So I think to sum...

Mix on the best set of speakers you can afford, this will allow you to hear what's really going on.  THEN, check on as many other sound setups as you can to make sure that it translates well.   IE how will it sound on an ipod, or car stereo etc.

As far as woofers go, bigger is usually better.   To move lots of air, you need big speakers.   Although, it's not always direct.  I have some 15inch Yamaha club speakers and they don't go as low as my 12inch car subs (but I think the yamaha's are meant to get paired with other active subs, lol).

mike_mccue


What you will notice is that no one speaking with first hand experience  about owning and using nice speakers or working for hundreds (or thousands) of hours on another studios nice speakers has anything bad to say about using that grade of speaker.

Even when you hear anecdotal stories about people using things like NS-10s or Auratones you rarely see any acknowledgment  that the NS-10s are hooked up to an Adcom or that the Auratones are plugged into a Crown Macrotech. The point being that even those *cheap* speakers are usually part of a rather expensive "system".

So yes, mix on the very best speaker/amp system you can afford... do your best... and be happy :-)


Oh yeah, when you finally get a sub woofer make sure you get a gianourmously powerful amplifier to drive it.

To answer the woofer question: Better is better.  A great 12" system is easier to make than a ok 15" system and 18" systems get really weird unless you have a huge budget. Look for a quality in something 12" and you'll get the most bang for your buck.

FWIW I consider my JBL LSR32 system adequate... nothing more than that... so take what I say with a grain of salt.

all the best,
mike

I agree with this completely.  But, it doesn't really address the OP's question.  We can't all afford the best monitors in the world, so what advice do you have for the OP within his guidelines?

stratman70

Bub

stratman70

Bub

John


... its just that sometimes somethings get a little "thick" when someone is so wrong and insists that they are right. More importantly others may believe what he is saying.

I know what you mean John, like when people come here and say X1 is working fine for them. Man that gets to me. :)

Yup, you caught me-I am lying-Jeeezzz-Give me a break will ya.

LOL!

Moron

****

bub, strat, I'm not sure who's up next but I suggest ''poo poo face'' for the next insult.

Could use "doo doo face" as well - your call.

can't wait lol

Adam A7 or the new Adam A7X near fields  . I have3 the A7s for the past 3 years and love them. Mixes  are very tranferable. price @ 1000 CND  a pair (self powered) You won't need a sub unless you are doing surround.

I have krk's rocket 5 and Yamaha HR-80's... Both are ok.. But I like the krks better most days...

I would save your cash and get higher end monitors in this instance...

Although in that price range I would be curious to here some of the CakeWalk Monitors

With the current used gear market, you can pick up a nice set of used monitors for a good price. I recently was able to get a nearly new set of Dynaudio BM5As for very little more than you are wanting to spend. If you go this route, audition the speakers carefully and get to know a bit about the seller before dropping the cash.

I have some LSR6328Ps... goodness they have some harsh tweeters... which I find are just the thing to reveal harshness in a mix.

Yes. I wish my speakers had more of high end harshness. That's where my setup falls short.. It actually HELPS on the final mix.

The goal of the monitors is to obviously be accurate, but also to help the final mix as much as possible (in my opinion).

A great mix done on great speakers doesn't always translate to all systems.

That is the truth.

The goal of monitors are just to monitor and HELP your final mix.

The goal of monitors are not to be audiophile speakers as your audience will certainly not have audiophile speakers.

Under the rare circumstance that you are recording jazz or audiophile-prone types of music (very, very difficult to record and mix), then possibly, you'd want Adams if your room was dead and perfect. But even then, in a home environment you'd have headphones which are even more accurate and probably wouldn't be recording Jazz ensembles. You can't have hiss or other disturbances when recording jazz. The headphones would reveal this quickly.

Actually, I heard a back to back compressor test on Youtube through headphones and I was able to point out something the video author never noticed. He listened with headphones and found the same thing. On another video of a guy testing a USB mic compared to a pre-amp mic, I was able to spot a hiss and loss of definition. He spot checked with headphones and then said he noticed it too and was surprised.

I'm not hating on expensive speakers, but lets put it this way. For the type of music I produce, there is a chance the most expensive monitors are going to hurt my final mix than a pair of cheap Berrhingers or M-Audio.

you know as much as i disagree with crush and find his opinions really off kilter,he does have a really goo knoweldge of music equipment and its uses.if you read his post early in the thread he brings up some good points on speaker sound

Thanks man ;)

I don't know what Crush knows about sound equipment but his knowledge of speakers is nonexistent. I wish it were otherwise.

WELL I MADE A VIDEO RESPONSE ON MY YOUTUBE CHANNEL SHOWING MY SETUP:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNYHVhRYK3s

When I think the mix is right then I use the JBLs to "master" the mix.

