Not sure you're right about Reaper there. I don't own Reaper, but I've donwloaded their plug-in bundles and they all work fine in other applications.

In my opinion, I think it's a wise move for Sonar to keep their plugs in their own DAW. It's like Jeff said....there are people that will not switch DAWs no matter what. However, if Sonar were to do something different in the plugin game that no one else had to where there was a big stink made about it, that's when you may want to consider going into the plug business. But as of now, though the PC plugs are really good, there's nothing in the game that is different. When I say different....I mean different product wise. There are other versions of the compressors we have and though we have "our own sound" vs. the competition, I really don't think people are going to spend additional money to have different versions of the same plugs purposely. I sincerely believe that most of us make this purchase with Sonar because...

1. It supports the company

2. They are cool features to have on every track while sporting a small footprint

I don't think it would be in Cake's best interest to jump into the plug game unless they literally came out with something mind blowing that either hasn't been done, or hasn't been done right. I personally think it' a good move to keep things Sonar exclusive.

John T: I'm not sure about the Reaper thing. Then again, I can try and find out. They have their own plugin directory that I've never included in any of my scans to see if they would appear. I'm not really crazy about them anyway which is why I've never attempted it. But you very well could be right on that.

WaveLab, Sony and just about all the other "half daw" programs (as I like to call them) allow their plugs in other applications. The only WaveLab plug that I can't get to work in anything else but Wavelab is their MBL....which is pretty cool actually. :)

At any rate, I think Cake is giving us quite a bit of bang for the buck and doing things differently than the others. Also, if they wanted to really get into the plug business, I feel the Cakewalk name may be a curse more than a blessing. Could you see a Pro Tools user using a Cake plug no matter how great it may be? LOL! They'd definitely have to go with something like "The Roland Executive Suite" or something and have the baddest looking plugs they could muster up that worked so well, no one would even affiliate them with Cakewalk....even though our Bakers would create them....shhh. LOL! :)

-Danny

The main reason for me using another DAW like Studio One are other areas and not the plugins at all. The standard instruments and processors are certainly fine but it is the 3rd party stuff that we build into our systems that makes them unique in many ways and adds a lot more to the overall sound we are achieving.

I think it is great that many Cakewalk plugins do work inside other DAW's and I am very glad they do because I like some of them very much especially their instruments. It is the main reason I still have Sonar installed on my system and because I use their products that way, I also consider myself to be a Cakewalk user as well.

Some DAW's (like FL Studio) are exceptional at detecting every plugin you own on your system (and allowing you to use them) and making many of their own available to other DAW's. (Cakewalk are very generous in this regard) I still think that if and when Cakewalk start releasing some or all of their Pro Channel modules as normal VST's (and other formats) for use in other DAW's they may do very well as a result. I can see many wanting those options. It is only going to make one's system even better.

I think it is going to get harder and harder to sell DAW's based on the normal framework stuff that a DAW does because many out there have got all the normal operations well sorted out. And in some areas better than Sonar. So what is left but the plugin concept and I think more and more DAW's are going to have to compete that way.

Take the FL Studio model for example. It only costs $30 or so to get all of their DAW updates for life! So they are not trying to make money that way. But they have a huge range of instruments which they sell for reasonable to high prices, and that must be the way they are surviving.

From a composers perspective I would love to see some more development from the Cakewalk instruments perspective and also making those available for use by other DAW users. But time will only tell what the longer term plans are. They seem to have enough on their plate already.

Ah, I see what you mean. They're locked when bundled, and unlocked when bought standalone.

Well I'm not sure that the ones that are in FL Studio are VSTs at all. The ones you buy are, John T.

I'm a bit out of step with everyone here on this, I suppose, as this plug in mobility thing is just not something I care about. I have fewer and fewer plug ins installed all the time as the years go by. My first approach, when doing a mix in any DAW these days, would be to see how far I could get just using what's included.

You are truly out of step for sure and how have you been able to do that? It goes against all human understanding!

Among others, yes. 

trimph1

John T


Not sure you're right about Reaper there. I don't own Reaper, but I've donwloaded their plug-in bundles and they all work fine in other applications.

Same here. They work in a lot of other DAWs....

No they don't. Only the VST ported versions do and as said they are 32 bit only and kinda old too.

I think they were ported from the Reaper 3.

Well made point Starise.

Alien abductions are lucid dreaming,and sleep disorders....

Just thought I'd join the conversation?

I bought the Expanded license, just to help out Cakewalk... but I never downloaded it.

I can upload to SoundCloud all by myself.

Jonbouy

John


No one has the buy into the PC concept. Those of us that have like it very much and consider it a value to a DAW that we already like.

There are things that could be improved about it but as it is now its a great addition to X1. Its a great reason to get the Producer Expanded version.

Upgraded.

I get the point of the PC, what I don't get is why Producer wasn't Expanded gratis in order to gain the extra revenue from ALL Producer customers wanting extra modules.

This is a question I've asked myself in the past.  I'm all for the DAW dedicated features and I've always thought ProChannel being a Sonar Producer edition exclusive to be a great idea, but I don't understand the logic behind that extra level of expanded for additional models.  It does seem like an unnecessary component and one that quite frankly will put off some from buying in.  They should have left it as simply a PE exclusive and marketed the modules to the Producer customers.  I really be interested in a Baker to comment on the reasoning for what seems a quirky marketing choice.


Don't get me wrong - I'm all for product exclusives, it's a differentiating factor in a very competitive market where similar results can be garnered from several platforms, so this is not a comment on locking PC into Sonar, just the fact of adding that one extra layer to expansion.

John T


I've said this before, but I'd bet heavily that X2 will be configured that way.

I'm hoping your correct.  One could reason that it was a test to figure out a level of commitment, a trial balloon of sorts to see if customers would tolerate different levels of "Pay for Features", but it still seems like, as you noted, if any of the Expanded features should have been rolled into simple Producer, it should have been the additional ProChannel modules.  Leave the Expanded title for other features, but ProChannel was already a Producer only feature, why add further delineation.  A bit of a boggle  for me.

 From what I'm reading there are still potential bugs with VST3,hence why maybe some of the other companies are still "toying "with it.

 Some plugs seem to be ok with that standard in some hosts but it doesn't seem to always play well with everything...yet.

 I applaud the Bakers for not using something that has the potential to cause a problem.


 There are other questions of real .vs perceived benefit  to making a change. This all involves Steinberg and how they chose to implement that standard and how that applies to a Sonar user. I found this thread about it here-

http://forum.cakewalk.com...;m=2407268&mpage=2