More guitar making stuff...

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The Maillard Reaction
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2014/07/06 15:04:13 (permalink)

post edited by mister happy - 2018/02/26 13:25:33


#91
michaelhanson
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/06 19:25:17 (permalink)
Very interesting info on how you build pickups, Michael.  They look really nice.  I like the beveled pole pieces, in the way they look, just a little better, but probably only because that is the way I am used to seeing them.  Functionally, like you say, makes no difference.  Interesting about the different types of wiring used.  I read some where, and please correct me if I am wrong, for I am just learning, but that Alinco 2's give you just a little more treble brightness and Alnico 5 is a little more tamed in the treble and has clearer definition???  I saw were some builders where going with Alnico 3 to get some where, kind of in the middle?  When I get closer to actually replacing pickups, I will PM you with some questions.
 
I changed out my tuners last week to Fender Vintage Style tuners. I was trying to decide if I wanted to go with sealed Grotch or Grover type, but in the end, decided that I didn't want to drill out the peg holes to 10mm on the head stock.  The Vintage are installed and work great.  Now I am trying to decide where I go next.....after I save up some more spare cash.  It's either going to be in the direction of a new solid block bridge, or in the pick guard and pickup assembly.  I need to take the pick guard off yet and look to see what I am starting with.  I was advised that if it had the small dime sized, el cheepo pots in the guitar, a simple pots and caps upgrade "might" dramatically improve the tone.  I am torn because if I end up doing a pots and electronics upgrade, I would prefer to just load up a completely separate pick guard with the electronics and pick ups, so that I could easily change the guitar back if I chose to someday sell it.
 

Mike

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spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/06 21:50:05 (permalink)
I think the A5 is a good all around mag for singles but I wanted to have some A2 with the same number of raps to hear the results and make my own determination. 
People can do things differently so rather than me going on what they may have to say I will find out how I hear the difference.
I've heard others say that the A2 is good for brighter woods. If that is true then it would be the opposite of what you said.
It stands to reason that, if it is true, then one could.just lower A5's and get the weaker and less brightness of the A2's.
So...pickup height settings is a big variance that could effect ones results and reason enough for me to make my own determinations.
 
I don't know why you think I used different wire but they are all wrapped with the same wire.
 
In my opinion you will benefit a lot by learning about the nut. How to make and replace. It is so very important and a very challenging thing to do correctly. It has such a major effect on not only the tone but the playability of the instrument. Really...does one really hear the tonal effects of different bridges with a BS nut?
Well I won't debate the issue - to each their own.
 
Well I'm in Little Rock tonight and scheduled for a craniotomy surgery in the morning so it may be sometime before I continue . I will when I can....or not.
#93
michaelhanson
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/06 22:32:57 (permalink)
Michael, had no idea you were having surgery, I hope all goes well for you and will say a prayer for you.

I probably had it backwards with the Alnico pickups. I know I prefer A2's on my LP and they usually are darker than a Strat. As far as wire goes, thanks for pointing that out to me, I guess I didn't read closely enough your response to McQue.

Interesting, your statement on how important is the nut. I have a lot to learn. I am glad I have started this project to learn some of this on my own. I will value your opinions along the way.

Do you put much importance into quality pots and capacitors for the overall guitar tone?

Mike

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The Maillard Reaction
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2014/07/07 07:32:44 (permalink)

post edited by mister happy - 2018/02/26 13:25:39


#95
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/07 11:47:09 (permalink)
Thank you Mike and Mike.
I'm home. They cancelled because there were to many emergencies.
The doc was just going to put back some skull bucket he had removed...I'm fine and been
enjoying my time off from work and doing things I enjoy so all is good. I'll keep on enjoying
until they reschedule.
 
Mike I like to use CTS pots and I have no voodoo hang-ups with caps...their value is what to pay attention to IMO.
Learning things myself Mike but if I can be of help I'll try.
 
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The Maillard Reaction
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2014/07/07 11:52:34 (permalink)

post edited by mister happy - 2018/02/26 13:25:46


#97
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 12:31:46 (permalink)
Got a cool tool yesterday I'd thought I'd share.
 
I've mentioned the "center-line" being so important to building a guitar. It's used from the start to the finish.
 
