
I'm simply curious about the comment that Cake hasn't addressed "the point", which I assume to mean your point, head on. So again, I'm asking what you meant by that and what you would have them do to address the point head on?
What I wrote first post. Not what John is writing that I am saying nor anybody else for that matter. Had enough of looping and so has everybody else :) Ta.
Yawn. Your first post doesn't answer the question "what you would have them do to address the point head on?" There's nothing clever about refusing to answer a straight and simple question, and you can bet everyone's noticed your MO in the regard by now. It's rude, basically, is what it is.
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kevinwal
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 14:35:46
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☄ Helpfulby John T 2015/11/23 15:05:39
Doktor Avalanche
kevinwal
I'm simply curious about the comment that Cake hasn't addressed "the point", which I assume to mean your point, head on. So again, I'm asking what you meant by that and what you would have them do to address the point head on?
What I wrote first post. Not what John is writing that I am saying nor anybody else for that matter. Had enough of looping and so has everybody else :) Ta.
Ah, I get it now. See, I was cycling on what you mean by Cakewalk not directly addressing "this point head on." I was thinking maybe you wanted a policy statement from some big shot at Cakewalk directly addressed to you explaining that you are absolutely right and they're doing it all wrong but regrettably, certain legal issues prevent them from changing over to your clearly superior model, or some such thing like that. But I do get it now. You don't want Cake to acknowledge the value of your points, you're going to hold this forum hostage until they pony up and adopt your release strategy. Kind of like a US Senate filibuster. What the heck, I'm a sucker for an underdog. Go Dok, Go! Ta back atcha, dude.
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John
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Re: As we near one year of a subscription model, what say you? Are we better or worse off
2015/11/23 14:48:10
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kevinwal
Doktor Avalanche
kevinwal
I'm simply curious about the comment that Cake hasn't addressed "the point", which I assume to mean your point, head on. So again, I'm asking what you meant by that and what you would have them do to address the point head on?
What I wrote first post. Not what John is writing that I am saying nor anybody else for that matter. Had enough of looping and so has everybody else :) Ta.
Ah, I get it now.
See, I was cycling on what you mean by Cakewalk not directly addressing "this point head on." I was thinking maybe you wanted a policy statement from some big shot at Cakewalk directly addressed to you explaining that you are absolutely right and they're doing it all wrong but regrettably, certain legal issues prevent them from changing over to your clearly superior model, or some such thing like that.
But I do get it now. You don't want Cake to acknowledge the value of your points, you're going to hold this forum hostage until they pony up and adopt your release strategy. Kind of like a US Senate filibuster.
What the heck, I'm a sucker for an underdog. Go Dok, Go!
Ta back atcha, dude.
LOL
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