Bad Idea.

You should use the car, as well as some bookshelf speakers or home theater setup. Whatever you can get. That should be your final mix (in my opinion of course).

Like I went to your soundclick and listened to "Mixed Up Me". That doesn't sound mastered optimally. Anyone care to chime in?

I consider mastering to basically consist of bass, mud, scratch, and highs. Cheap speakers will blow up mud and scratch (with lots of exceptions of course.. I'm just being general). You have a bit too much 'scratch' in that mix it sounds like. Likely it's because of your MONITORS and mixing practices of only checking on the JBL's.

Lynn

mike_mccue


What you will notice is that no one speaking with first hand experience  about owning and using nice speakers or working for hundreds (or thousands) of hours on another studios nice speakers has anything bad to say about using that grade of speaker.

Even when you hear anecdotal stories about people using things like NS-10s or Auratones you rarely see any acknowledgment  that the NS-10s are hooked up to an Adcom or that the Auratones are plugged into a Crown Macrotech. The point being that even those *cheap* speakers are usually part of a rather expensive "system".

So yes, mix on the very best speaker/amp system you can afford... do your best... and be happy :-)


Oh yeah, when you finally get a sub woofer make sure you get a gianourmously powerful amplifier to drive it.

To answer the woofer question: Better is better.  A great 12" system is easier to make than a ok 15" system and 18" systems get really weird unless you have a huge budget. Look for a quality in something 12" and you'll get the most bang for your buck.

FWIW I consider my JBL LSR32 system adequate... nothing more than that... so take what I say with a grain of salt.

all the best,
mike

I agree with this completely.  But, it doesn't really address the OP's question.  We can't all afford the best monitors in the world, so what advice do you have for the OP within his guidelines?

Lynn,

 here it is... it was right in the middle:

"So yes, mix on the very best speaker/amp system you can afford... do your best... and be happy :-)"

 I wouldn't presume to advise someone on a brand or model... but rather guide them to purchase as much bona fide power as they can so that what ever they get runs in a state of grace.

 best regards,
mike

Crush

I have some LSR6328Ps... goodness they have some harsh tweeters... which I find are just the thing to reveal harshness in a mix.

Yes. I wish my speakers had more of high end harshness. That's where my setup falls short.. It actually HELPS on the final mix.

The goal of the monitors is to obviously be accurate, but also to help the final mix as much as possible (in my opinion).

There is a great benefit to mixing on speakers that reveal harshness... you make the harshness disappear while you mix.  I use the JBLs, The Yamaha NS-10s are similarly harsh, and the Genelecs are notoriously harsh. When you hear a great mix on these speakers it doesn't sound harsh... because the mix anticipates what will happen on a system that can produce 115+dBSPL at 10 feet.

These types of speakers will let you see what your mix will sound like on a el cheapo pair like you use as well as a monster club system where all the tweeters are horn loaded compression drivers.

The other style of monitor is something like the Adams with their sweet smooth tweeter... it sounds great no matter what you throw at it and then you put your mix on a industrial grade system and realize your mix has ice picks coming out of the tweeters.

I don't know much about the el cheapo speakers you are recommending but the 60/40 watt biamp package is simply puny... the amp is probably contributing as much distortion as the tiny little speakers when you turn up the volume.

The fact that the little baby tweeters on your Warfdales hardly put out any information may help you mix for the flea market car audio bazooka tube subwoofer crowd but I can state without hesitation that they don't tell you anything about what the mix is going to sound like if anyone with a nice stereo system or club system ever decides to play your music.

When a guy like Chris Lord Alge mixes on a pair of NS-10s... they are hooked up to amps rated at several hundred watts of clean power.

BTW most people who run big powerful amps can tell you... it's the small over worked amps that tear speakers apart. A big powerful amp can drive a smaller speaker so cleanly that you will rarely turn it up far enough to hurt the speaker... because it hurts you first. You can run a 300 watt amp into a 40 watt speaker all day long while a 60 watt amp can tear a 60 watt speaker up because it is common for the listener to be dissatisfied with the sound and continually adjust for more volume until it all goes away.

The bottom line is that a great mix on a great set of speakers will translate to the widest variety of playback systems.

The great system will reveal ALL the flaws that show up in cheaper systems... if you have some experience and know what to look for.

Mixing to someones crappy car stereo system may optimize your mix for someones crappy car stereo system but it will skew the results when the mix is heard on other systems.

It's sophomoric to work in that method... and it's self serving egomania to recommend to others that they should work in a similar, ineffective manner, just because one doesn't know any better them selves.

regards,
mike