This being my first bolt-on build it's nothing like a neck-through in how the center line is kept track of.
It's easy to see how, maybe.
The center line runs from the head to the tail of the body so with a bolt-on style it's easy to see how it could be right on track with the neck and right on track with the body but where they bolt together can easily through it off.
Anybody that's played a Strat has probably had to loosen the neck and give it a pull, using the strings to help get it "straight" and tighten in back. Now if you didn't know that and either the first or sixth string is falling off the fretboard...now you know why. Of course there could be other reasons but that's the first place to start checking.
 
It doesn't take much movement at the head to make a big difference at the bridge so even though the neck pocket is tight the way Leo designed it is easy for it move enough to lose that center.
With this tool I can check not only my Fender made guitars but I can assure the neck is balls on before drilling the holes in the neck and assure that it is still "perfect" when I tighten the neck down. ( probably not a tool somebody would want to pay for just to check their guitars)
 
I was very glad to see that when I test fit the neck (even though the nitro is still curing) the center-line was "perfect" at the bridge. ( I know it's hard to tell by photo but the pic is to show how the tool indicates)
 
 
 
 

 
 
And since it is a guitar with many "firsts" for me I planned on displaying it, as my first build is, so I built a display case to hang in my shop. Oh...yeah it stills needs glass and the hinges lol.
 
 
 
 

post edited by spacey - 2014/07/08 12:33:36
#98
batsbrew
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 13:03:24 (permalink)
WAY COOL  
 
 
bolt on necks, a bit of a 'dark arts' kind of thing,
getting it right is sometimes voodoo
 
i like the idea of the threaded bolts and countersunk ferrules

along with the idea of a shaved off neck heel...
 
but the positioning of the neck and pocket have to be exact...
my strat buld has a contoured heel, but just a regular plate and shortened screws....
i have an extra strat body, that i'm wanting to use for a hybrid tele-style setup..
and my try this rounded heel and moved threaded insert approach for it...
it will be a bit of a frankenstein anyway, setup as a player, not a looker....
 
excellent project spacey, thanks for sharing

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#99
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 13:44:02 (permalink)
Thanks Bat and glad you're enjoying it.
 
Yeah the whole bolt-on thing is...well it's smart IF one wants to change/replace a neck for whatever reason but
in all these years I don't know of one picker that did...of course that's just what I've seen.
 
All the "issues" with bolt-on are gone with a neck-through. They just make more sense to me. They eliminate needing attachment methods and easy to contour the heal for better feel and reach. I imagine there is improvement with the tone and sustain but I have no proof of that...it just seems logical that it would to me.
 
I'm doing it to learn how. To have fun...like I need another guitar LOL.
I do like being able to work on the neck and the body separately. That is a major plus with an attached neck.
 
Well it seems that this one won't be hanging on my shop wall. A drummer in AZ apparently loves it more than me.
He owns a couple of nightclubs, and homes by each, so I don't know where it will be hanging.
The cool thing is he told me to call when it was finished and he'll come pick it up so I don't have to deal with stuff getting lost - as it has before.
 
I guess now I need to figure out how to inlay a "pickguard" on a neck-through design. Always something! lol.
 
 
yorolpal
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 14:41:18 (permalink)
Hey Michael,
 
Know your time will be taken up by much more important things while in LR.  But just want you to know you always have a standing invitation to drop by the studio and visit a spell.  Would love to meet ya, ol pal.  Good luck.  And great work on that fine instrument...it's a beaut!!
 

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pentimentosound
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 14:54:03 (permalink)
@spacey
Thanks for posting the pics of your guitar display frame! I have been drawing 3 different versions for my "wing of the house". I need to mount 3 of them that; 2 to hold 4 guitars - and 1 to hold 3 bigger acoustic ones. So your pic is very inspiring and handy.
 
I also want to build a stand to straddle my amp(s) and hold 6 to 8 electric guitars/bass/baritone. That one is shaping up in my mind, but I need to build them all, so I have room for the next guitar (an Epiphone Wildkat that I'll put TV Jones Setzer signatures in).
I've never built any guitar stands or display frames, so I am thinking it through before buying any lumber.
Michael
 
 
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 15:32:33 (permalink)
 
I use magnets to latch- no handle to be seen so people that visit my shop don't know how to open the cabinet.
Not that I don't mind them checking out my guitar(s) but I know when they do. Even with the hinges showing they're not quite sure how to open it lol.
 
Vince Gill has a great idea- @ 5:30 - I thought about building a drawer cabinet for my studio area (inside house) but a metal rack works good. A cabinet could lock but why?
I have to many guitars to display so I just 6 or 7 handy and switch them out whenever the feeling hits.
 
I use Red Oak Michael. It's easy to get at Home Depot here and I get to pick.
I get the material from Mojotone. I think the next one I build I'll see grill cloth instead of the guitar case type material.
 
Would be cool to see what you build Michael.
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 15:38:20 (permalink)
yorolpal
Hey Michael,
 
Know your time will be taken up by much more important things while in LR.  But just want you to know you always have a standing invitation to drop by the studio and visit a spell.  Would love to meet ya, ol pal.  Good luck.  And great work on that fine instrument...it's a beaut!!
 




Thank you much myolpal. They called and rescheduled for Friday. If all goes well I'll stay Friday night and leave Sat.
Pretty simple procedure I'm guessing...the bad part was over in March even though I wasn't aware of what was happening :)
We're lucky myolpal...Little Rock has some badass medical folks and they're all so very nice.
 
I know we're going to get together someday and I look forward to it. You know where I'm at and you know your welcome anytime.
The Maillard Reaction
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2014/07/08 19:46:34 (permalink)

post edited by mister happy - 2018/02/26 13:25:54


pentimentosound
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 20:10:56 (permalink)
Thanks spacey! I am going to have to do something soon! LOL or I'll be holding them in my lap during dinner!
 
like mike_mccue , that tool seems very handy! I want to put a new neck on my oldest (parts) strat
which doesn't compare to the Mighty Mite  CR2900, I put on my other (sunburst) strat
http://s1021.photobucket.com/user/mcintalker/media/RedStrat_zps282ed2b5.jpg.html?sort=3&o=11
I've always watched one of my more expert friends do it, and figure it's time to give it a go.
 
Thanks for wood suggestion, too. I will post when I get the first one done.
 
Michael
 

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spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 20:31:48 (permalink)
Yeah, most use strings to help set the neck but this tool is great because it's hard to use 2 strings when there is no tuners, nut or bridge LOL
 
I made a jig and used fine string so this is going to be so much more trusting and easier to get the accuracy I'm after in placement of everything.
Somebody was thinking when they designed it. I was sold with first use.
 
It also has a nice attachment that indicates square to center for bridge placement. Just a cool tool.
 
 
pentimentosound
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 20:39:41 (permalink)
@ spacey   I really enjoyed that Vince Gill video when I first saw it. I didn't think I had room for the drawer thing, but  it dawns on me if I build a rack it would probably have a similar footprint in my studio. I hate leaving my guitars in cases. When they are out, I grab them and play/enjoy them MORE, even if it means changing strings more often.
 
At the point in my life when I had my biggest collection (34), I had to keep them in cases, or at least most of them! Now, I'd like to find a way to have them handy/available, but also safely out of the way.
Michael
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/08 21:59:22 (permalink)
Michael I don't have but one amp - when I saw the drawer cabinet I thought it would also be a good place to set amps on. Good to have them up so you can hear it "right". So that design might be what you're looking for.
 
The way the guitars are set in drawer I agree that the footprint isn't bad at all. Guitars are handy and protected. Excellent design.
The Maillard Reaction
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2014/07/09 06:50:48 (permalink)

post edited by mister happy - 2018/02/26 13:26:02


spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/09 07:42:07 (permalink)
mike_mccue
"It also has a nice attachment that indicates square to center for bridge placement. Just a cool tool."
 
Something like a bolt on T-Square attachment?




Sorry Mike, I should have posted link. ( I'm not affiliated in any way- I just like the tool)
Jig
 
 
pentimentosound
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/09 07:59:57 (permalink)
That Luthier Supply is a great site! Thanks for posting the link.
RE Amps on top of guitar drawers; I have been thinking about what to do with my cases (too) and that drawer idea leads me to cases on pull out shelves, as that seems a fairly happy medium to storing them in cases and leaving them out. I do like seeing them all out! LOL
    Since my study and studio rooms are small (9.5' X11'), there will have to be some guitars in both and the
"foyer" between them has a space about 40" X 40"X 10" that I plan to hang 4 small instruments, like the MandoStrat, lap steel, Taylor Baby, and my classical. I have the picture in mind, but not the dimensions, nor the "how to put it together" part! LOL
Michael
 
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 10:37:28 (permalink)
Well this build has had many "first time" for me.
 
The nitro I sprayed on very lightly. I've done only oil coatings, which I love, and got the finish I was hoping for.
I do believe it was much easier spraying the nitro than working oil although I know many others feel the opposite.
The big advantage is that I don't believe the owner has to trouble with taking care of the finish as with oil. Oil does require attention. Especially with thin coatings.
 
It was a quick turnaround for them to put my missing skull piece back in so I got all the wiring done and can know start on getting the neck ready to bolt on and get the set-up done.
 

 
I took a guess for which one of the three sets of pups to use. I hope I picked the right ones. Since it's now not a guitar for me I'd really like not to need to make changes.
 
The electronics are like an '83 Standard ( I think) with exception: I added a treble bleed. ( highs don't bleed when vol is lowered)
With this arrangement the tone will control all the pups and I relocated the controls so the vol is lowered from bridge pup.
 
I was having trouble finding the right cord for it but Herb thankfully came through and solved that problem.
 
I do think that McCue's idea of using inlay dots to simulate screws on the "pickguard" is something I'll do with the next one. A great idea worth seeing. 
 
 
batsbrew
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 11:22:32 (permalink)
bad @ss

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drewfx1
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 11:39:23 (permalink)
Looks sweet.

 In order, then, to discover the limit of deepest tones, it is necessary not only to produce very violent agitations in the air but to give these the form of simple pendular vibrations. - Hermann von Helmholtz, predicting the role of the electric bassist in 1877.
Leadfoot
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 12:33:55 (permalink)
Beautiful job Spacey!
spacey
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 13:20:09 (permalink)
Thank you guys. I've been lucky. It's not uncommon for me to screw up first attempts and with this one having so many...good luck has been a major factor...so far.
 
I wanted to share a great tool. A well designed tool specifically for one job- to handle vintage style tuner bushings.
It inserts and extracts them with no damage when used correctly. It was expensive but worth it. Using hammers and screwdrivers or such is just not the way IMO.
 

I stopped working on the neck to take this shot and post for ya'll.
It is setup to install the bushings.
The extract a bushing the loose metal piece replaces the insert piece and the white cap is removed thus leaving
a space for the bushing to exit. The metal pusher to extract does adjust for bushing.
It's nice after going to the trouble of getting the holes correct to fit the bushings properly not being destroyed and bushings that fall out of loose pocket- after all the tuner is riding and positioned in place by it. Tuner action is without doubt better due to these steps being done correctly.
Replacing used ones may need correct attention so it's good to know what the repair person plans to do and what you expect how he/she should perform the job.
These bushings are of different dimensions so there are factors to be known.
 
The bushings will be removed at least once during the build. The test fit and at this completion stage.
They are the correct fit- the ones supplied with the tuners were not although the dealer was smart enough to include the right ones in a zip bag- and they have been installed correctly so should give many years of service.
 
I imagine the bushings supplied with tuners were to replace original- oversized to fit worn hole- the problem was the internal diameter for tuner peg was also enlarged which leaves to much slack for peg movement (to bend under string tension). Again...that's my guess.
 
 
 
michaelhanson
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 14:00:17 (permalink)
Cool tool, Michael. That would have been very handy a couple of weeks ago when I installed new vintage tuners. I used the hammer and flat head screw driver method, very carefully.

Mike

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craigb
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/15 14:31:46 (permalink)
Looks like vice-grips on steroids.  LOL.

 
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57Gregy
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Re: More guitar making stuff... 2014/07/16 10:06:42 (permalink)
I really like the inlayed wooden pickguard. I'm surprised no one else has done it.
Great work, as always.

Greg 
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